[lancer_rit]

Originally Posted by akshay1234

What about the Laura TSI? It was MT. It hardly sold. Skoda is going by their past experience.

True, so enthusiasts are much fewer in number. Does the low sales of Laura TSI MT prove that Laura TSI DSG would have sold in any larger numbers ? Did it do so when it was finally launched earlier this year ?

[azeemhafiz]

Originally Posted by lancer_rit

If you're an enthusiast and want to enjoy a sporty drive, the 1.8 TSI MT is much better bet, has higher reliability and significantly lower sticker price, as well as lower maintenance costs.
The 1.8TSI DSG Elegance is over 23l OTR in Bangalore. Absolutely reduces chances of enthusiasts going for it.

Not sure how you or anyone else works out that DSG is not fun or not as fun as manual. Get a DSG car and get some paddle shifters fitted onto it (usually a plug and play) and trust me the fun that you have is different and in some aspects superior to that of a manual car.

Most of the DSGs let you hold a really high rev and shift up only once you are dangerously close to the rev-limit. If someone likes to rev out a manual turbo charged car with EGR/T (Exhaust Gas Temp) in excess of 960C you are asking for a high maintainance with high wear regardless of transmission type. After having driven fellow BHPian and great friend Robimahanta's polo TSI with paddle shifters, I can tell you that the advantage of manual on a TSI engine is really low, negligible and at times inferior to the fun that you can have on a manual. It is not recommended that you take any engine especially TSI engines to the rev-limit.

Last week Robi and I headed out to Kerala in the middle of the night and came through some narrow stretches of well surfaced road while in the polo TSI. The combination of Gearbox, Engine, Bilstein Suspensions, Paddle-shifters made that stretch perhaps one of the most fun stretches in any car. This was primarily down to the brilliant DSG gearbox and paddleshifters for down-shifting. Given a chance, We'd probably take the polo on similar stretch over heavily modded Laura vRS of Robi. It was Fun. Believe me when I say this, more fun than what we attribute to as Enthusiast friendly manual cars.

Lastly, the term enthusiast is an elusive term. Towards the end of the life cycle of vRS the listed on-road price was 20.75 lakhs ex-showroom Bangalore. Now for about 1.5 odd lakhs more you get a car that is superior in kit and with that brilliant gearbox, although the car is expensive, one needs to understand that Laura in itself was expensive. But then again a bargain if you look at some of the competition especially the 2.0TDI A4. To each his own.

Skoda struggled to sell the vRS and the Tsi's in laura range and I salute their commitment to give us an enthusiast trim in petrol to an audience which in many ways should be imaginary if sales records are to be believed.

For a petrol head looking for a fantastic performance machine north of 15 lakhs and south of 50 lakhs in Bangalore this remains the one of the few and perhaps the only choice.

[lancer_rit]

@azeemhafiz, its a matter of personal preference. I have driven cars with paddle shifters, but I prefer the MT, thank you. DSG is great for smooth and fast up-shifts, but takes a bit of time to down-shift.

The reliability of the DSG is a huge letdown, so is the cost of the gearbox when its time to repair. So, I prefer the MT - less complicated, more natural ...

[azeemhafiz]

Originally Posted by lancer_rit

@azeemhafiz, its a matter of personal preference. I have driven cars with paddle shifters, but I prefer the MT, thank you. DSG is great for smooth and fast up-shifts, but takes a bit of time to down-shift.

The reliability of the DSG is a huge letdown, so is the cost of the gearbox when its time to repair. So, I prefer the MT - less complicated, more natural ...

Personal preference - Definitely. But equally unfair to call DSG gearbox as 'Not fun' as some of us seem to enjoy it a lot. (I'm not saying you said this, but this was the general consensus on the thread)
Although reliability remains a concern.
But then reliability has always been a concern with Skoda, DSG just adds to that factor of uncertainty.

You are right about downshifts - 600 long milliseconds. It felt quicker than that on the paddles, definitely quicker than what I could achieve on the manual (blipping the throttle, engaging clutch, manual input to stick shift, disengaging the clutch).

Anyway, I don't really want to go off-topic. But considering the kit you get for an added 1.5l over the Laura vRS, I maintain that this is a good price (list price).

[Hayek]

Originally Posted by lancer_rit

If you want ease of commute, and FE, you'll get the TDI DSG. If you're an enthusiast and want to enjoy a sporty drive, the 1.8 TSI MT is much better bet, has higher reliability and significantly lower sticker price, as well as lower maintenance costs. The 1.8TSI DSG Elegance is over 23l OTR in Bangalore.

I think the sticker shock is because people are missing several things. (1) The Rupee has collapsed against every currency in the world. Skoda has probably priced the Octavia assuming INR 90 to the Euro, which is 50% weaker than the INR 60 to the Euro when the Laura was launched. (2) Excise duties have risen to 27% from 22.5% earlier. (3) The tighter rules on CKD kits with a 30% duty on assembled engines and gearboxes may have had an impact as well. (4) State governments have been extraordinarily avaricious in their road tax levels. Taxes in MH were 4% for individuals and 7% for companies in 2004 - they are now 12% for individuals and 20% for companies. No wonder that the Octavia 1.8 TSI DSG costs more than what I paid for a Superb 1.8 TSi DSG in 2010. Agree with Azeem on the enthusiasts point: the DSG actually makes driving more fun than a stick shift. As for reliability, as several people have experienced, Skoda's unreliability is not limited to the DSG box alone - fuel pumps, ignition coils, coolant pumps and various other parts are also prone to failure. The DSG is just one such part and probably the one where goodwill warranty is most likely to be available.

[vb-saan]

Regarding DSG v/s MT, the monthly sales numbers probably does not justify the presence of both options. For the better selling diesel, they are indeed giving both the options for the top variant.
And, as buyers we always feel the unavailable option should have been there

References from our official reviews of Laura vRS and Octavia 1.8 TSI

Originally Posted by Rehaan

The Skoda Laura vRS has been launched in India at a price of Rs. 15.19 Lakhs (ex-Delhi).
...
What you won't:
• No option of the much loved dual-clutch gearbox (DSG) on any petrol Laura

Originally Posted by Vid6639

The Skoda Octavia has been launched in India at a price of between Rs. 13.95 - 19.45 lakhs (ex-Delhi).
...
What you won't:
• 1.8L TSI isn't offered with a manual transmission for the purists

[lancer_rit]

Originally Posted by azeemhafiz

Personal preference - Definitely. But equally unfair to call DSG gearbox as 'Not fun' as some of us seem to enjoy it a lot. (I'm not saying you said this, but this was the general consensus on the thread)

Perhaps you misunderstood what I said. I did not say DSG is boring. But for me, MT is more fun than any automatic of any kind. And more some other folks as well.

But then reliability has always been a concern with Skoda, DSG just adds to that factor of uncertainty.

Not really. The Gen1 Octavias with MT were very solid and robust. The vRS had some issues with advanced electronics etc as ajmat and others have recorded in the forum. Having an audio malfunction, or AC mis-behaving, or needing to replace some parts periodically etc is alright, as long as the car keeps moving on the road (even at a reduced clip) - if the gearbox freezes completely, that's simply not acceptable to me. Probably, you are fine with taking that chance and paying premium for it as well!

Anyway, I don't really want to go off-topic. But considering the kit you get for an added 1.5l over the Laura vRS, I maintain that this is a good price (list price).

Tell me how the Octavia "non-vRS" 1.8TSI DSG should be that highly priced that it almost runs into Superb 1.8TSI territory ? Is it better equipped than a Superb 1.8 TSI Ambition MT save for the DSG ? Many others have already echoed the price disappointment earlier in the thread.
From my perspective, I want the MT not the DSG. And I find paying 1.5l+ more for what I don't want, too expensive!
So, let's agree to disagree.

[Akshay1234]

Originally Posted by lancer_rit

True, so enthusiasts are much fewer in number. Does the low sales of Laura TSI MT prove that Laura TSI DSG would have sold in any larger numbers ? Did it do so when it was finally launched earlier this year ?

The Laura TSI DSG was pretty much a soft launch at the end of the product life cycle. Not too many people knew about it, and it was sold out before most could get their hands on it. I really don't think you should judge the saleability of the TSI DSG based on a few units of the Laura that were available.

Originally Posted by lancer_rit

@azeemhafiz, its a matter of personal preference. I have driven cars with paddle shifters, but I prefer the MT, thank you. DSG is great for smooth and fast up-shifts, but takes a bit of time to down-shift.

The reliability of the DSG is a huge letdown, so is the cost of the gearbox when its time to repair. So, I prefer the MT - less complicated, more natural ...

DSG has some hesitation in downshifting, only in D mode. With paddles it is almost instant, and much faster than other cars.

The reliability is being improved. I know I would buy a DSG without worrying about that.

Originally Posted by lancer_rit

Tell me how the Octavia "non-vRS" 1.8TSI DSG should be that highly priced that it almost runs into Superb 1.8TSI territory ? Is it better equipped than a Superb 1.8 TSI Ambition MT save for the DSG ? Many others have already echoed the price disappointment earlier in the thread.
From my perspective, I want the MT not the DSG. And I find paying 1.5l+ more for what I don't want, too expensive!
So, let's agree to disagree.

Don't the top end variants of a lower end car always be almost on par with the base variants of the higher model price wise? Look at the 320D and 520d with just a few lacs to separate them (after discounts don't quote the ex showroom to me). Also since you ask, the Octavia non vrs TSI DSG does have a couple of things over the Superb Ambition. For one the brilliant DSG box, adaptive xenon headlights, the sunroof, led daytime lights, ESP, tyre pressure loss warning, parking sensors at the front, touchscreen, audio controls on the steering wheel, bluetooth, maxidot. But the Superb Ambition does have more rear space, and that neat umbrella in the rear door.

Now which would you pick? Its an easy choice for me.

[Shortsell]

Originally Posted by kdeepakk

Thanks Guys for your suggestions on whether to buy the top end or not.

Am not going for it, its too expensive almost 2 lacs more than my budget and with the horror stories of their service i dont want to mess up things.

So planning for
Fluence - 18 lacs
Jetta - 23 lacs after discount
Elantra - 19lacs after discount

The new fluence is coming in Jan as they still have around 100 old kits to be sold.
The Jetta is available in down town auto dealer and the new one is coming in Jan.
Elantra facelift not soon, so it will remain the same.

Cruze/Kizashi are others which were seen.

As part of my previous job, I was in touch with various departments within OEMs and auto ancillary businesses in Chennai. Since i'm on the lookout for a car myself and fluence was in the shortlist, I called my contact at the company. I was advised that the new fluence will be launched by June 2014. I would say this information is reliable. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but where did you hear of this Jan launch?

Originally Posted by saurabh sharma

Ok guys this is official, Skoda HAS launched 1.8tsi in ambition trim. I went late today evening and took my 1st TD of 1.8tsi Ambition, must add the car goes like a rocket even when not run-in (50km on the odo) wonder what fun Mr.Adi here is having

I contacted Gurudev Motors in Chennai. They vehemently deny that 1.8tsi has been launched in Ambition version. They say that a few vehicles (15+) may have been launched but would have been sold off now and atleast Chennai will not get them soon. When pressed they said, if there was such a launch then the company would have at-least updated their website. Fair enough, no update on Skoda website on 1.8tsi ambition variant. Anybody has any information on this?

Also, the dealer here said that no service and maintenance package is available currently for Octavia. I protested showing them the skoda website link.

http://www.skoda-auto.co.in/models/octavia/Service-Plan

I was told that, they usually put these links 5-6 months before communication is sent to the dealer!strange.

Do you guys think that if skoda octavia puts up a weak number in oct and nov (say sub 200 per month) we can expect some discounts?

[abs182]

Has anyone bought or booked the New Octavia Diesel MT version? If yes can someone share their experience till date.

[lancer_rit]

Originally Posted by akshay1234

The reliability is being improved. I know I would buy a DSG without worrying about that.

Yeah, for something like last 4+ years, its being improved, and every year or so, it has been fixed!! And its been so reliable, that VW is recalling 1.5million + vehicles to try and fix it again.
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...speed-dsg.html

Again, I'll not buy a 7-DSG. Being stuck in the city is one thing, but being stuck on a highway, several hundred kms from the nearest Skoda A.S.S. in the night, is definitely not acceptable to me.

Maybe, I prefer mechanically simpler alternatives which do just fine, and are reliable over years.

[Akshay1234]

Originally Posted by lancer_rit

Yeah, for something like last 4+ years, its being improved, and every year or so, it has been fixed!! And its been so reliable, that VW is recalling 2million + vehicles to try and fix it again.
Again, I'll not buy a 7-DSG. Being stuck in the city is one thing, but being stuck on a highway, several hundred kms from the nearest Skoda A.S.S. in the night, is definitely not acceptable to me.

Maybe, I prefer mechanically simpler alternatives which do just fine.

It is a step for the better. Hopefully after the recall the rate of failures should go down.

Even Toyota recalled over 7 million vehicles which could have had faulty accelerators, and which caused unintended acceleration. Now if you ask me Id rather be in a vehicle which stops when it has a failure rather than one that accelerates more.

Sure, I'm not trying to force my opinion on you. If you prefer MT its completely your choice.

[azeemhafiz]

Originally Posted by lancer_rit

The Gen1 Octavias with MT were very solid and robust.

Tell me how the Octavia "non-vRS" 1.8TSI DSG should be that highly priced.

So, let's agree to disagree.

Happy to agree to the disagreement part. I'm not trying to force DSG over MT. But a couple of things, generation 1 Octavia 2.0 petrol was an NA engine. The Octavia vRS was notorious for issues. If the example on Laura is anything to go by, the performance difference between vRS and non vRS was not significantly higher. I know the springs were stiffer and exhaust is louder but from a pure performance perspective the difference is not as great as one would imagine.

Again, let's agree to disagree.

[Tats07]

Originally Posted by akshay1234

What about the Laura TSI? It was MT. It hardly sold. Skoda is going by their past experience.

I think Laura TSI lost out more because of the high petrol-diesel difference and the diesel hype (not an unjustified one at that, I must admit) that was going on in the country.

I do not know how much fun is DSG, I have not driven one. For me, I thought MT brings affordability for high end machines. However, Skoda has changed that with an OTR of 17.xx for 1.4 Active TSI in Bangalore. Of course, the onus is primarily on KA RTO, but I simply don't believe Skoda couldn't have kept it bit lower at ex-showroom level for base Active version, regardless of rising Rupee and excise duties. Imagine what happens to the pricing of new Jetta 1.4/1.8 TSI on MQB if/when that is launched, given the fact that VW branded vehicles suffer from a superiority complex.

Unfortunately, all this will lead to only one thing - death of TSI petrols in India since I don't see the day far off when discounts are meted out to sell off remaining stocks of TSIs, with a business plan focussing on diesels. Or stretching it further, now that diesel is 58.xx in Bangalore and likely to be deregulated, the death of high-end D segment European vehicles. We have already lost out on new Civic, maybe for a long time to come.

[abhinav.gupta88]

I am planning to buy the Octavia 1.8 DSG. But what is holding me back is the launch of RIO Red. Any pointers as to when would this be launched?