[HappyRoadie]

Originally Posted by audioholic

When was your car manufactured? It is mostly a case of warped discs due to rusting. Looks like your car has stayed in the yard for a long time before it was delivered to you/the brake discs are defective. There is no judder felt in my car at any speed/braking force except for two emergency braking scenarios where the ABS kicked in.

I purchased my Celerio in March and it was manufactured in Feb 2017. I decoded the the VIN number. So its not an old car. Juddering is not always present but yes 2-3 times I felt it.

[audioholic]

Originally Posted by HappyRoadie

I purchased my Celerio in March and it was manufactured in Feb 2017. I decoded the the VIN number. So its not an old car. Juddering is not always present but yes 2-3 times I felt it.

Since it is not an old car, rust isnt an issue. Do keep a watch on this issue and if it occurs next time, monitor the speed of the car, current gear and also note if this judder occurs while downshifting or without any gear change. One transmission jerk I have observed is when we accelerate hard in first gear and then suddenly brake hard. That time, the transmission will try to initiate an upshift to 2 but the braking action will make it come back to 1 during which there is a slight one time jerk.

Originally Posted by Sparky

I can't write the complain now, because the dealership already acted as I said, and in most nicest manner I have seen so far. I think I can write a feedback on maruti website, saying good words about dealership and also cautioning them about the issue? What do you say Audioholic, how should I proceed so that Maruti notices it?

I request others also who are facing similar juddering issue to act now, so we can all be heard together.

I was in the same situation as yours once the clutch was replaced. I couldnt escalate the issue further as the issue was assumed to be resolved. Now the judder has started and in initial stages. Though I wrote a mail, there hasnt been any reply made. Waiting for the car to reach the 10k mark in two weeks from now when I will personaly visit the service center and get the issue looked into along with the 10k service.

Exactly why I am highlighting the issue here. If we all act together, the issue will be taken up to a better level of escalation or technical competence and we can expect a more permanent resolution.. If not, be ready to replace clutch discs every 10-20k kms. On one hand, I am not bothered about doing that since the disc costs 800 bucks but that doesnt mean that the company shouldnt try to fix this issue. Hence I am stressing upon this.

If anyone is facing juddering, it is high time we all got together and get this issue resolved permanently.

[no_boundaries]

Took the car out to Mysore over the weekend. First long drive with relatively free roads and alone driving with the car.

The car is certainly not under powered. It has the beans to accelerate when situation demands. Its the smarty pants AMT that intervenes and cuts off to shed any load beyond the tolerable point in any gear ratio. Guess the car needs to understand the user driving and vice versa.

The car is spacious and is very comfortable for 4 adults plus a kid even over long distances. The only grouse is the amount of road noise that creeps in because of the JK Vectras.

The tyres just roll forward or backward. You put in some stress like cornering at slightly higher speeds, ride it through patchy roads, wet surfaces they hate it. They would ensure the driver is aware of all the contact points on the road surface. At times I feel the ABS kicks in early because of these tyres.

The car had 33kms on the ODO when I took delivery and fueled her up at Shell, Kengenri for the first time. They didn't have the regular fuel so I got her some V. As this is my petrol car after 5 years, I had no clue what to expect. The engine could hardly be heard and I drove between 80 - 100kms/Hr with gradual acceleration and deceleration, the MID returned an average of 19km/l.

The AC was running all through. In mid-day heat (average to above average temperatures) the car struggles to cool the cabin. It reduces the temperature in cabin certainly but it hardly chills the cabin. This was my feedback even from several cars I drove before. I feel the Wagon R, Eon have better cooling. Does anybody feel the same ?

The steering is slightly hard to use. I'm ok with this but wifey wasn't too comfortable with this. In Bangalore traffic this may be a problem. This is one of the reasons I haven't swapped the tyres yet.

I'm also keeping a close eye on the clutch reactions and the brake juddering.

Pics from the delivery date - 30 March 2017.

[Sparky]

Originally Posted by audioholic

If we all act together, the issue will be taken up to a better level of escalation or technical competence and we can expect a more permanent resolution..
If anyone is facing juddering, it is high time we all got together and get this issue resolved permanently.

I just checked the Maruti Feedback procedure. Their escalation matrix shows that the first feedback goes to the dealer, if they do not reply in 2 days or reply is unsatisfied, then only it can be escalated further. Which means my feedback wont pass beyond dealership level, so no use of trying.

I just hope that this issue reaches the correct person/department of maruti, and the correct solution be found soon. If anyone knows how to make it possible, please share. Can moderator step in and suggest appropriate steps?

I again request others who face similar issue, to step in. I think many might have experienced it, but they may ignore it due to improper knowledge and vague dealership replies.

[archat68]

The steering of the Celerio feels a bit harder than other cars with EPS . How is the steering in wagon r AMT? Is there any difference between the steering of AMT or MT?

[vdi]

Originally Posted by no_boundaries

The AC was running all through. In mid-day heat (average to above average temperatures) the car struggles to cool the cabin. It reduces the temperature in cabin certainly but it hardly chills the cabin. This was my feedback even from several cars I drove before. I feel the Wagon R, Eon have better cooling. Does anybody feel the same ?

The AC works really well in our Celerio and chills the cabin quickly. The car had done 20K plus kilometers.

[k88k]

My Celerio ZXi AMT (O) is almost 4 months old now with 7K Kms on the ODO. I haven't faced the juddering issue yet, except some minor vibrations being felt upon hard pressing the accelerator when switching from 1st to 2nd gear. My usage has been 70% on the highways and the car has been performing really well.

As audioholic pointed out, the problem of juddering is predominantly being faced in bumper to bumper traffic. To be prepared for such an occasion, I happened to call my SA at Pratham Motors (near Kudlu gate) in advance to check if they have been receiving complaints from other AMT owners about this problem. He answered in the affirmative. The solution being a software update done at Maruti Suzuki training centre at Peenya. Car has to be left there for a day or so. I checked with him again if it is just a reset but he was sure that it was a software update. So, fellas who are facing the juddering problem, can check on this at the service center near you and confirm if this can actually solve the issue.

[audioholic]

Originally Posted by archat68

The steering of the Celerio feels a bit harder than other cars with EPS . How is the steering in wagon r AMT? Is there any difference between the steering of AMT or MT?

The steering of the Celerio is on the harder side. However, the steering of the WagonR AMT is very light, similar to the manual variant of the WagonR. Since my cousin owns a WagonR AMT, I tried it out and could immediately feel the difference.

Originally Posted by k88k

The solution being a software update done at Maruti Suzuki training centre at Peenya. Car has to be left there for a day or so. I checked with him again if it is just a reset but he was sure that it was a software update. So, fellas who are facing the juddering problem, can check on this at the service center near you and confirm if this can actually solve the issue.

Can you please check and provide us more information? I have not yet taken up this matter and if at all there is such an update, I will be glad to get it done. Thanks for reporting the same though. Please contact your SA and share with us more information if possible. I will contact the supervisor at the dealership today in the evening for the same.

[k88k]

Originally Posted by audioholic

Can you please check and provide us more information?.....

Tried a couple of times to reach him but his number was busy. He should call me back. He was talking about this training center may be.

[sairamboko]

Originally Posted by audioholic

T
Can you please check and provide us more information? I have not yet taken up this matter and if at all there is such an update, I will be glad to get it done. Thanks for reporting the same though. Please contact your SA and share with us more information if possible. I will contact the supervisor at the dealership today in the evening for the same.

hi Audioholic - i feel i have the same juddering issue in my K10 Alto AMT also. There is a judder only in 1st or 2nd gear. I will check with Pratham Motors this weekend. Also for the 1st time my a/c is switched on, there is a noise coming like an air valve is opened. Need to check that also.

[Sparky]

Originally Posted by sairamboko

Also for the 1st time my a/c is switched on, there is a noise coming like an air valve is opened. Need to check that also.

When you switch on the AC, it taps extra power from the engine. So the noise may be due to extra vibration on engine mounts. If the noise is less/minor, its normal, otherwise get the engine mounts checked. Bad engine mounts might also be causing the jerking in 1st and 2nd gear.

Audioholic, please update if you anything about the software update or solution to the juddering problem.

[audioholic]

Originally Posted by sairamboko

hi Audioholic - i feel i have the same juddering issue in my K10 Alto AMT also. There is a judder only in 1st or 2nd gear. I will check with Pratham Motors this weekend. Also for the 1st time my a/c is switched on, there is a noise coming like an air valve is opened. Need to check that also.

When AC is switched on, the hissing noise is the refrigerant gas being circulated around, and makes this noise when it exits the expansion valve and the pressure gets reduced. This is common in the Dzire and swift too. However not the same in my Celerio/SX4.

Originally Posted by Sparky

Audioholic, please update if you anything about the software update or solution to the juddering problem.

I gave a call to the main supervisor of the dealership the same day you informed us about this. He told he would enquire and get back and I did not get any update from him. No replies from the TSM either. The second clutch has not yet started to judder severely, it was just a mild one second vibration when taking off from a hump in second gear. I have 1k kms left for the third service and I will take this issue up in person that time. Until then, I will just sit back and enjoy the car. Here is a video I shot in my native village today when I took off from a speed breaker.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Io68B3ovgE4

At 5 seconds, I have slowed down to around 15kmph and in 2M. I press the accelerator and the engine speed goes up to 1800RPM and stays there, while the clutch is slipped and the speed increases to 25kmph when the clutch is disengaged and then the engine speed continues to rise.

This slipping of clutch is the cause of judder and for vehicles which stay in second gear most of the times in city traffic, the judder issue will develop. The same is repeated again at 20 seconds and the clutch is slipped until 22s. This two second slipping is what causes the judder. Hopefully they should disable this and let the vehicle pick up speed without slipping the clutch. It might make second gear a little lethargic until 20kmph, but thats better than eating up the clutch.

Keeping this issue apart, I am enjoying the car to the core. Since its primarily used by me and my dad alone, we get to unleash the car regularly on all types of roads. It can take highway curves without having to slow down compared to the wagonR. In the WagonR, taking a similar curve once took me to a different lane at the end of the curve. It can comfortably cruise on highways(not fully loaded though) and has good power on tap for overtakes.

A quick note on FE delivered in different driving styles whenever I go to my native, which is Kolar. The Bengaluru-Kolar stretch is a beautiful 4 Lane + shoulder and is a bliss to drive after Hoskote.

• Consistent triple digit cruise with hard acceleration - 16kmpl(16.6 on MID)
• Consistent triple digit cruise with gentle pressure on accelerator - 18.5kmpl(19.5 on MID)
• Consistent cruise of 80-90kmph - 21kmpl(22.1 on MID)
• Consistent cruise of 80-90kmph without AC - 22.3kmpl(23.5 on MID)

The MID is 5-6% optimistic over the last 9k kms.

[audioholic]

Originally Posted by Sparky

Audioholic, please update if you anything about the software update or solution to the juddering problem.

Originally Posted by k88k

Tried a couple of times to reach him but his number was busy. He should call me back. He was talking about this training center may be.

Well the good news is that there is *some* reprogramming that is supposed to be done and the supervisor called to ask me if they could pick up the vehicle and inspect it tomorrow. The TSM will be visiting the service center and would get the software updated mostly from their training center. I have told them to pick up the car today in the evening and they offered me a loaner car. Will update on the proceedings.

[Sparky]

Originally Posted by audioholic

Well the good news is that there is *some* reprogramming that is supposed to be done and the supervisor called to ask me if they could pick up the vehicle and inspect it tomorrow. The TSM will be visiting the service center and would get the software updated mostly from their training center. I have told them to pick up the car today in the evening and they offered me a loaner car. Will update on the proceedings.

That's the good news, Audioholic. Hope they get it right this time. If they do, please request your SA to pull this issue to upper level at Maruti, so other people also get the benefit of it.

One doubt I have is, whether the service center is actually capable of reprogramming? because that will require some education/training! Is there any way you can make sure that they reprogrammed, and not just calibration/reset? Are they changing the clutch set again?

[audioholic]

GOOD NEWS, BAD NEWS:

I went to the dealership today where the TSM had already arrived. He had got his laptop with the flashing tool with him. Upon speaking to him, he told me that R&D engineers have recognized this issue and are working towards it with engineers from Suzuki Japan. They have an updated software which they are still not so convinced with.

The bad news is, the software update applies to vehicles manufactured before April 2016. My car already had the updated SW which still has the problem. The update also was unsuccessful due to this. I had left the vehicle in the morning when they attempted it and it failed. Then the TSM told that the diagnostic tool was faulty and they would fetch it from a nearby service center. Hence, I left to work. But later, they called to tell me this and the TSM was still not so reassuring. Took him to task for wasting half my day with his poor background study. If he made some effort to know what the update was and to whom it was applicable, there was no need to call me in for this.

He has told they will get back with a fix but I am not sure when. At least, the positive note is that this juddering issue has not been passed off by the higher ups and they are working on it. Hence, I will reserve further actions for some time.