[jkrishnakj]

If it gives any comfort, I have had two Safaris before I moved to an Innova. While the niggles were there in the Safari I had a good relation with the Service manager and had never faced a problem. There are marked 'experiential' differences that you will notice as a Toyota customer, and it is so good. Customer first approach is a trait that is hard to miss when it comes to Toyota.

It is quite unlikely that the Crysta may see a Sunroof anytime soon. If the decision hangs around the sunroof, Harrier is the way to go. The Tata vehicles do hold up even after 5-7 years. I know some of friends running 300k in their Safaris and not having opened the engine even once.

I drive a 2.8 Auto Innova and I no longer miss the Safari. 😊

[PrideRed]

Originally Posted by Puffdamgcdragon

Thank you all. Much appreciated.

Now I'm looking at either the current Crysta or save a few bucks and go for the Harrier XZ plus.

Its cheaper, I'll probably get more discounts Year end, more fuel efficient than the Crysta, It's got more ground clearance (A very important factor around here) and the kids want the Sunroof.
Team.Bhp is the greatest, isn't it?

Few bucks you save to buy Harrier, will be lost during resale. However these two are different animals altogether. If there is no use for 3rd row and badge isn't important, go for Harrier. Take a large sample, Toyota scores better on reliability, if at all that is important.

[haisaikat]

Originally Posted by bravo82in

I am considering buying a stone age phone to make mirror link work. My primary requirement is Google maps and calls. Before doing that I have few queries:
1. Are you facing any hiccups while using S3 and mirror link?
2. Is the connectivity butter smooth or are there any disconnections?
3. Can a second phone be connected via bluetooth for answering calls or for music along with mirror linked S3?

Sorry for the late response dear. My own experience with using Miirrorlink with S3 was not that smooth until this point for below reasons

1. The GPS chip within the phone seemed to lose satellite lock frequently resulting in maps behaving weird. GPSFix app could not rescue completely and eventually I ended up using GPSTether to Tether over Wifi the GPS position from another phone, good in a way since I did not hence require having a separate sim card blocked for this S3 and can tether both internet and GPS location. This was addressed hence and no longer a bottleneck.
2. Secondly and most important, may be it is due to recent upgrade of various apps within the phone even if OS was still Android 4.3 that the regular navigation map was a bit slow to update however pathetically non-responsive during Mirror Link mode screen duplication. Not sure if this is due to GMaps only or the phone limitation on modern day data volume required to process. I tried with Sygic but the app kept on crashing in Mirrorlink mode. May be it was due to newer apps on smaller memory of older phone. I did not try with older version of apk files.
3. It did break connection a few times but disconnecting and reconnecting the wire did solve the problem.

I still have not given up, as the 7 inch screen remains idle during longer trips, I am slowed down a bit by COVID though, targeting to get the Note versions may be Note S2 or Note S3 that has 4.3 Android OS and try with them. They had better processor, graphics and memory and may stand a fair chance in dealing with newer app versions.

To your other question, yes Bluetooth can connect to a different phone.

Originally Posted by Puffdamgcdragon

Now I'm looking at either the current Crysta or save a few bucks and go for the Harrier XZ plus.

Its cheaper, I'll probably get more discounts Year end, more fuel efficient than the Crysta, It's got more ground clearance (A very important factor around here) and the kids want the Sunroof.

Just a niggling doubt how a Tata vehicle wil hold up after six- seven years.

Originally Posted by PrideRed

Few bucks you save to buy Harrier, will be lost during resale. However these two are different animals altogether. If there is no use for 3rd row and badge isn't important, go for Harrier.

I agree, if no need of 3rd row then Harrier is better. I believe new Harrier BS6 170 PS edition should be a stable release considering its not the Gen 1 Harrier. If there are requirements like Sunroof that matter more to the family which I understand makes it a lot more fun to kids better go for Harrier if not Hector Plus.

[WhiteSierra]

Originally Posted by Puffdamgcdragon

Thank you all. Much appreciated.

Now I'm looking at either the current Crysta or save a few bucks and go for the Harrier XZ plus.


My Innova before that -I had one from 2010 to 2017, was rock solid and no problems what so ever.

Having owned many Tatas and Toyotas over years, I'd prefer Toyota any day blindly. It is like Heart vs Head. Heart says Tata and Head says Toyota. Tata cars look great and stunning, but mechanically they are not as competent and as lasting as Toyotas. If you are looking to own a car for long term, buy an Innova eyes closed. We have a Qualis which clocked 4 lakh 23 thousand kms, an Innova which did about 1 lakh 70 thousand kms and an Innova crysta which recently completed 40 k kms service. Our Tata vehicles from previous decades also did 2 lakh kms each, I test drove Tata Harrier and loved it, it is extremely capable vehicle. But there are many unsorted niggles in Harrier v 2.0 aswell. Best example is the AC drain piple leak recently a BHPian suffered in his 1 day old Harrier. Innova Crysta also had some nigggles in the first batch, like rain water entering cabin , 17 inch tyres bursting, etc. But Toyota promptly resolved it and from then on, there were no compliants. Ours is a 2018 MT Crysta GX, it is doing a wonderful job for our family with zero issues so far.

As PrideRed and haisaikat said, If you don't need a 3rd row, and want gizmos like Panoramic sunroof and a good looking car, go for Harrier. But if you want a vehicle with bulletproof reliability, tons of passenger space and complete peace of mind, go for Crysta. But don't expect Crysta to handle as good as your old Innova. I mean you get the good ride quality, Power and Torque, but it feels 'light' compared to the old generation Innova which feels very 'solid'. I would pick Innova any day over Harrier.

[Puffdamgcdragon]

Good read.

Appreciate you taking the trouble to write it.
Yes. It certainly is a head vs heart decision.

Between the two, everytime I decide on a course of action, I do a bit more research and start having doubts once again.

First I was all set on the Innova for its quality and peace of mind then thought the Harrier gives you almost the same space and we hardly need the third row and I get better fuel economy AND ground clearance, all quite a bit cheaper than the Innova Vz trim. And the panoramic sunroof, the fantastic music system and the six cogs in the gearbox didn't hurt either.

I was down to deciding the color with my family. Red or White or Red/Black or White/Black..

And then started reading the thread you mentioned above of water getting in a new Harrier.
And then a lot more posts of the vehicle having niggles, even in this V2 version.

Perhaps Ignorance IS bliss. Like in 2010 we went in for an Innova without much thinking. And had seven very contented years with it.
The guy who bought it from me comes often to my workshop for washing. He's very happy with it still.

Now I'll wait for either October or December discounts, talk to the banks, calculate my EMIs an then take a final call.

[bravo82in]

Originally Posted by haisaikat

My own experience with using Miirrorlink with S3 was not that smooth

Appreciate your response. S3 with a not so stable connection may become a distraction while driving. I will prefer to wait for a tad more time and hope of a software update from Toyota, else will change to a CarPlay/ android auto compatible HU. Android HU is also an option though reviews of sound quality are not very encouraging.

The GPS chip within the phone seemed to lose satellite lock frequently resulting in maps behaving weird.

Try placing the S3 close to a window/open sky. Hope this will make the connection stable. This trick used to work 5-6 yrs back in my android phone.

targeting to get the Note versions may be Note S2 or Note S3 that has 4.3 Android OS

Note 2 has android 4.4 if I am not wrong

Please keep us updated if anything works smooth with mirror link.

Regards
Bravo

[haisaikat]

Originally Posted by bravo82in

I will prefer to wait for a tad more time and hope of a software update from Toyota, else will change to a CarPlay/ android auto compatible HU.

Try placing the S3 close to a window/open sky. Hope this will make the connection stable.

Note 2 has android 4.4 if I am not wrong
Regards
Bravo

You are correct on the android version, probably a safer way to chose a phone is to check for the list given here if you filter with Mirrorlink 1.0 and Phones.

https://cert.mirrorlink.com/

You will find Galaxy S3 was certified in 2012 but there are tons of Sony phones under Xperia series certified in 2014 that may have a supposedly better spec. Finding a right match is the difficult, I experimented with samsung perhaps someone else can try with a Sony that is how community knowledge will grow.

The other thing on the expected upgrade from Toyota, it's probably never going to happen. Internet gossips says that Mirrorlink 1.1 onwards allow much more things to be done on the HU than the restricted 1.0 version. Hence Toyota thinks it's a safety threat upgrading. Not sure how they are coping with Android Auto in the Yaris.

The GPS signal lock problem does not resolve even bringing to open air until I run the GPS fix app once again to reclaibrate, perhaps it's a hardware degradation issue with years of non usage. Evennif the lock fixes on its own, the position accuracy goes for a toss without running GPS Fix. Doesn't mean it will be in all handsets.

Also I used the app Full Mirror, allows mirroring apps like YouTube etc on the HU, my previous post on Mirrorlink on this thread has the screenshot.

[audioholic]

For BS6 owners, how frequently do you face DPF regeneration? In my car, which is used for 40% city 60% highway, it happens every 300kms or so when driven only within the city, and not so often during a highway only drive. Yesterday we drove for 40kms to airport and then around a town. When I parked at a restaurant, the regen process kicked in. But I had to turn off the vehicle and after that, we did a return journey of around 50kms home so it would have completed then. Usually I believe this is a partial regen since the last time this happened, I had parked the car and left it idle and it took only five minutes to complete whereas the manual regen using switch takes a much longer time. How frequently does that happen to you guys?

[Inquilab28]

Hi! I’m in a fix on this very dilemma. I have recently transferred from the states and have no vehicle, feels a little like my wings have been clipped off as I am unable to even take the cab due to COVID.

Now, for the car buying decision, I would prefer getting something soon. I need a vehicle which is good in city and highway driving. Boot space and comfort is important as I would try and do some long drives on this. My family consists of me, wifey and 4 year old daughter. Would prefer a vehicle that’s going to last me ten yrs plus and 3 lakh kms. Would prefer a safe vehicle. I’m very lost and can use some help and advice..

I have looked at and am considering the following in the same order. Would love your feedback as I’m truly confused..

1. Good old innova
Except the hefty price tag there is nothing against this. Atleast 4 lakhs above my budget even for the base model. But if no better choice, would stretch and still prefer getting this for the badge

2. XUV 500
Don’t like the boot space. Is in the budget ball park. Not sure of mahindra ass. Considering the Scorpio, but for a little premium I’m getting a better product in xuv

3. Creta and Seltos
IMHO and With due respect to the current owners. Not as tall and the features on the car are not something I use. I need function more than anything and these cards have unnecessary features which hike the cost and provide no tangible value. Not a long term haul in my opinion(could be wrong). Small engine size.

4. Tata variants like harrier
I had a not so great, avg ownership experience with my indigo 2011. Had to literally give it away when selling in 2017. Though no major mechanical issues, didn’t like the unrefined experience. So not so upbeat about getting another tata. Scarred a little.

5. Maruti variants
No diesel option. Can’t justify running 3 L kms on petrol. Safety is a concern. Ertiga and XL could be options if I restrict to city driving, as I’m not sure on their behavior on the highway. Small engine size.

6. Honda variants
Absolutely no idea. Love the brand, but the mpv segment seems weak.

Can you folks suggest the best course of action? Also, what could be a good time financially to take this call? What I mean by that is, are we expecting any discounts or year ending deals if I wait for a couple of months?

[PrasannaDhana]

Originally Posted by Inquilab28

Can you folks suggest the best course of action? Also, what could be a good time financially to take this call? What I mean by that is, are we expecting any discounts or year ending deals if I wait for a couple of months?

Well, you have the Tata Hexa.

Fits right in your budget, it is supremely comfortable and great to be in. Spacious, can accomodate a lot of luggage with last row folded, it's safe and comes with 6 airbags.

Please dont judge Tata based on your experience 9 years ago. Though they are not perfect, they have made progress leaps and bounds over the years. Moreover the 2.2 Varicor is powerful and very reliable (1.5 lakh km experience with the 2.2)

But if I was in your shoes, I would close my eyes and buy the new Honda City diesel.

[vigsom]

Originally Posted by Inquilab28

I have recently transferred from the states and have no vehicle,

good in city and highway driving
Boot space and comfort
me, wifey and 4 year old daughter.
to last me ten yrs plus and 3 lakh kms.
prefer a safe vehicle

The only brand that offers a good build and decent life at the right price point is the Tata.

Since you're only three, the 2020 Harrier would be a good choice if going new; you could look at the car serving you well in the 8 year - 2,00,000km range with proper upkeep

If you're ok with pre-owned , pick up a good used 2014 or 2015 Innova VX or ZX with something like upto 80k on the odo; difficult to get low run examples but not impossible either.

The D4-D engines will easily go past 3,00,000km with good upkeep. These cars are excellent cruisers at 100 kmph.

I'd love to recommend the 2009-12 Innova V but again, old models and not sure of bans on old diesels.

XUV500 - not recommended

Seltos/Creta - not recommended

[PrasannaDhana]

Originally Posted by vigsom

If you're ok with pre-owned , pick up a good used 2014 or 2015 Innova VX or ZX with something like upto 80k on the odo; difficult to get low run examples but not impossible either.

The D4-D engines will easily go past 3,00,000km with good upkeep. These cars are excellent cruisers at 100 kmph.

I loved the old Innova, and have an example, where my friend bought one at 1.6 lakh km on odo and has now clocked 3.6 lakh km on it without any issues.

One major gripe is the lack of highway performance, and the increased NVH beyond triple digit speeds in the old Innova.

The crysta 2.4 and 2.8 are extremely capable cruisers in comparison and effortlessly cruise at 120 kmph all day!

I happened to drive the 2012 Innova last week, and having driven the crysta 2.4/2.8, the older 2.5 felt very weak and noisy

[Inquilab28]

Originally Posted by PrasannaDhana

Well, you have the Tata Hexa.

Fits right in your budget, it is supremely comfortable and great to be in. Spacious, can accomodate a lot of luggage with last row folded, it's safe and comes with 6 airbags.

Please dont judge Tata based on your experience 9 years ago. Though they are not perfect, they have made progress leaps and bounds over the years. Moreover the 2.2 Varicor is powerful and very reliable (1.5 lakh km experience with the 2.2)

But if I was in your shoes, I would close my eyes and buy the new Honda City diesel.

Hows the ASS for Tata? Has it improved over time? I don't mind choosing a Tata again, as long as the ASS has been addressed.

Is the 2.2 a good engine for city and highway driving?

I don't mind getting a pre owned vehicle.. just not sure if I can trust the odo reading with the folks selling.. don't want to invest around 10-12 lakhs for a 3-4 yr old vehicle which already did a lakh kms..

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[PrasannaDhana]

Originally Posted by Inquilab28

Hows the ASS for Tata? Has it improved over time? I don't mind choosing a Tata again, as long as the ASS has been addressed.

Is the 2.2 a good engine for city and highway driving?

I don't mind getting a pre owned vehicle.. just not sure if I can trust the odo reading with the folks selling.. don't want to invest around 10-12 lakhs for a 3-4 yr old vehicle which already did a lakh kms..

Tata A.S.S is fine in my case, but then I have been a Tata customer for over 2 decades, and I make it vocal about being fleeced/receiving improper service. I meet the service floor people and have a rapport. So I have received proper maintenance so far.

2.2 is a very good, proven engine. The V400 version of it is quite fast too, despite the fat kerb weight of Tata Safari/Hexa. It does have a slight lag below 1500 rpm, above which it's quite spirited.

My Storme v400 does a 0-100 in 12.8 seconds. To put that into perspective, a diesel swift does it in 13.xx seconds. So I can assure you the performance is not at all an issue with the 2.2

I have cruised at higher triple digit speeds for hours and it felt at home.

But if you are going for Tata, I recommend sub 60k run examples. Usually the stock clutch and suspension easily lasts for 1.25 lakh km.

Used Tatas depreciate two times as fast as used Toyotas. So your budget will easily accommodate a fairly new Hexa

[WhiteSierra]

Originally Posted by Inquilab28

Hi! I’m in a fix on this very dilemma. I have recently transferred from the states and have no vehicle, feels a little like my wings have been clipped off as I am unable to even take the cab due to COVID.

Now, for the car buying decision, I would prefer getting something soon. I need a vehicle which is good in city and highway driving. Boot space and comfort is important as I would try and do some long drives on this. My family consists of me, wifey and 4 year old daughter. Would prefer a vehicle that’s going to last me ten yrs plus and 3 lakh kms. Would prefer a safe vehicle. I’m very lost and can use some help and advice..

1. Good old innova
Except the hefty price tag there is nothing against this. Atleast 4 lakhs above my budget even for the base model. But if no better choice, would stretch and still prefer getting this for the badge

Your option No.1 makes perfect sense for your requirements. Old Innova can easily last 10 plus years and more than 3 lakh kms. It is a proven engine. Someone clocked 10 lakh kms on the old innova and it was shared on this forum as well. https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/india...ml#post4704200 (Highest reading on the odometer!)



We have a Qualis, Innova and Crysta. Old Innova is solid and better built than Crysta, you can feel this in high speeds, old innova is more planted.

You can get a used Innova V of 2015 vintage with 50 or 60 k kms on ODO. It will serve you for 10 or 15 more years (If NGT rules don't apply for Diesel vehicles in Hyderabad after 10 years, as of now there's no such issues, got our Qualis RC renewed recently after 15 years of service.)

Toyota vehicles are bullet proof, even if it is out of warranty, you can get parts easily, most of the parts are reliable, even the quality of service at Toyota service centers is top notch.

A used Hexa would also make sense but long term reliability is unknown. HEXA gives the best ride quality of segment, and Hexa AT has best tuned AT gearbox of the segment too. A used XTA would have all the bells and whistles.

IMHO, you should pick up an old innova with less than 1 lakh kms on ODO, get it checked at service center for any ODO tampering, accident history, etc After purchase, you can spice up the interiors and ICE, get it serviced at T.A.S.S, change all oils, filters, belts (No need to change the timing belt till the light shows up on instrument cluster).

Fun fact : The V-Belt / Fan belt of innova is costlier than the Timing belt.

V-belt costs 3.2K INR where as Timing belt costs about 2.3K