[mroptimist]

Originally Posted by GTO

Tri Mulyantono drops the following email. Innova owners, please respond:

Even though I am not an Innova Crysta owner, wanted to add certain things which are different between Innova Crysta offered in Indonesian market and in our market.

1. There is no difference between MT Innova Crysta in Indonesia & India, both are offered with 2GD 2.4 Ltr engine with 5 speed gear box. Power & torque figures are also same.

2. When it comes to AT, because of higher taxes on >2.5 ltr engines in Indonesia, Toyota offers AT with 2GD 2.4 Ltr engine only. Whereas in India (& Philippines) it is offered in 2.8 Ltr 1GD engine only. So direct comparison between the AT Innova Crysta's in Indonesia & India may not be appropriate.

3. Even Ford Everest & Toyota Fortuner are not offered with 3.2 Ltr 5 cylinder engine and 2.8 Ltr 1GD engine respectively in Indonesian market for exact same reasons.

4. Fortuner comes only with 2.4 GD in both MT & AT avatars and Everest comes with 2.2 Ltr only (Before Ford wound up Indonesia market operations) in both AT & MT avatars.

Sorry for going OT.

Hope it is relevant.

[rr_zen]

Originally Posted by sridhu

Dont know about the Crysta but on my Innova I had exclusively filled shell diesel for the first 10k or so. The catalytic converter died and was replaced under warranty.

The cause was identified as Shell diesel. Shell & Toyota refused to confirm when I mailed them.

So yeah, be careful.

Wow ! That's some piece of authentic information. I am finding it hard to digest the fact though. Nevertheless, will play it safe. Thanks again mate !

[samabhi]

Originally Posted by GTO

Tri Mulyantono drops the following email. Innova owners, please respond:

I will comment on what I have experienced with my car in the last three months of ownership and driven for close to 6k KMs on both highways and city B2B traffic conditions.

1. The AWR6B45 automatic transmission (used by 1TR, 2TR, 1GD and 2GD engines) behaves erratically. It is often jerky when gliding (when the driver lifts his foot from the gas pedal and uses up the momentum to keep the car forward) around 40-80 km/h. This happens because the transmission upshifts to reduce fuel consumption. It also often downshifts and causes the engine to rev up unnecessarily.

This is correct to an extent, however the jerks are noticed only in Normal and Power Mode, but not in ECO mode. I havent used Power Mode extensively and cannot comment on it, but its evident in Normal Mode. Whenever I take my foot off the accelerator pedal, inorder to coast the vehicle, it jerks forward and this is not noticed at higher speeds.

2. When engine temperature is below operating temp, the turbo attached to 2GD engines produces a whirring sound just like the sound of a kettle full of boiling water or like a wornout bearing. In fact, one user dismantled his turbo and found out that the blade is wobbling in all directions, proof that the bearing is worn out.

I cant comment on this, as this is my first diesel car.

3. There have been several occurrences where the engine is not responding according to pedal movement. In two occurrences in AT transmission, the car is accelerating for around 10 seconds although the driver has lifted his foot from the gas pedal and applied the brake. In another occurrence in the MT transmission, engine is losing power although the gas pedal was pressed. It only returns to response after the driver shifted to neutral for 3 seconds.

I havent observed this in my car so far. The only problem I have found with the transmission is, while trying to gain speeds (in Normal Mode) on highways, the engine doesnt respond to the throttle input at times. I have to release the pedal, let the vehicle coast for couple of seconds and then again press the pedal. Havent tried power mode on the highways as I felt its not necessary. The same detail is covered in the T-BHP official review and I am used to the response of the engine now.

To our disappointment, local Toyota representatives have declared that issue is very rare and does not concern safety, so they are not going to recall the product. They have only done a workaround of remapping the ECU/TCU which consequently causes the engine to work in lower revs and thus lower torque.

There are few issues that are reported by the members on this thread :

- Steering Vibrations at high speeds (I experienced this and also D-BHPian Sankar). Toyota replaced both the front discs under warranty on my car and there was no satisfactory response from them.
- Brake Pads worn out and replaced at 10k KMs service. Reported by only one member and I think its only with the AT variant.
- Shattering of front wind shield, questioning the quality of glass used.
- Quality of Rear Bike Protector which is a Toyota Genuine Accessory. Its a joke to call it a protector as it cannot take minor impacts.

Originally Posted by sridhu

Dont know about the Crysta but on my Innova I had exclusively filled shell diesel for the first 10k or so. The catalytic converter died and was replaced under warranty.

The cause was identified as Shell diesel. Shell & Toyota refused to confirm when I mailed them.

So yeah, be careful.

This is alarming. How can we confirm this?

[Sankar]

Originally Posted by Tri Mulyantono

The reason why I’m reaching out to you is to find out whether you hear any complaints from the all new 2016 Toyota Innova users in India. As you can see, Indonesian online media is swarmed with news regarding several issues on the new Innova that was found by tens to hundreds of users:

1. The AWR6B45 automatic transmission (used by 1TR, 2TR, 1GD and 2GD engines) behaves erratically. It is often jerky when gliding (when the driver lifts his foot from the gas pedal and uses up the momentum to keep the car forward) around 40-80 km/h. This happens because the transmission upshifts to reduce fuel consumption. It also often downshifts and causes the engine to rev up unnecessarily.

2. When engine temperature is below operating temp, the turbo attached to 2GD engines produces a whirring sound just like the sound of a kettle full of boiling water or like a wornout bearing. In fact, one user dismantled his turbo and found out that the blade is wobbling in all directions, proof that the bearing is worn out.

3. There have been several occurrences where the engine is not responding according to pedal movement. In two occurrences in AT transmission, the car is accelerating for around 10 seconds although the driver has lifted his foot from the gas pedal and applied the brake. In another occurrence in the MT transmission, engine is losing power although the gas pedal was pressed. It only returns to response after the driver shifted to neutral for 3 seconds.

To our disappointment, local Toyota representatives have declared that issue is very rare and does not concern safety, so they are not going to recall the product. They have only done a workaround of remapping the ECU/TCU which consequently causes the engine to work in lower revs and thus lower torque.

Me and other Innova users in Indonesia would be grateful if you can help us gather the facts.

Warm regards,

Tri Mulyantono

Let me answer about my experience so far with a Crysta 2.8 1GD AT @ 9300Kms

1) If the vehicle is not in top gear the transmission may shift to the next higher gear based on calculated load when "slightly" lifting off the pedal. When not in a hurry i use this to coax the transmission to shift higher gear. At 40-80KPH the vehicle would be in 3rd, 4th or 5th i guess (have not really noticed)? it would never be in top gear, so this lifting off the pedal will make it shift to +1. As you said its to reduce fuel consumption.

I have noticed the latter also, i.e., too eager to downshift sometimes. This i have noticed only after spirited drive in PWR mode - I come in fast, brake slow down, the transmission shifts down (get some engine braking too out of this), clear the hurdle and accelerate. I can remember it happen only about 3 times in about 10,000Kms i have driven so far.

2) No issues. Would appreciate if you can share the link or pictures of this particular case as reported by the user. How many miles has that vehicle run so far?

3) No haven't had this acceleration issue without throttle input. No issues of losing power momentarily when giving throttle either.

In other news: Should be getting the delivery of my Crysta tomorrow after windshield replacement, brake rotor change and a paint correction of the door they painted last week.

[sridhu]

Isnt the Hilux & the Crysta based on the same platform? So, is this something to worry about?

I had given my Crysta for the 5k service (update on the ownership thread) and thought a quick warning is in order. Please check if the driver side power window button cluster auto lowers AND raises all the windows (Obviously applicable only to Vx & above). In mine, the front passenger window would not come up auto.

The SA told that it is a known problem and a lot of warranty claims have been filed on that.

[geotracks]

To Innova Crysta owners, how many kms (approx.) a Crysta goes on a tankful? This would be typically for a daily city drive with moderate traffic?

The brochure may have tank capacity and we can multiply that by approx. 10 or 11 kmpl and get the approximate distance, but what I am really looking at is how many kms can it be driven (600, 700 kms etc.) between 2 tankful, from ownership experiences. Again, assuming typically owners who would fill up as the needle comes close to empty and not necessarily wait for the low fuel indicator light to come on.

[Sankar]

Originally Posted by geotracks

To Innova Crysta owners, how many kms (approx.) a Crysta goes on a tankful? This would be typically for a daily city drive with moderate traffic?

Around 600-650Kms in one tankful (autocut) on a 2.8 AT on four lane roads. City mode have not really checked.

[samabhi]

Originally Posted by geotracks

To Innova Crysta owners, how many kms (approx.) a Crysta goes on a tankful? This would be typically for a daily city drive with moderate traffic?

The brochure may have tank capacity and we can multiply that by approx. 10 or 11 kmpl and get the approximate distance, but what I am really looking at is how many kms can it be driven (600, 700 kms etc.) between 2 tankful, from ownership experiences. Again, assuming typically owners who would fill up as the needle comes close to empty and not necessarily wait for the low fuel indicator light to come on.

The last two tankfuls with my Crysta 2.8 AT have been in the city completely and with 70% of the drive in bumper to bumper traffic conditions. You can safely assume ~400 Kms for a tankful. I fill up once the fuel empty gauge shows up on the cluster and it takes about 42 Litres of Diesel before the Auto Cut off. FE is varying between 8.5 KMPL to 10.5 KMPL in city driving conditions. On Highway its much better and I get around 11.5 KMPL and the range is around 550 Kms for a tankful (~ 42L). Crysta Fuel tank capacity is 55L.

Originally Posted by Sankar

Around 600-650Kms in one tankful (autocut) on a 2.8 AT on four lane roads. City mode have not really checked.

How many litres do you put in? I presume around 50 Litres. The FE you are getting with your vehicle is pretty good in my opinion.

[Sankar]

Originally Posted by samabhi

How many litres do you put in? I presume around 50 Litres. The FE you are getting with your vehicle is pretty good in my opinion.

I top up till autocut before I start the journey irrespective of the level in the tank so can't really say how much i put in as its variable. FE is satisfactory, gearing is slightly taller after i upgraded to 215/65/16.
--

Brake rotors changed and the pads, saw the old rotors and they are uneven and I was able to feel it with touch. Will get delivery tomorrow after glass sets.

[Vignesh_N/A]

I am sorry for sabotaging this thread. But I just happened to come across a video shared on a similar automotive website based on UK. From my understanding, Toyota Innova shares its platform with the popular pick up truck called "Hilux" in Japan. Apparently they have done this what seemed to be a moose test which tests a cars behavior under hard/sudden maneuvering. It is sort for scary to look at. It would be better if someone proves otherwise with Innova Crysta. Given our road conditions, we cannot just write off this as such. Attaching the video link below.
P.S :- Please correct me if am misleading everyone.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xoHbn8-ROiQ

Here is the link to the source

[Axe77]

Wow. Amazing video. I would imagine this might be telling for someone picking between a fortuner and endeavour. Since the platforms are same for those two vehicles. Not sure about Innova though.

[DicKy]

Originally Posted by Vignesh_N/A

...Toyota Innova shares its platform with the popular pick up truck called "Hilux" in Japan. Apparently they have done this what seemed to be a moose test which tests a cars behavior under hard/sudden maneuvering. It is sort for scary to look at. It would be better if someone proves otherwise with Innova Crysta......

Not arguing for Toyota as they had repeated the same mistake again and should have taken care of the Hilux failing the moose test even after 10 years and a generation later.

But the earlier Innova was also based on the Hilux platform. And no one would say that the Innova had bad or unsafe dynamics.

Ditto with the Innova Crysta. Sure it has lost the car like handling of the old Innova and is now more SUVish.
But, it sits lower to the ground than the Hilux, has a multi link rear suspension and reviews have stated the handling is safe.

So it should be safer than the Hilux for sure, but it is the Fortuner that should be worried about.

P.S- The testing magazine says that the Hilux failed on both occasions due to excessive grip of the tyre and failure of the anti roll systems in keeping the vehicles in check.

[Sankar]

Originally Posted by DicKy

Ditto with the Innova Crysta. Sure it has lost the car like handling of the old Innova and is now more SUVish.
But, it sits lower to the ground than the Hilux, has a multi link rear suspension and reviews have stated the handling is safe.

So it should be safer than the Hilux for sure, but it is the Fortuner that should be worried about.

Although all three vehicles are developed from a single platform derived from previous Prado I believe the dynamics would be different between all three compared to each other with the Innova probably the most anti-rollover prone owing to its lower height. Among the three only Hilux rides on rear leaf springs. Fortuner and Hilux ride high, the former is taller but has a coil spring rear suspension and doesn't need to carry load. Fortuner is taller than the tested Hilux by 2 cm, Hilux is longer than Fortuner by 53.5cm and longer wheelbase by 34cm. With dimensions as different as this only a test can reveal the truth because Point 1 in notes.

Originally Posted by Toyota

Based on all the tests carried out during development, we are confident that the Toyota Hilux is a safe vehicle. As we understand, you have performed an evasive maneuver test according to your magazine testing protocols on several pickups, including the Toyota Hilux. You have informed us that the Toyota Hilux is not living up to your expectations. We were surprised by the test result, and we will take your evaluation very seriously, in the same serious way we do with the capacity for evasive maneuvers in the development of our vehicles. Hilux has been repeatedly tested according to the ISO 3888 standard for evasive maneuver tests during the development of the model and then it passed the tests successfully. Several technical parameters have an impact on the outcome of an evasive maneuver, so we want to better understand the exact parameters for your test.

Bengt Dalström, General Manager
External Affairs/PR, Toyota Sweden AB

Src: http://teknikensvarld.se/the-new-toy...g-over-338223/


Notes:

1. 4x4 17" wheeled Hilux is "minutely" "slighlty" "wee" bit shorter than 18" wheeled version tested and has a higher profile tyre. And the swedes say "A few days later, we got to test another Hilux with standard 17 inch tires in size 265/65. Once again the Hilux lifts the inside wheel, but less than the other car." Src: http://teknikensvarld.se/the-new-toy...g-over-338223/
   
2. 4x2 16" wheeled Hilux rides even lower, a massive difference of about 11.5cm difference in height in comparison to the model tested by Swedes, so it will perform differently possibly better.

Specs:
18" Wheel 4x4
http://www.toyota.com.au/hilux/speci...-diesel-manual

17" Wheel 4x4
http://www.toyota.com.au/hilux/speci...-diesel-manual

16" wheel 4x2
http://www.toyota.com.au/hilux/speci...-diesel-manual

Fortuner
http://www.toyota.com.au/fortuner/sp...uner-gx-manual

[Vignesh_N/A]

Originally Posted by Axe77

Not sure about Innova though.

They all belong to Toyota IMV Platform. There are differences among them.

Originally Posted by DicKy

But, it sits lower to the ground than the Hilux, has a multi link rear suspension and reviews have stated the handling is safe.

Originally Posted by DicKy

So it should be safer than the Hilux for sure, but it is the Fortuner that should be worried about.

Adding to the fact that Hilux uses leaf springs for rear, that could mean a world of difference. But given how well the ford ranger and D max performed with similar suspension system, Hilux is in deep trouble.

Note to MOD: Since the above content adds very little information to this thread, please move to a relevant thread.

[samabhi]

Originally Posted by Sankar

I top up till autocut before I start the journey irrespective of the level in the tank so can't really say how much i put in as its variable. FE is satisfactory, gearing is slightly taller after i upgraded to 215/65/16.
--

Brake rotors changed and the pads, saw the old rotors and they are uneven and I was able to feel it with touch. Will get delivery tomorrow after glass sets.

Sankar, have you checked the vehicle braking under high speeds after the rotors are changed? Also have you taken any pictures of the old rotors?

I haven't tested at high speeds, but checked at 80 - 100 KMPH speeds, there is no steering vibration now.