[Boomerang]

Went for a test drive yesterday. I was floored by how easy it is manoeuvre this vehicle.

A few observations in no particular order:

. Suspension is very good. Though the rear is bumpy, like most of us know, unladen
. Steering is mighty heavy. Highways would not be a concern but U-Turns and tight corners would need an extra pair of biceps
. Clutch is my favourite. Amazing response
. Gearshift is good. Stalk could've been shorter. But hey! this is a pickup
. Quality of plastic reminds me of VW quality
. Roomy
. Seats though slender are supportive and comfortable. Back ones lack under thigh support
. Legroom's vast in the back. Incline, like most mentioned, could be a problem; well, that's what i thought too. To my surprise, it was not bad. Its side cushioning (like wraps the passenger) may have done the trick. i am not sure
. Vehicle is solid and of supreme quality. This something you can pass on to generations
. Milage? - you should not worry, if you do, you are looking at the wrong vehicle

Questions:

1. Is fitment of D Box in the aftermarket done well?
2. Should one go for Company stereo or aftermarket? I am concerned about the fitment finish than saving money factor
3. How practically useful is round side step?

Thanks Guys.

[Kandisa]

Originally Posted by Boomerang

Went for a test drive yesterday. I was floored by how easy it is manoeuvre this vehicle.

It is indeed not so difficult to manoeuvre in spite of the humongous proportion, except parking at tight places.

A few observations in no particular order:
. Seats though slender are supportive and comfortable. Back ones lack under thigh support

A bit of padding should improve the under thigh support.

. Incline, like most mentioned, could be a problem; well, that's what i thought too. To my surprise, it was not bad. Its side cushioning (like wraps the passenger) may have done the trick. i am not sure

Exactly. The rear seats are not that bad as usually projected to be. The contours at the back are also smartly designed.

. Vehicle is solid and of supreme quality. This something you can pass on to generations

Precisely the main point where it scores over the other 'normal' choices in similar price range.

Though I am not yet an owner of Vcross but based on some information gathered, would try to reply to your queries in italics.

1. Is fitment of D Box in the aftermarket done well?

I guess yes.

2. Should one go for Company stereo or aftermarket? I am concerned about the fitment finish than saving money factor

Fitment part should be properly taken care of by dealership. Basically the cost of the OEM unit is not proportionate with the quality. Probably it is better to look for an aftermarket accessory shop who have done fitment on a Vcross.

3. How practically useful is round side step?

If you are referring to one of the OEM round side step, the width is too narrow. It would definitely give some protection to the body but won't be much useful for the ingress & egress support purpose. Quite a good no of aftermarket options are available for the side steps at different price level and probably better to choose from those than the OEM accessory. In general price of the accessories are not cheap though.

[tazmaan]

Originally Posted by nvldvr

Good to see you have fun with your V Cross. You are indeed putting it to good use.
How has service experience with Isuzu been? Can you please share cost of service and parts cost etc?

Thanks. The 2nd service for 10000 kms cost me approx 10000 rupees since gear oil, both differential oil has to be changed as per schedule. Also I insisted for engine oil change.

Originally Posted by Kandisa

Great to know. Any issues at the inter-state check posts or Toll booths?

No issues at all. I was also apprehensive about in initially but after doing Madhya Pradesh, Goa, Rajasthan, Gujarat, Delhi, Uttar Pradesh and Uttarakhand I am not worried anymore.

I was stopped at Ahmedabad this time on my return journey but all the cars with out of state registration were being stopped for Alcohol check. It had nothing to do with the car.

[Kandisa]

Originally Posted by tazmaan

Thanks. The 2nd service for 10000 kms cost me approx 10000 rupees since gear oil, both differential oil has to be changed as per schedule. Also I insisted for engine oil change.

Was anything in particular looked at during this previous check at 5000 km?
Also what was the response of the service centre on the oil change you insisted? There were some apprehension about the long oil change interval i.e. whether such an interval is realistic for Indian conditions. Finally how much was charged for the engine oil?

...No issues at all. I was also apprehensive about in initially but after doing Madhya Pradesh, Goa, Rajasthan, Gujarat, Delhi, Uttar Pradesh and Uttarakhand I am not worried anymore.

Great

[Hondaism]

Originally Posted by Kandisa

Was anything in particular looked at during this previous check at 5000 km?
Also what was the response of the service centre on the oil change you insisted? There were some apprehension about the long oil change interval i.e. whether such an interval is realistic for Indian conditions. Finally how much was charged for the engine oil?

Great

Even i had the engine oil changed during the 10k service, the service center guys just suggested that Isuzu recommends change at 20k interval however didn't have any issue in changing the engine oil and it cost approx 2k for the engine oil.

As far as the 5k service is concerned, its nothing but a tightening of nuts and bolts along with a wash.

Originally Posted by CDM

I am planning to get myself a V-Cross and use it as an expedition vehicle. My trusty Innova which had taken me all over India from Ladakh to Kutch had approached the 10 year mark and had to let it go.

I test drove the V-Cross and did not find the ride all that bad (despite my having a back issue) altough it does not come near the Innova.

Wanted advice on upgrading the tyres wihout compromising the ride comfort or suspension dynamics. I was thinking of two options; first, same size AT tyres (245 X 70, R16) and second, 265 X 70, R16, again AT tyres.

Also, does anyone have any knowledge about who is offering good quality canopies / lids as the ones available in Delhi are rather crude.

Any and all suggestions are welcome!

CDM

I have 255x65x16 Continental Cross Contact AT Tyres running on my vcross, which is the closest possible upsize, however i felt that the vehicle has lowered a bit due to the sidewall being smaller. Otherwise its an awesome tire to have and the tread is also quite aggressive looking, which suits the truck.

Go for the imported Canopies and lids, not with the locally manufactured ones, as the local fabricators havent been able to master it for the Vcross as yet.

Two guys in Delhi i know are dealing the canopy/lid are Azad 4x4 ( Inu Chaddha) and BImbra ( Taran Bimbra)

Originally Posted by Kandisa

Yes they claim it to be either Fujitsu or Blaupunkt make.
Thats good gesture at the dealer's end. Could you share some of those not so expensive HU models with navigation, compatible with the in-built steering control? Also is the reverse camera fitted after drilling in the rear bumper, (which is made of metal)?

All Pioneer head units are compatible with the steering wheel functions as you can individually assign the functions which the steering buttons control in the Head Unit.

[Hondaism]

Originally Posted by Jaggu

BINGO!! and little more of power would make it perfect! Everyone was complaining about the size of the vehicle and always discouraged me, but after i did the test drive, these ^^ were my exact thoughts.

Infact am also seriously considering moving from Thar to V Cross if finances work out. Definitely i would go for the remap, since the stock vehicle was too slow for my liking, coming from a Code 6 remapped Thar

Otherwise it would make perfect sense, for offroad trail driving plus some intercity run's for which i use the 4 wheeler these days. It is comfortable, refined, has decent safety equipment and can carry the bike behind if i become too greedy with my wish list!

Even I had transitioned from a Thar to a Vcross and having owned the Vcross for almost 10 months now, i can say that overall the product is generally good, however service support and high cost of spares are a bummer. I mean which Adventure Utility Vehicle has a set of brake pads for INR 9k and lasts only about 15-20k kilometers? That means i have to set aside around INR 50k just for the brake pads every 1 lakh kilometer. There are also some known cases wherein the brakes pads have disintegrated in 8k-12k kms.


There are various more issues which are prevalent and can be explained in detail some other time. I do hope Isuzu takes the feedback into consideration and starts working on resolutions before its too late.

[Jaggu]

Originally Posted by Hondaism

There are various more issues which are prevalent and can be explained in detail some other time. I do hope Isuzu takes the feedback into consideration and starts working on resolutions before its too late.

I think this should not wait and you should share ASAP for the benefit of the community I for one is actively scouting for a pre-owned one and will really help me decide.

[tazmaan]

Originally Posted by Hondaism

however service support and high cost of spares are a bummer. I mean which Adventure Utility Vehicle has a set of brake pads for INR 9k and lasts only about 15-20k kilometers?

There are various more issues which are prevalent and can be explained in detail some other time. I do hope Isuzu takes the feedback into consideration and starts working on resolutions before its too late.

I am also surprised at early wear of brake pads reported by other V-cross owners. Here in Mumbai they are priced at INR 8000/- AFIK. One of our v-cross group members declined to change the brake pads and have ordered OEM Brembo brake pads for INR 5000/-. I am waiting for him to use them and give an opinion.

As an owner of V-cross I would like to know what other niggles/issues you have faced.

[mani]

Originally Posted by tazmaan

I am also surprised at early wear of brake pads reported by other V-cross owners. Here in Mumbai they are priced at INR 8000/- AFIK. One of our v-cross group members declined to change the brake pads and have ordered OEM Brembo brake pads for INR 5000/-. I am waiting for him to use them and give an opinion.

As an owner of V-cross I would like to know what other niggles/issues you have faced.

Hi there

The OEM pads are priced exhorbitantly especially given their extremely limited lifespan @ ₹8k. A number of Vcross owners are reporting failed pads at as little as sub 10k kms. It's unacceptable for a vehicle being touted as an adventure utility vehicle. It's not happening on all trucks but yet a sizeable number of trucks are affected.

Unfortunately, Isuzu instead of addressing the problem proactively, is at the moment palming off the blame onto the owners' driving habits. That's a little silly because most people affected also own Endeavours/Fortuners etc and those vehicles driven by the same owners are returning pads that last an average of 40-50k kms.

I've complied a mini database of owners affected by failed pads (at an insignificant number on the odo) and other niggles, minor and major. I'm traveling at the moment, but shall put that database on this wonderful forum for the benefit of the larger community.

Whether these problems are the result of poor quality control, erratic SOPs for vendors or plain negligence, it definitely is in Isuzu's realm to conduct a serious investigation and in the interim replace pads of all those who have suffered failed pads and in some cases failed rotors (which I believe are an additional ₹13k a piece) and paid through their nose to buy new ones. It doesn't behove Isuzu, which in most markets, is synonymous with bullet proof reliability to be proffering excuses like poor driving habits to the Indian consumer.

People like me who have bought this truck have bought more than a truck. We've bought into the unbreakable reliability of Isuzu which is on offer primarily in the Thai, Australian and British, among other international markets. I cannot think of a single reason why Isuzu thinks the Indian consumer does not deserve the same quality offered in other markets.

I've heard many a people from the Isuzu's herd comment that the truck is so cheaply priced that's it's a bang for the buck. I totally agree, I love my truck and I love the way it looks. But, to say that because it's being offered at a sedan like price, it gives Isuzu the freedom to shortchange it's customers, is not just unethical but also unlawful. Pricing is in Isuzu's domain,a strategy to sell trucks in a hitherto unsuccessful product category in India - at which they have been more than successful wth the Vcross.

However,to expect consumers who end up paying almost ₹18-20L on road for a truck, to understand that is liable to fail on some key attributes which could be the result of localisation, of poor quality spare parts is unfair and amounts to hoodwinking a consumer who trusts brand Isuzu. No doubt the engine is a gem, but since no one is buying the engine separately to be used as in the 1800 ISZ Amby iteration, it's incumbent upon Isuzu to ensure the whole package works, works well, and works well in EACH AND EVERY truck they sell.

There can't be a law of averages, not unless some trucks are being gifted. Isuzu, as a reliable manufacturer owes a duty to each person who buys their truck. There can be no exceptions. And being a machine that it is, things may go wrong, but then Isuzu needs to unabashedly and singularly honour and go beyond its warranties instead of throwing technicalities and small print at consumers.

There are other issues, which I'll address in a day or two. This post is to be continued..

[Hondaism]

Originally Posted by tazmaan

I am also surprised at early wear of brake pads reported by other V-cross owners. Here in Mumbai they are priced at INR 8000/- AFIK. One of our v-cross group members declined to change the brake pads and have ordered OEM Brembo brake pads for INR 5000/-. I am waiting for him to use them and give an opinion.



As an owner of V-cross I would like to know what other niggles/issues you have faced.

We as owners won't know if the issue is in the brake pads or the rotors. It's for the Isuzu team to get into the thick of things and investigate the reason for early wear and tear. Also, the brake pads are 8k before tax, after tax it works out to approx 9k.

Could be that isuzu turns around and tells your friend that the warranty of the vehicle is void having used non-OEM brake pads even though all dealerships are enticing customers by showcasing heavily modded vehicles in terms of tyres and rims which are 15-20% above stock limits.

My vcross has been driven 14k kms and now I've started to feel shuddering of the steering wheel only while braking above speeds of 80 kmph. 4 hours later and after 4 different people from the workshop taking a test drive I'm told to come the next day to assess "other areas". This despite telling the service advisor (Krishna Isuzu) that the issue can be attributable to primarily 3 things -
1. Brake pads worn out (which isn't the case)
2. Rotor being uneven (which they didn't check)
3. Tie rod ends being worn out ( which they didn't check)
4. Balancing is already fine

Referred to paramount gurgaon as I had to travel the following day. Told to come after a week as the concerned guy is not in town.

Roof rail cover of my vehicle also flew off while driving. Went to paramount gurgaon, and they courteously changed the roof rails, however while taking the roof rail off the mechanic put a dent on the A pillar which can't be repaired without filling in putty and that's something I won't allow on a fairly new vehicle. Also the roof rails now have clear visible gaps in them and look hideous.

The passenger side airbag cover has started to lose its black colour and doesn't look like an integrated part of the dashboard anymore.

Got brake pads checked from paramount gurgaon and they said 3.8 mm left, 2-3 weeks later got it checked from Krishna mohali and they said 5.3 mm left. Reason for difference ? Because there is no standardisation and SOPs being followed. Paramount is measuring from the air gap in the brake pad air vent and Krishna from the side. Now which one is correct ??

To top it all write an email to isuzu india and it goes unnoticed, it's been a week now since I sent an email to them however all I get after 3 days of follow-up response I get is " We acknowledge having received your email on the concern of break pad. We have forwarded your concern to the appropriate team for addressing it.". That's about it.

Dead air till now. No further response.

[Jaggu]

Originally Posted by mani

Hi there

The OEM pads are priced exhorbitantly especially given their extremely limited lifespan @ ₹8k.
====
There are other issues, which I'll address in a day or two. This post is to be continued..

Originally Posted by Hondaism

We as owners won't know if the issue is in the brake pads or the rotors.
==
Dead air till now. No further response.

Terrible to hear such feedbacks, do you guys have pics of the worn out brake pads. It's a heavy vehicle but still with the limited power it has, it ain't a super car to chew pads at short notice. I can understand if it happens to a premium bike with very high speeds and stopping power. Not from a reliable truck!

Something seriously off with regards to the OE pads I guess.

[mani]

Originally Posted by Jaggu

Terrible to hear such feedbacks, do you guys have pics of the worn out brake pads. It's a heavy vehicle but still with the limited power it has, it ain't a super car to chew pads at short notice. I can understand if it happens to a premium bike with very high speeds and stopping power. Not from a reliable truck!

Something seriously off with regards to the OE pads I guess.

If you read my previous posts, I'm one of the greatest defenders of the Isuzu vcross. My greatest defence of them is I bought the truck.At the time of launch, and having driven the truck intentionally, i knew how good it is. I naturally assumed, the same quality would be offered here. And that's what's ranking with me, is Isuzu's stubborness at not even acknowledging the problem.

Isuzu India need to replace brake pads that last anything less than 30k kms for free ELSE it seems they are starting another revenue stream by first subsidizing the truck, to sell it, and then making money on EXHORBITANTLY priced spare parts that don't even last half as much as parts on similarly sized vehicles like Fortuner, Endeavour, Scorpio or XUV.

So the maths is

Truck cost 13.5L
Insurance. 60k average pushed by dealers
BASIC accesory pack. 2L.
Road tax 1.5L average

So basic on road cost without investing in any fancy accessories is approximately ₹17.5L. No mean figure,I daresay.

Now brake pads cost:
9k incl tax

The average persons truck:

driven 36k kms/year
= 4 pads changes every year.

4pads = ₹36k RECURRING cost every year of ownership.

So basically ₹1 extra paid to Isuzu for every km driven. So if an expeditionist drives 70k kms in a year, he pays ₹70k to Isuzu in brake pads for that year.

That's a brilliant earning at the customer's expense. The more each customer drives, the more Isuzu earns? Surely that can't be the business model of a world class manufacturer?

Such a wide variance in brake pad failure cannot be attributed merely to driving styles across a wide base.
Most people who own the truck own other vehicles and have definitely owned other vehicles in the past. To say that 70% of brake pads failing at 10k kms average, is attributable solely to driving styles is complete abdication of its duty to consumers by Isuzu.

How did team Isuzu arrive at this conclusion of poor driving style?

Was an empirical study conducted to study the driving styles of each consumer who reported failed pads?

Did Isuzu compare it with industry standard for similarly sized vehicles?

For a world class manufacturer to talk down to customers without any scientific or study based conclusion is preposterous and irresponsible and can never stand the scrutiny of law or ethics.

Isuzu needs to do what it would in any international market:
1. Acknowledge the problem
2. Investigate the problem.
3. Standardise the vendor QC procedures.
3. Either recall affected trucks or refund money of those who've paid for changed pads and/or rotors.

Brake pads issue is just one of the issues at the moment. Many customers are reporting issues with shock absorbers and other mechanical problems. Once the initial euphoria of ownership dies down and problems emerge, a responsible manufacturer should address those problems rather than plead deniability, without an investigation.

To be continued..

[tazmaan]

Originally Posted by Hondaism

We as owners won't know if the issue is in the brake pads or the rotors. It's for the Isuzu team to get into the thick of things and investigate the reason for early wear and tear. Also, the brake pads are 8k before tax, after tax it works out to approx 9k.

Could be that isuzu turns around and tells your friend that the warranty of the vehicle is void having used non-OEM brake pads even though all dealerships are enticing customers by showcasing heavily modded vehicles in terms of tyres and rims which are 15-20% above stock limits.


1. Brake pads worn out (which isn't the case)
2. Rotor being uneven (which they didn't check)




Dead air till now. No further response.

In all probability the rotors are warped. My Honda Accord got this issue in the first 5000 kms of ownership and brakes are not covered under warranty. It usually happens due to overheating of brakes or if you keep the brakes engaged after a good braking session (for example traffic lights).

I feel another way to keep a check on brake pad life is to keep an eye on the brake fluid levels. As the brake pads wear the brake fluid levels fall (assuming there are no leaks). When the level falls between max and min level, its time to physically inspect the brake pads. Mine is slightly below the max level right now at almost 14000 kms. (This is what I have observed from my experience I don't have any paper to back the above method)

You have faced a few issues and the dealer doesn't seem to ease your woes. Touch wood, I don't have any issues so far.

[r_nairtvm]

Originally Posted by Hondaism

Went to paramount gurgaon, and they courteously changed the roof rails, however while taking the roof rail off the mechanic put a dent on the A pillar which can't be repaired without filling in putty and that's something I won't allow on a fairly new vehicle.

I am not commenting on the issues with V Cross, which indeed are really shameful, but to point out a solution available to the specific problem you have as highlighted above.

PDR - Paintless Dent Repair - which is now available in many places in India including in and around NCR. I know it will cost money but is the solution you need if you are bothered about it.

There are lot of threads in TBHP itself and one such is as follows;

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...nt-repair.html

Hope this is useful

Best Regards & Drive Safe

Ram

[Kandisa]

Originally Posted by Hondaism

Even I had transitioned from a Thar to a Vcross and having owned the Vcross for almost 10 months now, i can say that overall the product is generally good, however service support and high cost of spares are a bummer. I mean which Adventure Utility Vehicle has a set of brake pads for INR 9k and lasts only about 15-20k kilometers?

..There are various more issues which are prevalent and can be explained in detail some other time. I do hope Isuzu takes the feedback into consideration and starts working on resolutions before its too late.

Originally Posted by mani

.. A number of Vcross owners are reporting failed pads at as little as sub 10k kms. It's unacceptable for a vehicle being touted as an adventure utility vehicle. It's not happening on all trucks but yet a sizeable number of trucks are affected.
Unfortunately, Isuzu instead of addressing the problem proactively, is at the moment palming off the blame onto the owners' driving habits.

Oh no, just when it looked that finally a mechanically reliable 4x4 of international standard at a good price has arrived in India, things have started taking not-so-good turns and I am literally shocked to say the least!

..Whether these problems are the result of poor quality control, erratic SOPs for vendors or plain negligence, it definitely is in Isuzu's realm to conduct a serious investigation and in the interim replace pads of all those who have suffered failed pads and in some cases failed rotors (which I believe are an additional ₹13k a piece) and paid through their nose to buy new ones. It doesn't behove Isuzu, which in most markets, is synonymous with bullet proof reliability to be proffering excuses like poor driving habits to the Indian consumer.

People like me who have bought this truck have bought more than a truck. We've bought into the unbreakable reliability of Isuzu which is on offer primarily in the Thai, Australian and British, among other international markets. I cannot think of a single reason why Isuzu thinks the Indian consumer does not deserve the same quality offered in other markets.

Absolutely. If there is one prime reason why this vehicle is getting such attention, it is only because of that feeling of ultimate reliability. The sooner Isuzu understands this the better.

I've heard many a people from the Isuzu's herd comment that the truck is so cheaply priced that's it's a bang for the buck. I totally agree, I love my truck and I love the way it looks. But, to say that because it's being offered at a sedan like price, it gives Isuzu the freedom to shortchange it's customers, is not just unethical but also unlawful.

Absolutely unacceptable thoughts from Isuzu. This kind of mentality will only ruin the long term prospects of the brand in the country and really it doesn't go well with the history & pedigree of the company. They must understand if this one factor of reliability is taken off from the scene, there are cheaper and more versatile products available in similar price range. And by the way, the product is not exactly cheap if that is the misconception they are carrying!

Originally Posted by Hondaism

...My vcross has been driven 14k kms and now I've started to feel shuddering of the steering wheel only while braking above speeds of 80 kmph.

Roof rail cover of my vehicle also flew off while driving.

The passenger side airbag cover has started to lose its black colour and doesn't look like an integrated part of the dashboard anymore.

..To top it all write an email to isuzu india and it goes unnoticed, it's been a week now since I sent an email to them however all I get after 3 days of follow-up response I get is " We acknowledge having received your email on the concern of break pad. We have forwarded your concern to the appropriate team for addressing it.". That's about it.
Dead air till now. No further response.

Originally Posted by mani

...My greatest defence of them is I bought the truck.At the time of launch, and having driven the truck intentionally, i knew how good it is. I naturally assumed, the same quality would be offered here. And that's what's ranking with me, is Isuzu's stubborness at not even acknowledging the problem.

...For a world class manufacturer to talk down to customers without any scientific or study based conclusion is preposterous and irresponsible and can never stand the scrutiny of law or ethics.

Brake pads issue is just one of the issues at the moment. Many customers are reporting issues with shock absorbers and other mechanical problems. Once the initial euphoria of ownership dies down and problems emerge, a responsible manufacturer should address those problems rather than plead deniability, without an investigation.
..

If Isuzu wants to intentionally bring down its standard for the Indian version of the product then it is really shameful. Isuzu has an extremely limited service network but still people like me are ready to take the plunge only because they have an assurance that the kind of mechanical reliability the vehicle has (supposedly) there won't be much requirements of going to the service centre other than the regular check-ups. But if mechanical issues start developing like the other SUVs in similar price range, what is the point of taking the risk! If localization of the parts are done only with a mandate of cost reduction sacrificing the QA part, then it will be totally lost case for Isuzu in very near future. Really it is extremely disappointing & disheartening to know all these!