[manpreetsj]

Sad that this forum will not see the kind of response Kushaq got. Now with Xuv700, Mahindra has stolen the limelight. Reminds me about durga puja, when a new concept based pandal of nearby locality makes you forget about your own para's pandal.

It will be interesting to know how VAG group will react to this new reality. (1) Will they prepone the launch timelines, to ensure they are able to sell few units to its fans and very few ramaining converts from Koreans? Or (2) Price Taigun very aggressively, slightly above Sonet/Venue (highly unlikely) Or (3) continue as is, assuming nothing much can be done now and they have lost the game even after having so much time in hands to deliver their best at right price.

PS - TROC should have been Indianised to extent possible and launched instead of Taigun - would have saved VW time and we would have gotten a wider car and brilliant looking digital cockpit (Not the cheap one of Taigun).

[amvj]

Originally Posted by manpreetsj

Sad that this forum will not see the kind of response Kushaq got. Now with Xuv700, Mahindra has stolen the limelight. Reminds me about durga puja, when a new concept based pandal of nearby locality makes you forget about your own para's pandal.

It will be interesting to know how VAG group will react to this new reality. (1) Will they prepone the launch timelines, to ensure they are able to sell few units to its fans and very few ramaining converts from Koreans? Or (2) Price Taigun very aggressively, slightly above Sonet/Venue (highly unlikely) Or (3) continue as is, assuming nothing much can be done now and they have lost the game even after having so much time in hands to deliver their best at right price.

I don’t think VW will reduce the price. Despite selling in very minuscule figure, Vento is still selling for 17+ Lakhs for top end auto in Bangalore.

The problem with VW is, they want to portray themselves as a premium brand (nothing bad in general) and another problem is the marketing people in those companies are disconnected from Indian customer expectations. They have done lots of localisations for the Kushaq and Taigun but priced like usual import stuff with less features. The nail in the coffin is the small overall size and small engine.

I see the comparison in Carwale, the differences are day and night at least on paper. God save the VW in India.

[mandarpotdar]

Originally Posted by mandarpotdar

As I had registered by interest for Taigun on VW website, I got call yesterday from a dealer. I told I want to drive 1.5 DSG before making any decision and he promptly offered T-Roc for test drive. I will be taking the test drive this Saturday. Hope it does not spoil me by making Taigun look too bad..

I had already test driven Kushaq 1.0 AT few days back. So know the inside size, boot space and ride to expect from Taigun.

Took the test drive of T-Roc yesterday, just to check the engine-gearbox. Loved the 1.5 DSG. Like mentioned in many reviews, it puts a smile on the face

Went ahead with pre-booking Taigun. Registered for 1.5 DSG in yellow. This will most probably be my last conventional-fuel car, so why not?

[rkaria1970]

Are there going to be non GT variants of 1.5 TSI DSG for the VW Taigun?

Also how many variants of 1 TSI AT would there be in the Taigun?

Will it undercut the price of Kushaq or will it sit on a more premium table above it?

I am really digging in for the VW Taigun inspite of the glass shattering prices of XUV 700 because I don't need such a big car for my city driving & occasional highways needs, also I don't have such a huge parking space for the XUV 700, plus wife occasionally drives the car, though I really like what M&M has done with the design and pricing of the XUV 700.

[07CR]

Originally Posted by manpreetsj

It will be interesting to know how VAG group will react to this new reality. (1) Will they prepone the launch timelines, to ensure they are able to sell few units to its fans and very few ramaining converts from Koreans? Or (2) Price Taigun very aggressively, slightly above Sonet/Venue (highly unlikely) Or (3) continue as is, assuming nothing much can be done now and they have lost the game even after having so much time in hands to deliver their best at right price.

I believe they will go with 3rd option. To be honest, IMO both the VW twins are quite overpriced at what they offer. Add to this the market disruptive pricing of XUV700, they surely can't try to counter both. They either correct their own pricing and then think of a way to counter the XUV's pricing. While they can correct their pricing by about 2 lakhs, the threat posed by XUV's price is just too much and I feel, will spell doom for 2.0 project of VW in India.

[nitkel]

Originally Posted by 07CR

I believe they will go with 3rd option. To be honest, IMO both the VW twins are quite overpriced at what they offer. Add to this the market disruptive pricing of XUV700, they surely can't try to counter both. They either correct their own pricing and then think of a way to counter the XUV's pricing. While they can correct their pricing by about 2 lakhs, the threat posed by XUV's price is just too much and I feel, will spell doom for 2.0 project of VW in India.

True. No matter what approach they take, it will be very hard for VAG to sell more than 3-4k Taiguns and Kushaqs consistently every month now! They have just seen all their profits walk out of the door and into Mahindra showrooms. It will be a challenge to recover their 2.0 investments at this rate IMO.

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Originally Posted by rkaria1970

Are there going to be non GT variants of 1.5 TSI DSG for the VW Taigun?

Also how many variants of 1 TSI AT would there be in the Taigun?

1.5 variants are badged GT. There will be no non-GT 1.5 variants available, though the GT itself will be available in at least two trims - a mid spec and top-spec.

No confirmation is provided on the variant distribution - but most likely to have three variants of the 1.0 TSI - just as in the Kushaq.

Originally Posted by rkaria1970

Will it undercut the price of Kushaq or will it sit on a more premium table above it?

Don't think Volkswagen can play the premium card above Kushaq - because even the top-end GT DSG (which gains 6 airbags, TPMS and digital instrument console over the Kushaq) misses out on some features present in the Kushaq such as a good audio system with subwoofer, leather seats with ventilation etc.

It is just a different feature-set and not a more premium package over the Kushaq. If VW thinks otherwise (especially in the aftermath of the XUV 7OO pricing onslaught) - they are only kidding themselves.

The VAG twins already had a very 'narrowed down' customer base who were willing to look past the Koreans and Chinese players. Now with the XUV 7OO - that market just got reduced by a big margin.

[sreenath13]

Need some expert opinion here. I am so confused between the Kushaq and the Taigun, so much so that I have actually booked both. The 1.0 TSI is adequate enough for me and hence the 1.0 TSI Style variant of Kushaq. While the variant level break up is not available yet for the Taigun, I am hearing no subwoofer and leatherette instead of leather in Kushaq, any thing else that will make this decision for me ?

1.) Is the Taigun stock audio system decent enough, I know this is subjective, but any comparison we can make with existing cars, Vento may be ?

2.) I prefer the exterior styling of the Kushaq but love the interiors of the Taigun - So if I do make the choice of Kushaq, will I miss a lot by not having the half baked albeit still cool digital cockpit

3.) Skoda ASS vs VW ASS - I have both dealers in my city, so is this a differentiator ?

Again, I know a lot of this is subjective but I have been booking and cancelling cars for the last 6 months and Kushaq was what I had narrowed down to until the Taigun launched. This choice is driving me crazy. Kushaq is likely to be delivered around end of September and thats when the price of Taigun will be announced too. I am dreaming that VW will miraculously price the 1.5 DSG as a reasonable bump from my Kushaq style variant, but of course we know how dreams go

[NT56]

I don't think XUV700 launch changes much for the VAG target market. People who wanted Suv presence and features were anyways going to Koreans or Tata, now these people might prefer the XUV700. Only people preferring petrol cars with small footprint and decent dynamics would be interested in VAG crossovers and that still doesn't change IMO.

[rkaria1970]

Originally Posted by sreenath13

Need some expert opinion here. I am so confused between the Kushaq and the Taigun, so much so that I have actually booked both. The 1.0 TSI is adequate enough for me and hence the 1.0 TSI Style variant of Kushaq. While the variant level break up is not available yet for the Taigun, I am hearing no subwoofer and leatherette instead of leather in Kushaq, any thing else that will make this decision for me ?

1.) Is the Taigun stock audio system decent enough, I know this is subjective, but any comparison we can make with existing cars, Vento may be ?

2.) I prefer the exterior styling of the Kushaq but love the interiors of the Taigun - So if I do make the choice of Kushaq, will I miss a lot by not having the half baked albeit still cool digital cockpit

3.) Skoda ASS vs VW ASS - I have both dealers in my city, so is this a differentiator ?

Again, I know a lot of this is subjective but I have been booking and cancelling cars for the last 6 months and Kushaq was what I had narrowed down to until the Taigun launched. This choice is driving me crazy. Kushaq is likely to be delivered around end of September and thats when the price of Taigun will be announced too. I am dreaming that VW will miraculously price the 1.5 DSG as a reasonable bump from my Kushaq style variant, but of course we know how dreams go

World over VW is priced just above Skoda, thats what a youtube reviewer mentioned in his Taigun review and said that the Taigun might be priced 2-5% above Kushaq. Also, Ashish Gupta the Indian head of VW when quizzed about the pricing of Taigun in one of the recent interviews, just smiled and said that they would like to continue with the PREMIUM tag for VW Taigun.

Hope VW guys see the pricing of XUV 700 and do some cource correction and atleast offer a one time substantial launch offer discount to get high volume bookings,though this is just a wishful thinking.

PS, I have alreday done the booking for the Taigun 1 TCI which is fully refundable.

[07CR]

Originally Posted by NT56

I don't think XUV700 launch changes much for the VAG target market. People who wanted Suv presence and features were anyways going to Koreans or Tata, now these people might prefer the XUV700. Only people preferring petrol cars with small footprint and decent dynamics would be interested in VAG crossovers and that still doesn't change IMO.

IMO the 200 PS vs 150 PS and 380NM vs 250NM changes a lot of things, atleast for me!

[amvj]

Originally Posted by NT56

I don't think XUV700 launch changes much for the VAG target market. People who wanted Suv presence and features were anyways going to Koreans or Tata, now these people might prefer the XUV700. Only people preferring petrol cars with small footprint and decent dynamics would be interested in VAG crossovers and that still doesn't change IMO.

While I agree with you regarding cars with small footprint / small size. Some people want that due to space constraints.

However, the so called VAG target market is all very miniscule in this country. VW initially wants to capture 20% market when they entered. Now they have a market share of less than 3%. While it feels proud to say it targets a different audience, it is no Bentley or Aston. Is it just a crossover segment.

There is no need for VW to atrociously over price their cars since VW specifically mentioned that both Taigun and Kushaq are having highly localized components compared to other models. Both Citroen and Jeep (Compass) have done that with over-pricing and are failing miserably.



Nobody will make cars for few enthusiasts. At the end of the day it is all about making money and profits. Our country is not Europe or China, at the end of the day most of us don't want cheap cars but value rich cars.

Companies who enter this country does not seem to understand this. That is why we see companies failing with cheap brands (Datsun) or 'pretentious prestige' brand (Citroen) without any underlying stuff.

[NT56]

Originally Posted by 07CR

IMO the 200 PS vs 150 PS and 380NM vs 250NM changes a lot of things, atleast for me!

I have followed the Kushaq thread too and from your responses there I felt you like the proposition of creta/seltos more. I guess I was wrong. Yeah there is a lot more power and also lot more weight/size. It will be great if the Xuv700 is fun to drive, more good options for consumers

Originally Posted by amvj

While I agree with you regarding cars with small footprint / small size. Some people want that due to space constraints.

However, the so called VAG target market is all very miniscule in this country. VW initially wants to capture 20% market when they entered. Now they have a market share of less than 3%. While it feels proud to say it targets a different audience, it is no Bentley or Aston. Is it just a crossover segment.

There is no need for VW to atrociously over price their cars since VW specifically mentioned that both Taigun and Kushaq are having highly localized components compared to other models. Both Citroen and Jeep (Compass) have done that with over-pricing and are failing miserably.

Nobody will make cars for few enthusiasts. At the end of the day it is all about making money and profits. Our country is not Europe or China, at the end of the day most of us don't want cheap cars but value rich cars.

Companies who enter this country does not seem to understand this. That is why we see companies failing with cheap brands (Datsun) or 'pretentious prestige' brand (Citroen) without any underlying stuff.

All I was trying to say was that xuv launch doesn't change much for VAG. There is no suggestion of pride or whether they would be successful. They might as well fail with their 2.0 strategy even without the launch of xuv700.

In general I agree with you that our market needs more players that offer good value to customers.

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Originally Posted by amvj

Both Citroen and Jeep (Compass) have done that with over-pricing and are failing miserably.

Jeep is selling well for its segment. For example - last month they dispatched 909 units, which is good for a car with the top-spec variant costing 36+ lakhs and currently has no discounts on offer. Endeavour and Fortuner are the only 30 lakh+ SUVs that dispatched more units.

Citroen on the other hand - dispatched 40! These two can't be put on the same pedestal.

Will Taigun be the next Compass? It feels like a mini-Compass to drive, but may be a bit too 'mini' to feel like an SUV, misses out on diesel, diesel automatic options and has a LOT of established rivals (especially if safety ratings aren't a bother). Will be a hard ask. You are right that they should have been priced better.

And the biggest weakness - whatever marketshare is left - will get shared by the two cousins.

[SBM3J]

For everyone who thinks that VW(as a group including Skoda) is doing the not so smart thing by pricing Taigun and Kushaq at premium and skipping feature are missing the point. VW didn’t get to where they are now by being dumb. What they are doing is they are making a car which has just enough and nothing more so that they can sell to ‘fans’ and exploit them. Once the fans have bought the overpriced and under equipped cars and made as much money from the initial loyal followers, they will add features and lower the price and then sell this to other buyers. A lot of companies do it, is it exploitation of loyalty? Yes. Is it unethical? May be. Is it illegal? No. But what does it say about a company who is looking to exploit the loyalty of people? Don’t really know.

What changed now is XUV700 pricing, I think enough is said about it, but just want to reiterate with the XUV700 pricing, mahindra made Kushaq’s vfm look garbage. I don’t think Taigun pricing will be any different to Kushaq’s, but if VW is really thinking of pricing it premium over Kushaq’s after XUV700 pricing, it’s as good as saying good bye to the billion they have invested in so called 2.0.

For everyone who thinks XUV700 pricing didn’t make any difference to VW’s plans, they are kidding themselves, VFM perception is very important in India even though one is not going to buy in XUV700s segment. Where does VW go after then fans have over paid for the initial 2000 to 3000 cars? Only time will tell.
As much as I want VW to succeed in India, I think they need to show some respect to this market. It would be a shame if they fail this time, but it will be only because of their arrogance than anything else.