[Guna]

Originally Posted by drshajul

Yes, exactly same happened with me.. it was a random email address consisting of my name and random numbers @gmail.com.. I finally created that email id and forwarded all emails to my correct email id

Happens with Gmail all the time. I get bank statements, insurance policies, bill reminders meant for some others who share my first name on daily basis.

[impala]

Originally Posted by normaltusker

By the way even my SA had told the same thing as you about getting Sony for AX7!

My SA confirmed today that the non-Luxury AX7s they got for delivery do not have Sony label on tweeters. So, I think we have to be content with normal 6 speakers.

Has anyone tried out the audio quality on non-Luxury variants?

[Guna]

Reading about the car pile up near Delhi because of the smog, it got me thinking how effective the 'front collision warning' and 'emergency braking' systems on XUV700 would be in such conditions. I believe it makes use of the camera as well as the radar to determine an object ahead, but in foggy situation, can it still work? If it does, this would be one of the real use case for this system.

[10nitin]

Originally Posted by atsphenomenon

But I'd expect it to be plausible, any further delay and Mahindra would be risking quite significant cancellations.

Customer care has been of no use at all! Called them a couple of times and have tweeted them as well but just keep getting the standard replies they've been taught to say. I've started feeling that Mahindra dealers don't really want the people who booked the cars in initial pricing to take deliveries. I've heard stories of people being offered their full booking amount even if they cancel and dealers demotivating people about the delivery times.
I really hope they do give people like us delivery dates so that our wait is defined. Don't like the feeling of being in the dark.

[Meph1st0]

Originally Posted by Guna

Reading about the car pile up near Delhi because of the smog, it got me thinking how effective the 'front collision warning' and 'emergency braking' systems on XUV700 would be in such conditions. I believe it makes use of the camera as well as the radar to determine an object ahead, but in foggy situation, can it still work? If it does, this would be one of the real use case for this system.

Radar works in any weather condition. If XUV700 uses a forward-looking radar for collision warning or autonomous emergency braking, then it should work in foggy conditions. This is the advantage of radar, it works in fog, rain, and at night. This can prevent one from colliding with the vehicle in front but rear-ending is still a possibility.

[normaltusker]

Originally Posted by Meph1st0

Radar works in any weather condition. If XUV700 uses a forward-looking radar for collision warning or autonomous emergency braking, then it should work in foggy conditions. This is the advantage of radar, it works in fog, rain, and at night. This can prevent one from colliding with the vehicle in front but rear-ending is still a possibility.

Originally Posted by Guna

Reading about the car pile up near Delhi because of the smog, it got me thinking how effective the 'front collision warning' and 'emergency braking' systems on XUV700 would be in such conditions. I believe it makes use of the camera as well as the radar to determine an object ahead, but in foggy situation, can it still work? If it does, this would be one of the real use case for this system.

No, the collision mitigation system (AEB) as it is called does not work in situations like these. RADAR and such systems are only driver aids and cannot replace the human intelligence which needs to be employed here.

Couple of screenshots from the manual to prove my point. You can read the same thing and more at this link.

[Meph1st0]

Originally Posted by normaltusker

No, the collision mitigation system (AEB) as it is called does not work in situations like these. RADAR and such systems are only driver aids and cannot replace the human intelligence which needs to be employed here.

Couple of screenshots from the manual to prove my point. You can read the same thing and more at this link.

Like I said before, if it is based on radar, it will work.
Looks like XUV700 collision mitigation is based on camera and not on the radar. The troubleshooting part of the manual clears it up.

Any owner must go through the disclaimer list very carefully.

"Vehicles, pedestrians, and cyclists at an offset may not be detected by FCW/AEB" - this means there are no side radars in XUV700 as well.
"System does not detect all kind of vehicles ,bicyclists and pedestrians" - sounds a bit scary now.
"Collision Mitigation System works on prediction of possible collision with the objects in front of vehicle by assuming the objects movements in certain directions. Sometimes the objects movement direction may not match to the prediction and the system may react early and provide warning or perform braking even though the object may not be in the host vehicle path" - This sounds like a recipe to create an accident.
"Only rear end of the preceding vehicles are identified by the system and warning or braking as needed will be provided by the system. System may not react or providing warning or braking for a crossing or oncoming vehicle. System may not react to a stationary vehicle if the vehicle is stationed in crossing or oncoming pose." - Headon collisions are not detected, only rear ending in certain scenarios.

To me, the ADAS in XUV700 heavily depends on the camera. I seriously do not understand the role of radar here.
What would really help is if someone does an in-depth review of these ADAS features in real-life scenarios. The limit review on the test track is ideal scenario.


I think Astor has a much better ADAS system.

[Tanmay007]

Originally Posted by Meph1st0

Looks like XUV700 collision mitigation is based on camera and not on the radar.

The ADAS in XUV700 is powered by Intel’s Mobileye SoC. If its the Q3 and above, the AEB is a fully vision based system.

Chart here:



You can also check a short presentation here:

https://youtu.be/xL7i2MQHORY

Originally Posted by Meph1st0

I seriously do not understand the role of radar here.

Radar is used by ACC to determine what speed the vehicle should be traveling at, also cross verification of various actions, there are many false positives and latency issues with vision-only approach. I’m pretty sure both are used in conjunction to improve error rates.

[Moto_Bear]

Hi Everyone! Been a long time since i posted. I had an accident and as such, wasn't able to access the internet side of things for over a month.

Anyways, coming to the context of the thread, irrespective of multiple suggestions to not to go head with booking the XUV by my family, I ultimately gave in and took a test drive on 3rd October, of both the Manual as well as the Automatic transmission. Whereas, the manual really surprised me with the quick throws and better response, Automatic felt a lot sluggish to me. Anyhow, was pleased with the vehicle in general, and the tech albeit being enticing, suffered glitches throughout my TD. As per the SA, it was one of the initial batch, so they were normal and the final products would be without any faults.

On the 6th, while visiting a temple, had an accident with a 10-wheeler and faced minor injuries but enough to land me on a bed for the next two weeks or so. However, through my dealer friend, I was able to get myself a booking on the 7th in the first hour but the booking was made for the MT rather than an AT.

So now, I have a confirmed booking of AX7L D MT(Everest White) on 7th October and being in the same boat as everyone here, no delivery date in sight(I'm also down a vehicle because of the accident). Has anyone received a delivery date for the MT variant of AX7L? And, does anyone know any video highlighting the features in AX7L in MT? Given, that I cannot go with another booking as it'll push the delivery date of the vehicle by months plus I have price protection for the MT booking.

And as far as the delivery algorithm is concerned, let me see what i can dig up. My SO has worked in the big fours and she has contacts in the industry.
Further, this weekend I got a tweet from a friend who also has booked the vehicle. Attaching the screenshot for reference.

Also, heartfelt Congratulations to all the members who have received their vehicles or are in-line to receive them. Eagerly waiting for your ownership reviews.

[Meph1st0]

Originally Posted by Tanmay007

Radar is used by ACC to determine what speed the vehicle should be traveling at, also cross verification of various actions, there are many false positives and latency issues with vision-only approach. I’m pretty sure both are used in conjunction to improve error rates.

What I actually meant was radar could have been used much more effectively. For instance, companies like Conti had developed radar-only systems for ACC.

In the case of XUV700, only the rear of the vehicle is recognized. Warning or braking for a crossing or oncoming vehicle is not provided mostly because the camera is unable to detect/classify it. This could have been easily solved with radar. Radar is very good with detection (range/velocity).


Any idea who is providing the radar sensor? It will be also interesting to see who provides the combined ADAS solution. Mobileye might be providing the camera but someone has to integrate with radar and make a complete solution.

[audioholic]

Originally Posted by Meph1st0

Like I said before, if it is based on radar, it will work.
Looks like XUV700 collision mitigation is based on camera and not on the radar. The troubleshooting part of the manual clears it up.

To me, the ADAS in XUV700 heavily depends on the camera.
I think Astor has a much better ADAS system.

Originally Posted by Tanmay007

If its the Q3 and above, the AEB is a fully vision based system.

I’m pretty sure both are used in conjunction to improve error rates.

Originally Posted by Meph1st0

What I actually meant was radar could have been used much more effectively. For instance, companies like Conti had developed radar-only systems for ACC.

Any idea who is providing the radar sensor? It will be also interesting to see who provides the combined ADAS solution. Mobileye might be providing the camera but someone has to integrate with radar and make a complete solution.

Let me clarify since I work on these systems but not for Mahindra. Normally AEB systems can be implemented using radar only setups. This is used in entry level cars in the EU. These systems can work well even in fog and bad weather, and only when there is some obstruction like ice on the radar, there could be temporary blockage which is displayed clearly on the cluster when it is unavailable.

The addition of a camera along with radar allows better object detection with the help of fusion of data and this improves reliability of object detection. For a braking system to trigger full braking, the system must have enough confidence on a certain object that it is definitely an object that is going to come in the path of the vehicle. If not, then there would be false positives which would cause more trouble.

In case of the XUV, its probably the choice of the manufactuurer that they only brake for double confirmed objects, ie detected by both camera and radar. Else they would turn off the system. While this reduces availability, it would greatly prevent false positives. While the camera loses its ability to see in dense fog or darkness, the radar is prone to stray reflections and ghost objects especially in dense scenarios like India. Radar only AEB systems work well in countries like EU where there is hardly any anomaly on the road.

So to conclude, be it the ACC or Emergency braking, they do not rely on a single sensor for data but a combination of the camera and radar objects to get a picture of the surroundings. Perhaps this approach by Mahindra is why they are confident that it will still work in Indian conditions.

[anandhsub]

Originally Posted by audioholic

Let me clarify since I work on these systems but not for Mahindra. Normally AEB systems can be implemented using radar only setups. This is used in entry level cars in the EU. These systems can work well even in fog and bad weather, and only when there is some obstruction like ice on the radar, there could be temporary blockage which is displayed clearly on the cluster when it is unavailable.

Arent radar based systems banned in India? I believe the frequency used in these systems are reserved for the Military.

[Tanmay007]

Originally Posted by Meph1st0

Any idea who is providing the radar sensor? It will be also interesting to see who provides the combined ADAS solution. Mobileye might be providing the camera but someone has to integrate with radar and make a complete solution.

Mobileye *IS* the complete solution provider. It provides the SoC as well as software.

Originally Posted by audioholic

So to conclude, be it the ACC or Emergency braking, they do not rely on a single sensor for data but a combination of the camera and radar objects to get a picture of the surroundings. Perhaps this approach by Mahindra is why they are confident that it will still work in Indian conditions.

Yup that's what I believe as well. If one system reports an error the complete feature will be unavailable.

While radar + camera based ADAS is widely used, vision-only systems have proved to be quite accurate by themselves. Tesla has chosen to remove radars from their setup altogether and rely on vision + ultrasonic sensors. Many others such as Comma.ai and even Mobileye (check their roadmap) too have concluded that vision alone is sufficient going forward.

Originally Posted by anandhsub

Arent radar based systems banned in India? I believe the frequency used in these systems are reserved for the Military.

Radar restrictions for automobile use were relaxed quite some time back. https://economictimes.indiatimes.com...w/49084107.cms

[atsphenomenon]

Yeah, I guess in the demand/supply equation, in a one year horizon, the demand overshoots supply, by quite some margin for the XUV 7oo.
It seems basic vegetables economics has been extended to a 25+ lac car by none other than one of the top 3 consultancy firms. It now seems deliberate to ding the 7th Oct folks, and prioritise the high margin and unconstrained supply combos - 8th vs 7th (increased prices), Petrol vs Diesel (diesel specific chip shortage), AWD vs 2WD (Maximize ticket size on whatever Diesels are ready), L vs non L, AX7 vs lower trims.

Might be the right thing to do from a profitability standpoint, but then these aren't really veggies worth 25 big ones. This myopic stance, might leave a bitter taste with a lot of people. Would be interesting to see how this plays out in the coming days.

[pseudo_coder]

Originally Posted by atsphenomenon

...It now seems deliberate to ding the 7th Oct folks, and prioritise the high margin and unconstrained supply combos - 8th vs 7th (increased prices), Petrol vs Diesel (diesel specific chip shortage), AWD vs 2WD (Maximize ticket size on whatever Diesels are ready), L vs non L, AX7 vs lower trims.

... This myopic stance, might leave a bitter taste with a lot of people.

Do we have enough data to say this? Some counterpoints:

1. Many folks who booked after 7th have got messages that the price of 7th October will be applicable for them.
2. I booked the topmost model: AX7 Diesel-L AWD, on 7th. Haven't received the delivery date yet, while many who booked a lower diesel variant on the same day have.

If it was just a matter of profitability, I don't think Mahindra would need to spend on a consultant.