[das_ren_auto]

Excellent review vidyut.Since you have done the review of City Hybrid also,which one you will recommend in terms of balance between power,dynamics and economy.On paper city hybrid has 250+nm torque. Waiting for your candid opinion.

[Vid6639]

Apart from the official review let me give my perspective on the Hyryder.

I am in a predicament with 4 cars at home right now. I don't need 4 cars. I have a 3 series for occasional joy ride and weekend quick drives. The Kodiaq does all long distance family trips and occasional weekend drives.

Ecosport is being used for errands and Corolla for driver duties for my dad. I can easily get ride of the Ford and Corolla but will need one practical city commuter. Right now my 2 city use cars are manual and the highway cars are AT. Which is opposite of what it should be. With wfh and hybrid work from home, I don't need a daily office car which is what the Ecosport was.

The Hyryder checks all the boxes. I get to remain within Toyota umbrella from Corolla. Gets amazing FE and being an automatic it's a breeze in traffic. Driver can drive for errands and I can use it when needed as well for short trips. Rear seat was decent in space and ride quality was good.

I have the Kodiaq for boot space and luxury and the 3 for fun to drive.

I am still not on the EV bandwagon and for me the Hybrid makes more sense than EV right now and even next 5 years. Few reasons are charging in my apt is difficult for an EV. A sub 4m SUV like Nexon is 20L even with all subsidies.

Secondly the EV is more like a mobile phone / appliance. The battery will degrade over time. It's a massive cost to replace it. This means used market resale for EV will be poor as battery will have good degradation. Secondly EV's are getting better every year in range, power and battery tech. In 2 years the old Nexon is outdated and replaced with Max and the MG has got a big facelift and improved range.

Hybrids will retain resale and will still be practical in used car market since the tech is already well established and well proven.

I will wait for prices for the Hyryder and if it is below the City e:HEV it has a strong use case. It cannot cross the price of the Creta/Seltos diesel AT as the Hyryder is compromised in some ways.

Originally Posted by das_ren_auto

Excellent review vidyut.Since you have done the review of City Hybrid also,which one you will recommend in terms of balance between power,dynamics and economy.On paper city hybrid has 250+nm torque. Waiting for your candid opinion.

City Hybrid is more refined but power and efficiency is similar. The Dynamics are good for both and no complaints with either.

However the City has a few more aces up its sleeve. It has ADAS, better interior feel, more rear seat space, better NVH, electronic parking brake with auto hold. You lose ventilated seats vs the Hyryder as the biggest miss.

[TT-S]

Originally Posted by amalji

My overall view of the hyryder.
The boot space or the lack of it. Sorry Toyota. After decades of experience in hybrids and having solved the boot space issue years ago, i expected a better attempt from you.

This is a limitation of the chassis I think. The Suzuki engineered Grand Vitara was probably not built with Hybrid aspirations in mind. If it was designed by Toyota, they would have surely considered slipping the battery pack under the rear seats to liberate boot space.

Hyryder I think, should be considered only as an experiment by Toyota/Suzuki. If the results and market response are good, there may be more hybrids which we can hope are properly engineered and designed considering all these shortcomings.

[Durango Dude]

Now that Osamu Suzuki has "pledged" Rs 10440 cr on an R&D Center in Gujarat can we hope for a tax rebate on Full Hybrid's from the Government! This is what I was talking about as heavy "lobbying" in Naye Dilli. These twins are an enormous gamble played by Maruti and Toyota as the product review of the Hyryder isn't as positive the only way to entice buyers would be with a "low Sticker price" and "Fuel Savings" to match in the form of a tax rebate by the Central Government. If the gamble fails badly both companies are sure to bleed and more so Toyota may have to shut shop as the Innova Petrol Hybrid would become a prohibitively priced gamble that's sure to fail.

https://www.autocarindia.com/industr...ga-push-425549

Pic courtsey: ACI

[hummer]

Hello,
Can we put luggage carriers on top of Hyryder's roof (Thule or some other nice looking ones)?

My only issue wit Hyryder is lack of boot space, so if the pricing is too tempting, then I want to explore alternates to increase luggage carrying capacity for occasional travels.

[Vid6639]

Originally Posted by hummer

Hello,
Can we put luggage carriers on top of Hyryder's roof (Thule or some other nice looking ones)?

My only issue wit Hyryder is lack of boot space, so if the pricing is too tempting, then I want to explore alternates to increase luggage carrying capacity for occasional travels.

Roof racks of Hyryder is not load bearing. You will need to attach them differently which will have an impact of FE on the highway as well.

While the boot space is definitely less, my suggestion would be to check it out carefully. I have a feeling that if you remove the lower tray and the upper parcel shelf and keep both these at home and adjust your luggage cleverly, you should be able to load the Hyryder reasonably well for a family of 4 on a weekend trip.

[hummer]

Originally Posted by Vid6639

Roof racks of Hyryder is not load bearing. You will need to attach them differently which will have an impact of FE on the highway as well.

While the boot space is definitely less, my suggestion would be to check it out carefully. I have a feeling that if you remove the lower tray and the upper parcel shelf and keep both these at home and adjust your luggage cleverly, you should be able to load the Hyryder reasonably well for a family of 4 on a weekend trip.

Thanks Vid6639, that's a bit of relief, I really want to adopt this new tech transition SUV before taking EV plunge in few years !!

Removing those two components will add up total space to atleast 400 litres?
475 in my current drive feels insufficient sometimes, but I am ready to compromise about ~75 litres for technology and other comforts

[shyampsunder]

Originally Posted by Durango Dude

Now that Osamu Suzuki has "pledged" Rs 10440 cr on an R&D Center in Gujarat can we hope for a tax rebate on Full Hybrid's from the Gumment!

Given that it's the GST which doesn't differentiate between Hybrids and Fossil fuel-only cars, I don't see a tax rebate anytime soon because even a proposal for the same is not being considered by any committee formed by the GST council. Only after a committee recommends it, will the GST council even consider it.

The last time any tax relief was granted for hybrids, Maruti quickly built some weak hybrids (Ciaz, I think) simply to benefit from the tax relief and didn't bring in any tangible benefits. It was quickly scrapped by the govt. I don't see why the govt should incentivize the current hybrids that Toyota and Maruti are bringing in since the car is fully powered by fossil fuels and only has higher mileage. If tomorrow Honda were to introduce a fossil fuel-only engine that can produce 30 KMPL mileage, shouldn't they also get lower tax benefits?

Any tax relief only makes sense if the battery is of a certain size and it comes in as a plug-in hybrid so that for short city rides, users have the option of simply charging at home and reducing their fossil fuel consumption.

[BoneCollector]

Originally Posted by Vid6639

While the boot space is definitely less, my suggestion would be to check it out carefully. I have a feeling that if you remove the lower tray and the upper parcel shelf and keep both these at home and adjust your luggage cleverly, you should be able to load the Hyryder reasonably well for a family of 4 on a weekend trip.

My only issue with Brezza is lack of boot space if whole family is traveling. In such cases, I remove the parcel tray and then I'm able to accommodate 1 medium size strolley and 4 cabin size strolleys plus a couple of small bags. So we should be able to accommodate luggage easily.

[Durango Dude]

Originally Posted by shyampsunder

Given that it's the GST which doesn't differentiate between Hybrids and Fossil fuel-only cars, I don't see a tax rebate anytime soon because even a proposal for the same is not being considered by any committee formed by the GST council. Only after a committee recommends it, will the GST council even consider it.

The last time any tax relief was granted for hybrids, Maruti quickly built some weak hybrids (Ciaz, I think) simply to benefit from the tax relief and didn't bring in any tangible benefits. It was quickly scrapped by the govt. I don't see why the govt should incentivize the current hybrids that Toyota and Maruti are bringing in since the car is fully powered by fossil fuels and only has higher mileage. If tomorrow Honda were to introduce a fossil fuel-only engine that can produce 30 KMPL mileage, shouldn't they also get lower tax benefits?

Any tax relief only makes sense if the battery is of a certain size and it comes in as a plug-in hybrid so that for short city rides, users have the option of simply charging at home and reducing their fossil fuel consumption.

Full EV's alone are a long way off, with the primitive grid system which can't handle A/C load in summer and trips, just think what will happen if even the EV population sees a spurt of 15-20% suddenly, it'll just collapse and the absolute "opaque" meter system at least in Chennai, we've been taken for a ride even during Covid, where the person who jots down readin inflates it and we were running from pillar to post to appeal for a reduction to no avail. The way forward for India is to incentivize the Full Hybrid instead of leap frogging to Full EV's which most probably our grids will not support. Yes, I agree when you say that the battery size and fuel savings must be confirmed by an independent Govt agency and then make it to the market. GST is not the 10 commandments it's changes or increases every month bringing newer and newer stuff into it's ambit so the Govt can't milk the udders till they bleed.

[shyampsunder]

Originally Posted by Durango Dude

Full EV's alone are a long way off, with the primitive grid system which can't handle A/C load in summer and trips, just think what will happen if even the EV population sees a spurt of 15-20% suddenly, it'll just collapse and the absolute "opaque" meter system at least in Chennai, we've been taken for a ride even during Covid, where the person who jots down readin inflates it and we were running from pillar to post to appeal for a reduction to no avail. The way forward for India is to incentivize the Full Hybrid instead of leap frogging to Full EV's which most probably our grids will not support. Yes, I agree when you say that the battery size and fuel savings must be confirmed by an independent Govt agency and then make it to the market. GST is not the 10 commandments it's changes or increases every month bringing newer and newer stuff into it's ambit so the Govt can't milk the udders till they bleed.

Didn't mention anything about EVs in my post. Just Maruti's past behavior abusing hybrid-related tax exemptions where they didn't even bother providing a battery before calling their cars hybrid which resulted in the entire industry losing out on hybrid-related tax benefits.

Hybrid as far as Maruti/Toyota is concerned is a technology to boost fuel efficiency and nothing else. This type of technology doesn't deserve any tax relief unless we provide similar tax relief to all fuel efficiency improvements in ICE cars.

Just like GST is not the 10 commandments, we can't wait forever for monopoly discoms to magically improve the grid. There is no reason for them to do it because they don't have any competition. EVs will take off whether the grid is ready or not because India provides the biggest tax delta between ICE and EVs. We are seeing it already with 2Ws. If not for the supply chain constraints, we would've seen it in 4Ws as well.

EVs have been growing exponentially in the last 2 years in India, not sure where you are getting info that another 20% increase will destroy grids.

[OpenRoads]

Originally Posted by hummer

Removing those two components will add up total space to atleast 400 litres?

You will get close to max 350 after adjusting the bottom shelf and removing the parcel tray. Anything above might hinder the rear view.

[midazolam]

Most of the people here are critical of the car regarding interior quality, mediocre performance, small panoramic sunroof or small boot space, while some of these things might be true but I still think this car will sell very well. Most of the buyers in this segment don’t care about performance (while it’s opposite among Team BHP members ), but they do care about rising fuel cost!

Haryana government is already giving rebate of 15 percent on hybrid cars and I think other states will follow soon. In future other states also might follow the NGT ruling regarding diesel cars, so I think a lot of people might line up for a hybrid from Toyota!

Originally Posted by shyampsunder

I don't see why the govt should incentivize the current hybrids that Toyota and Maruti are bringing in since the car is fully powered by fossil fuels and only has higher mileage. If tomorrow Honda were to introduce a fossil fuel-only engine that can produce 30 KMPL mileage, shouldn't they also get lower tax benefits?

Any tax relief only makes sense if the battery is of a certain size and it comes in as a plug-in hybrid so that for short city rides, users have the option of simply charging at home and reducing their fossil fuel consumption.

Haryana government is already giving a rebate of 15 percent upto 3 lakhs on Hybrid cars below 40 lakhs and I think other states might follow.
Posting a link for the same from times of india.

https://m.timesofindia.com/auto/news...w/92562889.cms

[rr06]

Originally Posted by Vid6639

Roof racks of Hyryder is not load bearing. You will need to attach them differently which will have an impact of FE on the highway as well.

While the boot space is definitely less, my suggestion would be to check it out carefully. I have a feeling that if you remove the lower tray and the upper parcel shelf and keep both these at home and adjust your luggage cleverly, you should be able to load the Hyryder reasonably well for a family of 4 on a weekend trip.

Thats good to know. Thanks for clarifying so many things! Do you think a stroller can fit in that boot? Only reason I am not considering the Koreans is because of safety for my young one. If his stroller can't fit in the boot, then I will have to start looking at alternatives.

[SKC-auto]

Originally Posted by midazolam

Haryana government is already giving a rebate of 15 percent upto 3 lakhs on Hybrid cars below 40 lakhs and I think other states might follow.
Posting a link for the same from times of india.

https://m.timesofindia.com/auto/news...w/92562889.cms

Only first 200 cars, many state govts don't have that much money, so I don't believe this is going to happen.