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Old 30th December 2022, 11:54   #361
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Re: Toyota Innova Hycross Review

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Originally Posted by The Rationalist View Post
The top end Hycross costs ₹37 lakhs in Kerala, if someone is taking half of that as loan his outgo will be ₹42 lakh. To afford the top end one must be earning more than ₹4 lakh a month.
There are people in Kerala buying 2nd and 3rd owner luxury cars with 70k+ kms from dealers like Royal Drive who sell them for about 70-80% of the original on-road price. I think buying a new Toyota is a much better choice provided the alternative and Toyota owners in Kerala are generally wealthy but financially cautious people.

Maybe the people buying this can't afford it and take on long loans with the expectation that they can sell it off in a few years for minimal depreciation, or maybe they are paying the full lumpsum amount. Maybe it's a loan against FD or maybe its cash they had lying around. Maybe it's just a 2nd or 3rd car they will be using for family trips. Maybe it's NRIs from gulf states. Maybe it's just wealthy, financially literate people who will still take a loan simply because they have that money invested elsewhere that provides better interest rates than the car loan charges. It could be anything really.

Most people including myself expected prices to be 40+L onroad for the top model which is where the Jeep meridian, Hyundai Tucson, Citroen C5 etc sit. Sub 40L pricing was a pleasant surprise and I think the premium over the Xuv700, Safari, ScorpioN is justified since it gets decent features, a hybrid motor as well as a actual boot capacity even with all three rows up as well as 3rd row seats you can actually use. Only compromise here is AWD.

Last edited by Aditya : 30th December 2022 at 19:34. Reason: Quoted text edited
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Old 30th December 2022, 11:59   #362
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Re: Toyota Innova Hycross Review

I own a Crysta 2.8 ZX AT. I was tempted to check out the new Hycross and was actively waiting for the price update. I am disappointed with the the price and don't feel to upgrade the diesel Crysta soon.

This can still serve me for a neat 9 more years as it is reliable and fuzz free. If I need an upgrade, my choice will be the new Scorpio N, which seems more VFM now.
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Old 30th December 2022, 12:35   #363
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Re: Toyota Innova Hycross Review

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Originally Posted by extreme_torque View Post
Thats not true. A Toyota Hybrid cannot drive over 42miles per hour or 67 kmph on electric power alone due to the design of the powertrain (in a nut shell the MG1 is software restricted to run at a peak 6500 rpm which it reaches when the MG2 is at 67 kmph)..
When I am saying EV mode in my post, I am referring to the text appearing on instrument cluster of Hyryder.

I understand what you are stating. Above certain speeds, both engine and battery would drive the vehicle. In the scenario which I described, for constant speed of 90 kmph (cruise control) on express way, HU will display 4 bars of battery - with EV mode lit up on instrument cluster. Car would be quiter momentarily - I assume engine will shut off as at that moment it senses that battery has enough juice to take the car ahead.

For a context, please see the post I was responding to which started that above 40 kmph a hybrid will drive just like a petrol car (engine only).
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Old 30th December 2022, 12:55   #364
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Re: Toyota Innova Hycross Review

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Originally Posted by vegitakarthik View Post
Correct me If am wrong. Aren't bigger diesels with adblue tech are already complaint with BS6 phase 2 real world emission norms. Its only the smaller diesels with LNT method fails BS6 phase 2?

Coming to the pricing, Its not phenomenal pricing. For that price I would have preferred multilink suspension instead of Ottoman seats.
They may or may not be depending on how test results look. Manufacturers may have to tweak things . Smaller diesel will for sure have to add SCR i guess. Also even with current BS6, there is hassle of AdBlue/DPF, which may not be suitable for some use case. Above all these there is also fear of diesel ban looming. Considering all these aspects, its better to go with Hybrid. I love diesel cars and will definitely miss the torque rush but the world is changing!

Toyota is never known for VFM pricing and based on earlier launches, many expected 40L+ pricing. By Toyota standards, Hycross is launched with good pricing. Whether you want to pay the Toyota premium is another discussion.
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Old 30th December 2022, 12:56   #365
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Re: Toyota Innova Hycross Review

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Originally Posted by The Rationalist View Post
The top end Hycross costs ₹37 lakhs in Kerala, if someone is taking half of that as loan his outgo will be ₹42 lakh. To afford the top end one must be earning more than ₹4 lakh a month.
As many have already commented, a section of the society or this forum do find it a sensible pricing (while for some it may not be). In my case for example, using company lease route, I will be effectively paying a lakh or two less than the OTR price at Bangalore. There are lot of people in this world with similar background - many others might be able to use this to reduce their tax burdens. And, some others may have their inherited wealth. Who are we to comment on all that?!

Toyota puts a premium on their cars because their cars are reliable - lot of R&D, effort and money gets invested for the same. There is nothing wrong if they want to charge their vehicles more than others in that aspect. It is all business brother - Tata or Mahindra can't afford to price their vehicles this much, else they will also increase the costs. If you like having one of their vehicles in your stable, go for it as long as you think you can afford one.

Last edited by Aditya : 30th December 2022 at 19:34. Reason: Quoted text edited
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Old 30th December 2022, 13:53   #366
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Re: Toyota Innova Hycross Review

Has anyone driven the non hybrid version? I want to know, which is better for a 20 lakh customer between Hycross and Crysta Petrol AT. How big of an advantage does the later has with it’s bigger 2.7l engine?
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Old 30th December 2022, 15:03   #367
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Re: Toyota Innova Hycross Review

While the pricing is pretty good and I do have a bit of remorse since I bought 2.4 Z AT in July this year at a cost of 31 Lacs OTR but still I do think that all Crysta owners should wait for real-life reviews of Hycross before upgrading.

Another reason why I am waiting is that Crysta is one Heck of a vehicle and otherwise also it's really painful to bid aideu to just a 6 month old car!
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Old 30th December 2022, 16:04   #368
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Re: Toyota Innova Hycross Review

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Originally Posted by baarish84 View Post
When I am saying EV mode in my post, I am referring to the text appearing on instrument cluster of Hyryder.
What does it show in the animation? The rotation speeds of MG1, MG2, and ICE are inter-dependent and any change in speed of the other 2, effects MG1 as well. MG1 can spin upto 10,000 rpm but is software limited to 6500 rpm if the ICE is off which corresponds to 67kmph.

Quote:
Originally Posted by baarish84 View Post
I understand what you are stating. Above certain speeds, both engine and battery would drive the vehicle. In the scenario which I described, for constant speed of 90 kmph (cruise control) on express way, HU will display 4 bars of battery - with EV mode lit up on instrument cluster. Car would be quiter momentarily - I assume engine will shut off as at that moment it senses that battery has enough juice to take the car ahead.
That would only happen if the car was going on a decline or going downhill, but even then at that speed the engine wont be off and it would still be spinning even if without petrol. Toyota Hybrid is fascinating in how it works.

Also, the car would be quiet at a constant 90kmph anyway as the engine would barely be running at 1500 rpm or less depending on the load.
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Old 30th December 2022, 17:13   #369
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Re: Toyota Innova Hycross Review

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Originally Posted by The Rationalist View Post
The top end Hycross costs ₹37 lakhs in Kerala, if someone is taking half of that as loan his outgo will be ₹42 lakh.
Think about the Taxes, govt. collects and you'll get heart ache. 10-11 lakhs of gst + 5.6 lakhs of Road Tax (20%), totaling to approx. 16.5 lakhs on each vehicle. These are direct taxes to the Customer. If you factor the taxes not paid by the Customer directly, but by the Company then it'll be more than 100%.

Whether Toyota will further increase prices after couple of months has to be seen. But the biggest blunder they did is giving 2 Airbags for a Car worth 30 lakhs, which is a shame on Toyota. I hope Toyota realizes it's mistake and include, since the production has not yet begun.

Last edited by jaaz : 30th December 2022 at 17:23.
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Old 30th December 2022, 17:57   #370
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Re: Toyota Innova Hycross Review

Toyota will achieve the desired outcome, apparent pricing looks attractive stating 18.3L but any sane buyer if opting for Hycross will only go for the Hybrid variants which are priced steeply. (i for-see 70%+ hybrid sales) On Road 30L+ is no Joke that too for a car which is primarily a family / utility vehicle.

Ideally they should have trimmed down features/ price of Crysta and move it for commercial / tier 2/3 usage [what Mahindra did with Scorpio (old to classic)] and launch Hycross as a premium 7 seater to capture Safari / XUV buyer base who are looking for a family car
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Old 30th December 2022, 18:51   #371
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Re: Toyota Innova Hycross Review

I have a creeping feeling that the pricing is in such a way that, if in future diesel and/or BOF Crysta reappears then they can justify a higher premium than Hycross.
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Old 30th December 2022, 19:26   #372
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Re: Toyota Innova Hycross Review

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Originally Posted by extreme_torque View Post
Thats not true. A Toyota Hybrid cannot drive over 42miles per hour or 67 kmph on electric power alone due to the design of the powertrain (in a nut shell the MG1 is software restricted to run at a peak 6500 rpm which it reaches when the MG2 is at 67 kmph). If you are doing more than 67kmph lets say while coming downhill, the engine would turn on but wont spark i.e no petrol.
Toyota Hyryder uses exactly same engine as the one used in Yaris cross in Europe (2020 edition). The specifications of drive motors, Engine, and even battery is exactly the same. Yes it does use a different platform(TNGA-B) but the unladen weight of both cars is almost the same.

Now I was reading number of reviews (European reviewers) of Yaris cross and they mentioned great improvements in 2020 edition of Yaris cross which includes this new Fourth generation TNGA engine/Transmission/Battery. They all mention that this new powertrain is capable of running at 130kmph/80miles/hr in EV mode alone , they are calling it Zero emission/Zero fuel consumption EV mode.

Now despite having exactly same powertrains with exactly same Engine/drive motor/battery. what is different which limits the max speed in EV mode in Indian Hyryder. May be the ECU setting is different?
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Old 30th December 2022, 19:54   #373
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Re: Toyota Innova Hycross Review

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Originally Posted by r24x7 View Post
Assuming price per liter of petrol as 110 and cost per kilometer( fuel only ) for GX , VX as 11 Rupees and 5 Rupees respectively , the breakeven seems to come down at somewhere around the 1 Lakh Kilometer mark.

Makes me wonder , why not GX? I think Toyota already did this calculation and hence lot more features are now provided on VX , ZX variants

But GX is not very bad to be considered according to me. All basic features are offered.
I agree, had me in dilemma, but then I realised this running cost does not include the added features.
The comparison method you chose is suitable when there are 2 powertrains in the same variant!
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Old 30th December 2022, 19:57   #374
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Re: Toyota Innova Hycross Review

I see a number of Crysta owners from the 2016-2018 vintage upgrading to the Hycross, creating a glut of used Crystas in the market in 2023. The prices of used Crystas will fall as supply increases. The taxi market may be able to pick up some of these and get them registered as commercial vehicles or run them informally. So if anyone is planning on selling their Crystas to upgrade to the HyCross, it is probably better to do that sooner rather than later, as demand is good right now and supply is low, given Toyota have temporarily stopped making Crystas.

Last edited by 84.monsoon : 30th December 2022 at 19:59.
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Old 30th December 2022, 20:02   #375
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Re: Toyota Innova Hycross Review

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Originally Posted by Heisenberg_ad View Post
.....IMO, Financially it doesn't make sense. Now taking into consideration reliability. This is a monocoque construction unlike the crysta BOF, we dont know how reliable the product would be. So is Toyota milking us for reliability image? .....
I believe durability/longevity, as opposed to reliability are not the same thing. BOF architecture is certainly well-known for its durability. Whereas monocoque designs are inherently less rugged, abuse-friendly and durable. But both types can be equally reliable as Toyota has demonstrated with their large portfolio of both types.

Last edited by shashanka : 30th December 2022 at 20:04.
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