[saurabhdadhichi]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

For those of us who have been around Mahindra jeeps understand that Thar is nothing but a better jeep. Hence our expectations are less and we keep the bar low. But for folks who have only seen Mahindra Jeeps but never owned one, probably have much higher expectations from the Thar, and end up being disappointed. Guys, please understand the only reason you buy a Thar is to go off-road or look cool. It is by no means a family vehicle. Don't buy it to take your family on cross country trips...

I agree with the expectation management but I beg to differ here by any means a branded vehicle sold in the market with basic safety features should not be compromised. If they say it is for off-roading then i expect the safety to be even better for them. As suggested above selling a half baked product is to reach a larger mass by keeping the price of DI less and these can be used by Jeepwallahs in various small towns to carry people (read overloading the jeep) while they also wanted to target urban mass but still not delivering the quality that is expected by them. They could have launched a version suiting to urban mass while keeping safety important in mind.

[4x4addict]

Originally Posted by saurabhdadhichi

They could have launched a version suiting to urban mass while keeping safety important in mind.

I am not justifying Mahindra or the Thar. I am just warning people, that should buy it only as a second/recreational vehicle. It shouldn't be considered as the only car for personal and family use. It is too crude without any basic/essential safety features. Forget about ABS, I was horrified at how poor the braking is.

[amolpol]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

For those of us who have been around Mahindra jeeps understand that Thar is nothing but a better jeep. Hence our expectations are less and we keep the bar low. But for folks who have only seen Mahindra Jeeps but never owned one, probably have much higher expectations from the Thar, and end up being disappointed.

Guys, please understand the only reason you buy a Thar is to go off-road or look cool. It is by no means a family vehicle. Don't buy it to take your family on cross country trips...

Well said Sir! If you keep an open mind and accept the Thar as an improved jeep in some aspects like power and comfort, it won't disappoint. But it's in no way a cruiser SUV or even a hatchback for city use. And spending 8.5L is a matter of choice and affordability, the company is selling what they want, whether you buy or not is an individual's choice.

What's the point in regretting later when the original premise of buying the Thar was not correct. Sometimes I feel this is like expecting the big RR phantom to fly you out of traffic when you're in a hurry, just because you paid so much for it. :lol

[saurabhdadhichi]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

I am not justifying Mahindra or the Thar. I am just warning people, that should buy it only as a second/recreational vehicle. It shouldn't be considered as the only car for personal and family use. It is too crude without any basic/essential safety features. Forget about ABS, I was horrified at how poor the braking is.

Is the common man at fault that they have aspirations to buy a vehicle with basic safety features as their primary used vehicle? Even an age old vehicle like Gypsy has decent confidence inspiring safety. What options does a common man have? I think there is a clear need of rough and tough vehicle like Mahindra Thar combined with driving comfort of Renault Duster at a price point of Ford Ecosport.

Thanks anyways and I do concur with your point that people have to understand these vehicles use and should only go for such vehicles that are not driven for a daily use and not always with family.

[amolpol]

Originally Posted by saurabhdadhichi

Is the common man at fault that they have aspirations to buy a vehicle with basic safety features as their primary used vehicle? Even an age old vehicle like Gypsy has decent confidence inspiring safety. What options does a common man have? I think there is a clear need of rough and tough vehicle like Mahindra Thar combined with driving comfort of Renault Duster at a price point of Ford Ecosport.

Thanks anyways and I do concur with your point that people have to understand these vehicles use and should only go for such vehicles that are not driven for a daily use and not always with family.

I won't say the common man is at fault but may be they have wrong expectations from the Thar. In our country we don't really have the concept of having specific equipment for intended use. Instead we want one that will do everything and do it well, moreover it should be priced economical as well. So net-net the Thar is not the common man's do it all vehicle and I don't think it was meant to be either.

On the safety equipments, I feel safety is a secondary criteria for the common man in India (sad but true). How else would you explain the Alto topping the sales charts for years now and the bolero reigning the SUV category. The awareness about safety equipments may be increasing but the demand clearly isn't overpowering the sales of vehicles with little or no safety features. Given that, the safety features in a jeep can easily be kept last on the list of must haves.

Moreover I wouldn't really want airbags or ABS to go off-road which is what the recreational vehicle is meant to do. It will cause more trouble than being helpful. BTW, what's in the list of safety equipment in the gypsy that you mentioned, I hadn't found anything apart from seat belts when I was deciding between the two.
Comparing a jeep to a crossover or SUV isn't going to do any good. They're different segments altogether and can't be substituted without losing a lot of desirable things in the bargain. For example you can't beat your Duster off the road like you'd do with a Thar and the latter can't provide ride quality like a crossover.

And before you guys think I'm being biased because I own a Thar, let me tell you that my jeep is at the ASC since a week and won't be back until the next week. So I know it's not perfect but I'm yet to find a reason to hate it.

[starter]

I have had a gypsy for close to 4 years and there aren't any safety equipments in a gypsy more than what the Thar has.
BUT, the major differentiating factor is that whatever equipment was there in the gypsy always worked in my ownership (4 years and 25K kms) It was an extremely reliable vehicle. And in my opinion, thar is still far away from reaching the reliability levels of the gypsy.

PS: I am yet to take the delivery of my thar

[saurabhdadhichi]

Originally Posted by starter

I have had a gypsy for close to 4 years and there aren't any safety equipments in a gypsy more than what the Thar has. BUT, the major differentiating factor is that whatever equipment was there in the gypsy always worked in my ownership (4 years and 25K kms) It was an extremely reliable vehicle. And in my opinion, thar is still far away from reaching the reliability levels of the gypsy. PS: I am yet to take the delivery of my thar

Thanks Starter! Amolpol I was just trying to make the same point as has been put forward by starter. Anyways we both I am sure want to have safer vehicles for all class and at least basic safety ( since common man doesn't want to spend much on that) like seat belts to work and last long.

[amolpol]

Originally Posted by saurabhdadhichi

Thanks Starter! Amolpol I was just trying to make the same point as has been put forward by starter. Anyways we both I am sure want to have safer vehicles for all class and at least basic safety ( since common man doesn't want to spend much on that) like seat belts to work and last long.

The MG413W is more than a decade old now, so maybe the Thar will prove to be better when it becomes that old too. Although I do feel the Gypsy can only be compared to the Thar DI and not Crde based on features. Remember, the lesser the features, the lower the chances of failure too.

Here's my view of things that are a common grudges against the Thar :

- Front IFS: we all know that solid axles are better for offroading. But the IFS isn't bad either, it can easily do what most old jeeps can do in their stock form. It does wonders to the on road experience though, so it's a worthy compromise.
- Poor brakes : I have had a problem with this too, but I was not wishing for an upgrade or ABS and EBD. The braking distance is reasonable if your speed is reasonable, my problem was more to do with pressure leakage on the brake lines which was fixed to a good extent. An upgrade would be nice but it will also mean that I start pushing the jeep beyond safe limits too often which ain't good for me.

- Bad Interiors : honestly who cares about interiors in a jeep, it's not going to look like a car any day. I'm glad there's AC and it works even with the soft top. The black plastic looks okay otherwise, doesn't squeak which is good and it's easy to clean.

- Ride Quality - This is the best in the segment actually. If you need proof try a stock gypsy or the 540/550 and you'd agree. The jeep is fairly stable at triple digit speeds though the safety risks are heightened. It's a matter of personal choice on what you do with the available power, my advice would be to avoid thinking it's a SUV.

- No Hard Top: Well there are plenty of options available now but for me it's good with soft top. You can't park it with stuff inside and that's why I had said that this ain't your city hatchback either. And I don't ever plan giving it to a valet so that's totally out of question here.

- Niggles: They provide character to the jeep and are best kept under check but not eliminated. Any previous experience with an older generation Enfield can give you some context here. The more you try to eliminate the niggles, the more you'll find new ones emerging. It's like marriage, perfect match is a myth, but happy couples do exist.

Lastly, if the purpose of buying the jeep is only to look cool and macho etc, then one must at least get some counseling before they put in their money to avoid regrets. Just coz it's available off the shelf doesn't mean it's going to suit your needs in entirety.

[red herring]

My music system became a casualty yesterday to the leaking windshield! It suddenly stopped working and when I took it for repair today the repair shop guy showed me dried water marks on it which I am assuming were from the water that came trickling down from the leaking windshield!
Hoping that the warranty covers it else its money 'washed away'! Will now try Highwaypatrol's solution above before I get the stereo refitted ( and will cover it well for any such future leaks)!

[ashishy]

I'm planning to change from the OEM Steel wheels to Alloys from Sai Mag Wheels and have questions regarding the same.

Currently I'm using Yoko Geolander ATS 245/70R16. The steel wheels are 16"/160 pcd*5/+55mm offset/6.5J.

The Alloys that I'm planning to go for are 16"/160 PCD*5/0 offset/8J.

Is this a right match? I did some research online and got the following information. Is this reliable?:

Rim Width Range is 6.5 - 8 in



This is the offset



So, should I go for these alloys or look somewhere else? Alloys provided by Mahindra have the same Rim Width as Steel wheels and are supposed to be ideal but I don't like the look of any of them. :( Any other sources I should looks at?

[NIP]

Guys when is the new version of the Thar expected, if at all !? I currently cannot put my money down on a vehicle with interiors like that !! It may not matter to some hardcore jeepers, but it does to me. Its not the only thing that's holding me back, but its on top of the list. Other things are livable with. I'm not expecting a hard top, but at least a nicely finished product would be nice. After all, with a vehicle like this, we tend to spend long hours on the highway and inside the cabin.

[dhanushs]

Originally Posted by ashishy

So, should I go for these alloys or look somewhere else? Alloys provided by Mahindra have the same Rim Width as Steel wheels and are supposed to be ideal but I don't like the look of any of them. :( Any other sources I should looks at?

As far as I know, you should be OK with these rims.

OT: I'm surprised and happy that someone is actually looking into the detailed specs before upgrading the rims, unlike what we see commonly.

[condor]

Originally Posted by ashishy

This is the offset

Rule of thumb - as long as offset is a little more negative than stock, you should be fine.

* more negative - is not an oxymoron here
* But common sense would suggest that the offset values should not be too different.

[groom]

came across this three seater configuration for the rear seat in a thar for first time.



you can also view this at www.facebook.com/automobilemodification

p.s: I have not links with this guy. :-)
found this interesting in ACI advertorial section so posting it.

[Thar4x4]

Originally Posted by ashishy

So, should I go for these alloys or look somewhere else? Alloys provided by Mahindra have the same Rim Width as Steel wheels and are supposed to be ideal but I don't like the look of any of them. :( Any other sources I should looks at?

Have a look here:
As per the chart you can go up to 8.5 J alloys for tyre 245, I have 8 J alloys with stock tyre 235 and they look as well as perform awesome. However these alloys will increase track which result in water and mus splash on both sides of vehicle

I have Plati 16"/0 offset/ 8 J alloys, the look is changed totally. You can have look here.

Thanks,
Vishal