[71Convertible]

Vintageman,
Restorations should be to the objectives of the restorer. Others can have opinions, but they are really irrelevant. I restore mine (see separate thread) to be a daily driver -- I drive my car 3-4 days a week -- yet I strive on this particular car for period correctness. -- with few exceptions. I don't strive for show car. My car will simply reflect a well used but well cared car period correct car.

There are also other cars that I've restored or been interested in restoring for which period correctness has not and will not be a factor at all. Given the right opportunity I would even do a custom beetle (just need the right car).

To your question my answer would be that restorations need only be true to the objective that the restorer intended.

In the case of the car we've been discussing -- Pavan has done a fantastic job in bring back a car that was "dead" -- a car which most people (including myself) would have given up on. Also from the thread it appears he had some intention of getting it period correct -- look at the extent he has gone to in locating a a one year only bumper, changing back headlights etc. I suspect others may have also gathered from reading this thread that Pavan wants to do a period correct restoration over time and are putting in their inputs.

Pavan, like I said to u on the phone earlier today -- next chat will be over some beers.

Byas

[PAVAN KADAM]

Yes Byas and Vintageman,

The satisfaction quotient in getting a car restored to a daily running car is more that anything.

I am not a great restorer but the inkling towards achieving a near period car is achieved upto 75%,

Yes maybe over period of time this might complete 25% of the remaining portion.

Byas you would agree with this, that having a VW Beetle you still feel that something is still missing after all the effort you've put in.Even thought the car runs fine, we tend to make it better.

[PAVAN KADAM]

Beetles raining in Hyderabad guys.

Its time good ole Nizam city get one club.

Just heard from 2 Bug owners yesterday.

[ajay99]

I did some research on the 1500 engine for beetles and this what I obtained.
1500 was introduced in Type I(beetles) from 1st August 66 and continued upto July1970 .
In the US the 1500 was replaced by 1600 engines an year earlier ie,Aug1969.
here are the engine numbers of the 1500 engine which came in various years.
(from Aug66- july67)
L0,000,001- L 0,019,335 40bhp (DIN)1500(US-M240smog)
H 0,204,001 - H 0,874,199 44bhp(DIN)1500*

(from Aug67- july68)
L 0,019,337- L 0,021,115 40bhp(DIN)1500(US-M240smog)
H 0,874,200 - H 1,003,255 44bhp(DIN)1500(not to US)*
H 5,000,001 - H 5,414,585 44bhp(DIN)1500(US- M157 smog)*

(from Aug68- july69)
L 0,021,115- L 0,024,106 40bhp(DIN)1500(US-M240smog)
H 1,003,256 - H 1,124,668 44bhp(DIN)1500(not to US)*
H 5,414,586 - H 5,900,000 40bhp(DIN)1500(US-M157 smog)*

(from Aug69- july70)
L 0,024,107-L0,026,500)40bhp(DIN)1500(US-M240smog)** H 1,124,699 - H 1,350,000 44bhp(DIN)1500(not to US)*

so the '1500' was not a one year phenomenon.

here are the list of changes made in the 1967 model
Oil pressure relief valve gets annular groove. "Volkswagen" badge on engine lid. 12 volt electrics. Fuse box increased from 8 to 10 fuses. Generator increased from 180 to 360 watts. Voltage regulator under rear seat. Rear track increased with wider swing axles to 1350mm. Clutch diameter increased from 180 to 200mm. 130 tooth ring gear (flywheel) replaces 109 tooth. Dual brake cylinder system (drum brakes). Front discs (single circuit) on 1500 models to some countries (not US). Outside door handle has round push button (different from previous years). Inside door handles recessed. Two speed wipers. Back-up lights (on US models). Vertical headlights replace sloped glass (non bubble, "upright" headlights like later years). US models get sealed beam headlights. Locking buttons on doors. Driver's armrest on door. Slimmer chrome trim on outside. Driver's outside mirror becomes standard. Rear anti-sway bar added. Brake fluid reservoir on 1500 raised after November 66.

[JayD]

Originally Posted by PAVAN KADAM

Mine is a true 1967 and 1500 and if you go through some history on VW's you will know that the 1500's were manufactured only from September 1967 till August 1968.


Thanks for your comments, not being offensive to them, i would like to give you some info on the car that has taken 1 yr of persuance to buy and the next 1 yr to detail it during restoration,and owning it for 5 yrs i've gone through all books and sites that give me the the best of information about my car.

And to sum it up mine is the car that was the limited edition of Beetles that came out in September 1967.
.

Originally Posted by ajay99

I did some research on the 1500 engine for beetles and this what I obtained.
1500 was introduced in Type I(beetles) from 1st August 66 and continued upto July1970 .
In the US the 1500 was replaced by 1600 engines an year earlier ie,Aug1969.
here are the engine numbers of the 1500 engine which came in various years.
(from Aug66- july67)
L0,000,001- L 0,019,335 40bhp (DIN)1500(US-M240smog)
H 0,204,001 - H 0,874,199 44bhp(DIN)1500*

(from Aug67- july68)
L 0,019,337- L 0,021,115 40bhp(DIN)1500(US-M240smog)
H 0,874,200 - H 1,003,255 44bhp(DIN)1500(not to US)*
H 5,000,001 - H 5,414,585 44bhp(DIN)1500(US- M157 smog)*

(from Aug68- july69)
L 0,021,115- L 0,024,106 40bhp(DIN)1500(US-M240smog)
H 1,003,256 - H 1,124,668 44bhp(DIN)1500(not to US)*
H 5,414,586 - H 5,900,000 40bhp(DIN)1500(US-M157 smog)*

(from Aug69- july70)
L 0,024,107-L0,026,500)40bhp(DIN)1500(US-M240smog)** H 1,124,699 - H 1,350,000 44bhp(DIN)1500(not to US)*

so the '1500' was not a one year phenomenon.

here are the list of changes made in the 1967 model
Oil pressure relief valve gets annular groove. "Volkswagen" badge on engine lid. 12 volt electrics. Fuse box increased from 8 to 10 fuses. Generator increased from 180 to 360 watts. Voltage regulator under rear seat. Rear track increased with wider swing axles to 1350mm. Clutch diameter increased from 180 to 200mm. 130 tooth ring gear (flywheel) replaces 109 tooth. Dual brake cylinder system (drum brakes). Front discs (single circuit) on 1500 models to some countries (not US). Outside door handle has round push button (different from previous years). Inside door handles recessed. Two speed wipers. Back-up lights (on US models). Vertical headlights replace sloped glass (non bubble, "upright" headlights like later years). US models get sealed beam headlights. Locking buttons on doors. Driver's armrest on door. Slimmer chrome trim on outside. Driver's outside mirror becomes standard. Rear anti-sway bar added. Brake fluid reservoir on 1500 raised after November 66.

Pavan!! so i guess u need to re-look at your originality aspect.

[PAVAN KADAM]

JayD.

I am getting tired of this checking thing.

I am happy its a 1500 54 BHP.

I dont want to go to an extent of removing my Pistons and showing the size.

What ever ajay has posted my engine specs match them.

I am content with what ever it is and would not welcome any comments and suggestions on the same.

Thank you.

[71Convertible]

Ajay99,
As posted earlier by me the non-US cars did not have some of the changes. The upright headlights were US only as were the 12V electrics (for non US it was not std, but an option).
Byas

[karlosdeville]

Again, am not contesting or questioning anything and take your word for it, but didnt you mention earlier that you had changed your engine to a 1600 from the original 1500? You always referred to the car as a 1600 earlier. Have you refitted the original engine now?

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/359603-post19.html

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/363523-post22.html

Cheers

[PAVAN KADAM]

Karl.

Typo error might be.

But no comments on it.

Again contesting on this issue. i would not like.

Will get the size of my piston rings and let u know in my next reply.

[karlosdeville]

Originally Posted by PAVAN KADAM

Karl.

Typo error might be.

But no comments on it.

Again contesting on this issue. i would not like.

Will get the size of my piston rings and let u know in my next reply.

Why do you take it negatively when I clearly mentioned Im not contesting your claims, I just remember you used to refer to it as a 1600, (which you did on a couple of occassions) thats all. Im not asking for the piston size please dont take the trouble! If you say it was a typo, that'll do just fine, I have no reason (nor the requisite knowledge) to doubt your claims.

[JayD]

Originally Posted by karlosdeville

Why do you take it negatively when I clearly mentioned Im not contesting your claims, I just remember you used to refer to it as a 1600, (which you did on a couple of occassions) thats all. Im not asking for the piston size please dont take the trouble! If you say it was a typo, that'll do just fine, I have no reason (nor the requisite knowledge) to doubt your claims.

Excatly! pavan, pls don't take each and every thing that someone says about your car in such a negative manner. I saw the same style of posting when chargerman commented about your car. I agree u may have done a lot of research on your model, but everythig u say is not always right, which has been proven many times over. We are all here to learn something from each other, so pls take comments in a positive manner. We are not accusing u of cheating on facts or anything of such sort! Just genuine interest in cars, and some of us happen to be suckers for originality that's all!

P.S: now pls don't come flaming at me for this reply!!

[PAVAN KADAM]

JayD.

I am getting sick and tired of this.

I am not reacting negatively but want to make one point clear.

I understand we need to learn from each other, but constructively.

Not knowing what Beetles are in the first case, i would not appreciate people talking.

I am content with what ever it is and would not welcome any comments and suggestions on the same.

Again contesting on this issue. i would not like.

Should my english be more precise than this.

Hope you get my point.

Pls get a complete original car period correct and .......running as fine as my car and talk about being suckers for Originality.

Thank you.

[moralfibre]

Originally Posted by PAVAN KADAM

Not knowing what Beetles are in the first case, i would not appreciate people talking.

I have been a silent observer of this thread so far but I can assure you that most people who have responded on this thread know a LOT about Beetles. Some have even visited the prestigious VW show in which an entire village is cordoned off for displaying VW's from all over Germany and more.

I am content with what ever it is and w

ould not welcome any comments and suggestions on the same.
Again contesting on this issue. i would not like.
Should my english be more precise than this.
Hope you get my point.

In that case my friend, the pictures would better off be in an Orkut, Picasa or Flickr album with a link to it in the Classics in India thread. Saying "This is my Beetle, love it or leave it". If you open a thread be open to constructive criticism from fellow readers. I don't think your pompous attitude would do any good to your repute around here.

Pls get a complete original car period correct and .......running as fineas my car and talk about being suckers for Originality.
Thank you.

You are welcome and we appreciate the pain taken in restoration and the amount you've spent on it: - http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/681361-post5.html, I am sure you could at least afford original door handles, etc. But thats your call in the end. I believe you started this thread with an intent of getting positive remarks about your car and if that is the case then why not just make it clear in the opening post itself?

[JayD]

Originally Posted by PAVAN KADAM

JayD.

I am getting sick and tired of this.
I am not reacting negatively but want to make one point clear.
I understand we need to learn from each other, but constructively.
Not knowing what Beetles are in the first case, i would not appreciate people talking.
I am content with what ever it is and would not welcome any comments and suggestions on the same.
Again contesting on this issue. i would not like.
Should my english be more precise than this.
Hope you get my point.
Pls get a complete original car period correct and .......running as fine as my car and tal about being suckers for Originality.
Thank you.

Hi pavan!
I've told this to u several times, i'm not trying to argue. I was just saying all this in good interest. To see a fellow bhp-ians car in concours conditions only makes me happy, not jealous!!

And one thing, pls don't think that just coz we dont say it aloud, that others do not know anything about beetles. U are not the person who invented the beetle are u?? U may know some thing i don't and vice versa! There are a loot of very learned members on this forum and their knowledge would be greatly beneficial to us.

Regarding getting a period car in complete originality before opening my mouth,that would apply to u too!.U've been saying about tata ace parts here and some autorickshaw parts there, and u are coming to question me about originality??

Regarding not having a car yet, many members know the reason all too well. I don't believe in pickin just some piece of thrash off the road and dumping cash on it. When i get a car which has potential, i'll see that its restored in proper style, with guidelines from several senior members on this forum who have undertaken such jobs!

And if u don't want to get any comments on the car(or suggestions) as moral asked,why bother putting up a thread!!(Or include "no suggestions/negative comments" in your thread title!) Just your orkut/picasa album will do, or your BHP garage should take care of it!

I'm once again, repeating what i've said to u, i have nothing personal against u, whatever i said was only in good interest.

[ajay99]

My intention was not to start any war of words between fellow BHPians but just to point out that 1500Type I is not a single year phenomenon or a RARITY as 'claimed' by someone in this forum.

and dear Pavan, for your kind info there are VW's in INDIA restored/maintained using purely GENUINEVW (GERMAN) NOS parts .
i know of a particular beetle with original NOS genuine VW German Squareweave bodylinings(carpets) (not the WOLFSBURGWEST or TMI or WCM or Jbugs variety) .
the full set cost that guy a whopping 550USD.
Also currently there is an ad in ebaymotors germany an add for a set of GENUINE VW (NOS)RUBBER CARPETS(front and rear) with VW logo and part no
and do you know the asking priceUSD 279 + shipping costs.
So the point is if use NOS GENUINE VW parts it will cost much but the end product will be worth that effort!!!