[autocrat]

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

Dear Gowtham - the suspension spiders that you have purchased are not original, please return them. Please DO NOT use aftermarket spiders, the material will not take shock load! In your car, the front suspension seems to be unopened and therefore original, nothing needs to be done immediately (refer underlined note below). PLEASE DO NOT OPEN THE SUSPENSION, NO MATTER WHAT ANYBODY TELLS YOU. DO NOT DO ANYTHING SILLY ON YOUR CAR! Setting the spiders is a specialized job, the tolerance on the OD is 24 microns, 99% of the guys do not understand what to do, they will spoil the stub axles.

The Lucas TVS coil is OK. The VIR leaf spring bushes are OK, the ones with the nuts go on the rear side. The EMA suspension rubber bush kit is OK.

In case of the battery also, you should have gone go through a simple process of elimination. Without touching the alternator, just put a "service battery" from the friendly neighbourhood batterywallah and use the car for a couple of days. If it works, the old battery was a dud. Also measure the specific gravity of the electrolyte by a hygrometer. It must be 1.2 in all cells. Its so simple, but friendly neighbourhood batterywallahs will forever remain ignorant of simple things ()! This is nothing new for me, I just quietly do what I have to do and find my own way, you'll have to do the same. Please post photographs of the new Amaron battery, I want to see whether it meets JIS-D-5301 (JIS means Japanese Industrial Standard).

Note: Get the lubrication done, no compromise on grease quality.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

Dear Sir,

As advised

1) I will not do any changes on suspension.
2) Will return the spiders - may be I will have to buy something else in return, I am thinking of carburettor packing kit (reason below). Question: is the spider forged steel?
3) I did think of switching batteries with my Linea and checking if Linea runs well, but i did not have the correct socket to open the Linea battery fastener.
4) Attaching new battery pics:









I was trying to take a video of idling engine to post here when I noticed that the carb was leaking fuel. Screenshots from video:

[autocrat]

Some Music (recorded with windows up)

https://youtu.be/oQ57EEILn8o

idling:

https://youtu.be/wIS0GVr6aUs

The low pass filter on phone has ensured that the clatter is amplified and nicer tones muted :(

[DHABHAR.BEHRAM]

Originally Posted by autocrat

Dear Sir, I will return the spiders, may be I will have to buy something else in return, I am thinking of carburettor packing kit. Is the spider forged steel? Attaching new battery pictures.

Dear Gowtham - carburettor packing set costs 50 times less than spiders, be careful otherwise you will lose money. The original spiders are forged steel, the aftermarket nonsense is not. You got the JIS-D-5301 specification battery but it is the "L" specification battery, means that the positive terminal is on the left side. It should be the other way round, isn't it? It is common sense that when it is the other way round, then the terminal will remain away from the bonnet edge. See, the friendly neighbourhood batterywallah sold you what he had and you merrily bought also. You are not expected to know, but he must at least tell you, isn't it? See how much ignorance is there in the marketplace out there, any nonsense goes, now you know why I am again and again telling you to be careful? Now it is too late, you will have to live with it for 4 years, best of luck! At least position the terminals properly before tightening, not haphazard. At least clean the base tray before fitting. What yaar!

All self-respecting Solex carburettors leak slightly, yours is no better or worse, if it is running properly, please leave it alone. The specification is MCS1061, means without accelerating pump but with econostat.

Have you done the lubrication and oil change? No compromise, please!

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

[autocrat]

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

Dear Gowtham - carburettor packing set costs 50 times less than spiders, be careful otherwise you will lose money. The original spiders are forged steel, the aftermarket nonsense is not.

Sir, thanks! noted. I am returning the HM spiders. Also, I will see if I can get some cosmetic bits in return.

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

You got the JIS-D-5301 specification battery but it is the "L" specification battery, means that the positive terminal is on the left side. It should be the other way round, isn't it? It is common sense that when it is the other way round, then the terminal will remain away from the bonnet edge. See, the friendly neighbourhood batterywallah sold you what he had and you merrily bought also. You are not expected to know, but he must at least tell you, isn't it? See how much ignorance is there in the marketplace out there, any nonsense goes, now you know why I am again and again telling you to be careful? Now it is too late, you will have to live with it for 4 years, best of luck! At least position the terminals properly before tightening, not haphazard. At least clean the base tray before fitting. What yaar!

Sir! I had no knowledge or information on the terminal orientation
Another valuable lesson I can't forget. I have ordered Rust-O-leum spray paint. I will mask the other components and clean and paint the battery tray, and also the floor panel behind rear wheel, which is perforated due to rusting.

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

All self-respecting Solex carburettors leak slightly, yours is no better or worse, if it is running properly, please leave it alone. The specification is MCS1061, means without accelerating pump but with econostat.

The idling is little better that before, however there is missing beats initially, the oil pressure and battery lights on dashboard wont go off until I accelerate a little.

Once the engine warms up, the idling speed increases, and the dash lights remain off

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

Have you done the lubrication and oil change? No compromise, please!

Not yet, as I want to get greasing done only at a petrol pump service station. Last option is to buy the grease from bunk and get greasing done in a good garage.

Rims are also rusted and need paint.

[FINTAIL]

Originally Posted by autocrat

Sir, thanks! noted. I am returning the HM spiders. Also, I will see if I can get some cosmetic bits in return.

Agreed that they may not be originals, and not of the correct specification, but I'd still say- Retain the spiders. They may come useful later.

Anything is better than nothing.

The idling is little better that before, however there is missing beats initially, the oil pressure and battery lights on dashboard wont go off until I accelerate a little.

Once the engine warms up, the idling speed increases, and the dash lights remain off

Yep, that is expected behaviour.

Although I would say that the car must start at half a crank and idle smoothly. And the exhaust must throw out a lot of water.

All our cars do that. Starting at half a crank- and they throw out water from the exhaust. Well, I love maintaining them at their optimal levels of tune- and keeping the engines in fine fettle.

Take car of the car- and the car will take good care of you.

Not yet, as I want to get greasing done only at a petrol pump service station. Last option is to buy the grease from bunk and get greasing done in a good garage.

Sound approach. Bangalore classic car owners could help you out a bit here- on where greasing can be done.

I'm sure people like KPS and funkykar (Karthik) can help you out a bit here.

A small suggestion- You can try DIY restoration of the rims, maybe? Painting them? 'Twill be a fun project- refer to this link (http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/tyre-a...storation.html

That was just a suggestion- Been wanting to do a DIY like that in our FIAT 1100D since a long time!

[DHABHAR.BEHRAM]

Originally Posted by autocrat

The idling is little better that before, however there is missing beats initially, the oil pressure and battery lights on dashboard wont go off until I accelerate a little. Once the engine warms up, the idling speed increases, and the dash lights remain off.

Dear Gowtham - idling will be perfect only when every single parameter detailed in the first page of this thread is carried out, everything else is conjecture. As you are not expected to know what to do, please get hold of somebody in Bangalore who understands and has the passion and inclination to actually do. In your case, as you have mentioned that "once the engine warms up, the idling speed increases, and the dash lights remain of", is a good sign because of the following reasons:

1. Alternator charging light (LH side): the Lucas TVS SA15 alternator draws its intital field excitation current through the filament of the charging circuit bulb (the small bulb in the dashboard). The original performance curve in the drawing called for start of charging @ 900rpm for bulb wattage of 2.2W. However, as 2.2W bulb is not a standard part, 2.0W bulb is used in production. Then the performance curve calls for start of charging @ 1400rpm. So, in order to initiate excitation, you must increase the engine rpm slightly for the first time. Subsequently, this is not required. The alternator will continue to charge even at the specified engine idling speed of 720+/-20 rpm. As long as the alternator charges, the dashboard light will remain off. However, please remember that if this bulb fuses, the alternator will not charge. Electricians who do not know this will do all sorts of nonsense and they may also unknowingly change the bulb, so the charging will start. I also know of electricians working in reputed establishments who know this and make a good amount of money by fleecing customers, please be careful. If possible, please buy Philips (Made in Holland) bulb and fit it, it will last forever, the quality is excellent. Each bulb costs 100 rupees but it is worth it. All my cars have them. This bulb also came with the older generation analogue clock made by a company called "Keinzle". You can take it off from there if possible. Whew!

2. Engine oil pressure warning light (RH side): your comment that "the dash lights remain off" is good because the oil pressure switch is calibrated to 0.8 kg/cm2 and the bulb will light up when the pressure is lower than this value. Please verify the tightness of the wire on the oil pressure switch which is located on the RH side of the cylinder block below the exhaust manifold, this connection is known to get loose. Check for this behaviour after changing the engine oil and oil filter. Whew again!

If you do everything correctly, then your car will work properly and you will be able to drive it all over the country. This car does not have a single design issue. The original drawings were dated 1953. Thank God there was no excel file and power point presentation during those days, hahaha! .

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

[FINTAIL]

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

This bulb also came with the older generation analogue clock made by a company called "Keinzle". You can take it off from there if possible. Whew!


Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

Thanks for the inputs!

Incidentally, 'Keinzle' was an OEM clock supplier for Mercedes Benz.

The W111 & W108 S-Classes; and the W114/W115 E Classes got them as OEM fitment.

If I'm not wrong, even Mercedes Benz Pontons had OEM 'Keinzle' dashclocks.

________________________

Phew! And with this post, I officially become a Senior BHPian!

Stay tuned!

[autocrat]

Originally Posted by FINTAIL

Yep, that is expected behaviour.

Although I would say that the car must start at half a crank and idle smoothly. And the exhaust must throw out a lot of water.

All our cars do that. Starting at half a crank- and they throw out water from the exhaust. Well, I love maintaining them at their optimal levels of tune- and keeping the engines in fine fettle.

Take car of the car- and the car will take good care of you.

Sir, the "idle smoothly" part is missing and car throws out soot along with few drops of water.

I have also read a post by Behram Sir in a different thread that the exhaust must throw out water - question - where is this water entering the system? Is it water condensed inside the exhaust pipe?

Originally Posted by FINTAIL

Sound approach. Bangalore classic car owners could help you out a bit here- on where greasing can be done.

I'm sure people like KPS and funkykar (Karthik) can help you out a bit here.

A small suggestion- You can try DIY restoration of the rims, maybe? Painting them? 'Twill be a fun project- refer to this link (http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/tyre-a...storation.html

That was just a suggestion- Been wanting to do a DIY like that in our FIAT 1100D since a long time!

I am in touch with Arun1100, and also will reach out to Karthik.

Regarding the DIY, I have planned this too

Rust-O-Leum silver spray cans on their way to Bangalore, ETA 20th August. There are also some rusted portions, which will be cleaned and painted over (although not on visible areas)

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

Dear Gowtham - idling will be perfect only when every single parameter detailed in the first page of this thread is carried out, everything else is conjecture. As you are not expected to know what to do, please get hold of somebody in Bangalore who understands and has the passion and inclination to actually do. In your case, as you have mentioned that "once the engine warms up, the idling speed increases, and the dash lights remain of", is a good sign because of the following reasons:

1. Alternator charging light (LH side): the Lucas TVS SA15 alternator draws its intital field excitation current through the filament of the charging circuit bulb (the small bulb in the dashboard). The original performance curve in the drawing called for start of charging @ 900rpm for bulb wattage of 2.2W. However, as 2.2W bulb is not a standard part, 2.0W bulb is used in production. Then the performance curve calls for start of charging @ 1400rpm. So, in order to initiate excitation, you must increase the engine rpm slightly for the first time. Subsequently, this is not required. The alternator will continue to charge even at the specified engine idling speed of 720+/-20 rpm. As long as the alternator charges, the dashboard light will remain off. However, please remember that if this bulb fuses, the alternator will not charge. Electricians who do not know this will do all sorts of nonsense and they may also unknowingly change the bulb, so the charging will start. I also know of electricians working in reputed establishments who know this and make a good amount of money by fleecing customers, please be careful. If possible, please buy Philips (Made in Holland) bulb and fit it, it will last forever, the quality is excellent. Each bulb costs 100 rupees but it is worth it. All my cars have them. This bulb also came with the older generation analogue clock made by a company called "Keinzle". You can take it off from there if possible. Whew!

Sir! Thanks a lot for the detailed information!
I will buy a couple of these bulbs and keep them. The technical information that you share can never be found elsewhere!

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

2. Engine oil pressure warning light (RH side): your comment that "the dash lights remain off" is good because the oil pressure switch is calibrated to 0.8 kg/cm2 and the bulb will light up when the pressure is lower than this value. Please verify the tightness of the wire on the oil pressure switch which is located on the RH side of the cylinder block below the exhaust manifold, this connection is known to get loose. Check for this behaviour after changing the engine oil and oil filter. Whew again!

If you do everything correctly, then your car will work properly and you will be able to drive it all over the country. This car does not have a single design issue. The original drawings were dated 1953. Thank God there was no excel file and power point presentation during those days, hahaha! .

Oil Change, Greasing is pending - already 2 weeks since I got the car and I am not able to take time off work and attend to this important activity. Getting restless.

I agree that with more technology at our disposal, we have more ways to make mistakes. I remember an incident where a draughtsman used solid line instead of dashed line in an AutoCAD drawing. The component was manufactured with the hole drilled on the opposite face of a stainless steel block.

With the advent of MPFI and CRDI engines, we also see that the skill needed to tune the cars is a fast disappearing art. Parts are never repaired, but replaced.

[Elegant Pig]

Hi!

Could someone help me find a good mechanic who can work on a FIAT 1100 as well as a Padmini? Ideally in Chembur or Navi Mumbai, but if you know one even in southern Mumbai then please do not hesitate to suggest him.

I am not looking for a restorer! All I need is a mechanic with a good garage who will look after the regular issues that arise with an infrequently driven classic.

Thanks.

[genesis]

Originally Posted by Elegant Pig

Hi!

Could someone help me find a good mechanic who can work on a FIAT 1100 as well as a Padmini? Ideally in Chembur or Navi Mumbai, but if you know one even in southern Mumbai then please do not hesitate to suggest him.

I am not looking for a restorer! All I need is a mechanic with a good garage who will look after the regular issues that arise with an infrequently driven classic.

Thanks.

No need to go to South Mumbai. Look no further than devabhai in Chembur. (shivaji putla). He maintains a few fiats for folks and my petrol jeep!

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/mumbai...ur-mumbai.html

[Elegant Pig]

Thanks a lot, Genesis, for such a prompt response!!! Will try and meet him asap. Btw, would love to see your petrol Jeep.

Originally Posted by genesis

No need to go to South Mumbai. Look no further than devabhai in Chembur. (shivaji putla). He maintains a few fiats for folks and my petrol jeep!

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/mumbai...ur-mumbai.html

[DHABHAR.BEHRAM]

Originally Posted by Elegant Pig

Hi! Could someone help me find a good mechanic who can work on a FIAT 1100 as well as a Padmini? Ideally in Chembur or Navi Mumbai, but if you know one even in southern Mumbai then please do not hesitate to suggest him. Thanks.

Dear Parth (Elegant Pig) - hello after a very long time! Is your car done? If yes, can we see some photographs please? In a lighter vein (by the way), the "guy" you are looking for is ME! ()! Hahaha!

Anyways, I have missed your number with many others when my SIM card got corrupted. Please PM me your number, Ill tell you exactly where to go and what to do. I suggest please also go to Soumya's (Genesis) contact in Chembur, I would like to meet that person also.

Dear Gowtham - as you are getting soot from the tailpipe, there can be multiple reasons, as follows. However, as some water is also coming out, this indicates a basic healthy engine. Water is condensate, it is the H2O from CO2+H2O:

1. Incorrect valve clearance, very likely as the setting would never have been done after production. The car has covered 50000 kms. I have attended numerous such cars, this is nothing new. Specification is 0.1mm in cold condition for all valves. Alternate methodology is 0.2mm for the inlet valves and 0.25mm for the exhaust valves in hot condition, set with the engine running at idling speed (yes, engine idling)!
2. Higher dwell angle. Specification is 60 degrees.
3. Incorrect (mostly retarded) ignition timing. Specification is 10 degrees BTDC with vacuum advance connected.
4. Inadequate centrifugal and vacuum advance provided by the distributor. Specification is 13 degrees at and above 3000 rpm.
5. Incorrect spark plug gap, chances are less though. Specification is 0.7 to 0.8mm.
6. Carburettor feeding rich air-fuel ratio mixture. Your carburettor is MCS1061 with an internal vent, so the inlet manifold breather is blocked. However, in many cars, the internal vent does not optimally provide for stoichiometric ratio, so the breather is opened with a 1mm orifice. This pipe was used with the MCS1049 / MCS1045 / MCS1023 / MCS1014 carburettors. Specification of main jet is 97.5 but 102 gives better acceleration without loss of fuel economy.
7. Higher fuel level inside the float chamber. Specification is upto the level marker projection in the float chamber when the float is pressed downwards.
8. Gradual build-up of carbon soot inside the exhaust system due to gentle city use over the years, 200 kms of spirited driving will get rid of this soot.

First, change the engine oil and filter. Clean the air cleaner element by blowing air through it (in to out). Everything else afterwards, step-by-step!

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

[autocrat]

Originally Posted by DHABHAR.BEHRAM

First, change the engine oil and filter. Clean the air cleaner element by blowing air through it (in to out). Everything else afterwards, step-by-step!

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

I set about the day determined to get the following tasks done:

1) Greasing
2) Oil and Oil Filter Change
3) Ignition coil change
4) Air filter cleaning
5) Correction of unstable idling when cold

As most places turned me away for task no. 1 citing weekend washing load, I thought its wiser to get other things done without wasting more time:

Oil and filter change: Oil: 20W50 Purchased at petrol pump, Purolator Filter: Done
Ignition Coil change: Lucas: Done
Air filter cleaning: Practically no dust in the pan. Just cleaned the filter and reassembled.
Cold idling: As the car had run about 35km, cold idling issue could not be checked and attended to.

Please take a look at the old oil (completely black):





Looked almost like used diesel engine oil

After the oil change the engine revs a little better and runs a little quieter too.

Also, removed the main jet and its size was 97.5. I have ordered for one 102.5 size jet.

Timing chain packing has given way and is leaking oil, although in small quantity.

Brake fluid was lower than max, and was topped up with Girling DOT3 brake fluid. The new ignition coil can be seen in its place.



After the coil was changed, the idling has smoothened out a little. However its not completely alright. However, car starts in half a crank most of the times. On occasions, I get the starter motor whirring sound without engaging the flywheel gear. I dont know if its the gear not engaging or the starter motor armature not acting.

Also I have also got some spares for future use.

1. Union brand tail light lens
2. Rane Tie Rod ends
3. VR propeller shaft coupling

Should I be worried about the black oil? I will run the car for about 100 km this week and check the oil level and colour and report.

[DHABHAR.BEHRAM]

Originally Posted by autocrat

1. I set about the day determined to get the following tasks done: Oil, 20W50 purchased at petrol pump, Purolator filter, done. 2. Please take a look at the old oil (completely black), looked almost like used diesel engine oil, after the oil change the engine revs a little better and runs a little quieter too. Timing chain packing has given way and is leaking oil, although in small quantity. 3. Also, removed the main jet and its size was 97.5. I have ordered for one 102.5 size jet. 4. Brake fluid was lower than max, and was topped up with Girling DOT3 brake fluid. 5. The new ignition coil can be seen in its place. 6. After the coil was changed, the idling has smoothened out a little. However its not completely alright.

Dear Gowtham - my replies are as follows:

1. Good. This was the primary requirement, which you have completed. I presume the oil pressure warning light remains off even during idling, if so, then it is a good thing.
2. I had told you to change the oil because the old oil is supposed to become black as it is supposed to keep on carrying the floating impurities along with it and in turn keep the engine healthy. The black color means that the old oil has done its job and needs replacement. You can report after running for 100 kms, 500 kms, 1000 kms and keep a record of the behaviour. Please don't do anything silly with the timing cover packing, just leave it alone for the time being, you can just wipe off the excess oil with a piece of cloth dipped in some petrol and see that all the M6*1.0 size bolts are tight enough, do not over-tighten, the bolts will break. Torque as per drawing should be in the region of 1.5kgm. The three bolts on the LH side (near the filter) have nuts and are known to get loose a little. This should not be more than a 5 minutes job. By the way, the two M8*1.25 size nuts holding the mechanical fuel pump on the cylinder block are also known to get a little loose, just tighten them properly. Don't do anything else here also.
3. The jet size is 102 and not 102.5. Please use the original jet made by Carburettors India Ltd only, there are numerous spurious jets floating around in the market, they will make your life miserable (Jet size is based on mass flow and not diameter, there are many funny stories which have happened with me, but I'll tell you some other time). It is best to take the jet off a scrapped carburettor rather than buying a new one. No other change to the carburettor is necessary, performance and drivability will drastically improve, fuel economy will not be affected. But remember that this will work when all related engine tuning parameters are exactly as per the specification. This reply is due to the learning I got from my carburettor mentor Mr.S.Govindarajan, the then GM(R&D) of Carburettors Ltd, Chennai. Thank you Sir!
4. OK, please monitor the level, this seems to be due to normal wear of the liners as the level was not very low. I had calculated for 0.5mm and 1.0mm wear of the liners, the volume loss in terms of cc approximately equals the volume loss in the cup. There should be no leakages.
5. OK, so you now have the PA12 in place. I can still see the two blue wires just pushed together, remove this nonsense and make a good direct connection. The other brown wire brings 12v to the coil only during cranking and is now redundant but it can remain there as it causes no harm.
6. You must bring everything else to specification, then it will work properly.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar

[HimuraKenshin]

Hi Behram!
i tried calling you but was not able to get through,but seeing that you are active on here, i wanted to ask you a question.

My car is leaning towards one side, the left to be specific.
The leaf springs were worked upon and the 'pata' bushes were replaced.
The fron suspension was also worked upon, all 'gutka' bushes were replaced with original VIR ones, nothing else was touched or replaced. During this job, the coil spring pads were also changed.

The car was fine for a few weeks after this, but now its leaning to the left again.
Kindly advice on the course of action..