Lagonda cars in India

wasif · 21st July 2009, 10:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lagonda12/24

Hi all,

If someone has it, please send it to me. And if possible, the engine and chassis number.
As I do a little research about 11.1, 11.9 and 12/24 Lagondas.

look at : http://www.myspace.com/pre1926lagonda
See pictures >

They are alle thermo syphon cooled cars.

Patrick

Hi Patrick.

Welcome to T-BHP.

You have a excellent collection of data and pictures on that link above.

Do tell us more on the various lagonda cars you have had in the past or have knowledge about.

Wasif

tonrag · 21st July 2009, 18:38

Hmm, interesting info posted by Harit. I'm not in Bangalore now and will check back with Shirazi when I return and refresh this thread with updates.

Lagonda12/24 · 21st July 2009, 19:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by wasif

Hi Patrick.

Welcome to T-BHP.

You have a excellent collection of data and pictures on that link above.

Do tell us more on the various lagonda cars you have had in the past or have knowledge about.

Wasif

Hi Wasif,

I have a 12/24 LC of 1925. (see link below) It's in the family for many years now. So I have a great interest in models like this. There are very few survivers. So I trie to get them all on my myspace. Including the 11.1 and 11.9. This are the first Lagonda's with a monocoque chassis. Quite modern for those times. They started this in 1913 with the 11.1 till the 12/24 in 1926. It are not very fast cars (about 70-75 km/h) Also not as expensive as a V12, but more rare as a lot of Lagonda owners don't know about these models
The Lagonda club always mentioned about 20 survivers (cars between 1913-1926). On the moment I found 25 of them. But I think I found them all. Exept for some pictures. So I am very curious about the car in Dehli.

Kind regards,

Patrick

BO 9521 12/24 LC LC6555 1925 Photo Gallery - Photo 1 of 37 by Lagonda 12/24 - MySpace Photos

morris1948 · 22nd July 2009, 22:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by wasif

Below is the correspondence I have had with the Lagonda Owners Club in UK,

They have cionfirmed that Lagonda did not produce any Air Cooled cars with four wheels

Dear Wasif

Our Historian, Arnold Davey, has now looked through his records thoroughly and is afraid he can find no photograph which matches this car. He says that it is a 3 litre Lagonda but with a home made body by someone who obviously made it without reference to other 3 litre models. Without chassis number or UK registration number that is as far as we can go. Arnold did wonder whether it was a famous 3 litre driven in India by Mr Bannerjee but it turned out not to be that one.
Dear Wasif , Harit and all actively involved with this post , herewith are the critical no's needed to confirm this cars identity; the identification numbers are as follows TYPE 35. ST44, ENGINE No. 2914 , CAR Z 11164.
I would be very obliged if you could put me in touch with somebody from the club who could help us to procure some parts to complete the engine etc. of the car.
The car is certainly very shabbly rebodied and will need a lot of attention to get her to a nice presentable state. The car is very certainly water cooled and from whatever little information that i have gathered she was a "Silent Travel saloon". Will try and put some recent pictures of the car in its current state soon.
Regarding air cooled cars, it is only the Lagonda Tri car which was air cooled and no other Lagonda had this.

I am so worry we can’t help you further but would be most interested if you do find any history as we have a vast database of knowledge on Lagondas and it is always exciting to find an “unknown” car.

I found the website most interesting and have actually met Awini Shanker who is very enthusiastic about his beautiful Lagonda.

Cheers

Colin Bugler

Lagonda Club Lagonda Club Limited Registered in England No.1266365 Registered Office: 6 Queen Square, Bristol BS1 4JE VAT 469653692

Dear Wasif , Harit and all actively involved with this post , herewith are the critical no's needed to confirm this cars identity; the identification numbers are as follows TYPE 35. ST44, ENGINE No. 2914 , CAR Z 11164.
I would be very obliged if you could put me in touch with somebody from the club who could help us to procure some parts to complete the engine etc. of the car.
The car is certainly very shabbly rebodied and will need a lot of attention to get her to a nice presentable state. The car is very certainly water cooled and from whatever little information that i have gathered she was a "Silent Travel saloon" before it was rebodied. Will try and put some recent pictures of the car in its current state soon.

wasif · 23rd July 2009, 10:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by morris1948

Dear Wasif , Harit and all actively involved with this post , herewith are the critical no's needed to confirm this cars identity; the identification numbers are as follows TYPE 35. ST44, ENGINE No. 2914 , CAR Z 11164.
I would be very obliged if you could put me in touch with somebody from the club who could help us to procure some parts to complete the engine etc. of the car.
The car is certainly very shabbly rebodied and will need a lot of attention to get her to a nice presentable state. The car is very certainly water cooled and from whatever little information that i have gathered she was a "Silent Travel saloon" before it was rebodied. Will try and put some recent pictures of the car in its current state soon.

Hi Morri1948.

Great to hear from you and get the numbers on this car.

You can contact Colin Bugler or the Lagonda Owners club at lagclub@tiscali.co.uk for any of your lagonda related queries. They have an excellent website and can definitely help you find what you need.

Would love to see detailed pictures of this car soon.

Regards

Wasif

wasif · 23rd July 2009, 19:57

Dear Morris1948.

The Lagonda Club has confirmed that your car is definitely one that originally came with the "Silent Travel Saloon" bodywork coded "ST44"

Mr. Bugler has been kind enough to send a scanned page from latest book by Arnold Davy the "Lagonda 2.3 & 31/2 in Detail" showing and describing the said bodystyle.

It is interesting to note that there are not many such cars to be found intact as of now as most have been rebodied as roadsters.

He has also sent me a couple of forms etc to regester as a member with them and for parts etc.

Do send me your email and I will forward these to you.

Mr. Bugler's mail is reproduced below.

Dear Wasif

Many thanks for these numbers and we can now identify this Lagonda. I have scanned in page 169 of Arnold Davey’s latest book “Lagonda 2, 3 & 3½ litre in Detail” and attach this although it is not the actual car now in your country

There are hardly any ST44 bodies left as most saloons these days are turned into tourers – a pity! I am afraid it is a poor scan but at least the current owner will know what his car originally looked like – rather elegant. Yes, it is a Silent Travel Saloon – see the ST in the model name.

Only members can buy spares from our Spares Service as we use members’ money to support this service. Just in case the gentleman is interested I attach several documents which will tell him how to join the Lagonda Club and what we can do for our members

Regards, Colin

karlosdeville · 24th July 2009, 10:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by wasif

Mr. Bugler has been kind enough to send a scanned page from latest book by Arnold Davy the "Lagonda 2.3 & 31/2 in Detail" showing and describing the said bodystyle.

If Mr Bugler doesn't mind, can you post that page up here for us to see? I couldn't find much on the same elsewhere.

wasif · 25th July 2009, 03:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by karlosdeville

If Mr Bugler doesn't mind, can you post that page up here for us to see? I couldn't find much on the same elsewhere.

I m sure Mr. Bugler wouldn't mind but the thing is Karl its a 4 MB file. Send me your email and I will forward the entire mail for you to do the honours

ritayan · 26th July 2009, 20:23

News just in is that Babi Nabis has recently aquired a Lagonda in calcutta. Can our resident hunturs sniff out and post some details.

harit · 26th July 2009, 23:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by ritayan

News just in is that Babi Nabis has recently aquired a Lagonda in calcutta. Can our resident hunturs sniff out and post some details.

Did he not already own half share of the famous green Delhi Lagonda? Maybe he took it over completely?
Just speculating, but a possibility!

hillram · 26th July 2009, 23:20

Didnt Aston Martin have a collaboration with Lagonda cars at some point of time.I remember disticntly in a James Bond movie where in the credits it is mentioned so as Aston Martin Lagonda Ltd...???

the mole · 27th July 2009, 09:47

I think Lagonda merged into Aston Martin sometime in the forties. Correct me if wrong guys.

wasif · 27th July 2009, 10:56

David Brown bought both Aston Martin and Lagonda in 1947 and merged them to form Aston Martin Lagonda.

Attached picture is of a Lagonda M45 Saloon whith what is termed the "Silent Travel' body style.

Note the pillarless construction with a door opening similar to the Fiat 1100 Balila

This is the similar kind of bodywork that originally was supplied with the Lagonda 3.5 we were discussing earlier with the boat tail.

Also attached is the scan of the page showing the exact ST44 bodystyle from the book on these cars written by Arnold Davy as supplied to me by the Lagonda Club's ever helpfull Mr. Bugler.

karlosdeville · 28th July 2009, 16:07

morris1948, who is involved in the restoration of Mallya's Lagonda, has requested me to post these pictures of the car in its current state.

tonrag · 30th July 2009, 17:09

I had a most interesting conversation with Mr. Shirazi this afternoon regarding the Lagonda that he owned. The car is a 1933 model 3 ½ litre water cooled model. Shirazi came to know of it when he was in London, in 1971. The car was then owned by Mr. Muzzaffar Ali, who later on became a famous film maker. He was then working in an advertising company named ASP. Shirazi returned to Bombay in 1972 (he was also working in ASP) and purchased the car. He remembers that the portion of the car between the scuttle and the rear end was made of canework, with a rexine cover. He said that in all probability, the car was a saloon, whose top had been chopped off to convert it into a tourer.

In an interesting side story, Shirazi told me that one of the earlier owners of the car was a gentleman named Mohammed Ali Bogra, who later became the Prime Minister of Pakistan from 1953 to 1955. He also said that the car had an Assam Registration; though he couldn’t remember the number.

Shirazi brought the car to Bangalore and had it rebodied in metal to his design. He then took the car back to Bombay, where he had the engine work done. Shirazi worked in Bombay from 1972 to 1977. He then relocated to Bangalore, where he used the car as his sole means of transport. He remembers entering it for the first ever rally of vintage cars in Bangalore and around that time, having driven to Hyderabad to participate in the rally there. He recollected how he had to break the order of the car parade in Hyderabad, and drive up ahead, because the car was overheating due to the slow traffic. Shirazi says he sold the car sometime in 1980 or 81, to a half-French gentleman from Madras, who sold it to another prominent collector in Madras – I do not know whether it’s right to mention names – who in turn sold it to Vijay Mallya.

Shirazi has fond recollections of the car and spoke of seeing late night movies in Bangalore and driving through the night with the hood down to Madras at night!

He promised to look for the few photos that he had. However, he said that the KVCCC might have photos of the first rally in Bangalore, in which his car was a prominent participant.

He told me that he had earlier been under the impression that it was his car that was fully restored by Mallya. However, he discovered recently that his car has not been restored; it still is in the same condition as it was when he sold it; in a garage in Colaba where some of Mallya’s cars are kept. Mallya has another Lagonda too, doesn’t he?

It may be seen that Shirazi’s recollections pertain to the period from the early seventies, and pre-dates the spotting of the car by Harit in 1979. Could it be possible that he might have been the person that Harit tried to contacte in 1979, even though by then, according to Shirazi, he had already relocated to Bangalore? That could be, because Shirazi thought nothing of driving around in his cars and could have been in Bombay with the car then.

I find that a very intriguing story is now unraveling! This is half the fun of restoring old cars.

21st July 2009, 18:38	#77
tonrag BHPian Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Bangalore Posts: 251 Thanked: 1,006 Times	Hmm, interesting info posted by Harit. I'm not in Bangalore now and will check back with Shirazi when I return and refresh this thread with updates.
	() Thanks

23rd July 2009, 19:57	#81
wasif Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Abu Dhabi (for now) Posts: 2,957 Thanked: 414 Times	Dear Morris1948. The Lagonda Club has confirmed that your car is definitely one that originally came with the "Silent Travel Saloon" bodywork coded "ST44" Mr. Bugler has been kind enough to send a scanned page from latest book by Arnold Davy the "Lagonda 2.3 & 31/2 in Detail" showing and describing the said bodystyle. It is interesting to note that there are not many such cars to be found intact as of now as most have been rebodied as roadsters. He has also sent me a couple of forms etc to regester as a member with them and for parts etc. Do send me your email and I will forward these to you. Mr. Bugler's mail is reproduced below. Dear Wasif Many thanks for these numbers and we can now identify this Lagonda. I have scanned in page 169 of Arnold Davey’s latest book “Lagonda 2, 3 & 3½ litre in Detail” and attach this although it is not the actual car now in your country There are hardly any ST44 bodies left as most saloons these days are turned into tourers – a pity! I am afraid it is a poor scan but at least the current owner will know what his car originally looked like – rather elegant. Yes, it is a Silent Travel Saloon – see the ST in the model name. Only members can buy spares from our Spares Service as we use members’ money to support this service. Just in case the gentleman is interested I attach several documents which will tell him how to join the Lagonda Club and what we can do for our members Regards, Colin Last edited by wasif : 23rd July 2009 at 20:05.
	() Thanks

26th July 2009, 20:23	#84
ritayan BHPian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Back in Delhi Posts: 228 Thanked: 46 Times View My Garage	Lagonda in Calcutta News just in is that Babi Nabis has recently aquired a Lagonda in calcutta. Can our resident hunturs sniff out and post some details.
	() Thanks

26th July 2009, 23:20	#86
hillram Senior - BHPian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 2,942 Thanked: 1,326 Times View My Garage	Didnt Aston Martin have a collaboration with Lagonda cars at some point of time.I remember disticntly in a James Bond movie where in the credits it is mentioned so as Aston Martin Lagonda Ltd...???
	() Thanks

27th July 2009, 09:47	#87
the mole Senior - BHPian Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Mumbai Posts: 2,189 Thanked: 825 Times View My Garage	I think Lagonda merged into Aston Martin sometime in the forties. Correct me if wrong guys.
	() Thanks

27th July 2009, 10:56	#88
wasif Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Abu Dhabi (for now) Posts: 2,957 Thanked: 414 Times	David Brown bought both Aston Martin and Lagonda in 1947 and merged them to form Aston Martin Lagonda. Attached picture is of a Lagonda M45 Saloon whith what is termed the "Silent Travel' body style. Note the pillarless construction with a door opening similar to the Fiat 1100 Balila This is the similar kind of bodywork that originally was supplied with the Lagonda 3.5 we were discussing earlier with the boat tail. Also attached is the scan of the page showing the exact ST44 bodystyle from the book on these cars written by Arnold Davy as supplied to me by the Lagonda Club's ever helpfull Mr. Bugler. Attached Thumbnails Last edited by wasif : 27th July 2009 at 11:01.
	() Thanks

28th July 2009, 16:07	#89
karlosdeville Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Pune Posts: 11,976 Thanked: 18,277 Times View My Garage	morris1948, who is involved in the restoration of Mallya's Lagonda, has requested me to post these pictures of the car in its current state.
	() Thanks

30th July 2009, 17:09	#90
tonrag BHPian Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Bangalore Posts: 251 Thanked: 1,006 Times	I had a most interesting conversation with Mr. Shirazi this afternoon regarding the Lagonda that he owned. The car is a 1933 model 3 ½ litre water cooled model. Shirazi came to know of it when he was in London, in 1971. The car was then owned by Mr. Muzzaffar Ali, who later on became a famous film maker. He was then working in an advertising company named ASP. Shirazi returned to Bombay in 1972 (he was also working in ASP) and purchased the car. He remembers that the portion of the car between the scuttle and the rear end was made of canework, with a rexine cover. He said that in all probability, the car was a saloon, whose top had been chopped off to convert it into a tourer. In an interesting side story, Shirazi told me that one of the earlier owners of the car was a gentleman named Mohammed Ali Bogra, who later became the Prime Minister of Pakistan from 1953 to 1955. He also said that the car had an Assam Registration; though he couldn’t remember the number. Shirazi brought the car to Bangalore and had it rebodied in metal to his design. He then took the car back to Bombay, where he had the engine work done. Shirazi worked in Bombay from 1972 to 1977. He then relocated to Bangalore, where he used the car as his sole means of transport. He remembers entering it for the first ever rally of vintage cars in Bangalore and around that time, having driven to Hyderabad to participate in the rally there. He recollected how he had to break the order of the car parade in Hyderabad, and drive up ahead, because the car was overheating due to the slow traffic. Shirazi says he sold the car sometime in 1980 or 81, to a half-French gentleman from Madras, who sold it to another prominent collector in Madras – I do not know whether it’s right to mention names – who in turn sold it to Vijay Mallya. Shirazi has fond recollections of the car and spoke of seeing late night movies in Bangalore and driving through the night with the hood down to Madras at night! He promised to look for the few photos that he had. However, he said that the KVCCC might have photos of the first rally in Bangalore, in which his car was a prominent participant. He told me that he had earlier been under the impression that it was his car that was fully restored by Mallya. However, he discovered recently that his car has not been restored; it still is in the same condition as it was when he sold it; in a garage in Colaba where some of Mallya’s cars are kept. Mallya has another Lagonda too, doesn’t he? It may be seen that Shirazi’s recollections pertain to the period from the early seventies, and pre-dates the spotting of the car by Harit in 1979. Could it be possible that he might have been the person that Harit tried to contacte in 1979, even though by then, according to Shirazi, he had already relocated to Bangalore? That could be, because Shirazi thought nothing of driving around in his cars and could have been in Bombay with the car then. I find that a very intriguing story is now unraveling! This is half the fun of restoring old cars.
	(1) Thanks