[2himanshu]

The following message is circulating on social media

It translates:

Only Vijaybhai (Gujarat CM) has given you respite (for helmets),

not the Yamraj...

Issued in public interest!

Image courtesy: @JoBaka

[hangover]

Originally Posted by 2himanshu

The following message is circulating on social media

It translates:

Only Vijaybhai (Gujarat CM) has given you respite (for helmets),

not the Yamraj...

Issued in public interest!

Image courtesy: @JoBaka
Attachment 1943780

So is the conclusion that 2 wheeler riders of gujarat don’t know about safety? And this forum has only 100 % infallible people?

Surely if you buy a vehicle with your money, it’s your sovereign right to decide whether a helmet is needed or not.

Who are we to say this or that is right?

If folks are so concerned then even protective body gear and knee pads can be made compulsory.

Then helmets must be mandatory for 4 wheelers also. It certainly saves rally driver lives. Make roll cages mandatory for all cars.

After that we can advise 2 wheeler drivers of gujarat what is good for them.

[K_Drive]

Of the people, by the people and for the people. You get what you deserve

[ash22]

This move is absolutely a bad example. Rules and Regulations are set to make things works smoothly. Road safety is still geek and Latin for many across India. People wear it just for sake and never understand the importance. The same applies for car seat belts too.

[mayankk]

Originally Posted by hangover

So is ----snip----them.

As Sheldon would say, is THAT Sarcasm?
Because I'm unable to figure out. Part of it does seem like it, but some of it is really coming through with conviction.

[airbus]

Originally Posted by hangover

Surely if you buy a vehicle with your money, it’s your sovereign right to decide whether a helmet is needed or not.

While I don't have any problem with people not wearing helmet, but they should also amend the law that if a person not wearing helmet dies after meeting an accident with another vehicle, it needs to be considered as act of suicide and other vehicle driver should not be held liable.

After all there need to be supply of human organs for the needy

[funkykar]

Originally Posted by airbus

While I don't have any problem with people not wearing helmet, but they should also amend the law that if a person not wearing helmet dies after meeting an accident with another vehicle, it needs to be considered as act of suicide and other vehicle driver should not be held liable.

After all there need to be supply of human organs for the needy

Why? I dont see any logic with your statement. If person died driving rash or dangerous then i agree, one can term as suicide and also murder.


If a 2 wheeler is riding without helmet and a drunk car driver rams the 2 wheeler, the drunk should be let go?

Also your logic should apply for cyclists and pedestrians also, correct? If they get knocked by a vehicle and if they arent wearing helmet, its suicide.

Edit: When cars meet with accidents, drivers head may hit pillar or steering may crash into their head or while car topples, their head may hit the road. Shouldnt they too wear helmets? Same with mass transport like buses.

[Romeo_Mike]

I have been literally rolling on the floor laughing with all the humour that has already been posted .

But humour aside, they should have also amended the MV act to say that whoever decides to ride a 2 wheeler without a helmet waves all rights and consideration in case of an accident.

Also, I wonder what stance the Insurers are going to take on this wrt claims settlement.

[hserus]

I am not sure why normally rational BHPians are defending helmetless riding. Is it that they ride helmetless themselves?

[landcruiser123]

Regressive move. How stupid is the government of GJ? Impact due to a fall at 10 kmph can cause severe head injuries. I hope this is a move not done to impress voters.

Originally Posted by Hayek

As a libertarian, I have to agree with him - why should the government protect two wheeler riders from their own stupidity?

Even in a liberal society, the government can regulate any dangerous activity THAT is performed by a lot of the population. Driving/riding is an activity which can kill. If we started removing seat belt laws and repealing speed limits, there’d be total anarchy considering the number of citizens performing that activity. (Not like there’s no anarchy on Indian roads today but that’s a topic for a different thread)

Also, the government has an interest to protect people as:
1. Accident victims may rely on the state health system which uses tax payer money
2. Roads are state property- the government can be sued
3. Insurance companies can lobby them
4. The duty of the state is to make the lives of people better

Since the US has very few motorcycle riders overall, different states have different helmet laws. But every single state has nearly uniform seat belt laws.

Also, this also applies to sugar, tobacco, alcohol, and other recreational drugs. If someone consumes too much of these, there are dangerous side effects. And if they rely on the state hospitals for care, they are unfairly using tax payer money. (More so if the government hasn’t regulated them)

*The reason they are regulated and not banned is to generate tax revenue and also prevent creation of a parallel economy

[Carpainter]

This shows the power of common man!!!

In India if the public at large demand anything be it good or illogical, chances are that it'll be approved when the election is just around the corner. Who cares how many people died or will die for not wearing helmets as long as the public in general are happy to not get challans from cops for not wearing helmets. And as we all know, the number of people reluctant to wear helmets far exceeds the number of people who care for their safety. Only problem is the poor guy behind the steering wheel who will be heckled because of a minor accident involving a helmetless rider.

[navin_v8]

Originally Posted by funkykar

This is a welcome move. When safety is imposed by rule, most resort to the 100rs helmet which is absolutely worthless.

2 (Fake ISI local made) - Just to evade cops nearby home. Yes, personally I dont want to wear helmet for using my 2 wheeler for small errands in my neighborhood.

Mate your contradicting statements confuse me.

Instead make it optional and educate the riders in whatever way possible. In city like bangalore, walking speed is faster than commuting on a motor. I dont feel need of helmet 70% of times. If rule removed, i woulr wear only during wee hours, holidays and Sunday noon where traffic will be less

So according to you speed and time of the day determines whether one should wear a helmet or not? This is really hilarious if it means sarcasm.

Originally Posted by funkykar

Why? I dont see any logic with your statement. If person died driving rash or dangerous then i agree, one can term as suicide and also murder.

If a 2 wheeler is riding without helmet and a drunk car driver rams the 2 wheeler, the drunk should be let go?

Also your logic should apply for cyclists and pedestrians also, correct? If they get knocked by a vehicle and if they arent wearing helmet, its suicide.

Interesting analogy, here's another one mate. What if a helmetless two wheeler rider slips and falls on the road due to water, oil residue, etc. considering he/she was only going for milk and grocery runs?

Edit: When cars meet with accidents, drivers head may hit pillar or steering may crash into their head or while car topples, their head may hit the road. Shouldnt they too wear helmets? Same with mass transport like buses.

Mate some cars come with airbags which prevents head being dashed against steering wheel, pillar, etc.

When you are comparing a tin cage(4/6/8/10/16/24... wheelers) with a two wheeler always remember the rules of probability. The probability of a two wheeler rider hurting his head compared to one in a tin cage is much higher due to almost 100% of rider's body exposed to the elements.

I emphasize on head as it is the most delicate part of a human anatomy during an uncontrolled fall. Remember mate 4 out of 5 sensory organs are housed in one's head. If one wants to lose their eye/s, ear/s, nose, mouth to an accident minor or major doesn't matter due to a stupid mistake of not wearing a quality certified helmet. Then as you said it is their choice.

Originally Posted by hangover

So is the conclusion that 2 wheeler riders of gujarat don’t know about safety? And this forum has only 100 % infallible people?

Surely if you buy a vehicle with your money, it’s your sovereign right to decide whether a helmet is needed or not.

Who are we to say this or that is right?

I am sure most of us BHP'ians here care about our own personal safety and that of others. To educate fellow beings about safety is just a small step, whether to adhere to the same or not is their choice as you rightly said, similar to ones decision of whether one wants to live or die.

There was a 22 year old girl in my building. She was very bright and through campus recruitment was placed with a MNC Bank. 6 months into her job, she once went with one of her friends to buy a gift for an office colleague who was celebrating her birthday. The girl is question was riding pillion with her friend. Unfortunately the guy lost control due to miscalculation while overtaking. While both fell from the bike the guy escaped with minor injuries while the girl hit her head on the railing and died on the spot.

Why did I mention this here, because I have been telling any and every pillion rider whom I know, about this incident. It was so sad and disappointing to see her parents staring at the dead body of their daughter.

You are right, who are we to decide whether those people have a family or not, someone is dependent on them or not? I mean who cares, right?

If folks are so concerned then even protective body gear and knee pads can be made compulsory.

Then helmets must be mandatory for 4 wheelers also. It certainly saves rally driver lives. Make roll cages mandatory for all cars.

After that we can advise 2 wheeler drivers of gujarat what is good for them.

What a lame analogy mate. Now at the risk of repeating myself. "When you are comparing a tin cage(4/6/8/10/16/24... wheelers) with a two wheeler always remember the rules of probability. The probability of a two wheeler rider hurting his head compared to one in a tin cage is much higher due to almost 100% of rider's body exposed to the elements.

I emphasize on head as it is the most delicate part of a human anatomy during an uncontrolled fall. Remember mate 4 out of 5 sensory organs are housed in one's head. No one wants to lose their eye/s, ear/s, nose, mouth to an accident minor or major doesn't matter due to a stupid mistake of not wearing a quality certified helmet."

Mate Rally cars travel at an average speed of no less than 150-200 KMPH. How many of our cars travel at the same average speed?

Originally Posted by funkykar

For all who are seeing such decision so critically, have you considered below:
- When its forced as rule, a good % wear a crappy thing that looks like a helmet and costs just 100rs. As good as no helmet. BAngalore police once tried a crackdown on this and later commissioner had to ask them to stop because there is no way to ascertain quality by look and feel.
- In many many cities, there is a hell lot of traffic and average speeds are too low. Again, some of you will be ready to pounce on this topic saying whatever speed an accident may occur, head may get damaged. If so, why not all 4 wheelers also wear helmet? Why not pedestrians be mandated to wear helmet?

Wearing helmet should be made optional and users should be educated. If you think Indians cant be educated safety, lets live with it, IF they are educated enough to get a license, they should be allowed to make their choice of wearing helmet.

Read my above posts mate. If you mean sarcasm then it is really hilarious mate.

I have 6 helmets for different purposes.
2 (Fake ISI local made) - Just to evade cops nearby home. Yes, personally I dont want to wear helmet for using my 2 wheeler for small errands in my neighborhood.

Not to scare you mate but there was an incident that happened with a dear friends' dad a couple of years ago. His dad too like you didn't use to wear helmet for local errands. While returning home late in the evening his scooter lost balance due to undulations on road and he lost control. His head went and banged against the divider and was left bleeding there for more than 10-15 mins. onlookers rushed him to hospital. After five days of battling he succumbed to his injuries leaving behind his wife, and two children including my friend.

2 (ISI marked, good quality Indian make)- For my daily commute. 1 for old scooter ride, 1 for modern scooters ride.
1 (ISI, good quality Indian brand) - Suiting bikes mainly yezdi
1 (International standards) - For highways. Even if I use my 40 year old BAjaj scooter that can do just 60-65kmph, I use this.

I see that you have multiple two wheelers mate. Yezdi is one of my favorite bikes. I always tell this to my buddies and family members. Do invest at least 10-20% of the total value of your motorcycle in riding gears, bare minimum of which is a helmet. But then again, To Each His Own. Who am I to decide. Like I said I can only educate folks about safety at the most.

These are the local helmet I use to evade cops (one doesnt even have a strap ):
Attachment 1943766

Attachment 1943767

Now, dont bash me for being Honest.

Thanks for being honest mate. Now also be honest and ask yourself, "What is some one intentionally/unintentionally dashes me or I slip and fall on the road due to undulations, water, oil residue, etc. and I fall off my two wheeler, will this contraption of a helmet save my head?"

On a very serious note: Let the government give us an option where we can put an sticker on our 2 wheeler like 'I am responsible for my actions of not wearing a helmet blah blah blah' like that on Tobacco and Alcohol products

The only difference being one is a slow killer(Tobacco/Alcohol) while other(no helmet or 100 rupee helmet) can cause bleeding, paralysis or worse sudden death.

[mayankk]

Originally Posted by funkykar

If a 2 wheeler is riding without helmet and a drunk car driver rams the 2 wheeler, the drunk should be let go?

The drunk ought to be punished.
For the helmetless person, if he dies due to injuries which a helmet could have prevented, well I'd say Darwinian riddance. But what a huge price to pay for such little convenience, no?

Originally Posted by funkykar

Also your logic should apply for cyclists and pedestrians also, correct? If they get knocked by a vehicle and if they arent wearing helmet, its suicide.

Unrelatable. What percentage of pedestrians and cyclists die of head injuries? How many bikers die of head injuries which could be avoided by helmets? Over the past 10 years, my younger cousin died because wearing a helmet in Gorakhpur was uncool. Same for another younger freshly married chap who left behind parents and a wife who have to live with regret on his behalf. I cannot ever support having a so-called freedom of choice for something as stupidly obvious as protecting your head. Especially when you know youre more vulnerable than anyone else on the road.

Originally Posted by funkykar

Edit: When cars meet with accidents, drivers head may hit pillar or steering may crash into their head or while car topples, their head may hit the road. Shouldnt they too wear helmets? Same with mass transport like buses.

You're really pulling at threads now.


Offnote: For all the talk of riders signing off on something that they are not liable for their death, if you hit such a monkey, and he dies, the crowd around will catch you/beat the crap out of you.
And if by some chance he does not die, he will come after you with his family for extortion. Speaking from experience. All the previous bravado of "I am the master of my fate" will vanish when that broken femur puts him in bed.

[funkykar]

Originally Posted by navin_v8

Mate your contradicting statements confuse me.

So according to you speed and time of the day determines whether one should wear a helmet or not? This is really hilarious if it means sarcasm.

As simple as user can determine when he needs to wear. OR say, at some time user is not wearing as he deems not necessary, he shouldnt be rapped for it.

Originally Posted by navin_v8

What if a helmetless two wheeler rider slips and falls on the road due to water, oil residue, etc. considering he/she was only going for milk and grocery runs?

EXACTLY my point also. Same can happen to a pedestrian walking or a cyclist. Why there is no rule for them to wear?

Originally Posted by navin_v8

When you are comparing a tin cage(4/6/8/10/16/24... wheelers) with a two wheeler always remember the rules of probability. The probability of a two wheeler rider hurting his head compared to one in a tin cage is much higher due to almost 100% of rider's body exposed to the elements.

Probability of head injury is low in car crashes? How do you determine that? Anything can happen right? So why not mandate helmets for cars without Airbags?

I think many of you are forgetting that not wearing a helmet is a calculated risk just like riding/driving itself is (just like over 50% Bangalore riders and may be around 80-90% pillion riders of Bangalore wear 100rs helmet; not to forget over 50% dont even strap it ). When user himself is accepting and willing to take risk, why are others bothered?

Also, one more important point is no one is saying DONT WEAR HELMET. All some of us are saying is 'Let us choose'. If knowingly one doesn't wear, I don't see any issue.

[grevvity]

Originally Posted by funkykar

I have 6 helmets for different purposes.
2 (Fake ISI local made) - Just to evade cops nearby home. Yes, personally I dont want to wear helmet for using my 2 wheeler for small errands in my neighborhood.
2 (ISI marked, good quality Indian make)- For my daily commute. 1 for old scooter ride, 1 for modern scooters ride.
1 (ISI, good quality Indian brand) - Suiting bikes mainly yezdi
1 (International standards) - For highways. Even if I use my 40 year old BAjaj scooter that can do just 60-65kmph, I use this.


These are the local helmet I use to evade cops (one doesnt even have a strap ):

Try walking into a wall without a helmet and you'll get your answer on why one do not need a helmet at walking speed and traffic.

I fail to understand the need of carrying 6 different kinds of helmets. One good quality helmet can server all the needs.