[Hayek]

I know people will start talking about Queens and Cake here - but the fact is just this - there is NO circumstance in which a child of 4 needs to be on a two wheeler! A 3 year old is of course capable of sitting but cannot be counted on to sit still. It is indeed a grave risk, and I always wonder how can parents take that risk.

In cities like Bombay, you have fantastic public transport. While my dad had an old Landmaster, it was incredibly unreliable - and we never dared take it outside our suburb. We always used BEST buses where ever we needed to go. Today, you have AC buses everywhere but people are so impatient that they need to take kids on scooters.

Even in smaller towns and semi urban areas, you have some public transport, and / or shared auto rickshaws etc. People tend not to use these more to save time than because riding a scooter is cheaper.

At any rate, mandating safety belts and helmets for kids is a step in the right direction. And the speed limit of 40 kmph with a kid is if anything too high- the energy in a crash varies with the square of the speed - so a 40 kmph crash leads to 16x the momentum in a 10 kmph crash (which is what happens on bicycles).

[anjan_c2007]

Some points to rack our brains with:-

-Most riders prefer to have their child seated over bike petrol tanks. Would a safety belt annexed to the petrol tank be safer???

- Many of the super bikes attain a speed of 40 kmph in the first gear. So would Dad's or Mom's on super bikes with children needing such safety belts be driving only in the first gear?

- The BIS Babus must be only too busy, copying and pasting the safety norms for the child safety devices from developed countries to place it hurriedly before Gadkariji.

[am1m]

Originally Posted by Hayek

there is NO circumstance in which a child of 4 needs to be on a two wheeler!

Even in smaller towns and semi urban areas, you have some public transport, and / or shared auto rickshaws etc.

There is no question that an unsecured child on a 2-wheeler is very unsafe, no debate about that.

But there are many circumstances/situations when people have to take their children with them. Denying them that and justifying it is unfortunate.

When there are 2 buses in a day and one breaks down, I'd be saving up and waiting for the day when I can buy a 2-wheeler and take my family in much better comfort. That is the fact in a lot of small towns.

[rohitoasis]

In the small town that i am, During the lockdown there was a sudden increase in young lady Zomato delivery agents. One of them who happened to come over to my house on more than one of these occasions was a young mother who obviously could not keep her Child back at home. So here is this lady trying to balance the delivery bag and the child in her scooter. I have seen here in close to 5 occasions in variety of climates including hot afternoons and crazy rainy evenings. This scene in itself is heartbreaking to me. My mom feels so bad seeing this poor young woman that we find the food hard to digest after that. This woman is prompt, very polite and has never caused any hassles in delivery.

After this new rule came into being and this thread came into being, i spent some time imagining how hard it will be for this young woman to stop at each of the hotel, pick up the consignment, get in scooter, harness the kid to herself. Go do the delivery. In case it requires her to disembark again. She has to struggle again with the harness. If their minimum income comes from a minimum number of deliveries. I cannot imagine how hard it would be.

I know this rule would not affect me or most of the people in my network. But by god it would make life miserable for a lot of them. It would be good thing if we have a reasonable discourse here taking into consideration of such people as well.

[Thad E Ginathom]

By and large, people want easy, not safe. The choice has to made, and there is no doubt which will be selected.

Originally Posted by anjan_c2007

- The BIS Babus must be only too busy, copying and pasting the safety norms for the child safety devices from developed countries to place it hurriedly before Gadkariji.

You think people in those "developed" countries carry kids on bikes like we do? I don't think so, and I don't think that the law allows it.

While considering those "developed" countries, take a look at the availability of public transport too. In rural areas it can be dire to non-existent, and it can also be expensive. And poverty is not exactly scarce. (Thinking of my mother country. I only know England and India with any intimacy)

[Black_Star]

Originally Posted by anjan_c2007

- Many of the super bikes attain a speed of 40 kmph in the first gear. So would Dad's or Mom's on super bikes with children needing such safety belts be driving only in the first gear?

- The BIS Babus must be only too busy, copying and pasting the safety norms for the child safety devices from developed countries to place it hurriedly before Gadkariji.

Anyone who owns a super bike probably has the money to own a car (or a fleet of cars) as such their children wont be tagging along on their bikes but be coming along comfortably in chauffeur driven car.

Again your third point does not make sense. Sure the rules are kinda half-assed but you do realize that India has probably the most regulations about two-wheeler safety? Many countries dont have much regulations regarding pillion handle, saree guard, crash guard etc.

Heck three states in US, Illinois, Iowa and New Hampshire dont have laws regarding motorcycle helmet.

[anjan_c2007]

Originally Posted by Black_Star

Anyone who owns a super bike probably has the money to own a car (or a fleet of cars).

Again your third point does not make sense.

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

You think people in those "developed" countries carry kids on bikes like we do? I don't think so, and I don't think that the law allows it.

The opening sentence of my post and the emoji therein are indicative of the satirical content. Hence these need to be taken in a lighter vein.

[Thad E Ginathom]

Originally Posted by anjan_c2007

... satirical content ... need to be taken in a lighter vein.

Easy to miss in conversations like this where people tend to get a little heated. <Blush>

[Arun Varma]

I believe every single law or legislation around safety is a step in the right direction. Of course, there will be problems with, and misuse in, enforcement to begin with. But at the very least, this will create awareness and a nudge for many to do the right thing. I see people complaining that 'infra needs to be fixed first before...' but that's never going to happen in a country like ours. Fixing infra is a complex, multifactorial endeavour that can never be 'complete', especially something that is subject to constant use / abuse, like our roads. It is therefore in our best interests to modify our behaviours to ensure the safety and wellbeing of ourselves and our families and for that, we need awareness and in our case, a deterrent. Will this be foolproof? Of course not. Nothing is - at least not 100%. But we needn't be fools for lack of trying.

Rather than worry about how the cops are going to misuse this law, we should be focused on how to abide by it. Especially since it is in the right spirit.

[BoneCollector]

Originally Posted by BoneCollector

The Motor Vehicle Act has been amended to provide safety to a child being carried on a 2 wheeler. This mainly pertains to child up to 4 years, nothing has been said about over 4 years.

MoRTH has issued a gazette notification with respect to this rule. I don't understand what kind of safety harness are they talking about or how can they implement this 40KMPH rule. It's up to the person driving the 2 wheeler who can control the speed to 40KMPH or less.

PIB1798731.pdf

[Rohan265]

Originally Posted by BoneCollector

MoRTH has issued a gazette notification with respect to this rule. I don't understand what kind of safety harness are they talking about or how can they implement this 40KMPH rule. It's up to the person driving the 2 wheeler who can control the speed to 40KMPH or less.

Attachment 2273401

Attachment 2273402

I think this is what they mean by a safety harness.
As per my understanding, currently, there are no certified infant helmets in the market. Considering that the helmet manufacturers will have to make and certify helmets of different sizes and specifications, I think that the deadline of 2023 may be too short.

I hope this move was planned in advance.

[CarManMotorcycl]

Wow, what an idiotic rule. Firstly I absolutely don't condone taking kids under 5 years at all on a two wheeler, secondly if by chance there is a mishap and the rider falls with the kid on the back, what would happen to that poor soul? Did nobody think of the wrongs of this rule?

[Thad E Ginathom]

Originally Posted by CarManMotorcycl

Wow, what an idiotic rule. Firstly I absolutely don't condone taking kids under 5 years at all on a two wheeler

Absolutely. So do I.

secondly if by chance there is a mishap and the rider falls with the kid on the back

Will they be better or worse off than if they go flying by themselves?