[surjaonwheelz]

Originally Posted by Thar4x4

This comes with all the basic safety features like metal toe cap, side padding etc. surprisingly it is light weight compared to Army shoes or Woodland one.

Hi Thar,
Industrial shoes are built for:
- Firm grip
- Durable build
- Protection from heavy equipment/tools falling on your feet (steel toe box)

As riders, this steel toe box is not recommended as in case of a flex of the shoe this metal can cause sustainable damage to your feet. Again these are widely used by riders due to its rugged construction which they say will prevent such flex.

So better options are:
- Army DMS boots (cheap)
- Costly Hiking boots (Quechua and not Woodland) which are worth every penny and come in waterproof variants also!

A flex scenario:

[nitrogary]

Christmas came in early for me this year. My friend was in the US for a few weeks and was generous enough to get some goodies for me Super thanks to him
Here's the list
1. Scala rider G9x powerpack (http://www.revzilla.com/motorcycle/c...r-g9x-powerset )
2. Joe Rocket Phoenix Ion jacket ( http://www.motorcyclegear.com/street...on_jacket.html )
3. Tourmaster venture air 2.0 pants (http://www.motorcyclegear.com/street...air_pants.html )
4. Firstgear mesh-lo riding boots ( http://www.motorcyclegear.com/street...oots_2013.html )

I wrote reviews on their website and kinda copy pasting the text here for anyone interested. I didn't find a lot of people getting joe rocket and tourmaster and reviewing them on team bhp.

Joe Rocket Phoenix Ion jacket





I love the Phoenix ion jacket. Writing this after my first ride today morning.
1. Fit and finish - very nice! I have a 40.5/41 inch chest based on measurement help provided on the website. I also have a Joe Rocket XL size jacket which is definitely big for me - but have managed to use it without hassle (so far ) by having all adjustments to their smallest size but that makes things a little uncomfortable. My colleague at work had a small size Joe Rocket jacket and I tried that one. That's when I knew the L would be appropriate for me. My concern was my waist since the max circumference around my belly is around 40 inches. I wear a 36 size levi's jeans lol (talk about vanity sizes)
But the fit is more or less perfect. For buyers like me, I am 5 feet 10 and weigh 92 kilos (say 200 lbs). The first time I tried it on, it was with both the liners (waterproof and thermal) so the fit was indeed snug as already mentioned many places but being in Pune there is little need for both of them underneath. The temperature must have been 22 degrees C (say 70-24 deg F) in the morning and I was wearing a t shirt inside and it felt cool and comfortable. The airflow is superb and this is exactly what I need. As with most jackets, the jacket just comes up to my belt or sometimes it could ride up if I wear something low waist. The silly part is that the riding pant I have has a zipper which runs the other way (tourmaster). So I cant zip it to the pant. Why would anyone do that?! I can think of this one idea where i ll sew the removable half of the zipper on to my pants and it should work then. Will keep you posted if it works.
2. Functionality - I am still learning how to wear the liners inside, but this doesn't seem a super easy task. Maybe I will learn with regular use.
3. I cannot comment for durability right now, but the build quality is great and I am hoping it stays with me for a long time
4. Shopping experience - Fantastic! I ordered this jacket at my friend's place in the US and he got it for me while travelling back but I had no trouble at all except for terrible exchange rate charged by my credit card All worth it though I'd say.

Tourmaster Venture Air 2.0 pants







1. Background
I was deciding between the Joe Rocket Phoenix Ion pants, Tourmaster venture air 1.0 and the 2.0 for my riding needs and going by the reviews of them all, I found tourmaster to be more suited for my needs. For the venture air 1.0, the size I wanted wasn't available. I am 5 ft 10 inch, 200 lbs (92 kgs) and I have a waist size of 40 max.
2. Buying experience
Now being from India, I had not seen or met any riders who own any of the above riding pants. We have a few other brands available in India which are good too - most riders are getting those. So, I was unsure of the size and spent significant time reviewing all testimonials of the product and not just on this website, but a few others too. You know who they are So after taking my own measurements a few times, I took help on the online help chat which was excellent - he didn't try to sell me any product before hand. He understood my requirements and gave the exact inputs I needed. I cant say how much that means to someone like me who is trusting the fit, function and finish of a product which costs good money.
3. Fit and functionality
I got the 2XL Short size as recommended (and what I thought would be appropriate) and fit is kinda baggy. I half expected this so no issues there. I will not be likely to ride with any of the liners (waterproof & thermal) since Pune weather is sufficiently warm. Maybe jeans or a track pant in winter should be okay. With all the liners, I wore it at home and instantly started sweating. Plus its kinda heavy - they all must be, I have limited experience with riding pants. I could have been happier if I can somehow reduce the bagginess of the pants.
I have ridden only once in them so far - on the same morning which was about 22 deg C (70-75 F). The airflow was a revelation. I was super comfortable on the bike. Many people have written how the knee guards dont stay in place - I didn't experience this. Its probably got to do with the bike you ride. I have a Bonneville. It could be an issue if you are maybe riding a cruiser with a more laid back riding posture as well as something which is more racy too.
About the size - (just) maybe I could have managed with an XL size, but I am sure I would need to adjust the waist velcro straps to have maximum size. Its a risk I didnt want to take - I dont want to re-ship it back to the US for a change in size. The short length was a super wise decision - its perfect for my legs. The velcro around the ankles perfectly closes over the tongue of my ankle length shoes. It rode up once allowing cool air in - which was welcome.

Firstgear mesh lo boots



I looked at reviews for the first gear shoes - but didn't find much about the functionality but loads of it on the fitting. So apparently these are like a size smaller than actual. I wear size 9 shoes (43 europe size) but I have a cortech calf length latigo in size 44 so I went with 44 and boy was that a good decision! The fitting is almost perfect and shifting is brilliant. I think for rear brakes, my right foot has suddenly become lazy and I find myself using a lot more of the front brake. For the bonneville, the rear is actually quite planted and needs a slightly more rear biased braking as compared with a say cbr 250 or even worse - ktm etc.

I havent started using the scala rider yet and neither is it part of riding gear, so not commenting on it.

[Thar4x4]

Originally Posted by surjaonwheelz

As riders, this steel toe box is not recommended as in case of a flex of the shoe this metal can cause sustainable damage to your feet. Again these are widely used by riders due to its rugged construction which they say will prevent such flex.



So better options are:

- Army DMS boots (cheap)

- Costly Hiking boots (Quechua and not Woodland) which are worth every penny and come in waterproof variants also!



A flex scenario:

Thanks for insight ! When I selected this shoes I went through all available options, the proper riding shoes are very costly which I can't afford right now as I do long ride occasionally.
I ride bike everyday to office so I wanted something which will solve both purpose, formal shoes look a like and safety. This shoe clicked both boxes however still this is not perfect shoe.

I will buy proper riding shoe whenever budget permit. 👍

[surjaonwheelz]

Originally Posted by Thar4x4

I will buy proper riding shoe whenever budget permit.

Agree, riding boots are insanely costly!
I've a pair of jungle boots bought from Army stores but can't wear it to office as it's too eye catching and similar to security personnel shoes in our office I use it outdoors for my weekend rides.

I went through your previous posts in team-bhp and I would wholeheartedly recommend you the Quechua Forclaz 500 shoes. I'm saving for the same!

Here's a review:
http://devilonwheels.com/review-quec...-ventiv-shoes/

It has a huge fan base resulting in increase in the product's price. There are some cheaper variants like the Forclaz 50 without the waterproof feature but I believe you will do justice to the 500!

Ride safe!

[mail4ajo]

For short riders (5"3' and closer) buying the mainstream riding pants, how do they fit? Waist should not be an issue. Concerned that the key protection may not line up with your knees due to shorter inseam and also what to do with the longer bottom?

[Urban_Nomad]

Originally Posted by surjaonwheelz

-
As riders, this steel toe box is not recommended as in case of a flex of the shoe this metal can cause sustainable damage to your feet. Again these are widely used by riders due to its rugged construction which they say will prevent such flex.

So better options are:
- Army DMS boots (cheap)
- Costly Hiking boots

I've advised people against steel toe boots on this forum on multiple occasions for the very reason you have mentioned above

Not too long ago; I found this belief to be totally inaccurate. This myth was scientifically taken apart by the famous "myth busters". Look it up

I also recommended army dms boots as a protective boot. Wrong again!

A dms has a very flexible sole to aid walking n traversing different kinds of terrain. But it offers 0 support, either horizontally or laterally. Ankle protection simply is not there. A pair of steel toes with a rigid sole will do you much better

Finally, why buy expensive hiking boots for riding when we have proper motorcycle boots available for similar money?

[Sojogator]

Originally Posted by mail4ajo

For short riders (5"3' and closer) buying the mainstream riding pants, how do they fit? Waist should not be an issue. Concerned that the key protection may not line up with your knees due to shorter inseam and also what to do with the longer bottom?

I am not sure about your inseam or your budget but what I can suggest is that the Rev'it airwaves come in 3 seam sizes, short, regular and long. Highnoteperformance sell them. Add to that 3 levels for the knee armors height adjustment. As a thumb rule, the seam length should be slightly more than a normal trouser you wear because when you are on the machine with bent kness, the pants should not ride up. Also I have experienced that the knee armors should be slightly below the knee while standing up if its is a regular fitting riding pant so that they fit perfect when you are on the saddle. Knee armors on tight fitting pants though should be placed right on the knee even when upright.

Easy rule to get it right is to sit on the bike while wearing it. armors should seating on the knee comfortable and perfectly and pants should not be riding up on the ankle.

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad

I also recommended army dms boots as a protective boot. Wrong again!

A dms has a very flexible sole to aid walking n traversing different kinds of terrain. But it offers 0 support, either horizontally or laterally. Ankle protection simply is not there.

I've been riding (and falling) with DMS boots for closing on to 20 years now. Even the past 5 that I've been wearing two pairs of custom built riding boots (Alpinestar racing and RST touring) I've still continued wearing my DMS.

I have two pairs. One is 12 years old now and the sole has finally split from the upper. Not yet holed through. Just ground down at the outer edges from years of Bullet pegs being scraped through corners. The other is relatively new and my regular riding boot inside the city and for short Bullet rides when I do not want to get into the tall riding boots. That one is about 6-7 years old now and looks almost brand new.

I've not only fallen off the bike in them, Ive had my foot also pinned under a 200+ kilo laden Bullet with them. And I continue to do some pretty technical trekking with them, in rocky and slippery conditions, where ankle support is very important, next only to wet rock/mud grip.

Sure there is a difference between riding boots and them, but short of riding boots, there is nothing that comes close to the protection and comfort of DMS boots. I'm a believer, and a fanatic, as are millions of faujis around the country who trust their lives on these boots.

The leather quality, toughness and thickness is second to none. None = 15000+ rupee boots. Get a proper one with one piece tongue stitched along the edges to the lace eye flaps, and you have a near waterproof above ankle length leather sock. This same leather sock when laced up to the top properly and tightly, gives you enormous foot and ankle support - which is further enhanced by the triple layer reinforced hard ankle cup - much like professional riding boots.

The front toe is not actually a steel toe, but again is triple layer reinforced hard leather (I've had an Ambassador wheel go over it incidentally). The steel toe boots are Ammo boots worn by Arty guys and Tankies, not Infantry.

The sole is another masterpiece. Enormous grip under many different conditions. Fire retardant. Chemical proof. Electricity proof. Puncture proof inner protective layer. And near indestructible (as evident by my two pairs). Its not uncommon for DMS's to last so long. I have yet to see a 7-8K buck top end "rugged" trekking boot (caterpillar, woodlands, diesel, etc.) that would last even half that period of time in terms of serviceable life.

This post is not to defend the DMS and say its equal to a riding boot. Just that it offers a huge kick for the amount one actually pays for it. And short of a riding boot, I personally would wear nothing else.

[surjaonwheelz]

Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad

Finally, why buy expensive hiking boots for riding when we have proper motorcycle boots available for similar money?

For off the bike use as well, Quechua (just saying) provides better usability! Hiking boots are costlier than Army boots but cheaper than riding boots and strikes a perfect balance between them.

Safety shoes sit between DMS and hiking boots. My say is buy as per your use!

Thar4x4 has a Storme hence I thought Hiking boots will suit him perfectly though as per his checklist it'll not be a formal lookalike! So his JCB is just perfect for his daily use.

Riding boots >> Hiking shoes >> Safety shoes >> DMS boots

[Urban_Nomad]

Originally Posted by ebonho

I've been riding (and falling) with DMS boots for closing on to 20 years now

Hey doc! Your experience of the real world usage of these boots is absolutely invaluable. Thanks for sharing

I never meant to say that the DMS were crap, but was merely commenting on Suraj's point of DMS being a better boot that the JCBs on account of potential severed toes by wearing the latter; which is a myth

Riding in the city; anyone who has made a decision to wear proper leather boots as opposed to sneakers or (gulp) flip flops had taken a big step (no pun intended) in protecting their feet from potential harm

The value DMS offers is hard to beat (500 odd bucks for a full leather boot ). But it truly is a "no frills" boot. No internal padding, no insole and not o mention - the <insert adjective here> painful break in period. One may not wish to endure this and pay more for:

- Overall Comfort
- Little to no break in period
- Additional material (waterproofing / moisture wicking)

Some boots actually offer more protection than DMS in the form of generous ankle padding & little to none lateral flexing of the sole (DMS literally turns over itself like a sneaker)

I am however curious Doc. How do you think the DMS helped when the bullet pinned your down your foot? DMS has no hard parts, no "load bearing" abilities. It is leather .... just leather; that is actually soft and not very rigid. I am going to attribute this to your luck doc. I cant see how DMS helped here in any way

[surjaonwheelz]

Originally Posted by surjaonwheelz

Riders,

I made an impulsive buy, ordered the Joe Rocket Sonic R WP Boots and Icon Compound Mesh long gloves at a closeout deal of $89 and $35 respectively from motorcyclegear.com

Now the long wait starts. Not that I needed them but the value proposition compelled me. My colleague will get them from US of A.

WP boots for the monsoons round the corner.
Mesh gloves for daily use, my all leather Cramster Twister is unbearable in the hot days!

Guys, if you have any review/feedback regarding these products then please share it.

Ohh! I'm too anxious. I'll get these only next month.

http://www.motorcyclegear.com/street...oof_boots.html

http://www.motorcyclegear.com/street...ng_gloves.html

Boots have to be tall, gloves long!

Finally got my stuff, here is the initial impressions of the boots!

[ebonho]

Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad

The value DMS offers is hard to beat (500 odd bucks for a full leather boot ).

They've gone up a bit now last I checked a week or so ago. 650 bucks. This 150 buck rise is the first I can remember in over 10 years.

But it truly is a "no frills" boot. No internal padding, no insole

The simplicity and toughness of build is its own virtue. I know regardless of how wet it is, or how much I stretch or stress it, or how little of its one sole I rest my full 100 kilos on, it will NOT give way. Ever. That sort of confidence is hard to get in any other. As I said, millions of our soldiers go to war in these boots. One may argue that they have no better choice. But I've lived with these guys and I know how they trust these boots. With reason. Even today when the Indian Army has a plethora of other official issue footwear. the shiny well worn DMS still holds pride of place in any fauji's battle dress shoe collection.

not o mention - the <insert adjective here> painful break in period.

Personal experience. Nothing good in life, or worth having or cherishing, ever comes easy. If it does, one rarely ever really enjoys or appreciates it. Or its rarely if ever really worth having.

I am however curious Doc. How do you think the DMS helped when the bullet pinned your down your foot? DMS has no hard parts, no "load bearing" abilities. It is leather .... just leather; that is actually soft and not very rigid. I am going to attribute this to your luck doc. I cant see how DMS helped here in any way

We were racing in mud. In the monsoons. On a hill. No roads. We both crested a hillock, which unexpectedly fell away to the left. I had just finally overtaken the other guy a few turns back (having pressured him for quite a bit till he cracked). We were pretty fast (90+), I dabbed the front brake reflexively and the front end just went in the red clay mud. I went down. The other guys close behind me went down too. Both of us on two opposite sides of the hillock. Both under our bikes. He luckily had a rock prop up part of his bike so he could free himself from underneath. My left leg was trapped under mine. The foot pinned under the foot peg and clutch casing. My entire body and leg turned around as I fell but my boots prevented my foot from twisting and any torsion injury. The bolt and rod of the foot peg also gouged through a 2 inch long slit a couple of mm deep into leather on the top of my boot (the one whose soles just parted company). The depth of that slit was deeper than the thickness of leather used in most top-end full grain leather boots. That slit would have otherwise been on the dorsum of my foot, crushing bones and severing tendons supporting the upper arch.

Hope that clears some of your confusion.

[n_aditya]

Gentlemen, need suggestions on riding gloves - full leather, full gauntlet type.

My existing pair of Spartan short cuff Phaeton gloves are coming apart and I need to get a new pair soon. These gloves served me well over the last 3 years.

Checked out the Spartan Aspida-Ares gauntlet gloves (link) and they fit well but slightly pricey compared to this one.

If anyone has personal experiences with the DSG Primal gloves, please share them here. I plan to buy the gloves this weekend. Thanks.

[Motard_Blr]

In my opinion, purpose-made equipment in any activity will always be better than something that has been adapted from another activity. So good quality, purpose-made motorcycle shoes will always be safer than DMS or safety/work boots. However, I agree that the cost of good quality shoes motorcycle shoes in India is horrendously expensive, so I too went and bought safety shoes.

I bought something like this: http://www.safetyshoebazaar.com/EXCAVATOR
What I have looks exactly like that but does not have the steel toe. The model is not available now. I have fallen in them once and was thankful for protection by the thick leather upper and the thick rubber soles. I actually wear them everyday since I commute on my bike. I also find them pretty comfortable for walking as well.

[b16h22]

Originally Posted by n_aditya

Gentlemen, need suggestions on riding gloves - full leather, full gauntlet type.

My existing pair of Spartan short cuff Phaeton gloves are coming apart and I need to get a new pair soon. These gloves served me well over the last 3 years.

Checked out the Spartan Aspida-Ares gauntlet gloves (link) and they fit well but slightly pricey compared to this one.

If anyone has personal experiences with the DSG Primal gloves, please share them here. I plan to buy the gloves this weekend. Thanks.

TBG ones are nice i heard. Tried it once and it felt really good quality. I'm personally using SPG Ares for daily commute and it's great. It requires almost no breaking in.