[balenoed_]

Originally Posted by rainmaster

Mistakes on Two wheeler

• Looks like two wheeler haven’t come to a complete stop before crossing the road. He did a rolling stop, which eventually led to less time to react
• Indecisive, his left indicator is on but driving straight, still thinking in middle of the road which way to proceed
• Critical mistake, didn’t look at both sides of the road before crossing the road

I think we need to be a little practical while assessing the mistakes and not to go by the books. What we saw the two wheeler doing here, is a norm, that is how a typical two wheeler drives in India. It is a TVS-50 I guess, which can only do so much. Who comes to a complete stop at an intersection in India if there is no stop signal? Putting wrong indicator was not a factor here for the accident. Guess he wants to actually turn right. The bus was way fast and didn't slow down for the speed hump there which is what the two wheeler didn't anticipate and got caught by suprise.

[Nalin1]

There is hardly any traffic. Bike wants to cross over to the other side, he sees a bus and keeps going (typical of us Indians, we DO NOT want to stop).

And for the idiot bus driver, seated so high with high beams does not see or just ignores the one bike in front of him and does the same. Just keeps going.

Each one looking at the other's face, what else do you expect other than a collision?

As always, the ones on the two wheelers are most vulnerable and paid the price.

[IshaanIan]

I am an ardent believer that buses are a mode of transport that have no business continuing to exist in the 21st century. That said, shouldn't the two wheeler have waited for the bus to pass? Looks like there was no traffic behind the bus anyway also doesn't the bus have the right of way considering it is approaching from the right side of the two wheeler? I feel even a simple upgrade to the stringency of our licensing tests would have prevented this from occurring. Nothing fancy even if the existing test required the applicant to fill out the theoretical component instead of having a police officer click on all the answers (this is what I went through), it may have prevented this.

Also any reason why the bus did not come to a complete halt and just proceeded to continue rolling after striking the two wheeler? I feel like had it come to a halt and not run over them with both sets of wheels, they may have survived.

[Thad E Ginathom]

Originally Posted by balenoed_

Who comes to a complete stop at an intersection in India if there is no stop signal?

Nobody. Nor should they. But they should be able and ready to stop.

This is formulated in GB law, with "Stop" and "Give Way" junctions. Stopping without need in a give-way situation would be a bad mark on your driving-test sheet.

Originally Posted by IshaanIan

I am an ardent believer that buses are a mode of transport that have no business continuing to exist in the 21st century...

Why? Good public transport is one of the potential antidotes to congested streets. If buses were plentiful, comfortable and cheap, there might be a bit less use of two-wheelers as family transport.

That's the theory, at least, and it is not all bad. Improve the buses, the schedules and the driving: don't get rid of them.

[MT_Hyderabad]

Originally Posted by rainmaster

Lost two souls due to multiple mistakes by two wheeler and bus driver

Originally Posted by balenoed_

I think we need to be a little practical while assessing the mistakes and not to go by the books. What we saw the two wheeler doing here, is a norm, that is how a typical two wheeler drives in India. It is a TVS-50 I guess, which can only do so much. Who comes to a complete stop at an intersection in India if there is no stop

Originally Posted by Nalin1

There is hardly any traffic. Bike wants to cross over to the other side, he sees a bus and keeps going (typical of us Indians, we DO NOT want to stop).

And for the idiot bus driver, seated so high with high beams does not see..

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

Nobody. Nor should they. But they should be able and ready to stop.

This statement by Thad E Ginathom is what I would appreciate.

I was involved in a very similar near miss a few years back. Thank God, I store these near misses on youtube, I considered it useless but it is exactly the same situation, uncontrolled intersection, low light night condition, bike trying to cross the road, a vehicle approaching, biker just stops in the middle of the road.

My learnings when I compare the two incidents and what could have gone wrong in hindsight:

Had I not approached the unmanned intersection slowly, the result would have been different.

While I was approaching the signal and I spotted this motorcycle, I was literally shouting to myself Why did he stop abruptly? In the first place he should not have been on the road and only made the move like a pedestrian. It's clear, I move. It's not, I stay. Now, that he was, he could have calmly moved just like the auto did, but he developed cold feet!

Usually, I blame the person who causes the accident and not the person who could have prevented it. However, in this case, the cause is the rider as well as the driver. Rider, for not looking before entering the crossroad and driver for approaching a crossroad at a high speed. Here, the preventive measure would have been a Working Signal!

https://youtu.be/K8CeOBPwRh4

[Yieldway17]

Originally Posted by IshaanIan

I am an ardent believer that buses are a mode of transport that have no business continuing to exist in the 21st century.

Wow, that's some take. Buses are the face of public transport for majority of India. Without buses, people will be seriously handicapped.

I believe the other way and give a lot of leeway to public transport drivers on the road (well except the deadly KSRTC drivers). Like, if they block a lane to onboard/deboard passengers or when they have to do a sudden lane change, I don't get mad much relative to a private vehicle doing the same. At least public transport is a net good for the society.

[epiccross]

Originally Posted by IshaanIan

I am an ardent believer that buses are a mode of transport that have no business continuing to exist in the 21st century.

Sounds pretty elitist to me. Most common folks (and regardless of class, a lot of people) use buses as they make a lot of sense as a mode of public transport. Highly affordable, accessible, even the most remote village can rely on this. Sure, you can lower the need there by getting bettter rail coverage for long distance, but buses are the backbone of public transport, especially in a country like ours.

[MyLife_MyCar]

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

That's the theory, at least, and it is not all bad. Improve the buses, the schedules and the driving: don't get rid of them.

This, forever, is going to stay a theory. At least in our lifetime.

Go anywhere in India and it's the same nuisance from bus drivers everywhere.

Mentioning 2 incidents that I witnessed today itself (in Delhi) while on the way to airport. I don't have the videos as I was in a cab.

Incident 1
My cab is approaching a signal. There is a bus little ahead of us on the left lane. Suddenly the bus driver does a hand signalling for turning right and immediately makes his maneuver.
My cab, and some other vehicles, had to apply sudden brakes to prevent running into the bus.

The bus driver took the right turn (from a left lane) and went away like nothing happened. A routine for him.

And guess what, there was no indicator light blinking. Either it wasn't working or the driver simply didn't care to turn it on.

Incident 2
So we are continuing with our journey. After 10-15 minutes, we saw another bus on the left lane. Ahead of the bus was a Seltos and some traffic police with barricades. Naturally, the Seltos slowed down. But not this bus driver. He made a sudden switch to the right lane to attempt overtaking the Seltos. Two bikes, one tempo and one car on the right lane had to work on saving their lives.

So what do we notice here - the bus drivers drive like they own the road. No proper or prior indicators are given if they want to switch lanes or make a turn.

My cab driver told me that in case of damages to the bus, drivers are liable for only for 10% of the amount. And we all know how well maintained our buses are. In short, they never have to pay, unless it's a huge damage that is a must fix.

If there is a bus ahead of me, I try to keep maximum distance possible from it. I overtake it only when I have lot of room on the right or when bus stops at a bus-stop.

If there is a bus following me, I have made it a habit to check my rear view mirrors every now and then, just to ensure that I'm maintaining a safe distance from it.

[Capri89]

A mishap. Fortunately, no serious damage. So, I believe.

https://youtu.be/O0m2NKPh5Ac

[aadya]

Originally Posted by epiccross

Sounds pretty elitist to me. Most common folks (and regardless of class, a lot of people) use buses as they make a lot of sense as a mode of public transport. Highly affordable, accessible, even the most remote village can rely on this. Sure, you can lower the need there by getting bettter rail coverage for long distance, but buses are the backbone of public transport, especially in a country like ours.

Well said. Though OT for this thread. More public transport use will reduce the number of posts in this thread. Even though, I have been offered door to door cab free of cost, i have opted to use Delhi Metro and BMTC from airport for the very reason, the cabs and other personal transports are the cause of most accidents in these roads.

[MT_Hyderabad]

Wet roads and suspected oil spillage somewhere.

https://youtu.be/H5qCJ5C2mTo

[Cresterk]

Originally Posted by IshaanIan

I am an ardent believer that buses are a mode of transport that have no business continuing to exist in the 21st century.

"A developed country is not one where the poor have cars, but the one where the rich also want to use public transport"

Buses are completely necessary for any reasonable public transport network. What does need to be addressed is the rash driving, bad maintenance, zero safety features, overloading and complete disregard to other people's lives and property that is common in Indian buses and their drivers. What other country has buses being the most dangerous and rash vehicles on the road?

Proper training and holding the bus drivers accountable for their actions, constructing bus stops with dedicated spaces for buses to stop would all go a long way towards improving things.

[Small Bot]

Originally Posted by MT_Hyderabad

Wet roads and suspected oil spillage somewhere.

I'm doubtful if wet roads alone led to this. I suspect it to be a combination of rains+oil/diesel spill+downward slope to cause this tumbling over.

Originally Posted by IshaanIan

I am an ardent believer that buses are a mode of transport that have no business continuing to exist in the 21st century. ...

Also any reason why the bus did not come to a complete halt and just proceeded to continue rolling after striking the two wheeler?...

Disagree with the first part and completely agree with the second one.

Forum members have talked about the necessity of having cheap public transport, and I will not speak further.

On the second part, I too found it odd that the bus driver lets go of the brake and proceeds to run both wheels over the bodies of the victims. Adrenaline? Or probably a kneejerk reaction to just having been involved in an accident?

While we do not know and therefore can't say for certain, those two wheels going over might probably have ensured that the victims were gone for good.

[S1200]

Originally Posted by Capri89

A mishap. Fortunately, no serious damage. So, I believe.

I must say that the motorcycle rider, who came from the left and got hit by the scooter rider, has excellent riding skills. When he felt to be safe to overtake (the road was having separator, so has to overtake from LHS and he has very good space for his vehicle at the left side), he accomplished the overtake within good time but at the same time, he was outstanding in controlling his drum brake motorcycle while aborting this overtake.

Also looks that his motorcycle is in top shape and he also does care about his ride. I wish our roads have such excellent vehicle operator so that everyone stays safe, whatever be the catastrophe.

Also really wish this motorcycle rider soon start to wear helmet himself and makes his pillion one to wear one.

[MT_Hyderabad]

Originally Posted by Capri89

A mishap.

The rider crossing the road was a learner or a drunk. He was crossing the road from the wrong place (between the separators). He clearly didn't know how to ride a scooter and was struggling.

The guy on the left saved him from getting off road and having a solo accident