[pixantz]

Originally Posted by sbkumar

Not sure what you are alluding to with this. Are you suggesting it's okay to go over 100 kph on Indian roads based on each driver's assessment of his own capability ?

Ha ha. Not at all. I'm not suggesting any speed to anyone. All I'm saying is that speed is NOT the only one to blame every time for an accident. Technically if observed, accidents happen at all and any speed. Going 100 or above doesn't and cannot guarantee an accident scenario.

[honeybee]

I am sure if everybody drove at speeds less than 30kmph, the number of road accident victims would drastically reduce.

And we should still believe that speed doesn't kill?

I think in most accidents if you halved the speeds of the vehicles involved, you would reduce fatalities or reduce injuries.

You may argue that it is the pothole that is the culprit, however if the two wheeler had been traveling at 20-30kmph, fatalities could have been avoided.

I am not blaming the driver or the rider, just pointing out that speed is an integral part of most accidents.

[for_cars1]

Originally Posted by pixantz

.... a drivers top speed should be that which he is comfortable with and at which speed he can easily control any tricky situation safely enough. Now this speed varies for every person according to his driving capabilities. So speed as I see it is also NOT the only cause of accidents as is the most common perception. It is just among one of the causes, mostly when a driver overestimates his capability at a certain speed.

Originally Posted by honeybee

..... just pointing out that speed is an integral part of most accidents...

Unfortunately, Speed is the most critical aspect in most accidents.

However good a driver maybe, the human brain reaction time to just realize and respond to any situation is between 150 to 250 milliseconds (1/4th of a second) That's the physical limitation for humans.

For eg: At 100 kmph, if say something comes in front of the road:
* It takes upto 1/4th of a second for our brain just to realize that and take action.
* By that time, the vehicle would have moved by 27 metres (or 91 feet) * * Then the brakes are slammed, it takes a further 60 to 70 metres for the car to stop.
* Totally it takes about 100 meters to just stop: Reaction distance of 30 meters plus stopping distance of 70 meters.

So at 100kmph, if something comes in the way within 100 meters or 300 feet, the probability of hitting it increases exponentially. (If the drive tries to swerve, there is a high possibility of skid, rollover, collision with opposite/side lane vehicle etc)

Unfortunately, every time the speed is doubled, the stopping distance increases by 3 to 4 times.
At 50 kmph, the stopping distance is about 100 feet (30 metres)
At 100 kmph, the stopping distance is about 330 feet (100 metres)
At just 20 km higher at 120kmph the stopping distance is 450 feet (140 metres)
At 140 kmph, the typical stopping distance is a whopping 600 feet. (180 metres)

A combination of human limitation (brain reaction time) and pure physics (braking distance) at play here that results in these stopping distances.

With experience, a driver may gain increased ability to anticipate and foresee trouble and steer clear of it, and ability to drive more defensively and safely even at speeds, but if something like a dog, cattle or person or vehicle decides to come in the say within these stopping limitations, then the driver is in real trouble. Maintaining slower speed minimizes the risks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjaSdD_kw3k

Speed and stopping distance reference table.

[vin11]

What causes accidents is not speed, but carelessness and mindset of the driver. A mature driver would always think twice before giving pedal to the metal - and has better chances of surviving if he is attentive and concentrated in driving.

Speed is an important aspect, but one cannot guarantee the occurence of an accident at high speed or not happening of an accident at low speeds. 2 unattentive drivers can have a crash/collision even at 30 kmph, while 2 sensible and attentive drivers may not get involved in any mishap despite doing a 120 kmph run. Accidents depend on situation basically. It is perfectly safe to do 140 kmph if you are 100 % sure that no external factors will divert your attention and cause an accident (like dogs, humans, cars, etc.), just like it is on race tracks.

IMHO, speed doesn't cause an accident but the circumstances (driver's mindset, attention, experience, disturbances on the road, car condition and capabilities, road condition and many more) are the real cause. I however agree that high speed is involved in majority of casualities as these are the vehicles that get major (and noticeable) damage after the high-speed crash and make way to this thread. How many have reported accidents at 30 kmph in this thread? Why - because they are mostly ignored and people move on.

For example - A car driver doing 130 kmph on the expressway didn't plan an overtake move correctly and ended up losing control and hitting the divider. This case would make way to this thread and everyone would blame the speed rather than the driver's lack of planning and mature mindset and thinking (or lack of it). High speed is involved but circumstances are a more critical aspect in accidents according to me.

Another example -
A biker doing 30 kmph fails to judge the stopping distance and rear ends a stationery car at a traffic signal. This is also an accident but it would go un-noticed. Biker gets up, starts his bike and moves on! Was it not an accident? This is an accident but not reported here as it was minor (not involving major damage). In this case, limited speed helps the rider and prevents a major accident. It decided the effect of the collision. If the biker had been doing 90 kmph, the crash would have been more fatal.

There are many other examples one can think of. Consider an Maruti 800 doing a 100 kmph and a Fortuner doing the same. They encounter some obstacle (an animal / vehicle) on the road, both brake hard but because of the advancements in the Fortuner (braking and stability system), he is able to steer clear of this. OTOH the Maruti 800 hits the object and ends up totalled. Here the situation was the main cause. If speed was to judge and accident, both the cars would have been totalled as both of them were doing a 100 kmph.

I would conclude by saying that - 'Circumstances are the biggest aspect in most accidents. Speed only decides the magnitude/effect of the accident'.

[honeybee]

Since this discussion is not of accidents but its causes, I think it deserves its own thread now. My last post in this thread on this topic:
To brake to a halt from 130kmph you need a much capable car and a much capable driver. To brake from 60kmph is.much less demanding.

If you are also arguing that a Fortuner equipped with ABS and airbags is safer than a M800, it's only true for its own occupants. If the Fortuner hit a M800, both travelling at the limits of 'their' limits, and if the two collided while travelling within the 'stipulated' limits, it doesn't take much to predict which will lead to a worse crash.

I sense an attitude amongst people that since one is driving a better equipped or heavily built car, one doesn't have to follow the speed limits imposed for the poor Marutis. Also I see a dangerous argument that the highways do not prescribe a speed limit and so one can push to his/her limits.

This is an unsafe and irresponsible thought which completely ignores the other road users and their condition.

[vin11]

Originally Posted by honeybee

If you are also arguing that a Fortuner equipped with ABS and airbags is safer than a M800, it's only true for its own occupants. If the Fortuner hit a M800, both travelling at the limits of 'their' limits, and if the two collided while travelling within the 'stipulated' limits, it doesn't take much to predict which will lead to a worse crash.

Sorry for the misunderstanding but I meant to say that factors are the main aspects in an accident, as someone said that speed is the biggest factor. I disagree that speed decides an accident, rather it decides the magnitude of the accident. I wanted to show that at a similar 100 kmph speed, a car with better kit will fare better. The fact that it had a better kit is a factor and this factor made it escape a possible accident. As you are saying, braking from 130 kmph to halt - a Fortuner (or other 4 wheel disc cars) will stop better and quicker than a Maruti 800 (or other less equipped car) is what I wanted to say. Here, speed didn't matter, kit mattered. Just like this, there are many factors to an accident rather than just speed.

You are right that we can have a seperate thread on this topic.

[pixantz]

Originally Posted by vin11

I would conclude by saying that - 'Circumstances are the biggest aspect in most accidents. Speed only decides the magnitude/effect of the accident'.

Vin11, man, you hit the dot. There are so many factors if you technically look into every accident which ultimately build up to cause the thing to happen. But most of the details would need a really smart detective to detect. The easiest visible culprit always appears to be Mr. Speed. The biggest technical culprits I think these days are the unruly pedestrians, other than bad roads. Among the other numerous reasons, of course.

[Aakarsh]

Originally Posted by Gotham_City

Now this is one accident which I wish none has to ever witness.

Imagine happily milling around on your machine, and a snake raises its head from the dashboard

(Received these pics on watsapp group)

Imagined the situation if i were riding my bike and suddenly a snake raises its head in front of me. Oh my god! I would have died of heart attack at the spot

Just wish no one ever faces this kind of accident.

[SunnyBoi]

Got this photo from a friend - a speeding duster toppled at Marathalli bridge around 11.30-11.45 tonight, Bystanders were saying the duster was doing high speeds and braked screechingly and toppled, not sure what happened to the people inside. City then rammed them, both airbags out so I'm guessing the occupants are safe.

[barcalad]

Apparently, this happened today morning at a popular biking spot near Pune.

Daytona owner is dead. RIP.
No news on the Ducati. The bike is history, though.
Anyone having more info on this?

[Rahul Bhalgat]

Originally Posted by barcalad

Apparently, this happened today morning at a popular biking spot near Pune.

Daytona owner is dead. RIP.
No news on the Ducati. The bike is history, though.
Anyone having more info on this?

Sad to read about the accident.

It appears to be a collision of bikes. If that is so, I have no words to express the disappointment about both the riders.

The parents dedicate so much of love, affection, care, time and money for the children. The children shall make sure that reckless driving does not make all these efforts and love void in one moment.

[sammyboy]

I got the ducati images a few days ago, no clue what happened but looks like a big hit. Sad to hear about the daytona. Rip

[phamilyman]

Here are photos of a Swift ZXi that apparently rear ended a stationary truck on Sohna Road Gurgaon late last night.

[Aakarsh]

Mod Note : There are several spelling & grammatical errors in your posts. This negatively affects the forum experience for other readers.

Kindly ensure that you proof-read your posts prior to submission. Also, it would be a good idea to use a spell-checker.

[vin11]

From the pictures, I guess the car is a relatively new vehicle (covers haven't been removed from the rear neckrests + new alloy design I think). This looks like it hit that truck in the rightmost lane and hit the divider together (after and due to the first impact) as there is no way it could jump over to this lane after hitting a truck with that speed.

How can a truck be stationary on that lane?

Any clue about the state of the occupants? The car looks badly damaged - torn roof, missing bumpers, engine bay, fenders and look at that dent caused (possibly) by the rear door (upper) edge on the roof!