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Old 26th September 2018, 15:48   #16
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Default re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car

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Originally Posted by blackwasp View Post
Would your decision differ if the person were A. Rich or B. Politically connected? If no, then let go of it. If yes, you need to get these chaps pay for their deeds. At most, you can waive off their liability towards damages caused by your car, but let them be charged for triple seat, helmet less riding and rash driving and others as per the provisions of the law.
If they were well off, they would be able to pay for my damages. If I press with charges, I would be spoiling their future, so their being rich or poor would not have mattered.
The thing is that if instead of them, if it was either your younger brother or your son or your friend or relative who would have done this "misadventure", would you have preferred him going to jail or expect the other person to be kind and humane to give them a chance to mend themselves.
If the case was little serious like someone got hurt seriously or there was huge loss to life and property, there then was no dilemma and the options were very clear and sure.
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Old 26th September 2018, 16:02   #17
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Default re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car

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Originally Posted by autobahnjpr View Post
If the case was little serious like someone got hurt seriously or there was huge loss to life and property, there then was no dilemma and the options were very clear and sure.
I would word this point differently, to see how it can be interpreted differently.

You have a brilliant opportunity to knock some sense into their heads without causing them long-term harm (via job prospects, or a jail term). The relatively low severity of the incident (no third-party personal injury or death) means they can at most get a strong rap on their wrists for their current offences - one that they should take as a wake-up call to mend their ways, before they go out tomorrow and mow down an innocent pedestrian (at which point the book will be thrown at them, in a life-changing way).

Sometimes the humane thing to do is to punish them.
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Old 26th September 2018, 16:12   #18
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Default re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car

By letting them go free your not doing any good to the society.

I am a victim of DUI accident, i was hit by a hero honda pleasure on my left leg on 19 September 2012. The person who hit me ran away after picking his bike while i lay on the road. I am still paying the price of it everyday, i tore my ligament, fractured my leg in three places,lost 9 months of work pay. Changed my life totally, from an avid sportsperson playing different sports today i cant do much of stuff that i loved doing.

Now you decide if you want to let them go scot free. You may let them go free and they may kill someone or harm someone.
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Old 26th September 2018, 16:13   #19
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Default re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car

Offenders & law breakers, in any sphere of life, do not respond to leniency with reforming their habits. I never saw it in my career in dishonest folks or union trouble makers or crooked customers. If you let them off they will laugh their heads off at your weakness - kya ulloo banaya - and repeat their waywardness and next time maybe kill a child. Go for the jugular.

Also please do not under estimate the cunning or foxiness of a villager. The wailing mother, the torn wife, the hungry kids - they know which heartstrings to yank at. Sorry if I am preaching.

Last edited by V.Narayan : 26th September 2018 at 16:17.
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Old 26th September 2018, 16:42   #20
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Default re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car

I only hope you went through the scenario in reverse: let's say you just nudged them and damaged their taillight! They'd have extracted more than a pound of flesh from you and your brother.
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Old 26th September 2018, 16:56   #21
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Default re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car

While I appreciate that you're being kind enough to think about the consequences that the boys may face if you press charges, I fail to understand a few things:
If they can afford a 200 CC bike, and have money to have drinks, how on earth those boys belong to poorer family?

And this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by autobahnjpr View Post
The owners father is paralyzed and mother is the only bread winner.
Looks like a made up story to me. If I belonged to such family, I wouldn't dare indulging in such activities.

I've seen such chaps in Pune. Even if you don't press any charges and just try to talk sense to them, that wouldn't help IMO. There's a high probability they'll brag about this "adventure" within their group, instead of learning a lesson.

We have laws for a reason. If you see a culprit, and decide not to report it, you're not helping. That's my opinion.

Last edited by pkulkarni.2106 : 26th September 2018 at 16:57.
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Old 26th September 2018, 17:09   #22
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Default re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car

In addition to what fellow members have said, there is no assurance that it is their first time so that they can be pardoned. They would have definitely done this triple + rash driving many times earlier and would not have been involved in an accident.

Think about it. We see such morons weaving in and out of traffic and causing problems to fellow commuters and at times abusing the fellow road users who tried to confront them. Only thing was their rash driving never ended in an accident. If and when it ended in the accident(Like in your case) they ought to be punished because there is a fat chance that they have been doing such acts before and have gotten away with it. It cannot be the first time offense! And if you had hit them even so slightly without much damage image the amount of mental harassment they met out in the process of extracting money from you. They do not show any mercy. You should not as well. Especially so when you are on the right side of the law. Let them go through the pain of their misdeeds.
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Old 26th September 2018, 17:29   #23
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Default re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car

You did the best thing by reporting this matter to the police. I hope they have already officially registered your complaint rather than just making a diary entry.
Let the law take it's course and as mentioned elsewhere get things in writing too.
Your sympathy towards these kids is simply misplaced. The reason behind their actions is a simple thought of having nothing to loose. Luckily (unluckily for you) it was only your car they have hit and not some person causing far more damage.

We all have had our own wilder days, but drunk/ drugged, overloading, without a single helmet, all points to a complete lack of fear or repercussion of their actions.
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Old 26th September 2018, 17:56   #24
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Default re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car

Quote:
Originally Posted by autobahnjpr View Post
The thing is that if instead of them, if it was either your younger brother or your son or your friend or relative who would have done this "misadventure"
I don't have to think about anyone else, I've been guilty of something similar in my early 20s, I'm now ashamed to say. I've taken two friends on my bike after a night out and ridden home a couple of times. Thankfully, we never hit anything, by the grace of whatever guardian angel was watching out for us.

So a couple of things from personal experience - we never did things like that because we thought we were immune from the consequences or because we were the rowdies of the area, we were young and stupid that's all.

It would be great if our legal system had something like community service for such offenses, but the fact is that involving the cops and a brush with our legal system if it does lead to jail time for these guys, will most probably turn these chaps into hardened criminals. That's a fact well documented by studies of the prison system. Plus the hassle you will have to go through to see the legal process through to the end. The wonderful thing about our legal system as most of us very well know is that both victim and perpetrator are equally hassled and made to run around!

My humble opinion- you have seen these kids, you can gauge better than any of us sitting here if they are indeed already hardened thugs who will continue to do stuff like this or if they are just silly kids. If the latter, scare them a bit with the threat of the cops, they won't dare do it again.

Last edited by am1m : 26th September 2018 at 17:58.
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Old 26th September 2018, 18:42   #25
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Default re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car

By not reporting the incident and not lodging an FIR you're letting them go scot free and this will let them get an impression that sab chalta hai. From your description of the incident, the following things stand out clearly:-
  • They were breaking the law by triple riding on a two wheeler.
  • They were breaking the law by not wearing helmets on a two wheeler.
  • They were definitely breaking the law driving under influence of alcohol.
  • A cognizable offence/ traffic violation occurred because of their willfully breaking the above three laws. This could have been fatal had they run over a human being.

If you let them go scot free, what is stopping them from not repeating the same again? This time it was only a broken bumper and some damage to the rear of a car. The next time who knows, a human being may lose a limb or worse his/her life?

However, if you lodge an FIR and corrective /punitive punishment is delivered then these youth will be a lot more cautious on the road next time, will respect and obey traffic rules and hopefully not be responsible for damage to life, limb or property.

You will be doing the right thing by reporting it properly.

Cheers !
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Old 26th September 2018, 19:12   #26
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Default re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car

Quote:
Originally Posted by autobahnjpr View Post
I am in a dilemma
Do you think you can do something within the limits of law that can send the offenders to jail and by abstaining to do that something, you will be helping the offenders stay clear of punitive action? I am afraid you are not.

Before moving further, let me ask a few questions:
  1. Did the cops who arrive at the scene conduct a breath analyzer test? Were the two men taken to a hospital for a blood test? Was anything done to gather evidence to prove that they were under influence?
  2. Have you given a written complaint at the police station and received an acknowledgement for the same?
  3. Has anybody, apart from the riders themselves, been injured?
If the answer to any of the three questions is a 'NO', then you are absolutely in no dilemma. Take it from me that nothing will happen to those men.

Men who mistakenly nudged a stationary car and caused a minor material damage.

The investigators might call you for a meeting, offer to settle the matter and in the process dip their own fingers in a little honey. An FIR is very unlikely. Even if it is filed, whoever has heard of a court sentencing riders to a prison term for accidentally, inadvertently crashing into a haphazardly parked car? And, how is that when you were obviously driving the larger vehicle, you are calling yourself the victim? Is there no justice in this sad, bad world?

I admire your humane perspective. But I also feel that you should, if possible, let the law take its course. If the long hands of law could touch and at least deliver a rap on the knuckles of the - 200+ CC bike owning - burdened with ailing dependents - yet riding on a high - poor, innocent, harmless boys, the world will be a tiny bit better and safer: for all of us.

I might appear like a fool, but let me bring in a story here:

Quote:
Once upon a time, a tiger was caught in a trap. He tried in vain to get out through the bars, and rolled and bit with rage and grief when he failed.

By chance a poor Brahman came by. “Let me out of this cage, oh holy one!” cried the tiger.

“Nay, my friend,” replied the Brahman mildly, “you would probably eat me if I did.”

“Not at all!” swore the tiger with many oaths; “on the contrary, I should be for ever grateful, and serve you as a slave!”

Now when the tiger sobbed and sighed and wept and swore, the good Brahman’s heart softened, and at last he consented to open the door of the cage. Out popped the tiger, and, seizing the poor man, cried, “What a fool you are! What is to prevent my eating you now, for after being cooped up so long I am just terribly hungry!”

In vain the Brahman pleaded for his life; at last the Tiger agreed that if the Brahman could ask three things to judge whether or not the Tiger was treating him unfairly. If one of them would say that he should keep his life, then the Tiger would not eat him, but would let him go.

So the Brahman first asked a pipal tree what it thought of the matter, but the pipal tree replied coldly, “What have you to complain about? Don’t I give shade and shelter to every one who passes by, and don’t they return my kindness by tearing down my branches to feed their cattle? Don’t whimper–be a man!”

Then the Brahman, sad at heart, went further afield till he saw a buffalo turning a well-wheel; but he got no better result, for it answered, “You are a fool to expect gratitude! Look at me! When I gave milk , the people fed me on cotton-seed and oil-cake, but now I am dry they tie me here, and give me their rubbish for food!”

The Brahman, still more sad, asked the road to give him its opinion.

“My dear sir,” said the road, “how foolish you are to expect anything else! Here am I, useful to everybody, yet all, rich and poor, great and small, trample on me as they go past.”
Link

The story goes on. But I hope you get the drift.
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Old 27th September 2018, 07:43   #27
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Default re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car

@autobahnjpr
I believe in second chances, for deserving people. Triple seat drunk driving guys may not be deserving but you have to be the judge of that.

If you decide to let go, there is a chance of the "ullo banaya" but frankly if you see genuine remorse and a chance of someone correcting themselves then just let go with some token punishment.

If you decide to use the full extent of the law that's also okay.

Your call.
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Old 27th September 2018, 08:14   #28
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Default re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car

Law and rules are same for all and we also break them in some scenarios but then in case we are caught the punishment is valid. Same is the case here, it is not like these morons were on this trip for first time, they might be following this routine from long time. It was just a bad day for them and they should have a fear that this is not repeated.
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Old 27th September 2018, 09:59   #29
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Default re: The Accident Victim's dilemma - Drunk biker rams into my car

It is kind of you to have such thoughts in the first place. In my opinion, by not taking any immediate action and letting them leave the accident scene, you already took a decision. In showing leniency.
If no DUI tests were done by the cops and if you have no evidence to prove the accident, they would not have any major consequences anyway.

My suggestion would be to file the complaint and let the law run its course. If you get any retaliation from those guys, you can just tell them that cops forced you to file the complaint.

We all have such stories to relate with. Here is my story. We had years ago a cook/ maid who came over daily to make 'chapatis' for us. She did not turn up for a few days so we assumed she was off sick (agreement was she should not bother to turn up to cook if she was unwell). When she turned up after a week, she said her son was arrested by the cops for some petty crime and being kept in custody. She spent all day sitting outside the lockup pleading them for releasing the chap.
In her words, he was working for his 'saaheb' who had given him a Pulsar to run errands and paid him money occasionally. When I asked what tasks he did, she had no answer. She continued to be confident that the 'saaheb' will come and ensure her son was released. So her sob story was based around her assumption that her kid was innocent and did not do anything. When I heard the story from other neighbours, the guy was actually guilty of that crime. The 'saaheb' had sold him up the river and refused any ownership.

The basic query remains why is a guy in such circumstances (paralysis/ single earning member):
- owning a 200+ cc bike?
- riding it under influence
- keeping such company

This may sound blunt. If you have ensured that you have evidence to file a case for DUI against that kid and do so, kudos. If not, anything you do now will have way less impact.
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Old 27th September 2018, 10:47   #30
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I would ask you to consider the time as well as efforts you will be spending if you follow the legal path. Please dont think of this as me trying to ward you off from doing the right thing. I am only telling you the practical aspects from a bitter experience I had dealing with the cops and legal system.

Last year in December my mother's mobile phone was stolen from her purse while she was boarding a train. Now, the good thing was that the cops (railway crime branch) caught the crooks and called me. They got my number since my mom was furiously calling her phone from a friend's phone. She had boarded the train and I was at home. I went to get the phone and saw the crooks. One had passed out as he was under the influence and the other was standing. The cops told me to lodge a case as they had caught him and if I let him go, the same incident would happen.

Trust me, I wanted this guy to pay his dues and the was he was dressed and from what the cops told me, this guy was a repeat offender. So I followed the legal course. From that day till the next 5 months I was in legal hell. Ok that is a bit exaggerated but I had to take leaves from my new job and go to recover the phone after lots of running around and huge amounts of paper work. I spent more on the lawyer than the worth of the phone which I finally got after 1 month.

I was spoken down to by clerks in the legal offices. I was told to come to the court when the summons came and recognise the crooks. All this happened around January ending. I did not hear from the court or the cops for 3 months and then in April, an extremely rude clerk calls me and tells me they are issuing a non bailable warrant against me since I have missed to come to the court on 2 occasions when I was summoned. Now imagine such a threat when you have 10 things going on at your workplace. I talked to him calmly and tried to make him understand that I had not received any communication but he would not listen. Thankfully I remembered that you need to sign an acceptance of the summons and asked him if he had my signatures. He immediately back tracked and then I released a slew of expletives at him. I was frustrated and frankly scared. I went that evening and met him and realised he was just a clerk. Signed the summons and had to take a day off to come to court.

My lawyer seeing my plight understood that I was no longer willing to take the case ahead and advised me to tell the same thing to the court which I did. The crook had apparently been in jail for the past 4 months and was released.

All in all, when I look back I feel considering the personal inconvenience, I wouldnt have gone through with it. But my situation was not affecting anyone's life. No one would have died due to that theft. One can argue that under the influence the crook would/could do a lot of things but then that argument would never end. The point is that if you are really willing to go through all of this and maybe more then you should do it. As everyone has said, it is your responsibility to do it. But please consider everything before you go ahead with this.

I know I will get a lot of backlash for this but I have shared what has happened with me purely without using any contacts and following the legal word to the "T". I totally agree with the "what if" situation that the offenders may go and ram into an innocent person. This is not a dilemma of what the right course of action is. You must report this but please remember you will have to have reservoirs of patience if you do go ahead with it.
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