[volkman10]

All new cars from 1st October to have 6 airbags – 4 passenger airbags and 2 side or curtain airbags standard.


Link

[Rohan265]

Originally Posted by volkman10

All new cars from 1st October to have 6 airbags – 4 passenger airbags and 2 side or curtain airbags standard.


Link

"Four passenger airbags and 2 side or curtain airbags"?
I don't understand this setup. I hope they are indicating the standard configuration of 2 front, 2 side, and 2 curtain airbags.
Hopefully we don't see some unique setup where 2 knee airbags replace either side or curtain bags.

[thanixravindran]

Not exactly related but this is from HT Auto today

Supreme court observations on a fault airbag case involving Hyundai Creta

https://auto.hindustantimes.com/auto...596205376.html

Excerpt:




Background:



In my opinion, this is in the right direction by holding the manufacturer accountable. Need of the hour is the setting up of independent/statutory forensic auto expert body that can be approached by consumer or insurance company or manufacturer to properly investigate accidents to arrive at the root cause and contributing factors.

With 6 airbags going to be mandatory in all cars, this will be significant else it is going to be a tussle with all parties involved.

Mods: Please move this post to any other thread if it is not relevant here.

[ron178]

Originally Posted by Rohan265

I don't understand this setup. I hope they are indicating the standard configuration of 2 front, 2 side, and 2 curtain airbags.

No he specified a few months ago that it's two frontal, two side thorax bags and two head curtains (covering all rows and presumably meeting a minimum geometric coverage area near the head).

He further said that to minimise the impact of frontal and lateral collisions on the occupants seated in both front and rear compartments, it has been decided that 4 additional airbags be mandated in the M1 vehicle category.

" ...i.e two side/side torso airbags and two side curtain/tube airbags covering all outboard passengers. This is a crucial step to make motor vehicles in India safer than ever," he said.

carandbike

[LoveMyHyundai]

I have a question on this upcoming mandate, haven't seen any articles discuss it yet, so hoping members here would be able to shed some light:
1) How will this affect resale vehicles that don't have 6 airbags? Are there issues expected in transfer of title in the future?
2) How about registration renewal for vehicles older than 15 years? Will this negatively impact the re-registration?

[ringoism]

Originally Posted by hkollar

I suspect this is usual govt miscalculation, without a proper study. An airbag needs to have accelerometers that detect an impact, to trigger a small explosion that fills the airbags with nitrogen. 6 airbags at 3-4K will mean they can do all this at about Rs.600+. Very unlikely...

City cars do not travel at high speeds, will typically have less number of passengers. For these city vehicles (especially EVs) we need relaxation in 6 airbag rules. Even a car without any airbag is way safer than two wheeler, which is what people will buy if small cars become very expensive.

There are ideals, and there are practical ideals - and level-headed means of achieving the latter.

Nobody wants to die or be maimed in a car wreck. Perhaps too few are concerned about killing/maiming others. Having "safer cars" certainly can help overall, but too often we put the cart before the horse / miss the forest for the trees.

I understand that things take time. When a two-year-old is learning to walk, he inevitably stumbles, and so we may place pillows / cushions around him/her to break his fall - because the baby WILL fall, it is expected. But it is ALSO expected that before long he will be walking successfully, and moving forward on two feet without endangering or hurting his/herself or others.

Like airbags / ABS, helmet laws are certainly sensible to have. BUT we have to remember that their safety benefit only comes into play at the point that someone is coming off a two-wheeler and striking their head on a hard surface. Please, PLEASE, we also need to examine why he is falling or making some impact in the first place! Likewise, airbags only provide some benefit once an accident is in progress and metal has violently come against metal! And that is happening far, far too often in our context. Meanwhile, airbags' demerits (in terms of children's safety, in terms of poorer visibility due to thicker roof pillars in particular, in terms of cost as quoted above) are realized continuously. Thicker A-pillars create potentially dangerous visibility issues daily - and only provide their benefits in the case of serious rollover accidents. So what percentage of our accidents / deaths / injuries involve rollovers? What is the net safety benefit, when looking at crores of vehicles moving 10's of km's daily? Is any of this analysis actually being pursued here, and plans of action formed on that basis?

In truth, licensing standards, testing, enforcement are till now a joke in many/most places. Better not to rant on too long, but seeing an oil tanker overspeeding the wrong way up a four-lane road, running his single functioning high-beam into oncoming traffic at night while talking on his phone, kind of sums it up as a plausible image that wouldn't surprise me at all by now - In truth I see every separate element of that on an almost daily basis, and feel I'm daily putting my life on the line just to pick up my kids from school. Indeed my friend's wife (my kids' school-teacher) as a pillion fractured her ankle last week after being run off the road by an overspeeding double-laner (someone overtaking a long line of traffic by running in the opposing lane). Police, if they are around, mostly want to keep traffic moving and deal with crisis jams. Giving challans for no helmet, and a few parking violations in places where it really doesn't matter, is about the extent of their interest/ involvement, they smile nicely with mutual waves re: taxi wallahs talking on their phones while trying to negotiate their turn. Easy money motivates them, nothing more - that's what I see. Just sad.

So first: Why are any kind of motor accidents happening in the first place? And why are they happening in our subcontinental locales at such a higher rate than other, similarly populated locales elsewhere? The answers may not be entirely comfortable, but till we know them, it is (as we see manifested), easier to expect/accept the worst, and just force manufacturers to give us "safer" vehicles, without taking even greater action to reduce the obvious dangers that cause accidents. But seriously, "Prevention is better than cure" has never been more true!!!

The first time I went for my driving test here, I got a PASS stamp without actually getting behind the wheel - because it was raining that day, and the inspector apparently didn't want to get wet. The second time, several years later, my "test" involved: 1) driving in straight line at 5kmph between cones spaced approx 5m apart; 2) reversing lefthand L-turn into another coned area. And that was it!

Nothing about turn signals, basic control at real driving speeds, proper turning at intersections, braking modulation, or literally ANYTHING pertinent to actual on-road motoring. Even that reversing turn hardly approximates any real parking situation anywhere on the subcontinent. So why has that become the testing protocol / standard?

And here we are facing countless tragedies.

Last night we had a dinner guest, a senior network security specialist who had recently emigrated abroad to a place where, in all honesty, there is a lot of traffic control and relatively few traffic fatalities. His overall assessment was, "We can't progress to that level for at least another 100-200 years".

But have a look (on YouTube, etc) at traffic orderliness and safety in Aizawl, Mizoram - yes, different conditions (and culture), but in relation to road size/surface area it is as "high-volume" as Delhi or anywhere. Significantly, when motorists there are interviewed, it becomes apparent that the order on display is borne of self-control - and that from a kind of basic moral grounding, which more than law-enforcement makes the undeniable and dramatic difference in how operators conduct themselves.

So first, how can a nation come to more broadly (internally) embrace that kind of "moral grounding"?

And secondly, even if THAT seems unrealistic to many, then why must our expectations of enforcement and control must be so low and attitude so fatalistic? Remember that the first part of that word is "fatal". Aim low and we can only hit a low target.

Speeds are getting higher and high-beams brighter, and there are ever more vehicles on the road and overall km's driven. No matter what "safety features" are mandated, deaths / maimings will continue and IMO the rate is unlikely to decrease till people on a larger scale start operating vehicles more responsibly.

In short, we really need to be emphasizing things other than pillows and cushions by now! We need to learn to walk properly.

-Eric

and P.S. - It seems to me that these decisions are being made (and positively assessed, even here) by "elites" - people for whom an amortized 60k means virtually nothing. For them it will not mean the difference between being able to afford or not afford a new car - or indeed (as quoted), any car. The pedestrians (in poorer view on account of those thick A-pillars), and masses on their cycles and two-wheelers (and in 8+ passenger transports), have virtually no voice here and indeed such decisions put relative "safety" further from them than ever.

[volkman10]

Six airbags to be made mandatory in up-to eight-seater vehicles: Minister

Link

[schwartz]

I am surprised why there isn't any discussion around this in the media/ markets. There are significant implications for the industry. It will be like a knock out punch for entry level cars/ Maruti and Hyundai.

Clearly the minister is not backing down. In fact the government is talking crash test norms for cars from March 31, 2023.

I never been so bamboozled. Generally, media is very noisy. On this I dont ever hear a squeak.

[anjan_c2007]

A slugfest has now commenced between Sh Gadkari plus the MoRTH with the auto manufacturers on the "receiving end" in the proposed, compulsory half a dozen airbags in cars seating upto three-fourths of a dozen passengers.

Sh Gadkari is unable to understand the logic of carmakers who export safety compliant cars from India to phoren lands but at the same time their assembly lines roll out unsafe cars for local sales in the country. He calls this as double standards.

Firstly, we need to understand the tax component in India on our cars that loot the consumer vis-a-vis those in the developed countries and their respective living standards plus their currency's purchase power. With such safety features (six airbags plus more mandatory features to accord the NCAP five stars), our cars could cost 25-30% more, on-road. And the three year compulsory insurance devil, payable on news cars is an added eyesore. So if Sh Gadkari stresses on safety as per his new Bharat NCAP the taxes need to be reduced.

We cannot forget the double standards of the MoRTH though. You car or bike is outcast, polluting, unsafe and untenable for road use if its 15-49 years old. You pay green tax, high reregistration fees and fines to get its fitness certificate. And when this same unwanted car or bike is 50 years old, MoRTH welcomes it with a red carpet into the family of vintages. This is anomalous and a double standard.

And coming to our small car makers, Sh Maruti Bhargava (suits him more rather than Sh R. C. Bhargava) has lately emerged as a spokesperson and voice for the Indian auto industry. But he forgets the days, years and decades when his company was manufacturing small cars that remained the mainstay, made MSIL what it is today and also vastly improved the financial health of the parent Suzuki Motor Corp, Japan adding to it's brand equity and stature as a small car maker, worldwide. And today this gentleman says he will quit small car manufacturing if that's unviable for MSIL. It's like ditching a near and dear family member who was the family pillar once, but has now aged and needs lots of medicines and medical care. This is a straight from my heart, sweeping statement, that may practically not apply for business and commerce. But all said and done, the auto industry needs to make effective presentations with facts and figures and objective notes to Sh Gadkari, MoRTH and the top levels of the government to explain the practical situation and as to why it is really becoming unviable to make small cars with six airbags. They could cite the taxes charged on cars, buying costs vis-a-vis living standards of the West and their respective currency's purchase power in their presentations. These facts and figures can be compared with our taxes on cars, our living standards and our currency's purchasing power.

Rather than quitting small car manufacturing, MSIL and other car makers need to use logic and reasoning with the government to make the costs of safe cars reasonable and realistic in tune with the Indian car buyer's purchasing power.

MoRTH and Shri Gadkari slam double standards of the Indian Auto Industry :

https://m.timesofindia.com/india/nit...w/92505833.cms

Maruti likely to quit making small cars if cost is unviable :-

https://m.timesofindia.com/india/mar...w/92505771.cms

[Meph1st0]

The draft version of the Bharat New Car Assessment Program is updated in the link on 26th June. It is a 197-page pdf and covers in detail the different tests involved.

There is a 30-day window to provide comments/feedback to comments-morth@gov.in

It is interesting to note the original document from which BharatNCAP was conceived, see the image below

[bivision]

Which way the Oct 1 deadline for 6 airbags trending to? I am not seeing much update neither from car manufacturers on their preparedness nor from Transport Ministry for any relaxation of dates.

Six months back I started exploring the market for a new car to replace my 15 year old Santro, then I saw the news on 6 airbag mandate, and hence postponed my car purchase. Hope I don't have to wait too long. I don't want to buy high end variants just for the airbags that comes with not so useful features of sunroofs and wireless chargers etc and pay the premium for those.

[Venkatesh]

Nitin Gadkari: Airbag costs just Rs 800, Six Airbags should soon be mandatory.

Proceedings for the new rule will start soon and it will be implemented in October 2022, as announced earlier.

Source

[ajayc123]

Originally Posted by Venkatesh

Nitin Gadkari: Airbag costs just Rs 800, Six Airbags should soon be mandatory.

Is this really so? What kind?
In the same article, noted the following:

As a consumer, you can expect to pay a premium of around Rs 25,000 for the extra four airbags than the current standard dual front.

[the.dogfather]

Originally Posted by Venkatesh

Nitin Gadkari: Airbag costs just Rs 800, Six Airbags should soon be mandatory.

While this maybe true about just the airbag, I think the other components of the airbags system would increase the costs.
We would need more sensors, control modules, inflators, and also the cost of R&D and programming, for these sensors would need to be considered.
Most of the airbag modules are made by vendors like Bosch, Continental and there would be design and decisions to be made with respect to sensor placements, programming decisions of deployment based on speed and conditions based on inputs from the sensors. These would vary from car to car and would need development cost for each platform.

[Pras92003]

Hello Folks,

Is there anyway headway around it? Almost no news from manufacturers on the number of airbags. This is too big a change to not talk about. I am in the market for XL6 which has 4 airbags. Should I hold my decision for another month or so?