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Old 10th November 2021, 17:40   #31
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re: Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP

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Originally Posted by CarNerd View Post
How can they award it 5 stars when side airbags didn't deploy and the head has banged the B-Pillar? What kind of ridiculous testing is this? This GNCAP is based on front offset tests only:

Getting 5 star safety rating from GNCAP is like getting admission into IIPM rather than IIT which is the Euro NCAP.
Not sure if you are trolling, but do read up on all the sensors that capture the impact forces on all parts of the dummy's body. Specifically for the head, something known as the HIC (head injury criterion) is evaluated based on the sensor data, which would have been within limits for this test for it to have gotten the 5 stars. And this model didn't have side and curtain airbags, so they didn't deploy.
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Old 10th November 2021, 17:43   #32
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re: Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP

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Originally Posted by CarNerd View Post
How can they award it 5 stars when side airbags didn't deploy and the head has banged the B-Pillar?
Doesn't matter if the head hit the B-Pillar as long as the impact is within permissible limits. Also, they wanted to simulate the base variant getting hit from the side and hence probably disabled them. Refer this thread. (NCAP tests: Things to keep in mind as a buyer / misconceptions about NCAP)
Quote:
This GNCAP is based on front offset tests only.
No, you can't get 5 Stars without doing the side test and having a few other features such as dual channel abs.
Quote:
Getting 5 star safety rating from GNCAP is like getting admission into IIPM rather than IIM which is the Euro NCAP.
This however is sadly true, when compared to the amount of different tests done by Euro NCAP.
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Old 10th November 2021, 18:00   #33
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re: Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP

Awesome!

The latest cars from Mahindra and Tata are acing the GNCAP crash tests.

Hope other manufacturers also take the competition seriously and India gets safer cars.
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Old 10th November 2021, 18:12   #34
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re: Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP

Congratulations to the M&M team for this. Its truly a great step in the correct direction. I am sure they will also do the Euro-NCAP testing once the export kicks in. Its good to have a domestic brand competing with the South Korean twins and other global players. I am sure many will not any second thoughts to buy a M&M in the next few years like how TML has changed the perception of their cars.
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Old 10th November 2021, 18:23   #35
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re: Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP

Here is the C&B video of the crash test preparation and testing. Also answers question raised in the forum on variants.
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Old 10th November 2021, 18:26   #36
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re: Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP

Excellent effort from M&M
Meanwhile
Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP-f15dba20a29343bbae6358f064a268a6.jpeg

(Pic credit to respective TV show)
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Old 10th November 2021, 18:36   #37
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re: Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP

Great news , now Tata may get pressurized to get the Harrier and Safari tested.
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Old 10th November 2021, 18:41   #38
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re: Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP

Meanwhile, Maruti today launched India's most fuel-efficient car . Maruti sticks to its cheap formula, while Mahindra pushes the premium envelope. What a contrast!

Super proud, Mahindra . Giving you a virtual high-five, take a bow! Not only have you created a fantastic product in the XUV700, but you've also aced the crash tests like a champion.

Proud of Indian companies showing the Koreans & Japanese how it is done. The Seltos can go cry in a corner now.

Last edited by GTO : 11th November 2021 at 09:11.
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Old 10th November 2021, 18:44   #39
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re: Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP

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Originally Posted by CarNerd View Post
Getting 5 star safety rating from GNCAP is like getting admission into IIPM rather than IIM which is the Euro NCAP.
I guess some manufacturers are not even able to get IIPM admission and I think this test is doing it's job of segregating safe and unsafe vehicles relatively speaking.

Yes, ENCAP is stringent, but conditions always vary and we need to look past the paper spec, consider the accidents data in said market and choose tests. It doesn't mean GNCAP is useless, means it can evolve given the time and funding.

Last edited by saikarthik : 10th November 2021 at 18:45.
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Old 10th November 2021, 18:47   #40
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re: Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP

Congrats Mahindra!

Ranking and publicity stunt looks like Olympics medal tally reporting (In the past) by USA and Rest of the world. USA used to rank them first by considering total medals and rest of the world put China first based on the Gold medal count.
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Old 10th November 2021, 19:00   #41
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re: Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP

Quote:
Originally Posted by CarNerd View Post
How can they award it 5 stars when side airbags didn't deploy and the head has banged into the B-Pillar?
This is a UNECE Regulation 95 side impact test. It is not scored but is rather a pass/fail test, and a pass on it is required for 5 Global NCAP stars for adult occupant protection. But, nevertheless, it's possible to score very well for head protection in side impact (even when there are upper performance limits) without side head protection airbags. The MDB side impact usually causes chest and lower body injuries. Cars without side head airbags have recorded low Head Injury Criterion values in past tests, even in other NCAPs. For example, this Mazda 2 hatch tested for Latin America.

You have to remember that Global NCAP or the test engineers have no say in the injury measures, the accelerometers in the HIII dummy heads do. You can't say that Global NCAP shouldn't give it a pass just because the head hit a surface. If the HIC36 value was less than 1000, it was less than 1000 and nothing can change that. Unlike consumer-information side impact tests this test has no modifiers either, though even in the consumer tests there exists no such modifier for the head hitting a surface. Maybe the IIHS (in the USA) does because they pay a lot of attention to dummy movements.

The better test for assessing side head protection is the lateral or oblique pole test (which a manufacturer is not even allowed to sponsor in the first place in most NCAPs if side head protection is absent) which Global NCAP will, thankfully, introduce next year.

You can find the test protocol and pass/fail criteria for the current R95 side impact test here.

As for the comparison with Euro NCAP - yes, it's far more up to date but you have to remember that NCAPs proceed in a phased manner with gradually evolving protocols. I do agree that Global NCAP is very slow (the first major update to their protocols is in 2022) but you have to remember that they are funded by philanthropies and Safer Cars for India is just an intermediate till a Bharat NCAP is set up, whenever that is. I think the best we can do right now is be thankful that we have at least some means of consumer information. When Maruti Suzuki says Global NCAP is a third party, they aren't joking. We still don't have a government-funded NCAP in India.

It would simply be impractical to suddenly impose Euro NCAP protocol on Indian cars because it would dramatically drive up the price of cars and would, more likely than not, cause rebellion from most manufacturers rather than compliance. That said, I do agree that Global NCAP's assessment protocol is getting a little too old now and thankfully it will get some significant updates next year bringing it approximately in line with late 2000s - Euro NCAP protocol (there are many differences, though, for the better).

Is it the best NCAP? No, far from it.
Is it better than nothing? I think so.
Should we settle for 'better than nothing'? Well, definitely not, but we don't have an option and neither does Global NCAP. With the funds they get they might not even be able to complete the assessment of one car to Euro NCAP protocol every year - and even then it would likely be a very poor rating. (in this I'm assuming they somehow managed to add an ESC test since Euro NCAP hasn't been conducting it since the EU's mandate for standard-fit GTR8 compliant ESC)

Quote:
Originally Posted by fhdowntheline View Post
I am a bit curious about the side impact test. I thought that the XUV 7OO tilted over quite dangerously on impact. I dont know why they didnt show it moving across sideways like they do for other side-impact tests.
There is no modifier for the car tipping over during side impact. Many cars have tipped over in MDB side impacts in the past, including but not limited to the Lynk&Co 01 recently tested by Euro NCAP, which - get this - scored a full 16.0 for side impact (a rare thing, especially with all their new far side impact testing). Granted, the mobile barrier used was different (heavier and more car-like) and the test speed was higher, but the principle still holds. It's a very common occurrence in SUVs.

Name:  Screenshot 20211110 at 6.20.22 PM.png
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Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP-screenshot-20211110-6.19.31-pm.png

This comment from Latin NCAP on the LHD Volkswagen T-Cross' test video might be of interest (it tipped over during side impact, and I'm wondering whether we should expect the Škoda Kushaq to do the same since the test configuration is identical)

Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP-screenshot-20211110-6.41.46-pm.png

Quote:
Translated by Google
@latinNCAP, in the side collision did the car overturn or not? If yes, what is the impact on the evaluation? Waiting for an answer.

Yes, in the same way that many SUVs fall in this type of test. This is normal considering the low impact point and high center of gravity. Plus wound assessments showed no risk measurements. If the car is toppled, this does not affect the test. The evaluation of the side impact is more critical for the magnitude than the tipping that occurs at low speed in this case. In cars with side curtain airbags it is normal for the airbags on the underside to be deployed if the overturned is high speed or hazardous.
Coming to the topic, I'm thrilled, but not surprised at this news. I guess this is somewhat a first for Mahindra since we can't even really call this one a rebadged Ssangyong. Mahindra knows the importance of a high NCAP rating now and I'm sure there's no going back for them now. They also seem to already be taking the 2022 assessment protocol seriously if my observations are sound.

I will not be surprised to see a Safer Choice Award for the XUV700 very soon, given its optional ESC. It has met the requisite star ratings for adult and child occupant protection.

On another note, while 4 stars for child occupant protection is still a very good rating, I can't help but be slightly disappointed that we still haven't had a five star child occupant protection rating. I'm waiting for the first true 'full five star' Global NCAP rating and I look forward to see which manufacturer it will be, if at all.

I'm also delighted that Mahindra has chosen to recommend a rearward-facing CRS for even the Group I child, following closely on *Toyota and *Honda's (and recently Tata's) heels.

About the petrol-powered car's rumoured intrusion issue, I had requested someone at Global NCAP to include the fuel type of the tested car in the technical report (for all future tests), and he said he had passed it on (without confirming whether it would be introduced). Unfortunately, it looks like they haven't made the change after all. Can anyone who's been following the XUV700 closely determine which fuel type was tested?

Also, based on the test code (43rd week of 2021 (Tata Nexon: Global NCAP’s first 5-Star Indian car)) it looks like the tests Global NCAP was tweeting about (Tata Punch secures a full 5-star rating in the GNCAP) near the end of October were for the XUV700 and not the round of non-voluntary tests.

I'll also point out that this comes as a stark contrast to the 2020 round of tests whose results were released almost exactly a year ago (off by one day).

We've had nothing but good to great results in 2021, not surprisingly (since all the tests were sponsored by manufacturers), and I hope this year's round of non-voluntary tests doesn't disappoint either. I also have a feeling we might see more manufacturers making entries into the five star club very soon.

*internationally but not in India and South Africa

Last edited by ron178 : 10th November 2021 at 19:27.
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Old 10th November 2021, 19:06   #42
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re: Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP

Kudos to Mahindra!

Frankly this was expected. There was no way Mahindra would have gone for anything less than 5 stars for their premium flagship product. I doubt though if sales are going to increase just because of this. It is already a blockbuster product with exorbitant waiting times. Nevertheless it is reassuring for those who booked which is the best thing to happen for them!

I strongly feel we humans have forgotten to be happy at anything without poking fingers at someone else. Let us enjoy the success of Mahindra without bashing TATA and MG at least in one thread!
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Old 10th November 2021, 19:12   #43
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re: Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP

Kudos to Mahindra!!! Superb and great news.
This Safety based competition between Tata and Mahindra is great news for us the buyers.

On another note, MODS: Can we have this on the Home Page please? This deserves to be there...
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Old 10th November 2021, 19:46   #44
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re: Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP

Kudos to Mahindra for achieving this feat

Now, I feel Kia should wake up and launch the Seltos ASAP with better structural integrity in order to get better safety rating.
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Old 10th November 2021, 20:41   #45
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re: Mahindra XUV700 scores 5 stars in the GNCAP

Well done Mahindra and Mahindra. Congratulations

I guess, many of us were expecting a very good NCAP performance by XUV700. Our desi companies are proving that we can produce safe and value for money cars. Hope our market leader is listening and will put more emphasis on safety in addition to fuel efficiency.
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