[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by am1m

.
Once we invited a senior participant to talk to the newbies, someone who was among those that pioneered the sport in the state and used to participate long before it had started becoming popular. To our shock, he refused to acknowledge any of the basic safety aspects, even wearing a helmet! His response: "Oh all that is for Western countries!"

Thanks!
Put a woman in front of men. You have far fewer safety attitude problems with women than with men. I made an ex army female head of our field organisation. One of my best decisions ever! She had no time for any of this male gung-ho crap!

Jeroen

[glovins2004]

I’m so paranoid to drive through highways with tall bushes on the median. Who know what will jump out of it at any moment. I had a nightmare during one my trips few years back but by god’s grace I came out unscratched. when such situations still linger around along with all possible insane traffic sense, this news is no surprise

[blrautobahn]

MORTH has accident reports for every year, that has good granular information.

https://morth.nic.in/road-accident-in-india

[subincb]

Near to 18% of world population having just 13% of road fatality is not very bad atleast on statistics level.

[Gennex]

The above report which mentioned the increased fatalities due to road traffic accident (RTA) in India reports after the accident has happened. When breakdown the causes, we can say the factors before, during and after the accident. Prevention is always better but we know some nuts behind wheel lack civic sense. During the the impact lot many factors come in and they decide the outcome of on site mortality. What I would like to stress is the response of the bystanders who are at the site of accident,( or reach there). Just think about how much time it takes for the medical help to arrive, how far the site of accident is from a village/town/city. How many of the general population are aware of basic life support.
Unless we strengthen each of these factors the trend would remain the same.

[hdburner]

In my opinion one of the biggest contributing factor in road accident is lack of basic road etiquettes. Many folks out there are simply unaware of lane rule and overtaking rules. People will jump on the wrong side just to save some drops of fuel and that too on expressway. For a couple of months driving on highways have become even more challenging thanks to overloaded tractors and bullock carts (starting season of sugar mills in north western parts) who absolutely refuses to let you overtake.

[dragracer567]

Originally Posted by SmartCat

India's road safety is comparable to that of China/Russia/Brazil etc.

We can slice and dice data however we want. Instead of accidents per capita, if we look at accidents per vehicles actually plying on the road (which is a lot less in India than these countries), the numbers are less palatable.

There is no doubt that India has a terrible road safety problem, even worse than our neighbors like Nepal or Sri Lanka. I should know, I drive frequently in Saudi Arabia which already has one of the worst driving standards in the world and still freak out from the antics on Indian roads when I come visiting.

[SmartCat]

Originally Posted by dragracer567

We can slice and dice data however we want. Instead of accidents per capita, if we look at accidents per vehicles actually plying on the road (which is a lot less in India than these countries), the numbers are less palatable.

This is incorrect. India's vehicles on the road is multiple times that of pretty much all countries in the world. One has to slice and dice the data - because only then we can understand where the problem lies.



Source: https://www.news18.com/news/india/a-...1-6113779.html

And the biggest problem is that pedestrians account for 15% of deaths & two wheelers account for 45% of deaths on Indian roads. And there are no easy solutions to reduce these numbers. Our absolute population & population density (esp. in towns & cities) is extremely high, and this contributes to high pedestrian deaths. Regarding two wheeler deaths, our citizens cannot afford to buy/use cars in lieu of two wheelers.

Improving safety in cars (15% of deaths) and commercial vehicles (10% of deaths) is low hanging fruit though.

Regular public road safety messaging might help, but then rural areas contribute 50% to overall deaths - where education levels are low & poverty levels high. In their daily struggles (one among which includes lack of access to proper transport), road safety is very likely to rank low among their priorities.

Essentially, India's problems are unique and different. we should not read a road safety report by UK authorities that that says "badly designed roads is the cause for 20% of accidents" and then simply extrapolate that data point to India too. Also, at best, the standard road safety solutions like "better infrastructure" or "rules enforcement" will just ensure that the death numbers do NOT rise.

The problem is complex and answer probably lies in rapid increase in India's GDP per capita.

[McLaren Rulez]

You don't need to be a statistician to know that driving in India is more dangerous than most parts of the world. The primary problem is that the majority of Indians never learned to drive safely but got licenses anyway - as simple as that. And this continues to happen today.

The only way to solve this is going radical. Beef up RTO testing capacity. All existing licenses should be set to expire in three years. Anyone who wants a new one should pass a proper test before that period ends. Ramp up penalties for anyone who is caught breaking traffic rules over the same period.

If we can demonetize overnight, this is equally possible. Just that politically, no party will find the will to do it because so many "expert" drivers will fail the new test and go up in arms against those who try to make such a change.

[Turbohead]

Originally Posted by SmartCat

Regular public road safety messaging might help, but then rural areas contribute 50% to overall deaths - where education levels are low & poverty levels high. In their daily struggles (one among which includes lack of access to proper transport), road safety is very likely to rank low among their priorities.

Essentially, India's problems are unique and different. we should not read a road safety report by UK authorities that that says "badly designed roads is the cause for 20% of accidents" and then simply extrapolate that data point to India too. Also, at best, the standard road safety solutions like "better infrastructure" or "rules enforcement" will just ensure that the death numbers do NOT rise.

The problem is complex and answer probably lies in rapid increase in India's GDP per capita.

I think you summarised the data well but I would interpret them in a different way. A drastic increase in India's GDP may reduce deaths as people move on to cars but it will not reduce accidents by any stretch of imagination - most of our countrymen are taught by their friends/families to drive and their standards will completely depend on their trainer and their habits and not any standardised rules and regulations of the country.

Like McLaren Rulez perfectly summarised, we need some solid, well thought out rules which are enforced strictly along with proper training of drivers.

Transportation is no longer a luxury in today's economy because you cannot earn money/sustain yourself unless you can move about or your necessities can be delivered home. It is imperative that sensible rules are enforced and not some hare brained ideas implemented by bureaucrats who've never driven in their lifetime.

[ComboCutter]

The shaming is well deserved.

Even a sedate disciplined driver on a well marked highway here is forced to drive rashly due to

• Vehicles parked right at the entry or exit ramps. Roads at such points also bad almost always.
• Condition of roads is unreliable (there could be a big pothole somehow the next day). The fixing of such potholes is unscientific and mostly a temporary measure rather than a proper fix.
• Junctions being under-developed and encouraging chaos. The rumble strips are good, adding an entry/exit/uturn lane at such places will improve safety.
• Left most lane is blocked one way or the other - parked vehicles with no hazard lights, encroachments, mud/sand, wrong way drivers etc.
• Unfit vehicles plying on right lanes. Fully loaded Tata Magics and three wheelers riding on the right lane (partially due to above point; unacceptable in 6 lane roads)
• Trucks driving in tandem blocking all or the right lanes. Government can impose and enforce a bigger fine for such drivers. Also a mandatory Dash camera fitment directive would be welcome for all trucks. They can even roll an incentive program of collecting videos at rest stops. (Far cry but not impossible)
• Drowsy and/or drunk drivers. They signed their own death warrants, one can only pray they don't harm others.
• Rash driving. Maybe mandatory yearly training videos would improve discipline. Can definitely be mandated for commercial drivers. Block fastag and license if videos are not watched.
• Increase the commercial speed governors limit to 100kmph. On expressways it doesn't make sense to limit them to 80kmph.
• Unlicensed or inexperienced drivers. Overhauling RTO offices and procedures encouraging people to apply online and watch Safety training videos is needed. Tiered licenses for bikes and cars also would be welcome. Higher power/torque automobiles requiring a higher tier license. The Tests being tougher every tier. (Never going to happen but one can dream)

All of the solutions warrant the government having the strong will to reduce road deaths. But the government will do the bare-minimum and boast some cherry-picked odd statistic to show everything is so rosy.

[ZenMaster]

The biggest problem that I have seen, especially in Northern Parts of India is how most people get their licenses...Without ever even stepping their foot in the RTO or even in a car.

Most of my colleagues got their license throught an agent by paying some amount which these agents then pay under the table to whoever it is and voila....the License appears on their doorstep after 2 weeks.

My flatmate who's had his license longer than me had never learned to drive and had to properly learn to drive with a driving instructor after buying his car.

But most people don't do this. They just learn from a friend or relative until they figure out the controls...
As for rules.......lets say they just figure it out themselves as time goes by.

[NewUser123]

The latest report is pretty good, and does the slicing and dicing of the data well. The images are from the 2022 report.

I take optimism from the fact that even though the number of vehicles is growing expoenentially, the rates of accidents and fatalities are declining.

# Vehicle Registrations:




Fatalities / 10K Vehicles:




Accidents / 10K Vehicles:


It's not all bad. We are improving, albeit slower than some would like.

[VeluM]

Originally Posted by SmartCat

And the biggest problem is that pedestrians account for 15% of deaths & two wheelers account for 45% of deaths on Indian roads.

Originally Posted by McLaren Rulez

You don't need to be a statistician to know that driving in India is more dangerous than most parts of the world. The primary problem is that the majority of Indians never learned to drive safely but got licenses anyway - as simple as that. And this continues to happen today.

The only way to solve this is going radical. Beef up RTO testing capacity. All existing licenses should be set to expire in three years. Anyone who wants a new one should pass a proper test before that period ends. Ramp up penalties for anyone who is caught breaking traffic rules over the same period.

If we can demonetize overnight, this is equally possible. Just that politically, no party will find the will to do it because so many "expert" drivers will fail the new test and go up in arms against those who try to make such a change.

Originally Posted by ZenMaster

The biggest problem that I have seen, especially in Northern Parts of India is how most people get their licenses...Without ever even stepping their foot in the RTO or even in a car.

As for rules.......lets say they just figure it out themselves as time goes by.

Very well identified as the basic problem, and root cause of most accidents in India. Excellent suggestion about the cancellation of licenses pending a time bound re-evaluation of all existing licenses.

There are three basic issues, each of which need to be addressed individually:

1. Licensing
2. Infrastructure
3. Enforcement

1. Licensing:
   As stated by McLaren Rulez, this needs a radical solution. Trouble is that licensing is a state subject, which is why we have different state licenses with varying degrees of training and testing requirements.
   
   There has to be a complete revamp of the syllabus which is pathetic at the moment. The testing must have a comprehensive theoretical portion including basic vehicle maintenance and inspection.
   
   All normal scenarios must be addressed with clear instructions, and all non-normal situations must be addressed with a limited set of standard mandatory actions and well defined responsibilities.
   
   For example people just put a branch or leave the hazards on their vehicles on if it breaks down anywhere on a road - this should be a mandatory keep clear and call RSA, which is why RSA is so important abroad and pointless in India.
   
   Practical training must include a specific number of scenario based simulator training hours, with the syllabus and objectives of each hour defined in a manual for prior self study by students.
   
   Responsibility of learning the rules and etiquette should be stated clearly as that of the student, with gates for testing proficiency at the theoretical test, beginning and end of simulator training, and at any point during the live vehicle training.
   
   Training institutes should be empowered to independently recommend additional training hours with a provision for review, and all licenses should be tied to the originating training institute so that future driver behaviour reflects on the institute’s rating/licenses.
   
   
2. Infrastructure:
   Poor pedestrian infrastructure is the next biggest threat to all motorists. This includes the availability of last mile walkability and sufficient proper embarkation/disembarkation areas for public and private transport.
   
   Example sufficient and properly located large bus bays, taxi and auto stands, and public vehicle parking well connected by well lit, spacious and well built pedestrian foot path to all adjoining areas - both commercial and private.
   
   Good highways are happening, but city infrastructure needs a drastic upgrade both for vehicles and for pedestrians. I’m of the opinion that cycles should be treated as pedestrians for now because that’s a tiny problem which can be addressed later.
   
   This again is a state level problem as these are city level bodies sometimes governed by state regulations at best. Central planning guidance in the form of model codes might help.
   
   
3. Enforcement:
   At the moment, no one knows who is at fault, and that’s because of the lack of the former two items in my list. Even the police doesn’t know all the rules or how to apply them.
   
   In the event of an accident, usually all parties involved are at fault due to a combination of lack of knowledge of the rules, poor infrastructure, and the police if involved normally comes in just to make a buck.
   
   Most minor accidents can be handled without involving the police because that’s what insurance is for, provided people know the rules and the value of insurance and RSA.
   
   Police should be trained even more rigorously than regular driving licensees so that they are instantly able to identify the offending party without extended bickering on the road.

Separately, I believe all enclosed vehicles must have forward and rearward recording at the minimum of 1080p with the last 2 recorded hours available at any given time. These recording devices should also log date, time, and GPS data such as speed and location.

There will be valid concerns about the honesty of training institutes which can be addressed once the ball is rolling.

Hope this post is as clear as my thoughts about the subject. Putting things down in writing is a challenge in these days of WhatsApp

[V.Narayan]

Rant Starts...

Let's call a spade a spade. Our egos and our attitudes towards driving and rules sucks big time. Most of us, not the one's on Team BHP, but those 10 million other drivers out there believe 'baap ki sadak hai'{road belongs to my father}. We suffer from a 'I can do what the hell I please so long as I don't get caught' attitude that is so ingrained that a large proportion of two wheeler riders believe jumping red lights, driving on the wrong side etc is their right. All of us on this forum are familiar with the 101 rule breaking surprises we face each time we drive. 75% of the problem lies between our two ears.

Can it be fixed - yes it can but the political will does not exist. Even the cops do not know the traffic rules.

...Rant ends