[hkanitkar]

Originally Posted by hkanitkar

Hi guys !
Currently we are looking to buy a car for my wife, who is re-learning driving after a gap of 7 years since she learnt it the last time ! :P

A quick update on my query few weeks back !!

We bought home a pre-owned Hyundai Grande i10 Asta (O) yesterday ! Its a July 2016 manufactured, 68k KMs run, Single owner car. Initial offer was 4.7L but finalised at 3.75L as my Brother in Law knew the dealer very well.

IMO, we got a good deal and wife was convinced to up her budget by 75k since the car fit all the criteria well ( All the bells and whistles : ABS , Air bags, Keyless entry etc all ).

[Balthazar]

Hello
I recently started working 5 months ago. The plan was to commute using the Delhi Metro, but due to the pandemic, that is not an option. I have been using my father's old swift, but I need my first car soon. My requirements are fairly unorthodox, since I am on a contract which expires next year. I am paid fairly well for an entry level position in my field, but I do not know what the future holds. For now, so I am assuming the worst, which entails 15 to 20,000 a month in 2022-23. Which is why I am pinching pennies, and looking for a cheap, reliable, but if possible, a good looking car.
My requirements are

• Budget

Strictly under Rs. 1.5 to Rs. 2 Lakhs. Due to my budget, I am only limited to the second hand market, and from my searches, 8-11 year old cars.

• Make and Model

I am was initially okay with any car, and was looking at old Altos. But I found out that upping my budget bit more ( Rs. 50,000 approx.) opened up old City, Civic, and other seemingly decent options. So I am leaning towards them now. I know that the one cardinal rule of buying cars that have spent a decade on Indian roads is to not look at the make/model, but the condition of the car in general. So that is what I am going with. That said, I detest the tall boy design, which removes a lot of cars from the running. I would still prefer sedans over hatchbacks, and anything over Wagonrs, K10s etc.
I have personally been looking at Cities, Civics some base model Polos, Accent. Open to suggestions.

• Maintenance

The less over the next 3-4 years, the better. Since they are so old, I would prefer cars that are cheaper to run, and reliable. Which brings me to

• Reliability

The most important criteria. Over my ownership, I would prefer fairly reliable. Please tell me what to avoid, and what to look for.

I have just started my search. This will be my first car, and I haven't settled on anything yet, since I have only just begun actively looking for something d the list is quite vast at this point. I need some advice on which cars to avoid, what to look for, so I can make a shortlist and start from there. I live in Delhi, which means diesels are out. I do not want any CNGs at all, so I am avoiding that. Anything older than 2010 would not be fruitful because of the 15 year lifespan of petrol here.
Please point me in the right direction folks.

[Archie_27]

Originally Posted by Balthazar

Please point me in the right direction folks.

Hi Balthazar,

As per your requirements, IMO in the pre worshipped market, three categories of cars can be found on that specific budget.

First is the plethora of hatchbacks like 10 year old santro, alto, wagonR, i10, eon, a-star and the like which are good on value, easy and cheap to maintain and are available aplenty.

Secondly, talking about premium hatches and sedans, you have options like polo, i20, fiesta, SX4, punto, dzire etc which are better in value proposition but are a bit expensive to maintain.

Thirdly there are really rare finds like well maintained examples of the civic, cruze, chevy sail, crv and the like which provide excellent value and are expensive to a high extent to maintain. In some cases even parts availability could be an issue. So it is a personal matter I believe. I would've gone for a DZire, polo or an SX4 if I'd be going for one.

Cheers

[omar]

Considering the budget, I wouldn’t recommend a sedan unless it is clean and well maintained, more so since it will be your first car.

I would recommend a 2011-2012 first generation (facelift) Jazz. Its a great car, which is more sedan than hatchback in terms of space. In fact, you won’t like the internal dimensions of any another hatchback after using it!

It has a proven engine, and is also fun to drive once it is off the block. The build quality is also better than the other mass market alternatives available.

[Equus]

A well maintained Honda City (likely ZX only in this range) would be the best bet from what you describe. I sold my 2007 ZX GXi last august - it had run 73k kms and could easily last another decade if maintained well. We didnt need 2 cars and I was paying extra for packing, so sold it off. I dont think you can find a Jazz but its worth a try.
Look out for Verna's as well.

[Nissan1180]

Get a CNG fitted car with at least 5 years of registration left. You'll really see the difference in fuel bills because you are on a budget and a properly tuned CNG won't drive badly. If you can get a factory fitted CNG then it is the best option.

I'd also recommend checking out a good Nano because the car is perfect for city traffic and you might find the automatic version also within your budget.

[07CR]

Originally Posted by Balthazar

For now, so I am assuming the worst, which entails 15 to 20,000 a month in 2022-23.

If by this you mean, your monthly salary will be in the range of 15K to 20K, and I assume you don't have any other substitute income (through parent's/ and you plan to utilize the entire 20K corpus for your daily needs as well) then I am afraid, you should not go for the City's and VWs.

I ran a quick search on OLX in Delhi, with the following filters-

1) Cars between 2011 and 2021.
2) Petrol cars
3) Cars from brands (Toyota, Honda, Maruti and Ford, a bit dicey about old fords for the reliability)
4) Budget between 0 to 2.2 Lakhs. (You can shave off atleast 20K, in negotiation)

So based on the above information I would suggest the following, and on the order of my preference-

1) Toyota Etios/ Etios Liva (Boring choice. But won't demand any attention from you! Nothing lasts like the Toyota)

2) Honda Brio (One of the few desirable entry level hatchbacks, you will also find a fairly new model in your budget. Quite Fun to drive too)

3) Ford Fiesta Classic/Figo (cars, that won't shout that you bought something cheap and will offer you plenty of fun! I am just not sure how much the old Ford's would be for maintenance. That said, Post 2014 the Ford has been exemplary in ASS department for most buyers.)

4) SX4 (Dicey about the parts availability; being a maruti should be reliable)

[Balthazar]

Originally Posted by Archie_27

So it is a personal matter I believe. I would've gone for a DZire, polo or an SX4 if I'd be going for one.

I was considering the Polo, but was unsure about the reliability of a 10 year old Volkswagen. How are they in general? I assume servicing from a FNG would be cheaper than ASS? I am going to drive at-least 20k kms this year, since I have a 55 km daily commute to work.

Originally Posted by omar

Considering the budget, I wouldn’t recommend a sedan unless it is clean and well maintained, more so since it will be your first car.

I would recommend a 2011-2012 first generation (facelift) Jazz. Its a great car, which is more sedan than hatchback in terms of space. In fact, you won’t like the internal dimensions of any another hatchback after using it!

It has a proven engine, and is also fun to drive once it is off the block. The build quality is also better than the other mass market alternatives available.

I had not thought about the Jazz. I was looking at the Brio. I should assume that the Jazz is reliable as well since its a Honda right?

Originally Posted by Equus

A well maintained Honda City (likely ZX only in this range) would be the best bet from what you describe. I sold my 2007 ZX GXi last august - it had run 73k kms and could easily last another decade if maintained well. We didnt need 2 cars and I was paying extra for packing, so sold it off. I dont think you can find a Jazz but its worth a try.
Look out for Verna's as well.

That is the issue. The Cities and Civics under 2 are very near the 15 year limit, so that only leaves 2010-2011 model year. They are slightly over my budget, and I did not think of this before, but the bigger sedans would entail higher maintenance.

Originally Posted by Nissan1180

Get a CNG fitted car with at least 5 years of registration left. You'll really see the difference in fuel bills because you are on a budget and a properly tuned CNG won't drive badly. If you can get a factory fitted CNG then it is the best option.
I'd also recommend checking out a good Nano because the car is perfect for city traffic and you might find the automatic version also within your budget.

I do plan on taking it outstation occasionally, so I had ruled the Nano out. And I dislike cars with CNG. I had the opportunity to drive my mechanics 15 year old WagonR CNG, and it left a very bad taste in my mouth. Petrol is only option left.

Originally Posted by 07CR

If by this you mean, your monthly salary will be in the range of 15K to 20K, and I assume you don't have any other substitute income (through parent's/ and you plan to utilize the entire 20K corpus for your daily needs as well) then I am afraid, you should not go for the City's and VWs.

I ran a quick search on OLX in Delhi, with the following filters-

1) Cars between 2011 and 2021.
2) Petrol cars
3) Cars from brands (Toyota, Honda, Maruti and Ford, a bit dicey about old fords for the reliability)
4) Budget between 0 to 2.2 Lakhs. (You can shave off atleast 20K, in negotiation)

So based on the above information I would suggest the following, and on the order of my preference-

1) Toyota Etios/ Etios Liva (Boring choice. But won't demand any attention from you! Nothing lasts like the Toyota)

2) Honda Brio (One of the few desirable entry level hatchbacks, you will also find a fairly new model in your budget. Quite Fun to drive too)

3) Ford Fiesta Classic/Figo (cars, that won't shout that you bought something cheap and will offer you plenty of fun! I am just not sure how much the old Ford's would be for maintenance. That said, Post 2014 the Ford has been exemplary in ASS department for most buyers.)

4) SX4 (Dicey about the parts availability; being a maruti should be reliable)

I will make 7.4 lakhs till May next year, after taxes. But after my contract expires, unless I can find something better, 15-20k is what I will make in 2022-23. This is the worst case scenario, but speaking financially, I am assuming the worst. That is why I wanted to save as much as I could this year. I do not have any income from parents to fall back onto, so the 20k next year will only be for petrol and the essential expenses.
My commute is fairly long as well. I drive 55kms daily, and I am looking at almost 20k kms in a year. That is why I wanted something that would last for another 60k in 3 years without any major fuss.

Also, what do you think of the the Corolla? I haven't been able to find one within budget, and might have to extend it a bit which I really do not want to, unless it gets me something quantitatively better.

[Sanidhya mukund]

Originally Posted by Balthazar

Hello
I have just started my search. This will be my first car, and I haven't settled on anything yet, since I have only just begun actively looking for something d the list is quite vast at this point. I need some advice on which cars to avoid, what to look for, so I can make a shortlist and start from there. I live in Delhi, which means diesels are out. I do not want any CNGs at all, so I am avoiding that. Anything older than 2010 would not be fruitful because of the 15 year lifespan of petrol here.
Please point me in the right direction folks.

Hello Balthazar!

I recently helped someone select their car. The said person had the exact same set of requirements as yours. I looked at online portals, Maruti True value website and even visited a couple of used car dealers in Safdarjung Enclave. Based on this, I would like to state a few points that might be helpful to you.

When we started our research, the idea was to get a good mid-size sedan or premium hatchback. We were only looking at post 2010 petrol cars because of the NGT rule. We came across several examples of Civics, Citys, old Corollas, SX4s and Ventos/Rapids. In that budget, the newest cars of these models that we could find were 0f 2011, while most other examples were from 2006-2009, and hence pretty much useless with only 2-3 years of validity remaining. But the most major deterrent was the fact that most of these cars had a few things in common;

1. They had seen several owners and had clearly tampered odos.

2. Almost all the cars that we saw had aftermarket CNG kits; you can never be sure of how well was the kit fitted. These things could be potentially lethal if not done properly.

3. Most cars, being old and high mileage had sagging seats, stinky interiors and rubbish body work.

This was when we decided to look for a segment lower. We were now looking at hatchbacks. I simply avoided the Skoda Fabia and VW Polo because those cars have very expensive spares and most examples needed the usual expensive repairs- Suspension, steering racks etc. These cars were reasonably cheap, but the parts bill would surely mount up to 30-40 percent of the price one would pay for such a car. The only decent cars we could find were 2010-13 Maruti Ritz, 2010-2014 Ford Figo, 2010-2013 Toyota LIVA/Etios and a couple of later Esteems/Ambassadors/Accents in decent shape. We also found multiple Swifts and Dzires, but those cars held their value very well and the sellers would not negotiate much, given the fact that these cars are still in high demand.

Eventually, one thing was clear. Whatever car you buy, a 10 year old car is bound to require work. Yes, you can find a few reasonably neat cars, but an old is an old car and things will go wrong. Since the man wanted a hassle free commuter, I suggested him to look for 2016 and later Maruti Alto800/K10, WagonR, Ritz, Hyundai Eon, Hyundai Santro and Renault Kwid. Datsuns were also considered as a wildcard entry because we saw many nearly new ones going for less. Eventually, we found many low mileage examples, especially of Renault Kwid and Alto, all being post 2015. We had almost finalised on to a red 2016 Renault Kwid RXT with merely 28k on the odo, but this was when we got an awesome Hyundai Eon, 2015 model that had only done 2.4k Km on Cars24. We even verified the odo reading through the Hyundai dealer and they confirmed that it was indeed that low. He test drove the car and it drove just like a new one. the rear seats even had the plastic coverings intact. He immediately paid the deposit to reserve the car. It had been advertised for 2.5 lakhs and we got it down to 2.37. The owner is very very happy with his purchase, he got a nearly new car with validity upto 2030 and no niggles/issues. It is an awesome commuter car and the interiors also feel very premium for the price.

TL;DR- Look for a post 2015 Alto800/K10, Renault Kwid, Datsun Redigo, Hyundai Eon or Tata Nano. You can easily get a reliable, newish, low mileage example that would be an efficient and reliable commuter. If you are keen on getting something bigger, Look for good deals on Ford Figo, Hyundai Accent, Maruti Ritz and Toyota Liva.


hope this helps
Sanidhya

[07CR]

Originally Posted by Balthazar

I will make 7.4 lakhs till May next year, after taxes. But after my contract expires, unless I can find something better, 15-20k is what I will make in 2022-23. This is the worst case scenario, but speaking financially, I am assuming the worst. That is why I wanted to save as much as I could this year. I do not have any income from parents to fall back onto, so the 20k next year will only be for petrol and the essential expenses.
My commute is fairly long as well. I drive 55kms daily, and I am looking at almost 20k kms in a year. That is why I wanted something that would last for another 60k in 3 years without any major fuss.

In that case I stand by my earlier quote, in the order of preference-
1) Etios/Liva
2) Brio
3) Figo/Fiesta Classic
4) Sx4

Originally Posted by Balthazar

Also, what do you think of the the Corolla? I haven't been able to find one within budget, and might have to extend it a bit which I really do not want to, unless it gets me something quantitatively better.

I would avoid Corolla.
Reasons-
1) Asking price would be higher
2) Mileage would be very low compared to my other references
3) Some spares could be pretty expensive (again relative to my other references, especially the Liva/Etios and Brio), thereby higher maintenance costs.

[IshaanIan]

I would recommend the SX4/Jazz/Brio all are solid reliable options. A Corolla would be a great car but I'd avoid the D-Segment since spare costs will be expensive.

[lamborghini]

Looking at petrol prices & a daily commute of 55kms at the moment : I would keep fuel economy in mind as well.
These larger sedans are going to be thirsty and it wouldn't be surprising to see nearly ₹500/day going just towards fuel.
Ideally you should pick something that has poor resale (so you can get a newer example which has taken bulk of depreciation), a well built car (reliable, and body integrity), with good fuel economy.
You should also find a good independent mechanic who can do work on these cars and source parts.

I would recommend looking for the etios / liva, ritz, figo, wagonR, Jazz, Brio / Amaze.

The Polo is a good option, but the car isn't as abuse friendly as a toyota, and unlike many Marutis can throw up heftier bills - if you do find one in immaculate condition, do give it a thought but be prepared to spend a little more on maintenance : routine & accidental.

[PrasannaDhana]

Originally Posted by Balthazar

Please point me in the right direction folks.

Ok, let me summarize what you need :
A reliable, cheap, fuel efficient first car to take you from A to B.
You already use a Swift.

I may be against the tide here when I tell you to avoid used Fords and Volkswagens.

This purchase has to be something very practical. Polos and old Figos definitely aren't the most reliable bunch, nor are they fuel efficient/cheap to maintain. Honda city might not be available at your budget (I mean the 3rd generation or later). You might find dolphin citys, which doesn't fit your "want" of good-looking car.

Older Corollas with their 1.8 petrol is a bit thirsty specially considering metro city usage. If I were you, I would just go with the safer option of getting an auto k10, and may be sprucing it up with after market alloys and some other tasteful but subtle mods to stand out from the sea of Altos.

The car is simple, reliable, fun to drive, fuel efficient and you can find them aplenty in the used market. It is quite small and hence very easy to drive and park in urban setting.

Next choice would be a brio. But brios demand much more cash in the used car market. You might have to up your budget by atleast 75k to a lakh to accommodate Brio. IMHO brio looks better than the alto and the car is pretty fun to drive too.

Sx4, oh no! 1.6 mill is a petrol guzzler. And you said you drive 60km a day. Gosh!!

So it's going to be the following in my list:

Alto k10
Brio
Wagon R / Celerio (both ugly, but very practical nevertheless)

All the above cars are easier to sell back in the used market too. They are always well sought after.

As a owner of Kwid, I would vote against it. It isn't as efficient or as reliable as a maruti.

A gentle reminder- During the start of your career when you are trying to be very prudent with your expenses, it's better to have a "fill it, shut it and forget it" type of a car than a good looking, higher segment car that constantly keeps you in the anxiety of the next maintenance expenditure/costly spare part replacement.

[TwerkyC0ffee]

Originally Posted by Balthazar

I do plan on taking it outstation occasionally, so I had ruled the Nano out. And I dislike cars with CNG. I had the opportunity to drive my mechanics 15 year old WagonR CNG, and it left a very bad taste in my mouth. Petrol is only option left.

Hi Balthazar, please take a test drive of newer Marutis - Celerio CNG or WagonR CNG, the ones with factory fitted CNG kit.

I doubt that the 15 year old WagonR you drove came equipped with CNG from factory. Aftermarket CNG fitments make the car feel very underpowered, whilst affecting other things like AC performance, and suspension. I suspect these are the exact symptoms you felt in the WagonR you drove which left a bad impression.

We have a Celerio CNG at home and earlier we had an Alto. Alto initially was petrol-only for initial 6 years of trouble-free ownership, but because of my father's high running (100kms per day) we got an aftermarket CNG kit installed on the Alto.

Soon the problems started cropping up - weird sounds from engine, AC didn't cool effectively and the car had no power left. It was next to impossible to overtake on highways. Also, because of added weight of CNG cylinder the rear suspension bottomed out at every given opportunity. The car drove nose-up when there were 3 occupants in the rear seat. The suspension simply wasn't designed to take such loads.

When we were buying our new car, we checked Celerio CNG and it fit our requirements perfectly. The SA informed us that these factory fit CNG cars had some changes to the rear suspension to handle that additional weight, and it was a revelation to drive as well. You couldn't tell difference between driving in petrol vs CNG, and no other factor (AC, driveability, etc) was affected. It is still serving us well after 5 years / 50k kms.

I think a 5 year old Celerio CNG would fit in your budget as well, and trust me, your fuel expenses will be equivalent to a motorbike.

And coming to long outstation drives, you'll get about 250kms range from one tankful CNG, and post that you always have petrol as backup if you don't find CNG stations enroute.

TL;DR: Do take a test drive of Celerio/WagonR CNG (factory installed) before finalizing your decision. There's a very high chance you'll like it, and it fits perfectly fine in your financial requirements - both - buying cost as well as running cost.

[charanreddy]

Originally Posted by Balthazar

I will make 7.4 lakhs till May next year, after taxes. But after my contract expires, unless I can find something better, 15-20k is what I will make in 2022-23. This is the worst case scenario, but speaking financially, I am assuming the worst. That is why I wanted to save as much as I could this year. I do not have any income from parents to fall back onto, so the 20k next year will only be for petrol and the essential expenses.
My commute is fairly long as well. I drive 55kms daily, and I am looking at almost 20k kms in a year. That is why I wanted something that would last for another 60k in 3 years without any major fuss.

Sorry to have to point this out, but you need to write down your requirements and prioritise as your requirements are quite contradictory.

A low priced, old sedan is not going to be cheap to run and maintain. A reliable sedan which gives good fuel efficiency (Dzire) is likely to be costly as they hold value well.

If you are going to 20 K kms in a year, assuming a really high fuel efficiency your annual fuel costs are likely to be upwards of Rs 1 lakh. Assume a maintenance of rs 15 K including tires.

I would suggest that you acquire a cheap to run and maintain hatch like the alto with a 3 year time horizon as you sound quite young( an assumption on my part). Start up skilling and try to increase your budget by 2024 and then go for a car you desire.

I would suggest that you play for the long term rather than get stuck at the wrong point in time with an expensive car. Just my 2 cents. Sorry if my post sounds preachy / offensive.