[speed79]

@07CR If your friend plans to keep car for atleast 10 years, it does not make sense to get a used car. 2016 Amaze would already be 6 years old. What if the 10 Years NGT Diesel ban is applied to other cities too in next few years. Tiago Petrol seems to be a better choice from perspective of safety ratings ( 4* GNCAP) within his budget.

[Ton Ami]

These are unpredictable times for buying an old (bs4) diesel car. Who knows what rules may be introduced by 2024-25 once the mega scrap factories of big conglomerates are functional and what NGT may ban in Tier 2&3 cities.

If I was your friend I would have gone for a new petrol car from Maruti as a first car buyer, Probably base Varian of Baleno or Wagon R 1.2.

1. Peace of mind for next 15 years in terms of registration.
2. Extended warranty
3. Lower interest rate on loan for new car
4. Higher resale value for 1st owner vehicles
5. Easy availability of spare parts
6. Easy availability of mechanics/ garage across the country
7. Relatively better FE than Tata petrol cars

New baleno is relatively better built than older model, maybe Maruti finally realised that its time to change their reputation of building 'Tin cars'.

If he can stretch his budget he can also look for base Tiago EV (Just in case, his budget allows).

[07CR]

Originally Posted by speed79

@07CR If your friend plans to keep car for atleast 10 years, it does not make sense to get a used car. 2016 Amaze would already be 6 years old. What if the 10 Years NGT Diesel ban is applied to other cities too in next few years.

Originally Posted by Ton Ami

These are unpredictable times for buying an old (bs4) diesel car. Who knows what rules may be introduced by 2024-25 once the mega scrap factories of big conglomerates are functional and what NGT may ban in Tier 2&3 cities.

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe such rules are never applicable to vehicles that have been already sold. It will only be applicable for the vehicles that would be sold, once such rule has been applied. I have seen this policy for many of the government norms.

Originally Posted by Ton Ami

If I was your friend I would have gone for a new petrol car from Maruti as a first car buyer, Probably base Varian of Baleno or Wagon R 1.2.

He prefers to go for a safer car. Wagon R is out of the consideration. Yes the Baleno can be considered going forward.

EV is completely out of the picture as he is very apprehensive of the same. To be honest, an EV as a primary car, doesn't make much sense to me as well.

[speed79]

Originally Posted by 07CR

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe such rules are never applicable to vehicles that have been already sold. It will only be applicable for the vehicles that would be sold, once such rule has been applied. I have seen this policy for many of the government norms.

These rules are applicable for all diesel cars, whether registered before or after NGT rule came into effect in NCR.

[Ravi Parwan]

Originally Posted by 07CR

...

3) I have never used a CNG vehicle. I agree the prices are now negligibly lower than diesel, but isn't the fuel efficiency drastically more ? I am of the assumption that cng cars deliver much better FE than a Diesel/petrol? For instance the cng Tiago is rated at 26.5~ kmpl, whereas the petrol Tiago is at around 20. My sister has a petrol Tiago and it barely manages 12-13 kmpl in Pune City traffic. My assumption is that the cng vehicles deliver much better FE and should be able to deliver 20-22 kmpl in Pune City ? Please correct me if I am wrong.

....

I think this is a common misunderstanding that many are prone to. Firstly, fuel efficiency for diesel/ petrol is measured in kmpl, while for CNG is measured in Kmpkg(kilometer per kilogram).

This distinction will become clear when you understand the storage capacity of a fuel tank in each case.

For a petrol/diesel car, the tank will have between 30-80 Liters of capacity (proportional to the size of the car), giving the car a range of 500+ Km between fuel stops (without running the tank dry).

For most passenger vehicles, the CNG tank is between 10-15 KG. This gives you a best case range of 250 KM between refueling. However, most of the times, you will not be running the tank to empty, so will be filling at 80-90% capacity. So your achievable range between refueling goes down. And this range goes down drastically further with loading (If you have loaded the car with luggage and passengers, or you are driving with a heavy foot, or you encounter heavy traffic). so if your sister's petrol Tiago is giving 12-13 (against the 20 claimed) in Pune city traffic, don't expect more than 16-17 KMpKG in CNG.

In a nutshell, the benefits you could derive out of a CNG vehicle are largely over now that the gas prices are coming up to similar levels as petrol/ diesel. Today CNG is selling in Pune at around 87 Rs per kg, while petrol is at 105. Considering the above FE, it would cost you around 5 Rs per km in CNG while petrol will cost around 8 Rs per km. so a price differential of 3 Rs per km.

But keep in mind, you will have to drive that car for almost 35K Km to recoup the additional 1 Lac you will spend to buy the CNG car. That equates to three and a half year at 10K KM per year. That is assuming the cost differential remains the same. Add to that the lower boot space, frequent trips to the CNG station and opportunity cost of capital, you will take 5 years just to break even on the purchase price.

Slightly OT here, if you are comfortable with your sister's petrol Tiago, why don't you recommend the Tiago EV to your friend? The additional upfront cost might be more easily offset in this case.

[rishil.ghurki]

I would really recommend the Ignis 1.2 Petrol. I believe the Delta variant is around 7L. My uncle owns the same (Delta AMT) and I think it fits the bill for your friend's requirements.
It's a super refined K12 series 4-cyl engine, reliable and comfortable for 4 adults. It looks fresh (quirky however), and my uncle gets an easy 12-13 kmpl avg. (AMT) in the city.

I personally do not think CNG makes much sense in this use-case. The Ignis manual is surely capable of some greater FE figures.

[Neversaygbye]

Considering that I own a dual fuel (Petrol+LPG) car, I can tell you that dual fuel cars require higher maintenance. Plus as many people have already mentioned, the boot space is severely compromised. Considering the ever closing gap in CNG vs Diesel/Petrol prices, I agree with the BHPians here who are recommending that your friend go for a single fuel type vehicle.

I also agree with those saying the car should be a new one. New cars come with warranty and don't need too much maintenance in the initial years (unless they happen to be a lemon). Your friend's decision of not opting for Maruti is also the right one, since no safe Maruti car exists within his budget (even the Ignis is 3 star rated and the Wagon R which seems to be the popular recommendation has only 2 stars). On a separate note, I am surprised that so many BHPians are recommending unsafe cars. I know that many might say that the GNCAP test happens at 64 kmph which may not hold true in the real world, but there is the repair cost and loss of NCB thing to be considered. Forget about the safety aspect when on highway runs, even in city driving, a Maruti requires more body work to be kept ship-shape simply because it is more prone to picking up dents from even the smallest incidents. If your friend is particular about maintaining the look of his car, he will be spending quite a bit on body work over the life of the car, if it's a Maruti.

Therefore in my book, a new non-CNG Tiago is the best choice for your friend - since your sister already drives one, she can also provide her inputs on this choice.

[UD17]

Originally Posted by Ravi Parwan

so if your sister's petrol Tiago is giving 12-13 (against the 20 claimed) in Pune city traffic, don't expect more than 16-17 KMpKG in CNG.

+1 to this. Moreover The bad are:

- Sacrificing a good drive experience
- Sacrificing Boot Space (reduce practicality)
- Anxiety of crowd in CNG pumps
- Anxiety of not finding CNG pumps during trips to other states/cities
- Anxiety of running the CNG car on petrol for longer trips (& to places where CNG is not available), the guilt that the very purpose of owning a CNG is lost= Frustration

My friend had bought CNG Dezire recently, he daily repent his decision due to disconnected drive experience (no thrills) & due to the fact that CNG had elevated to 93 INR level now from the level of 60 INR when he booked the car. He struggled to keep up with us in Maharashtra hilly roads in his CNG car so this adds fuel to his inner fire.

[TSI47]

My friend recently replaced his ageing Ritz with an Ignis Zeta. He was going for the Delta Amt but the night before the booking I messaged him at 1:30 in the night to go for Zeta which was 45k approximately more than Delta and quite VFM. So there goes that and we got a shining Zeta Amt in 7 days You get quite a lot of features in that money as compared to Swift and Wagonr counterparts and not to forget 3 star safety rating.

[N4Nikunj]

Dear 07CR,

Can I ask why CNG?

Yes, It may be cheaper to run but eventually, It will have 0 boot space. As a first-time car buyer boot space is one of the criteria too.

I will suggest buying a pure petrol car Tiago or Ignis. I will not suggest Hyundai petrol for its poor fuel efficiency record.

The CNG-equipped car will be 1L rupee more expensive than its petrol counterpart. The 10k yearly running translates to 830km monthly running. It will have a negligible difference in monthly running costs. CNG vs. Petrol.

Not suggesting diesel due to the low running of your friend.

[Livnletcarsliv]

In all sense, your friend should not look at a used car if it's his first and only daily car.
Go for a new car. Period.

Well, your requirements are very generic and do not give anything specific.
As you've mentioned ease of maintenance, space for 4, reliability, and cheap to run - almost all the cars in your budget of 7-8 lakhs meet this with very minimal differences.

On the other hand, I definitely don't recommend a CNG car. In fact, I strongly recommend against it due to safety reasons. For your friend, the most reliable option is to go with ONLY a petrol car.

So the options you have (and that I recommend) are Tiago, Punch, Wagon R 1.2, Ignis. You cannot go wrong with any of these. However, I recommend you choose a variant from mid to top, based on your preference. Even if it is a slight stretch on the budget, it is definitely worth it.

[07CR]

Update

Well I agree with most forum members that CNG isn't the route to be taken. I tried convincing my friend of the same. Unfortunately, he isn't budging on the same and believes CNG would still be the cheaper car to run and own and has therefore gone ahead by booking a Tiago XT CNG.

Thank you all for your opinions.

[Sagarjagga]

Get a new petrol Ignis or Tiago in this price range. They are safe, in budget and provide good FE. Ignis will probably have lesser niggles and higher FE.

[NarediAni7518]

Did you ask him to check out the Citroen C3 ? Yes, its reliability is yet to be proven and we don’t know whether the brand will survive in India or not or it’s after-sales will be good or not, but have a look at it too at least once.

[Ton Ami]

Originally Posted by 07CR

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe such rules are never applicable to vehicles that have been already sold. It will only be applicable for the vehicles that would be sold, once such rule has been applied. I have seen this policy for many of the government norms.

If you look at the case in Delhi/NCR. The 2012 diesel vehicles still have 5 years registration period remaining but due to NGT rules, they cannot ply on roads there.
They have two options 1. Obtain NOC and transfer vehicle to some other state or 2. Scrap their vehicles for some peanuts.

Few month back a lot of RCs (with less than 5 years validity remaining) were cancelled in NCR as the owners haven't obtained the NOC for transfer to other states.


Question for the experts:

How is the age of vehicle defined for NGT regulations, is if from the date of manufacturing or date of registration?

I am asking this question as there is lot of ambiguity on this subject especially for ex Army vehicles whose age on Vahan portal is shown from the date of registration but have a significantly older manufacturing date on their RCs.