[CaliAtenza]

I don't know why there isn't a thread about this yet but it's not about politics here, it's about basic human decency. What a heinous crime; 6 adults assaulting and raping a 23 year old woman and then tossing her out like a piece of trash. :(.

[amitoj]

Because it was too shameful an act and everyone will unanimously agree here that this should not have happened.
And eventually it will probably come down to politicians.

[pganapathy]

It shows the very sad state our country is in unfortunately. This is not to say that rape is not an universal phenomenon, but I fail to understand the whole thing. Why did they beat her so badly. Was the idea to kill her so she could not testify. If so, they obviously should have aimed to kill both her and her boyfriend. They only seem to have beaten him up for interfering.

Unfortunately the attitude in our country seems to be one of the woman deserved it or asked for it by dressing wrong or being out late. Additionally the law is so disinterested in the actual law and order side of it (much rather make money) and the legal system so perverted and abysmal (slow pace, low convictions) that people tend to think they can get away with anything.

My heartfelt sympathies to the girl and her boyfriend who were simply in the wrong place at the wrong time. I hope all seven people get a very long jail term and suffer in prison. Taking a person's dignity and peace of mind are the worst things you can do. Monetary items can be covered, albeit with time and effort.

Fortunately or unfortunately this case has received a lot of media attention. This means that the case will not be tried on it's own merits now, but rather on public perception. Hopefully the outrage involved will lead to the perpetrators getting punished severely.

I also hope the politicians do not get involved in this case

[CaliAtenza]

Originally Posted by pganapathy

It shows the very sad state our country is in unfortunately. This is not to say that rape is not an universal phenomenon, but I fail to understand the whole thing. Why did they beat her so badly. Was the idea to kill her so she could not testify. If so, they obviously should have aimed to kill both her and her boyfriend. They only seem to have beaten him up for interfering.

Unfortunately the attitude in our country seems to be one of the woman deserved it or asked for it by dressing wrong or being out late. Additionally the law is so disinterested in the actual law and order side of it (much rather make money) and the legal system so perverted and abysmal (slow pace, low convictions) that people tend to think they can get away with anything.

My heartfelt sympathies to the girl and her boyfriend who were simply in the wrong place at the wrong time. I hope all seven people get a very long jail term and suffer in prison. Taking a person's dignity and peace of mind are the worst things you can do. Monetary items can be covered, albeit with time and effort.

Fortunately or unfortunately this case has received a lot of media attention. This means that the case will not be tried on it's own merits now, but rather on public perception. Hopefully the outrage involved will lead to the perpetrators getting punished severely.

I also hope the politicians do not get involved in this case

It seems like the politicians are involved though. Why did they get on the bus though? I mean from what I read this didn't seem like a regular DTC bus and these guys had already committed some small time crimes as well. It's disgusting and people shoud be in the streets demanding that things change. Honestly i wish India has a "Tahrir Square" moment when people realize that things aren't working. What has happened to basic human decency and rule of law in India?

[CaliAtenza]

Originally Posted by amitoj

Because it was too shameful an act and everyone will unanimously agree here that this should not have happened.
And eventually it will probably come down to politicians.

We Indians need to have this discussion; What has become of our culture? Why has it reached this point that poliiticians are saying that women shouldn't be stepping out of their homes after 8 pm? Do you ever hear somebody in any other civilized democracy say that ?

[netchef]

Originally Posted by CaliAtenza

We Indians need to have this discussion; What has become of our culture? Why has it reached this point that poliiticians are saying that women shouldn't be stepping out of their homes after 8 pm? Do you ever hear somebody in any other civilized democracy say that ?

We need capital punishment, period. Steal someone's property and get your hands cut off. Rape a woman and hang! We have crime galore because there is no fear of retribution...serious retribution. Yes, the law will kick in IF you are well connected or rich or probably both. God help you if you aren't. If and when it does, the case could take years to come to closure and the criminal is very likely to walk away scot free. I'm ashamed to be an Indian!

[pganapathy]

Originally Posted by CaliAtenza

It seems like the politicians are involved though. Why did they get on the bus though? I mean from what I read this didn't seem like a regular DTC bus and these guys had already committed some small time crimes as well. It's disgusting and people shoud be in the streets demanding that things change. Honestly i wish India has a "Tahrir Square" moment when people realize that things aren't working. What has happened to basic human decency and rule of law in India?

Don't we all wish for a tahrir square moment. Unfortunately there are too many vested interests attempting to prevent it and not enough people who seem to be willing to make the effort to change things for the better. Most large groups of people protesting something seem to be doing so as some politician or other has convinced them to do so by promises or payments.

Basic human decency is a highly missing factor in India and seems to be so in the world at large.

I am guessing the people got onto the bus because it was getting late and the regular buses would get rarer the later it got. There are quite a few non regular vehicles (private buses, company transport, cabs etc.) which ply the roads and function as unofficial buses, at least here in Bangalore. Am guessing Delhi is the same and they figured the same thing. Get home ASAP.

Look forward to the culprits all being caught and punished very severely. It is times like this I wish we had certain aspects of Islamic law in force. These people should be publically humiliated and at the very least castrated

[amitoj]

What no one is talking about, and no one will, is the fact that it was so simple to ensure that this crime did not happen. The bus was plying on a route on which it is not authorized to. Had the traffic police been alert and strict enough to ensure that these private luxury buses do not ply on routes they are not authorized to, this bus would not have been able to pick up those unsuspecting two folks. But, and i can bet my last dime on this, the authorities that be are being paid to look the other way.

There is another car forum here in US that i am a member of. It has a thread started by a law enforcement officer, so that people can ask him any questions related to law enforcement specific to traffic etc (he does answer any other queries too) And he said that the reason they would stop cars or vehicles for small offenses like a broken number plate or a non functioning brake light or tints that appear darker than legal limit is that it may lead them to a bigger crime being committed. Its the small things that these guys here pick on, to keep a lid on bigger things.
Of course they are not 100% successful in stopping criminals, but at least they are better than not trying.

[CaliAtenza]

Originally Posted by netchef

We need capital punishment, period. Steal someone's property and get your hands cut off. Rape a woman and hang! We have crime galore because there is no fear of retribution...serious retribution. Yes, the law will kick in IF you are well connected or rich or probably both. God help you if you aren't. If and when it does, the case could take years to come to closure and the criminal is very likely to walk away scot free. I'm ashamed to be an Indian!

I agree with you. Criminals aren't scared and that's why these sorts of henious crimes will continue to happen. Somehow the enforcement of laws needs to be much much stronger. The culture has become such that men are scared of women stepping out of their homes and demanding equal rights and fairness, whether it be socially or in the workplace.

[CaliAtenza]

Originally Posted by pganapathy

Don't we all wish for a tahrir square moment. Unfortunately there are too many vested interests attempting to prevent it and not enough people who seem to be willing to make the effort to change things for the better. Most large groups of people protesting something seem to be doing so as some politician or other has convinced them to do so by promises or payments.

Basic human decency is a highly missing factor in India and seems to be so in the world at large.

I am guessing the people got onto the bus because it was getting late and the regular buses would get rarer the later it got. There are quite a few non regular vehicles (private buses, company transport, cabs etc.) which ply the roads and function as unofficial buses, at least here in Bangalore. Am guessing Delhi is the same and they figured the same thing. Get home ASAP.

Look forward to the culprits all being caught and punished very severely. It is times like this I wish we had certain aspects of Islamic law in force. These people should be publically humiliated and at the very least castrated

People in Egypt were suppressed for a long time and they stood up and overthrew a dictatorship. I am not advocating for an overthrow of government but ordinary, common people need to take to the streets and make their voices heard.

[drmohitg]

The ONLY way to prevent our society from rotting is to bring in laws advocating strict and cruel punishments for such criminals. That is the only way you can instill some fear into these animals. Unless that happens I guess things will just continue the way they are. The Govt. of the day will make some committee and everything will be forgotten in sometime to come only to be discussed again when another women is subjected to this horror in the streets of Delhi.

[amitoj]

Originally Posted by drmohitg

The ONLY way to prevent our society from rotting is to bring in laws advocating strict and cruel punishments for such criminals.

What is the point in bringing in more laws when the existing ones are not being implemented in the first place?

[raghu.t.k]

Originally Posted by amitoj

What is the point in bringing in more laws when the existing ones are not being implemented in the first place?

Perfectly agree. We first need the law to be implemented without fear or favour, and then bring the fear of law. Today the laws seems to beapplicable for the unfortunate who are not connected, everyone else can get away doing anything they want.

How many of us can really go to a police station and file a geniune complaint with out apprehensions, also how many of the cases get solved with the right criminal undergoing the punishment. Also the other mode is to delay the cases in court until it is no longer in the public attention, and dies a natural death. We need reforms both in the Judiciary and the Policing.

[C4CAR]

Punishment for rape in most countries today is imprisonment. Bring back death Penalty. Just a quick Google will reveal that the average sentence for convicted rapists is 11.8 years worldwide.

Unless the punishment is severe this will not change.

JC

[drmohitg]

Originally Posted by amitoj

What is the point in bringing in more laws when the existing ones are not being implemented in the first place?

What you say is true. Infact I agree with your previous posts that there is no one step cure to this problem. Any solution has to take into account the complete falling apart of our system and action should then be started by suspending the policemen on duty for letting the bus ply on an illegal route and in violation of its duty hours.

But until we reach such levels of sophistication a couple of strict and gruesome punishments might act as a deterrent for atleast the comparatively weak-hearted criminals. It is just like using Baygon spray in our homes used for killing mosquitoes. The permanent cure is to improve the environment and make it unfit for mosquito breeding. But until then you just keep shifting to a repellent of higher strength to keep off as many of them as you can. I know the example may not be the best one but I hope you get the drift of my post.

Edit: As a resident of Delhi I sometimes even agree to an extent with those politicians who advocate " self preservation" to women in our society. It may sound democratically flawed but then practically makes sense since the law and administration are sleeping, your safety is in your own hands.