[darklord]

The version in NDTV says the police fired two shots, one in the air and another at the bike's tire. The rider pulled a wheelie and the pillion got shot. Also, NDTV version says quote-a group of over 100 bikers-unquote. This group attacked one police van (I guess 4-5 cops?). I fail to see how the police is at fault. If anything, the rider got his pillion killed.

http://www.ndtv.com/article/cities/s...hi-cops-397921

[Recompose]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

In general in life the principle is to assume innocent until proven guilty.

We've all been witnesses to this at some point, there is no assumption with conclusive proof.

Popping a bunch of wheelies does NOT give any policeman license to kill.

True.

I cannot imagine how shooting at the tyres led to a pillion dying (shooting wide by almost 3-4 ft!)

If the biker performed a wheelie just as the policeman fired, its safe to say the pillion came in the way of the bullet shot at the rear tire.

They are clearly not too fit to carry their weapons!

You forget the police were assaulted by the miscreants before they opened fire on the vehicle.

[HammerHead]

A young man was shot dead and another injured after an altercation took place between a biker gang and the police on Parliament Street in New Delhi.

This is a typical 'breaking news' kind off statement with important details missing allowing people to speculate.

The version in NDTV says the police fired two shots, one in the air and another at the bike's tire. The rider pulled a wheelie and the pillion got shot. Also, NDTV version says quote-a group of over 100 bikers-unquote. This group attacked one police van (I guess 4-5 cops?). I fail to see how the police is at fault. If anything, the rider got his pillion killed.

This looks like what actually happened.

Bullet is not the last resort however depends on situation too!!
Police should have controlled this nuisance using other means and ways.

[shashank.nk]

Originally Posted by darklord

The version in NDTV says the police fired two shots, one in the air and another at the bike's tire. The rider pulled a wheelie and the pillion got shot. Also, NDTV version says quote-a group of over 100 bikers-unquote. This group attacked one police van (I guess 4-5 cops?). I fail to see how the police is at fault. If anything, the rider got his pillion killed.

This makes more sense! I was wondering what made the police think they could fire at a narrow 6 inch patch of tyre on a bike being driven rashly and at a distance. The country's best marksman would've probably missed the shot by a mile.

However , if the rider did pull off a wheelie the pillion was unfortunately in the path of the bullet and had a pay a dear price. May his soul rest in peace. I just hope this serves as a deterrent to numerous such bikers who show off their talent to highway users on NH-4,Mysore Bangalore highway!

Thinking out loud here,but couldn't the cops have used dummy or rubber bullets ?

Originally Posted by phamilyman

I doubt that - when you are wheelieing, you are normally slower than you would be, if you were going flat out - the way one would be if they were trying to escape.

Need not be a lot slower. I've seen people pull off wheelie's at decent speed too,approx 40 km/hr, they drop down a gear or two and rapidly accelerate supposedly. Its called a "Power Wheelie" or something

[phamilyman]

Originally Posted by Recompose

If the biker performed a wheelie just as the policeman fired, its safe to say the pillion came in the way of the bullet shot at the rear tire.You forget the police were assaulted by the miscreants before they opened fire on the vehicle.

I doubt that - when you are wheelieing, you are normally slower than you would be, if you were going flat out - the way one would be if they were trying to escape. If the police were trying to shoot at the tyre of bikers pulling wheelies, then they are being even worse - did they not use their brain before using lethal power? If they were really meaning just to stop them, they should've asked themselves of what would happen if the biker continued to pull his wheelie.

Originally Posted by HammerHead

This is a typical 'breaking news' kind off statement with important details missing allowing people to speculate.

This looks like what actually happened.

Bullet is not the last resort however depends on situation too!!
Police should have controlled this nuisance using other means and ways.

Agree fully with you.

[Recompose]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

I doubt that - when you are wheelieing, you are normally slower than you would be, if you were going flat out - the way one would be if they were trying to escape. If the police were trying to shoot at the tyre of bikers pulling wheelies, then they are being even worse - did they not use their brain before using lethal power? If they were really meaning just to stop them, they should've asked themselves of what would happen if the biker continued to pull his wheelie.

I think its best we lay this conversation to rest since neither of us were at the scene. Why did the drunk biker pull off a wheelie while trying to flee the scene? What speeds were the biker and the police car traveling at? Were they trying to goad the officers? Did the policeman use his weapon before the wheelie was performed or during?

There are a number of unanswered questions. Only reason I brought it up was you had said 'I cant imagine...'.

[noopster]

^^It's one thing to question the police action when people are reported killed in an "encounter" which any sensible person would interpret as as nothing short of cold-blooded execution. That is hardly the case here. Consider the facts:
- The bikers actions were illegal
- They offered resistance when police arrived at the scene
- They continued in their illegal behaviour
- They fled the scene

This is justifiable grounds to open fire even in a litigious society like the US.

Also, the police can't possibly make up all the facts here: it happened in full view of presumably dozens of witnesses. And yes, our media will do its share of allocating blame as well. Please don't be under the misapprehension that they will protect the police in any way.

[bblost]

Originally Posted by phamilyman

I doubt that - when you are wheelieing, you are normally slower than you would be, if you were going flat out - the way one would be if they were trying to escape.

No.

I learnt it the wrong way when learning to ride and that to on a Shogun.
Was doing about 70 and the signal changed.
Dropped 2 gears, popped a wheelie and crossed the signal in style.

Happened in the past century. I was very young and very immature and lucky.

[drmohitg]

Unfortunate that the cops had to fire. I feel that was a little too drastic an action. Because to me it looks very sad that the cops have to use firearms to scare away a group of bikers. They could have very well just called in more PCRs and support, used road blocks and a million other options they have access too. Using real bullets to scare them away was a very bad call, however much nuisance the bikers were creating. If this becomes a norm then I can't imagine where we will be headed as a society.

[Recompose]

Doesnt one gain speed by performing a wheelie/lifting the front tire off the ground when starting from standstill? This is something I've noticed the bikers doing in MotoGP and some of the racing games.

[Sheel]

Originally Posted by bblost

No.

Race bikes have anti-wheelie in built. You lose lots of time (in racing scenario) with one wheel up.

You feel you are going faster, but that is not the case. You are defying gravity & pulling wheelie, providing resistance to the bike. You would be faster with both wheels on the ground.

[GrammarNazi]

Police shouldn't have used those bullets. They should've used small pellets or rubber bullets(?). Something that would sting hard at most.

They KNEW its a biker gang doing STUNTS (& maybe vandalising), and they should've known these fellows would be unpredictable. Before shooting (even in the air), they should've resorted to things like water cannons, lathi charge, tear gas and blocking the roads with barricades. They should've called for extra force to tackle the mob, not just 'Shoot in the air and then on their wheels'.

Shooting in the air is also wrong, its like threatening to shoot at the person in a way that it MIGHT kill that person. Does this kind of mischief at a certain small level call for being threatened to be shot at, such that it can potentially kill you? Who knows if they actually shot at the wheel or not? There's no Proof. They caused a persons death by shooting.

So very many criminals have not been caught because Police didn't shoot at them in a Public place in fear of mistakenly injuring an innocent person or even scaring people (resulting to stampede)!

It shows how untrained our police force is. This being in the Capital is all the more shameful.

I remember a few days back I overheard a few kids (prolly 6th graders) from a school near my home. They were asking what others parents did, some said software, another said medical store, and whatever. One of them said his dad was a Police Inspector & all the kids laughed at him, mocked him, accused his dad of corruption, whatnot! This kid was like he was brought up by wolves, he didn't care for their crap, told them they were wrong and simply walked away.

THIS is how our society honestly thinks of them & unless for some personal gain, THIS is how they're treated. We need a more well paid and trained honest police force, who'll change they way people think of them.

[rohanjf]

I am also of the opinion that the life is not wasted. The death of one person will go a long way in saving the lives of innocent people. I hope all the other bikers present there, never again use public roads for their fun. I also hope that all newspapers and news channels report this with a neutral point of view (that is, not blame the police for the death), so that at least some of the stunt bikers in other cities give up their illegal hobby.

[yogibear007]

Still not able to figure out how a pillion during a wheelie gets shot in the back. Seems too much of a coincidence. There are several wrongs in here. One the kids are doing something illegal but then why directly resort to firearms ? In so many lethal situations, Police seems to wait for orders when action is necessary. Look at the looters hovering through crowd in the name of political gatherings. Never heard Police directly resort to fire arms when the situation seems to be get tricky unless off course the kids are brandishing firearms themselves in this case which does not seem to be the case. Secondly, shooting the wheels of moving bikes to scare the kids ? Did the police watched Fast & Furious earlier night ? Crazy.
Even though the mobs like these kids needs to be controlled and taught lessons, does not really mean that response from law enforcers will be like this. Seems again to be a case of individual personal trait from the police force.

[Mik]

Frankly, I have no sympathy for the injured miscreant and the dead. Lets not call them bikers. Calling them a biker is an insult to those of us who take meticulous care to be safe and wear safety gear.
Being in Delhi, I have seen these kind of guys many times at late night pulling wheelies, blocking traffic and abusing others on the road. Have myself been hounded by a group of these miscreants from punjabi bagh since they didn't take kindly to me overtaking them while they were in formation for a wheelie on ring road !

Kudos to Delhi police!