Team-BHP > Around the Corner > Shifting gears


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 2nd July 2019, 09:33   #31
Senior - BHPian
 
deehunk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1,650
Thanked: 1,648 Times
Default Re: My ex-company (a giant MNC) wants me to pay notice period shortfall, I didn't propose the end da

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
The idea behind 3 month notice period is simple. To create maximum inconvenience to the employee who is leaving. They know that the person is leaving only after securing a job. And how many employers are willing to wait if a newly hired employee says he/she needs 3 months to join? Not many. I have seen that with my former colleagues. They are often told to join within a month, and these companies themselves have the 3 month notice period, strictly enforced.
Maybe a decade ago, employees would just quit without revealing anything during the exit interview. The youngsters of today have the courage to speak up during the exit interview, this is my personal experience. I have also seen Managers getting punished later for their incompetency. The new trend by HR and Management is to put the rebel employees on PDP for 2-3 months and then terminate them stating poor performance or showing dissident behavior. This reflects on their relieving letter too, so many people just move out.
The other reason is to deny the employee "Joining Bonus" at new workplace. Ironically, the amount of joining bonus at new job and the amount payable by an employee to his previous employer will be same. A person thinks that he can get more money by leaving early, some get, and some don't.
deehunk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd July 2019, 09:34   #32
BHPian
 
Jaguar's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 695
Thanked: 289 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ninjatalli View Post
OP,
I'd suggest just get over it and pay up. In the end it's just a sum of money, unless you are tight on funds wrt to your current venture. Give the feedback to the higher ups but don't burn your bridges.
Yes, this is the best thing to do. At least you have time to pay up. When I left my first job from an Indian service giant in 2006, I had negotiated the notice period 1.5 down from 3 months. There was no mention of the notice period buyout during that time. On the final day late afternoon when I was following up for the delay in clearance from the finance team, I was told that I need to pay the remaining notice period amount immediately if I wanted the relieving letter. And the payment was to be made via DD. Luckily the bank within the campus was open and even more importantly I had the money in that account and was able to pay up. That was on a Friday and I was joining the new firm the next Monday. Wonder how that would have panned out if I hadn't managed to get the relieving letter. Since then, I've head that the said organization has made the 3 months notice period non negotiable and even pregnant women on bench being compelled to go to office to sit idle.
Jaguar is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd July 2019, 10:36   #33
Team-BHP Support
 
Samurai's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Banglore-Udupi
Posts: 23,825
Thanked: 20,929 Times
Default Re: My ex-company (a giant MNC) wants me to pay notice period shortfall, I didn't propose the end da

Quote:
Originally Posted by deehunk View Post
Maybe a decade ago, employees would just quit without revealing anything during the exit interview. The youngsters of today have the courage to speak up during the exit interview, this is my personal experience.
As somebody who quit TCS in 1998, I have to disagree. Actually, we were more outspoken in those days. That was because we often knew the HR guys personally.

TCS only had 3300 employees, and Bangalore branch had mere 175 of them when I joined. So we hung out with everyone whether they were from engineering, finance, HR, reception, secretaries or travel department. We went to coffee and lunch together, sometimes even after office hours. So I practically knew everybody from administration. By the late 90s, it changed as TCS grew rapidly. When most of us quit, exit interview was more like talking about the good old times, or ranting with old friends. So we were brutally honest.

TCS did have the 3 month notice thing even then. I served it completely knowing I didn't have the resources to fight them in the court. Many of my colleagues who skipped bonds and notice periods, had to live like fugitives while TCS put up their photos in their local newspapers, etc. Yup, they used to do that.
Samurai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd July 2019, 11:25   #34
BHPian
 
tilt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Canada / B'lore
Posts: 375
Thanked: 758 Times
Default Re: My ex-company (a giant MNC) wants me to pay notice period shortfall, I didn't propose the end da

Quote:
Originally Posted by naveenroy View Post
*SNIP*

HRs are hmm...well you know what I want to say there.
HR - the function and the people - are a waste of atmosphere.

Cheers
tilt is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd July 2019, 12:28   #35
Senior - BHPian
 
kiku007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 1,856
Thanked: 2,230 Times
Default Re: My ex-company (a giant MNC) wants me to pay notice period shortfall, I didn't propose the end da

Quote:
Originally Posted by driverace View Post
TLDR/ I quit my desk job, since I want to pursue adventure sport of paragliding as a living.
Brave decision. I wish you the very best.

Quote:
Originally Posted by driverace View Post
The sequence of events in summary:
1. I resigned (official email date 1st January 2019), requested the soonest possible relieving date from my Manager.
2. My Manager confirmed resignation acceptance & he proposed the last working day as 28th February 2019, on email (HR in copy).
You asked for the soonest possible date and your Manager gave you that and now you call him spineless? Is it fair?

Quote:
Originally Posted by driverace View Post
8. My manager is spineless, but I have brought in level-up manager (American) in the communication chain & I would be meeting the centre head in about 9-10 days. (he is out of India right now)

---
* I guess, should have explicitly asked about this period in my resignation email, perhaps that might have made it much easier.

I have worked for the company for the past 6 years.
(Out of total 11 years of my total work experience)
What is the significance of the word "American"?

Buddy, you say you have 11 years of experience and you worked for the same company for 6 years. You should have known on the notice period payout condition. If you wanted a waiver, then the onus is on you to have asked for it in the first place. There's no element of "guess". It was your responsibility.

IMHO don't burn bridges and settle amicably.
kiku007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd July 2019, 12:41   #36
BANNED
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: bangalore
Posts: 561
Thanked: 648 Times
Infractions: 0/1 (7)
Default Re: My ex-company (a giant MNC) wants me to pay notice period shortfall, I didn't propose the end da

Quote:
Originally Posted by kiku007 View Post
Buddy, you say you have 11 years of experience and you worked for the same company for 6 years. You should have known on the notice period payout condition. If you wanted a waiver, then the onus is on you to have asked for it in the first place. There's no element of "guess". It was your responsibility.
In the MNC that I work for, notice period waiver means you don't have to pay. In the last decade and a few, I have a seen countless employees go. Almost everybody asks for notice period waiver and the managers try their best to accommodate the requests. Only in some cases when a manager wants to get back at the employee, he refuses to entertain a waiver. And when it is waived, that means that nobody pays up anything.

In this case, I think, somebody in the turmoil has an axe to grind with the OP. But I do agree that it is better he settle amicably. They still have his money.
blacksport is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd July 2019, 13:04   #37
Team-BHP Support
 
navin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: mumbai
Posts: 23,912
Thanked: 5,983 Times
Default Re: My ex-company (a giant MNC) wants me to pay notice period shortfall, I didn't propose the end da

Quote:
Originally Posted by tilt View Post
HR - the function and the people - are a waste of atmosphere.
I ain't HR, but if you think so, you obviously have no idea of the importance of HR or the roles is plays in any organization especially ITES companies.

I am not in IT but I believe that the reason companies like Infosys grew to their current size was because of good HR practices (at least pre 2010).
navin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd July 2019, 15:53   #38
BHPian
 
KrisTvpm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Bengaluru
Posts: 86
Thanked: 180 Times
Default Re: My ex-company (a giant MNC) wants me to pay notice period shortfall, I didn't propose the end da

My scenario is not exactly similar to OP's, but have undergone somewhat on those lines.

Background: Back in Dec-2004, I quit my company (a scheduled commercial bank), with a written assurance that I will comply with demands in the employment contract -- 3 months notice + 50K bond-amount (!). I paid up the amount promptly, worked for couple of months assuming I'm on notice-period. By the end of 2nd month my employer (HR) comes back to say that my resignation is rejected! I was a junior programmer (Probationary Officer Scale-1, as per banking terminology) with 4years exp that time, in an IT setup of roughly 50 people - some seniors & some of my own batch.
Long story short, they accepted & relieved some other employees who quit just before & just after my resignation - but refused to acknowledge mine that too after 2months of serving "notice period". Needless to say, I was pi**ed off and tried all possible steps with various layers of executives but net result was naught - they said due to the nature of IT projects that I'm handling I can't be relieved! C'mon, I said I've complied to all that you demanded by way of contract, and you let go of some others who resigned after me, then why not me !? All went to deaf ears and the possibility of joining my new opportunity was looking bleak.

Action taken: After various rounds of discussion with them, I sued my company by taking help from the employees union and filed a PIL in certain high court, pointing out that as an employee I've obliged to the T&C of contract but employer is NOT doing so. Further, employer had withheld ALL of my original certificates with them (plus those of 25 of my batch-mates -- this was their "practice" those days) at the time I entered into employment with them, citing that these shall be returned after me serving 5years with them. Since this is affecting 25 individuals it's not a case pertaining to a single individual, rather a matter of public interest.

Result: Within 1 week of the above -- by 30Mar2005, I was relieved of duties with retrospective effect from 1month back. I had a mind to fight with the company and try to get back my money, as I had to work 2 months + waste 1 month in legal tussle. My gut feeling is that I might've succeeded if I pressed on, but I had to relocate to a different city for my new job so couldn't pursue it with the "villains"!

Now, OP's case being different not suggesting similar steps neither feel this will suit his case. Just narrated my story to tell the community that employers resort to various tactics to protect their interests and save their face too. And I had no intention to go back & work there, so no questions/qualms about burning any bridges ;-)

I'm no legal expert; just my 2cents: As the OP has not demanded for any specific "relieving date" and it was suggested by his manager (assuming, with copy to HR), it's not his obligation to "pay up" the deficit in notice-waiver. HR can't feign ignorance and say we didn't know about it, can they !?
However, if that doesn't go well, can the OP try to negotiate with the employer (+1 manager or HR) to retract the payment demand and stick on for whatever time they're demanding -- if that's an option and provided he's in no hurry to join/assume the other job/role.
KrisTvpm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd July 2019, 18:52   #39
Senior - BHPian
 
naveenroy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1,464
Thanked: 1,004 Times
Default Re: My ex-company (a giant MNC) wants me to pay notice period shortfall, I didn't propose the end da

Quote:
Originally Posted by navin View Post
I ain't HR, but if you think so, you obviously have no idea of the importance of HR or the roles is plays in any organization especially ITES companies.

I am not in IT but I believe that the reason companies like Infosys grew to their current size was because of good HR practices (at least pre 2010).
I totally agree - the HR function is an important part of any organization - as long as they are supportive of employees too or at least pretend to be.

A few years ago, I had major problems with my salary and hikes and escalated to management for months to no avail. I finally went to HR - thinking they would at least hear me out and get something done. I kid you not - the HR person yawned through the discussion. After the discussion was done, my manager took me aside and told me - pretty much word for word what I'd discussed with the HR person.

It is funny now and I can laugh about it but the feeling of helplessness - was just so frustrating.

Well, HR practices in Infy? We used to call it the white-collar jail.

Last edited by naveenroy : 2nd July 2019 at 18:53.
naveenroy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd July 2019, 19:24   #40
Team-BHP Support
 
Samurai's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Banglore-Udupi
Posts: 23,825
Thanked: 20,929 Times
Default Re: My ex-company (a giant MNC) wants me to pay notice period shortfall, I didn't propose the end da

Quote:
Originally Posted by naveenroy View Post
Well, HR practices in Infy? We used to call it the white-collar jail.
Doesn't Infy have some monitoring software on every PC to track everything employees do? Apparently it is based on the theme of George Orwell's 1984 book.
Samurai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd July 2019, 20:16   #41
BHPian
 
DriverR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 375
Thanked: 292 Times
Default Re: My ex-company (a giant MNC) wants me to pay notice period shortfall, I didn't propose the end da

When i quit my job recently, my ex-company had the 90 days notice period as a standard term. I was aware of several people who was asked to pay the shortfall when they left before 90 days. Similarly, i also knew others who left in about a month and a half without paying a penalty. While HR policies are there, the reality is that policy enforcement depends on people. In my organization, if the Reporting Manager and BU Head was fine with an early departure, HR would not collect any payment penalty. When i left, I served 2 months and left without paying anything since I had already discussed the relieving date with my Manager and BU Head who agreed to an early date. (Note: I did not ask for a date. I said while i fine with serving the full 3 months, i would appreciate a earlier relieving date. The early date was given by my Reporting Manager which I agreed to.)

It is sad that your case falls under the first type. As someone has mentioned in an earlier post, I think someone does not like you and is causing you problems using the HR policy. In my experience, as long as the BU Head is fine with it, HR does not go out of its way to enforce this policy. (A caveat here is that the BU Head should be someone with strong pull within the organization. A weaker BU Head does not get much attention from HR.
DriverR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd July 2019, 21:47   #42
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Chetan_Rao's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 2,627
Thanked: 7,305 Times
Default Re: My ex-company (a giant MNC) wants me to pay notice period shortfall, I didn't propose the end da

Common misconception on this thread about a supervisor's role in the relieving process.

One's supervisor may have some influence based on seniority/contacts and how an organisation is structured, but HR are the formal enforcers of the employment contract. Unless one has a waiver in writing from them, original contract T&C apply.

Not always nice to deal with (and plenty of MBA types these days who have no idea what being part of HR means), but a business-critical function nonetheless, akin to umpires/referees in sports that nobody cares about until there's a disagreement.

Last edited by Chetan_Rao : 2nd July 2019 at 21:48.
Chetan_Rao is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd July 2019, 22:24   #43
Distinguished - BHPian
 
neil.jericho's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Cochin
Posts: 1,481
Thanked: 3,786 Times
Default Re: My ex-company (a giant MNC) wants me to pay notice period shortfall, I didn't propose the end da

Quote:
Originally Posted by driverace View Post
This is unnecessary & a drag already. (Process & the post too, I guess!)
Any inputs on how to help close this at the soonest will be appreciated!
Ace, Im sorry to hear of your predicament. As others have suggested, the best options in front of you are to set up time with your business unit head or HR head and talk this out. In person, if possible. Very often, if you encounter a reasonable person higher up the ranks, things can move smoothly and your exit will be turn out to be an easy process. If nothing else works, I suggest you wait out your three month notice period and enjoy your blissful last month of getting paid to do nothing! Trust me, this way in the long run, you will have the last laugh though the last month might seem laborious as you go through it. Take a book to office, use the library, your options are open.

For the benefit of others, please do your research before your quit your corporate job. Talk to people who are in their notice period. Understand every single step involved and ensure you get details of what email to send to whom, learn how to raise the resignation in the HR system or your boss raises it properly (different companies have different policies here, dont miss anything!), keep your HR cc-ed from the time you send your resignation email and so on. The more you know, the more you safeguard yourself. Traditionally in the IT corporate space, Indians are very averse to sharing information about their own resignations though I have been the first to announce the happy news to all and sundry!

On the secondary topic of HR, well their job isnt easy to say the least. I knew several people in HR while I worked in one of India's top IT companies and at junior levels, each of them were tagged to between 900 - 1,100 employees. Then add to that the challenges with each project and account and then BU level dynamics and their job becomes a lot tougher. In some companies, HR is an after thought if the HR function lacks poor leadership and that is really what puts employees on the back foot when issues arise.

The only point where I have an issue with the HR function was when it came to annual hikes and bonuses. Being part of the sales team, we were the revenue generators for our BU and our hikes were usually below 10% with the justification that there just wasnt enough to go around but what we got percentage wise was higher than the rest of the organization. Fair enough. Until I got to know the hikes that HR was awarding themselves every year was far higher than what everyone else used to get. The foxes have the keys to the chicken coop.
neil.jericho is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd July 2019, 23:46   #44
Distinguished - BHPian
 
neil.jericho's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Cochin
Posts: 1,481
Thanked: 3,786 Times
Default Re: My ex-company (a giant MNC) wants me to pay notice period shortfall, I didn't propose the end da

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
Doesn't Infy have some monitoring software on every PC to track everything employees do? Apparently it is based on the theme of George Orwell's 1984 book.
Back in around 2013 when I was working for one of Infy's chief competitors, the top honchos of one of our key customers were travelling to India to meet the delivery teams. I was involved in that visit and was amazed to see the software we were piloting in the account which was showcased to the client. It tracked the usage of the computers of all employees in the account and generated reports to the managers. The customers loved it for obvious reasons and delivery managers were happy to show actual productivity numbers, internally and externally.

But it was concerning to know that every little move of yours on your office computer was being tracked. I heard that the tool had since been rolled out across the organization in all accounts.
neil.jericho is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd July 2019, 09:03   #45
Team-BHP Support
 
Samurai's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Banglore-Udupi
Posts: 23,825
Thanked: 20,929 Times
Default Re: My ex-company (a giant MNC) wants me to pay notice period shortfall, I didn't propose the end da

Quote:
Originally Posted by neil.jericho View Post
But it was concerning to know that every little move of yours on your office computer was being tracked. I heard that the tool had since been rolled out across the organization in all accounts.
So you are saying all employees are spied upon in other top IT services companies too.
Samurai is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Notice Period Buyout RAINMAKER Shifting gears 80 19th July 2012 19:56
IT Dept notice under 143(1) to pay outstanding tax HappyWheels Shifting gears 11 15th June 2010 15:40
Medical ailment during Notice Period after resigning MutantX Shifting gears 20 5th December 2009 16:29


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 10:51.

Copyright 2000 - 2019, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks