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Old 29th August 2019, 14:26   #61
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Default Re: My experience of getting fired!

The number one thing to learn here is, use all your free time to begin monetizing your hobbies or build alternative income streams.

And get out while you are still young and before you grow your family and 'loanership' into unmanageable levels.
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Old 29th August 2019, 14:30   #62
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Default Re: My experience of getting fired!

Great of you to pen your saga. Congrats on your new job and wishing the best.

The partner company that we work with has let go lots of senior people. I have heard they pay 15 months salary for people completing 10 years ! I think most of them did get a job outside and the money was good at cushioning the expenses for couple of months that was needed. I have heard some people mostly on the technical wanting this deal

Except home loans, I dont think having any other periodic outgo sensible. Our auto companies might not like that though.
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Old 29th August 2019, 14:37   #63
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Originally Posted by Eddy View Post
For people who don't have inherited property, a home loan is sometimes unavoidable.
When I got laid off, housing loan was a big tension. I couldn't find a buyer in 2009 and finally bank took over the possession.

I am not saying not to buy a house. I would buy when I am sure I can stay in that house for next 20years. Maybe when I am 50, without taking a loan.

Reasons below:

> With a finacial wisdom hat, renting works out cheaper and moving around is easy when you shift your jobs. Typically the realistic cost of a property is 25yrs worth rent. So, if you are buying a property for more than 75lac where the rent is 25k, you are paying more than realistic price. Rent is not going to change drastically, EMIs do change. It changed from 16k to 23k for me in 2-3years.

> Stay less than 20min from office reducung commute time, back-pain , traffic tension. I used to commmute 3-4hrs everyday from Jayanagar to Whitefield, just because I owned a house. Commuting a long distance leads to unhappiness. Ref: Art Of Thinking Clearly by Rolf Dobelli

> 20k in Mutual Funds might give you more returns than owning an apartment.

> EMI of 25k is just tip of the iceberg, if you study the amortization chart.
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Old 29th August 2019, 15:15   #64
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Default Re: My experience of getting fired!

@Selfdrive - Respect.

Thank you for sharing this very personal and emotional incident with us. Most people in today's economy, including myself, have this sword hanging around our head.

Glad to know you got a new job.

I have been through this once in my life and at that point the fact that I was chosen before others to be let off affected me badly. I was young so easily employable and in fact got a better job after that.
I had similar experience with the HR, that their demeanor changed after the notice, though my friends stood firm by me. In my current job I do not take anything for granted.

All the best for you new job, Thanks again for sharing.

- Slick
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Old 29th August 2019, 15:36   #65
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Originally Posted by Holyghost View Post
Do we know anyone who has stood his ground not to resign and asked the employer to terminate? I would like to understand the consequences. When my time comes, I don't think I would resign and will be requesting the company to terminate my employment. I would happily accept the termination and will move on. At the same time, if the employer play anything unethical with respect to termination, I would not hesitate to go legal.
Yes, I am aware of one instance.

Person A refused to resign. Person A was terminated stating that they showed nepotism and recruited a relative.

Person A went to court and fought for >18 months against wrongful termination and won the case. The company offered a hefty compensation. Person A declined and wanted to be reinstated in their earlier role in the same location. Person A wants to prove their integrity/innocence. Person A is still fighting for their cause. The issue hasn't reached its conclusion yet.

Please note that Person A is very well to do financially and Person A hasn't even taken another job yet.

Would a typical employee be able to play this long legal game? I guess the answer is NO.
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Old 29th August 2019, 15:44   #66
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Originally Posted by kiku007 View Post
Please note that Person A is very well to do financially and Person A hasn't even taken another job yet.

Would a typical employee be able to play this long legal game? I guess the answer is NO.
Exactly, this is the scenario I described in this post.
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Old 29th August 2019, 15:56   #67
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Glad that you got another offer. A thread like this is definitely an Eye-Opener for many.

Salaried employees should have a backup income and have to Keep the commitments low due to uncertainty of IT jobs. We strongly have to look out for a secondary income. Let it be a rental income from property outskirts or FD interest from a bank loan etc. Though the income would be minimum, At least there will be a breathing space.

The market trend nowadays is like "Survival of the fittest"
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Old 29th August 2019, 16:37   #68
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Take adequate medical insurance for your dependent family members. Your corporate medical insurance stops the day you leave your office, even if it is covering your spouse, children, parents and grandparents. The major problem with taking a new insurance on the last day of your employment is that it won't cover many illness for the first year, many pre-existing illness for upto 4years.

So take an additional personal medical insurance right now, and keep paying for it. You can claim tax benefits on that amount as well. This will help you in case of a major medical emergency while you are unemployed and helps you even when you are retired. Too many small prints after you turn 60.

Recession is lurking at us due to global and homegrown issues. A steady flow of energy is what drives the economy, not money! It was coal in 1900s and oil later. High volatility in energy price is not good for any economy.
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Old 29th August 2019, 22:09   #69
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@Selfdrive

Oh, was off this handle; untill I came across this post today after a long hiatus.
That was an enlightening, open and courageous post. Aye understand what you must have gone through, but you stood the test. My story was a bit different. More of volunteering, than enforced.
At the quarter of last year, took a momentous decision of applying for a VRS after a 27 year stint at an MNC. The decision was not easy, but the continuous downsizing of personnel since late 2000's to cut down on costs had a negative impact on the confidence levels within. It was like waiting for the guillotine to strike you every two years a retirement scheme came up. With downsizing came additional responsibilities. Had no problem with that, but the atmosphere was getting so rancid, it took a toll on my health. It's more of stress when you need to handle outsourced personnel, than when you handle your own; as there is little commitment in them. My decision took everyone by surprise, as they never expected me to apply as was not targeted. The decision made, aye just looked forward to another phase. Fortunately, landed up another job before my term ended. Yeah, the company was graceful to give me some time before aye winded up. It was a sad departure, however it was inevitable.

And life goes on

Quote below my thoughts a couple of days later aye had tapped and forwarded to my friends.

"Retirement and the aftermath!!

After a long stint with a fantastic organisation, I took a call to hang my boots with them.

And here I wake up on my first day after retirement without any shoulder pain I had..
I wonder, and realise that I was carrying a lot of lost luggage, thoughts sour, conduct of individuals unsure and the usual rigors of handling a complex station.

Well, I feel a nought within, however need to unravel the knots sowed!!

And as l go on, I rest in peace; for my actions were what my mind reflected on.
Always believed in doing what's right and ethical and forge ahead imparting this knowledge; for you live life once as what you are.

In all these years, have come across situations, dramatical, comical, intentional; and some vengeful.

No regrets, for I behaved and did what I felt was principally right"

Wish you all the best in your future endeavors.
vishyvish
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Old 29th August 2019, 22:43   #70
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Originally Posted by kiku007 View Post

It's shameful to see how companies are getting away with forced resignations when the employee hasn't broken the law/agreement in any way.
It is an option given to the employee and it is a good thing for both sides. If they 'terminate', it reflects in their relieving letter and the prospect of getting another job becomes almost impossible. For the company, it becomes a hassle if someone challenges it in the court (which is rare, but one or 2 such incidents can damage the reputation of the company)
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Old 29th August 2019, 23:38   #71
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Originally Posted by Guna View Post
It is an option given to the employee and it is a good thing for both sides. If they 'terminate', it reflects in their relieving letter and the prospect of getting another job becomes almost impossible. For the company, it becomes a hassle if someone challenges it in the court (which is rare, but one or 2 such incidents can damage the reputation of the company)
High time companies let go of this practice of relieving letter. Employees should have the right to not show up any day, and go work for someone else. Sure, there can be a "no dues certificate" that clears the employee of company property (laptop, what not), but holding an employee hostage for a good termination letter is terrible. Also, the new Employer should stop asking for this meaningless letter.

Terms like "an employment bond, accepting of resignation" remind me of slavery. In the 90s when I quit my employer to move to the US, the HR person said "congratulations on your new job, we have accepted your resignation", I remember thinking, and if you dont accept - who cares?
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Old 30th August 2019, 07:05   #72
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My best wishes to you and your family and much love to your daughter. Hope all her wishes come true!
Thanks @rrsteer
We are all trying to deal with living separately for now. Social media helps but is not really a solution. Looking forward to fix this in the medium term.

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Originally Posted by CarBot View Post
I will take steps on my personal front to make few changes that would help in managing finance better for these situations.
This is most necessary. While I have never been a big spender, I have ended up losing money in what I thought were decent investments such as insurance. I delinked investments from insurance a few years ago, switched to basic term plans for health & medical.
Whatever little I don't put there I am putting away to close off loans. The home loan is a paradox though. I am at a stage in the last few years where I am paying primarily towards the principal outstanding (as seen in the amortisation schedule). Instead of paying that off, I am considering investing in say mutual funds and then keep paying the EMIs.
That will also keep me in check from taking another loan if I happen to forget these lessons learnt.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kiku007 View Post
If they want to send permanent employees away, then first and foremost treat the employees with respect and empathy.
That is one of my biggest grouses. A small severance package would only be a fraction of their expenses, but I am sure some bright spark wants to show off to their bosses how cheaply they managed to downsize. For them it is just a chop off and not a surgery; if I can use that comparison.
The other issue I have is folks benefiting from downsizing efforts. I know of people who have shown x % reduction in costs only to claim benefits such as an upgrade in the company car or unnecessary business class travel.

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Originally Posted by mayankk View Post
However, I have learnt that you are not indispensable at any level. Do your job, but dont be owned by it. At this point, I am prepared at all times, because anything can happen at any time.
Your story is very inspiring. Many of us are stuck in such jobs due to fear of taking that leap. This situation is only exploited further by those who consider themselves to be in a position of power and exert control.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddy View Post
For people who don't have inherited property, a home loan is sometimes unavoidable.
But a lot of people do not realise the benefits of using credit cards vis-a-vis cash -all expenses are documented and reward points can offer good freebies.
I agree with the home loan part as of perhaps 10 years ago. If I were in the property market today, I would not even consider buying a house. It is way more cost effective to rent out a flat. It also keeps unnecesary purchases in check because one has the thought at the back of their mind that they may need to move soon. The level of junk I have hoarded in the past few years is unimaginable. But that is perhaps fodder for another rant elsewhere.

As for the credit cards, as long as one is able to repay without having to pay interest or late charges, it works fine. Though I find the point accumulation highly unused in my case, I do end up using the lounge facilities offered in airports for next to zero costs.

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I understand but you were valued during this one month and it is a good thing.
Unfortunately I was not. A few weeks before I put in my papers, I was excluded from all meetings and my opinion did not matter. This resulted in further attrition in my team. In my last working week, few people came begging for advice. But it was too late to do anything as by then the horses had bolted.

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Originally Posted by speedguy View Post
Maintain strict working hours & give time to your family after the office DAILY. You might think that I give time to family on every weekends, but life is not only about weekends. Small but significant things are happening everyday. Be a part of it.
Thanks for sharing the list. All are completely valid, but this one really hits the sweet spot for me. There was a time when I considered going home was a part of my working life. Now, coming to work is an important but small part of my life. It pays the bills so I would not demean it. But it is not the be all and end all any longer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bullock-Car View Post
Such difficult times helps us to prioritise the life goals. Todays generation are more likely face uncertainties in all fields of life which is stressful.
I am sure this is faced by all people at various stages. Perhaps with the wider reaching consequences, the impact is more visible these days.
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Old 30th August 2019, 07:42   #73
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@Selfdrive, It's indeed courageous to write down the darker side of our - men's - life. It touched our souls.
I may being sounding 'Patriarch' but amongst the multiple things you do, the source from which the basic/higher income comes decides a man's identity. Hobbies and interest do play a significant role for our identity in view of ourselves, but alas in view of our family, relatives and society, it is our job/work that decides who you are!

I have been through such Identity loss phenomenon and it lasted for a good long 20 months. Being in a PSU, finances were not a problem. I thank our Hon. Constitution of India for taking care of my 'subsistence'. But the ordeal was insane and it is still not over. I am the unluckiest of the Govt. sector lot for being among the 0.04% (calculated for my organisation) and suffering. And also I am among the 2% of the above 0.04% who are innocent and still suffering.

Life is totally different in Govt. sector. Here lot has been talked about HR. While working in Govt. offices it seems easier to deal with and have bilateral talks with our nations' notorious neighbour than with HR section for making right, what is wrong done with you. Legal route is the only option left. I guess many of you have come across news of Govt. employees fighting for years together for justice.
Now they call themselves HR'D' where D is non existent!
Self - respect is the thing that gets murdered first hand. A lot of people out there complain of insensitive and wierd behaviour of Govt. officers and employees, but a clean chap bears a 'rhino's skin' within 7 to 10 years of his service due to the behaviour of seniors, juniors, HR section and the anti social elements from the vast public exposure.

I think HR is not the worst in such phases. The relatives who are in an imaginery race towards monetary prosperity with us are the worst and help our ways to depression!

I am thankful that Teambhp came to my rescue in those 20 months. I have become a voracious reader and really enjoyed everything reading the experiences of the community members. Now that recently I have earned my membership, its our community and we stand by each other!

For me, it was a new attire for myself instead of the doll after missing my 'Chair' for 20 months!

P.S. Pardon me for any mistakes above, as I am noob to expressing myself through pen.
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Old 30th August 2019, 10:32   #74
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Hey @Selfdrive,

Reading your ordeals and experiences brought back some memories from not too long ago. Nevertheless, congratulations on your new job and I hope we do not go through another experience like this again.
Quoting Edwin Markham -
For all your days prepare, and meet them all alike.
When you are the anvil bear, when you are the hammer strike.

Cheers,
BR
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Old 30th August 2019, 11:28   #75
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Hey Selfdrive,

Hats off for coming out and sharing your story in such a candid and lucid manner. At times, it is very easy for us to blame the system, the boss, the organization, the family and the social circle for all the ills that befall us, but its only upon us to realize that nowhere is there certainty in this world, be it in a Job or in Business. The best one can do is try and save as much as possible, invest to the best of their ability in good quality assets (if at all there is any such product in today's economic scenario) and focus on Fitness, Health and Family which are the driving forces for a healthy mind.

Congrats on the new job and hope your kid likes the doll you got her.

Regards
Premjit
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