[DigitalOne]

Originally Posted by amitk26

Because that is what FB has invested in. Please check media briefings again FB did not purchase 9.9% of JIO but FB acquired 9.9% of
JIO platforms . All the applications developed by JIO or brought by JIO will be under this umbrella of JIO Platform

Till you pointed this out, I was not aware of the difference between Jio and Jio Platforms. Thanks!

I think this deal will define the decade for India. Reliance local reach (Jio users, and retail) and know-how backed by Facebook's technology prowess and WhatsApp/Instagram user base is a formidable combination. I am guessing the first casuality would be Flipkart.

Mark Zuckerberg acquisitions (WhatsApp, and Insta) have been very successful till now. He seems to have a sharper business sense than his tech rivals (notably Google).

[v1p3r]

Originally Posted by AMG Power

Obviously not enough to even pay the bills as JIO has been consistently loss making. Of course they have a lot of hype about the revenue they may generate in the future. That hype is what VC's trade on and such trading helps to pay the bills of VC's - not that of the company. Remember VC valuation is hype and not revenue in the books.

All investments are made on potential. Otherwise you are not investing, you are a customer. When you buy a functioning hotel chain (as a recent PE player did in India), you are projecting an increase in revenue to profit, even if the player is currently loss making or has never turned a profit. This investment in the future is the ethos that railroads and oil companies in the US were built on, leading to megafortunes like those of Carnegie, Vanderbilt, Rockefeller. Not to say that the robber barons had great ethics, but they certainly had great business sense.

Also, I am not the biggest fan of VCs, but where in this whole Jio business are you seeing any VCs?

If anyone is watching closely, Mukeshbhai has just unleashed a new scheme to guarantee an increase in his shareholding in the mothership, paid for by good ol' Zuck. The man truly seems to hold all the cards.

[amitk26]

Silver Lake to invest in Jio Platforms 750 million $.
They are valuing JIO Platforms at 65 Billion $ , giving 12.5% premium over FB deal.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/silver-...ms-11588560153

[PetrolheadRup]

Vista-Equity Partners acquires a 2.32% stake in Jio Platforms for 11,367 crores. The deal values Jio Platforms at 12.5% premium over Facebook deal.

https://www-moneycontrol-com.cdn.amp...w-5239571.html

[v1p3r]

And it continues. The marquee PE fund General Atlantic has invested as well.

https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/bu...s-5278401.html

[Lobogris]

Originally Posted by amitk26

Because that is what FB has invested in. Please check media briefings again FB did not purchase 9.9% of JIO but FB acquired 9.9% of JIO platforms . All the applications developed by JIO or brought by JIO will be under this umbrella of [b]JIO Platform[/ So henceforth we should discuss this entity instead of JIO the telecom operator. About why FB should pay this much let's say if FB wanted to acquire a Payment company ( say PhonePe) in India roughly they might have to spend a couple of B $, here in JIO platforms they are buying 10% of a company which has a big customer base for payments, music and media streaming, Cloud Service ( JIO Cloud), Digital TV, News etc.

You make it sound like the investments have not been in Jio, the phone company, but only in a different entity known as Jio Platforms. In reality, Jio Platforms is the parent company which owns Jio, the phone company. Hence all these investments are buying a stake in all of Jio including the phone network, streaming services, payment and e-retail.

[amitk26]

https://techcrunch.com/2020/05/17/ge...jio-platforms/

General Atlantic bought 1.34% of JIO for 870 million$

Originally Posted by Lobogris

You make it sound like the investments have not been in Jio, the phone company, but only in a different entity known as Jio Platforms. In reality, Jio Platforms is the parent company which owns Jio, the phone company. Hence all these investments are buying a stake in all of Jio including the phone network, streaming services, payment and e-retail.

It was in response to the question on why I am bringing up other things apart from telco. The deal was with bigger entity and JIO is not comparable to operator only entities in India.

[PetrolheadRup]

Yet another investment in Jio, the fifth in a month. Private equity firm KKR to invest Rs.11,367 crore for a 2.32% stake.
The combined value of the 5 deals is Rs. 78,562 crore.
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com...3.cms?from=mdr

[wheelguy]

So the juggernaut started, just came across this banner advertisement by JioMart. I think Amazon and BigBasket will be keenly watching as JioMart had all the potential to make them fret.

[kiku007]

One heck of a scam story due in the second half of this decade.

The rise and fall of a company with close connections.

[Pancham]

Originally Posted by kiku007

One heck of a scam story due in the second half of this decade.

The rise and fall of a company with close connections.

Care to elaborate a little more on this? What scam are you referring to?

[kiku007]

Originally Posted by Pancham

Care to elaborate a little more on this? What scam are you referring to?

Let's mix a concoction containing the below and you get the potential for a scam,

1. Questionable business ethics.
2. History of stifling competition.
3. Against free-internet.
4. Disregard for privacy and security.
5. Willful disobedience to regulation.
6. The power to influence multiple pillars of democracy.

Many have questioned the unreal valuation. Obviously the investors know something about the 'hidden' potential that the doubters don't know. When someone isn't influential enough to get into an exclusive club then it's a good idea to make friends with the most influential member at the club.

[v1p3r]

Originally Posted by kiku007

Let's mix a concoction containing the below and you get the potential for a scam,

1. Questionable business ethics.
2. History of stifling competition.
3. Against free-internet.
4. Disregard for privacy and security.
5. Willful disobedience to regulation.
6. The power to influence multiple pillars of democracy.

Many have questioned the unreal valuation. Obviously the investors know something about the 'hidden' potential that the doubters don't know. When someone isn't influential enough to get into an exclusive club then it's a good idea to make friends with the most influential member at the club.

Let's break this down
1. Questionable business ethics. - Nearly every large business house, whether in India or across the world. Degrees vary, and memories fade with age, but it's always there. 'Behind every great fortune there is a crime'.
2. History of stifling competition. - Same as above. Will do as much as possible, as allowed by law.
3. Against free-internet. - Same as 2.
4. Disregard for privacy and security. - Same as above.
5. Willful disobedience to regulation. - Same as above + the ability to change the goalposts of regulation in order to get ahead. Again, not illegal.
6. The power to influence multiple pillars of democracy. - Again, nearly every large business. Google, FB, Tesla, Amazon, MSFT all do it. Oil companies engineered regime changes.

I am not saying any of this is right. I am not a supporter of any of these business practices or morals either. What I'm saying is that you can't classify the above as a scam. A scam involves cheating people, normally unsuspecting lay persons, by promising unrealistic returns while intending to keep the money illegally. RIL has shown an excellent track record of creating investor wealth for over 40 years, and thus cannot be classified as a scam. Further, the new investors are extremely sophisticated and cannot claim to be innocent victims if the venture fails. Yes, there are actually clauses and definitions for accredited investors.

Originally Posted by kiku007

Many have questioned the unreal valuation. Obviously the investors know something about the 'hidden' potential that the doubters don't know. When someone isn't influential enough to get into an exclusive club then it's a good idea to make friends with the, most influential member at the club.

The valuation is pretty obvious. RIL/Jio has the potential to be the next Alibaba or Tencent. The opportunity to build or invest in a dominant platform that straddles entertainment, e-commerce, broadband, mobile, content, payments, and god knows what else, serving over a billion people, is a once-in-a-century opportunity. Jio will likely list on NASDAQ inside 24 months, and give handsome returns. For comparison, Tencent and Alibaba are valued at north of USD 500 bn each, and Jio is currently at USD 66 bn. Even a 100 bn IPO in 24 months gives you a return of nearly 25% each year.

[kiku007]

@V1p3r Thanks for your reply and I appreciate it.

However, let me humbly disagree and just say that it is my view and I have trouble trusting this investment frenzy.

[v1p3r]

Originally Posted by kiku007

@V1p3r Thanks for your reply and I appreciate it.

However, let me humbly disagree and just say that it is my view and I have trouble trusting this investment frenzy.

Fair enough, buddy. For every Google and Facebook, there is a Theranos and WeWork. Let's see how the next 36 months shape up.