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Old 4th June 2020, 15:36   #16
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Default Re: Vijay Mallya: Will he be extradited to India?

On Vijay Mallya's Extradition, UK Government's Statement Hints At Hurdle


https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/on-v...home-topscroll

He's probably applied for asylum. Can you imagine that?.
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Old 4th June 2020, 21:01   #17
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Default Re: Vijay Mallya: Will he be extradited to India?

As someone who has the 'distinction' of being on the list of business creditors of this worthy allow me to chime in. I'll stay with stuff that is in the public domain.

Clearly some members either out of ignorance or curiosity are not wired in to this person's activities and consistent willful fraud which by the way is different in the eyes of the law from being a defaulter on a bank loan in the normal course of business. The loans, or most of them are backed by his properties, shares in UB and in some cases personal guarantees. While he was in India and in the initial three years after galloping off he did not indicate any desire or intention to pay while sticking his tongue out to his employees by spending lavishly on F1, cars, properties etc. So we really really need to take this change of heart of waving cheques with a strong dose of skepticism. He started his cheque waving only when he started losing in the UK Courts. Other than willful default, he is also guilty of not paying his employees, deducting tax at source from salaries and not depositing it with the Govt, deducting provident fund and not depositing it......these are for starters. The last mentioned is a non-bailable offense but he clearly was protected by powers that be from 2011 to 2016. All attempts to recover dues back in 2011 to 2015 time frame were met with the deepest scorn and the strongest legal attack from his side. His conduct then indicated he never believed he would be caught. He genuinely believed, for reasons I won't dwell on, he was above the law.

A few dozen of his employees came to work for me most facing dire financial conditions.

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Originally Posted by alpha1 View Post
My question: ok, so he is extradited, found guilty of financial fraud. What would be his punishment? Repay the loans that have been defaulted? What if he proves that he is bankrupt and has no capacity?
He should do jail time, his properties sold and the proceeds paid to his creditors especially his employees.
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Also weren't all his companies with limited liabilities?
??? You may want to read up better on this case.
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Originally Posted by ABHI_1512 View Post
You will be surprised to know that Mallya has been repeatedly tweeting from London to repay the loans he owed in full. No body has responded to him, in public at least !!
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Originally Posted by Shreyans_Jain View Post
Mallya has made many appeals offering to pay back in full. These got zero traction, at least in mainstream Indian media.
I do not know whether you are naive or not wired in to this case. If he is so sincere I suggest he first show intention by paying off his employees. I can assure you he will do nothing of the kind. When you owe any sum of money and you are seeking an out of court settlement your lawyers send some fairly detailed legal letters of offer to the plaintiff (ie the creditors in this case). Last I knew tweets and social media photos had not yet become accepted methods of communicating formal legal intention. Though clearly as some posts here show they do serve a purpose to win sympathy for criminal behaviour.
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Regardless, it was the fault of the banks who actually lent huge sums against insufficient and flimsy collateral. How many bankers have prosecuted?
The banks gave normal straight loans. I don't think till 2009 it was clear he was in trouble. The collateral was not and is still not flimsy or insufficient. It is just that our wheels of justice grind so slowly.

For the frauds he perpetrated, at times through complex web of structures and transactions, he should first do a lot of time at Arthur Road Jail. His CEO and CFO at KF are at fault too for some of these frauds.
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Old 4th June 2020, 23:22   #18
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Default Re: Vijay Mallya: Will he be extradited to India?

I am not too familiar with his sordid or otherwise details, only know what I've read in bits and pieces....but this much seems to be clear - like how all good things must end; would most likely be the "end of good times" for at least this "king!"
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Old 5th June 2020, 02:11   #19
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Default Re: Vijay Mallya: Will he be extradited to India?

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Originally Posted by V.Narayan View Post
A few dozen of his employees came to work for me most facing dire financial conditions.
There is a word for making someone without compensation. That word is slavery. For this crime alone, the good Dr.(?) Mallya should be prosecuted to the maximum extent possible under law.


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Originally Posted by alpha1 View Post
Oh but you underestimate the power of politics in our country
No one first used and then underestimated the power of politics better than Dr.(?) Mallya. He was instrumental in driving a then-profitable AI to the ground, along with his friends in power. Unfortunately for him, the winds changed and he was caught unawares. It is possible that his ego blinded him to the political reality. Yes, he is being made an example of and being used as a political football, but that is not to say it is undeserved.

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Originally Posted by NPV View Post
I've heard from some folks that this man's ego is too big
He made the cardinal mistake of crossing someone whose ego is far, far bigger.
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Old 5th June 2020, 08:55   #20
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Default Re: Vijay Mallya: Will he be extradited to India?

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Originally Posted by V.Narayan View Post
As someone who has the 'distinction' of being on the list of business creditors of this worthy allow me to chime in. I'll stay with stuff that is in the public domain.
Clearly some members either out of ignorance or curiosity are not wired in to this person's activities and consistent willful fraud which by the way is different in the eyes of the law from being a defaulter on a bank loan in the normal course of business.
Well said! He simply thought that he'll have people in power write off his loans.


Quote:
Other than willful default, he is also guilty of not paying his employees, deducting tax at source from salaries and not depositing it with the Govt, deducting provident fund and not depositing it......these are for starters. The last mentioned is a non-bailable offense but he clearly was protected by powers that be from 2011 to 2016.

A few dozen of his employees came to work for me most facing dire financial conditions.
This IMO is really a reflection of his personaity. He could fly a private jet. Throw the most lavish parties, had the cash to fund this, etc. But his intent was really petty until the long arms of the law reached his throat. I am with you on the assessment which clearly shows that he has no intent to pay. If he can pay the banks 12000 crores via twitter, he can surely pay 300-500 odd crores to his employees via a wire transfer.


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The banks gave normal straight loans. I don't think till 2009 it was clear he was in trouble. The collateral was not and is still not flimsy or insufficient. It is just that our wheels of justice grind so slowly.
One other thing that the likes of Mallya, Modi, Choksi and Wadhwans ended up doing was drying up the credit line from PSUs for deserving businesses. Banks are very very wary of opening up their purses for businesses in genuine need of loans. Most are now stonewalled due to the greedy nature of some who borrowed and literally ran away piling up NPAs for many.


I see few people putting up a comparison between AI / Jet Airways with Kingfisher.

Some points:

AI Loans were govt driven. The people in power borrowed 70k crores to revamp a fleet while they kept dishing out profitable routes to private entities and also some international airlines. I haven't verified this but some also told me that international airlines were permitted to fly in from middle east to India and pickup passengers towards other destinations. This is not industry norm and most countries protect their airlines by not letting foreign carriers pickup and drop passengers to any country other than the source of the airline's home base.

Air India is a story of systematically planned destruction by those in power. There are enough articles that fix accountability for this. Highly recommend this book to understand this better.

Jet Airways more or less has the same amount of debt as Kingfisher. 8000 odd crores. They pulled the plug but did not steal from their employees by short changing their PF or tax money. The promoter did try to scoot off but was caught in time. Now hoping for a buyout.

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Originally Posted by v1p3r View Post
He made the cardinal mistake of crossing someone whose ego is far, far bigger.
Who is that?
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Old 5th June 2020, 09:10   #21
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Default Re: Vijay Mallya: Will he be extradited to India?

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Originally Posted by v1p3r View Post
He made the cardinal mistake of crossing someone whose ego is far, far bigger.
Since you haven't named that person I will not make any assumptions, but even if true I'd be happy that the 'king of good times' finally met his match, very deservedly too This man has been a big player for far too long and had taken things for granted.
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Old 5th June 2020, 10:17   #22
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Default Re: Vijay Mallya: Will he be extradited to India?

Apparently he has applied for Asylum status, and UK wont be extraditing him anytime soon. They have a long-drawn process. and he has submitted documents for evaluation. Maybe they will never send him back. Don't pop the champagne yet
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Old 5th June 2020, 12:54   #23
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Default Re: Vijay Mallya: Will he be extradited to India?

Confidential issue holds up Mallya extradition.

Link

In all probability it's his asylum application..
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Old 7th June 2020, 23:03   #24
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Default Re: Vijay Mallya: Will he be extradited to India?

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Originally Posted by moralfibre View Post
Jet Airways more or less has the same amount of debt as Kingfisher. 8000 odd crores. They pulled the plug but did not steal from their employees by short changing their PF or tax money. The promoter did try to scoot off but was caught in time. Now hoping for a buyout.
Sir, staff hasn't received salaries and EPF. Please reconfirm.
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Old 7th June 2020, 23:11   #25
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Default Re: Vijay Mallya: Will he be extradited to India?

The supposed king of good times, huh? For the life of me, I couldn't figure out why someone spending crores on lavish parties, would claim reimbursements as small as Rs. 6000 as a Rajya Sabha MP?

Source: https://www.financialexpress.com/pho...ll-as-rs-6000/

Sounds shameful and below dignity for someone trying to maintain a larger than life image, what say?
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Old 8th June 2020, 00:00   #26
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Default Re: Vijay Mallya: Will he be extradited to India?

No company in this world fails in a day. It shows signs of failure in many ways such as failure to pay loan installments, not paying salaries to its employees etc. Bankers sometimes out of fear don't declare it as NPAs or raise alarms and try to cover up the things knowingly out of pressure/collusion. Public Sector banks give loans many times out of pressure from government.

How can a business man flee out of country without support from authorities? Answers are simple, we all know.
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Old 8th June 2020, 06:56   #27
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Default Re: Vijay Mallya: Will he be extradited to India?

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How can a business man flee out of country without support from authorities? Answers are simple, we all know.
+1. Aviation circles are quite clear about who in power helped him flee in the nick of time.

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Originally Posted by moralfibre View Post
Well said! He simply thought that he'll have people in power write off his loans.
Yes. His CFO said so as much in one of our meetings in the early days before his company blew up.

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One other thing that the likes of Mallya, Modi, Choksi and Wadhwans ended up doing was drying up the credit line from PSUs for deserving businesses. Banks are very very wary of opening up their purses for businesses in genuine need of loans. Most are now stonewalled due to the greedy nature of some who borrowed and literally ran away piling up NPAs for many.
+1 to that. These 4 were the high profile versions of modern day bank robbers. There were several lower profile variants too {in car language} with smaller engines. Together they put the fear of God, CBI, CAG and CVC into all PSU Bankers which has created today's bank loan freeze for deserving companies too.
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Old 8th June 2020, 13:50   #28
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Default Re: Vijay Mallya: Will he be extradited to India?

Well, Mallya's return to India is of extreme political importance for the current ruling party.

Once back in India the agencies would start digging out names from him of people who helped him get these loans, who attended his lavish parties and who ultimately helped him run away from India with 300 bags of luggage.

If you read the ruling of Judge Emma Arbuthnot, Chief Magistrate at Westminster Magistrates' Court in London then it clearly states the following:

a) She was extremely critical of Indian bank and expressed her shock at the failure to obtain proper credit reports before certain loans were sanctioned by some of the state-owned Indian banks.

b) There was a failure to ensure that the guarantees were formally taken when they should have been and a failure to investigate the representations that KFA [Kingfisher Airlines] made at various stages to obtain the loans,”

c) If the criteria for lending to KFA had been applied, if the background checks had been carried out, the loans should not have been granted.

I also had read somewhere else which was not highlighted in the Indian media that Judge has observed in her ruling that there are emails and letters signed by the then PM and FM asking banks to lend the loan amount requested by Mallya, and in such a scenario which bank official could go against it and deny the loan?

It seems these letters have been submitted as proof by the Indian agencies to the UK government. Not sure how true this is though.

Last edited by ajmat : 8th June 2020 at 19:39. Reason: typo
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Old 9th June 2020, 22:43   #29
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Default Re: Vijay Mallya: Will he be extradited to India?

https://www.cnbctv18.com/politics/vi...ed-6102601.htm

Well, the crook is playing his last card! He never had any intention to pay back the loans. Any sympathy for him is misplaced.

This may well turn out into a diplomatic row between India & the UK.
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Old 10th June 2020, 09:47   #30
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Default Re: Vijay Mallya: Will he be extradited to India?

If he did not get into aviation, he still would be king of good times. That was a reckless move. My uncle worked for UB MEC batteries, and those were the finest batteries around (the UPS battery in my his house lasted 11+ years). He sold it. Kissan was the best in its segment (now, a market leader), he could have just had a vision for the brand. Like this, he sold off promising businesses with huge potential. Besides the financial miscalculations there were more sordid things happening behind closed doors, leaving so many young lives scarred. This is one guy who must be persecuted to the fullest extent of law and made an example out of.

Last edited by Sebring : 10th June 2020 at 09:48.
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