[joslicx]

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

And why are you looking at population as just a liability, a young population at that? You dont think if there was positive propaganda all over the news, focus on education, scientific temperament and data based decision making, liability and accountability that things would have been better or atleast different? I have seen and felt what administration in Delhi has been able to do in various they have full control off even with curtailed power and now a bill which has been passed in the parliament curtailing powers of an elected government and giving it away to the LG? You think that was for the benefit of people? There is no excuse for poor governance after that level of mandate. Government is NOT a victim, people are. You think the wasteful spending of billion upon billions of dollars on jumbo jets and vanity projects is for the good of people?

Where did I say people are a liability?

130cr population is a fact. We cannot run away from that. The resources needed to solve problems of 130cr are considerably more than those needed for 1cr. That should be a given. That was the whole point. Israel can source 1cr vaccines easily. India cannot source 130cr vaccines in the same time frame. Nobody has got that many vaccines lying around.

And I do not wish to get into politics. I have moved on. We are on our own. I am taking the best precautions I can. I hope to survive this pandemic. That is all. Do not have problems with anybody spending money on fighter planes or jumbo jets or keeping it for themselves.

[Emvi]

Originally Posted by V.Narayan

Speaking on the Govt's behalf fact is that in several rural and semi-urban areas citizens are not coming forward to get themselves vaccinated even at govt hospitals where it is free. Last week we went to some of the villages around the town outside where one of the hospitals I am associated with sits. The sarpanch told us in chaste Haryanvi that Corona is a illness of the rich city dwellers. It isn't there in his village so why are we bothering him! In the cities the desire to get vaccinated is there but not so every where.

True. Hailing from a rural part of India, I definitely get your point. Last week the local Panchayat had organised mass vaccination drive and they had even arranged free transport to the hospital. And guess what, not everyone's interested. Quite a few people are not worried about covid and in some cases people are unwilling to get vaccinated because of the propaganda relating to claimed side effects associated with vaccination. Last month, apparently large no of vaccine vials had gone waste because of people's unwillingness to get vaccinated. Make no mistake, a large portion of such people are educated/informed. Shocking!

Last week I had a phone conversation with my brother who resides in Dublin. He was pleasantly surprised to know that people in my place have access to vaccination. He says vaccination still is a distant dream in his country! This is an European country not even half the size of Karnataka and about 1/3rd the population of Bangalore, period.

[extreme_torque]

Originally Posted by joslicx

Where did I say people are a liability?

So was that an excuse? Even worse if you ask me.

Originally Posted by joslicx

130cr population is a fact. We cannot run away from that. The resources needed to solve problems of 130cr are considerably more than those needed for 1cr. That should be a given. That was the whole point. Israel can source 1cr vaccines easily. India cannot source 130cr vaccines in the same time frame. Nobody has got that many vaccines lying around.

We have some of the biggest vaccine manufacturers in our country. And no we dont need 130 crore vaccines on day 1 to stop the spread. Just like stopping bushfires doesnt mean having water enough to cover the whole areas under the bush.

Originally Posted by joslicx

And I do not wish to get into politics. I have moved on. We are on our own. I am taking the best precautions I can. I hope to survive this pandemic. That is all. Do not have problems with anybody spending money on fighter planes or jumbo jets or keeping it for themselves.

You got into politics. This is just entitlement. Peace out.

[C300]

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

We have some of the biggest vaccine manufacturers in our country. And no we dont need 130 crore vaccines on day 1 to stop the spread. Just like stopping bushfires doesnt mean having water enough to cover the whole areas under the bush.

I dont think its that simple. Depends on the entire supply chain and where its manufactured. Australia, which is the size of Mumbai is struggling to put together a coherent vaccination policy. Our challenges are multifold compared to that. This has been a massive learning curve for all.

The Job scenario is also sector specific and cant be generalized. For the IT services, this has come as blessing in disguise. The Agile based colocation model has collapsed during the pandemic and there is renewed push for offshoring. Indian IT companies will benefit immensely in coming years. We are already seeing utilisation going through the roof and people quitting with multiple offers in hand.

[extreme_torque]

Originally Posted by C300

I dont think its that simple. Depends on the entire supply chain and where its manufactured. Australia, which is the size of Mumbai is struggling to put together a coherent vaccination policy. Our challenges are multifold compared to that. This has been a massive learning curve for all.

I did not say it was simple. Its also true that we no shortage of relatively cheap human resources and some extremely clever academicians and professionals in India and also abroad but what can you do if banging utensils and resulting noise can kill the virus and your institutions are toothless so much so that you can go against all regulations and gloat about people attendance in your election rally and not one institution raises an objection.

Australia’s management of COVID on the other hand has been one of the best in the world. We have had a total of 29k odd cases ever since the pandemic started and of all the new COVID cases, more than 1/3rd of them are from flights coming from India. For the same reason they have just banned travel from and to, India from Australia just like NZ. The real numbers in India are atleast ten times more than the official government figures. The problem isnt vaccination policy per se but the efficacy and choosing one. We arent in dire hurry either. Time is a luxury we can afford because we did hard yards earlier and the government planned extremely well. Victoria for example hasnt seen a single Covid case for more than 2 months now. The job market is looking particularly good as well now that sectors have started opening up - local tourism, flights along with well directed government incentives for small businesses.

Originally Posted by C300

The Job scenario is also sector specific and cant be generalized. For the IT services, this has come as blessing in disguise. The Agile based colocation model has collapsed during the pandemic and there is renewed push for offshoring. Indian IT companies will benefit immensely in coming years. We are already seeing utilisation going through the roof and people quitting with multiple offers in hand.

I am not sure if its entirely true. If a resource can work from anywhere in the world, there is less incentive to outsource to just India. The company i work for example is now hiring people in regional Australia and instead of firing people, insourcing a lot of outsourced work. They also are not very keen to outsource to India because their experience hasnt been good with respect to attrition and frequent job switching by the devs or the job ethic. They have been impressed by Vietnam and to some extent Phillipines and are looking towards outsourcing work to those countries.

[C300]

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

We arent in dire hurry either.

Try telling that to a 80 year old in one of the aged care facility in Hawthorn.
Lets not trivialize the challenges faced by the governments across the globe and especially in India. I am sure the entire state and central govt machinery is working round the clock to ease the pain.

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

I am not sure if its entirely true. If a resource can work from anywhere in the world, there is less incentive to outsource to just India. The company i work for example is now hiring people in regional Australia and instead of firing people, insourcing a lot of outsourced work. They also are not very keen to outsource to India because their experience hasnt been good with respect to attrition and frequent job switching by the devs or the job ethic. They have been impressed by Vietnam and to some extent Phillipines and are looking towards outsourcing work to those countries.

Having spent two decades in Aus IT industry I see it differently. Vietnam and Phillipinos were always there. They may be present in smaller pockets but can hardly compete in big RFPs.
As for regional Aus, its been a pipe dream sold by phony politicians for 20 yrs now. Good to see that jobs are finally outsourced there. I am an Aussie at heart

[extreme_torque]

Originally Posted by C300

Try telling that to a 80 year old in one of the aged care facility in Hawthorn.

Is that a rhetorical question? Like do you expect anyone to say No.

Originally Posted by C300

Lets not trivialize the challenges faced by the governments across the globe and especially in India. I am sure the entire state and central govt machinery is working round the clock to ease the pain.

Lets trivialise the suffering of the general public instead. Let's also just deflect the whole discussion to generic statements like "lets not trivialise challenges faced by the governments across the globe"? Like who even said there were no challenges? What other world governments are spending money on their vanity when there is massive unemployment and a messed up pandemic response? On the contrary, the government of the day has trivialised the life of a common man, which mind you has absolutely no safety net as far social welfare is concerned unlike the generous welfare that we are used to here in Australia. Consider yourself really lucky that you are not in India at the moment.

What makes you so sure that the "entire state and central govt machinery is working round the clock to ease the pain"? By fudging both the infection and death numbers for perception and image management? Or by not having the foresight to plan looking at second wave infection rates in other countries? Or by allowing a massive religious gathering to go ahead inspite of extreme risks? Or by organising massive election rallies and then gloating about the numbers? In how many countries can you simply get away by "ordering a probe" after 24 patients die in one single hospital in one day due to lack of oxygen? Oh but there is an 80 year old in an aged care facility in Hawthorn. Well played.

Originally Posted by C300

Having spent two decades in Aus IT industry I see it differently. Vietnam and Phillipinos were always there. They may be present in smaller pockets but can hardly compete in big RFPs.
As for regional Aus, its been a pipe dream sold by phony politicians for 20 yrs now. Good to see that jobs are finally outsourced there. I am an Aussie at heart

And what do you know, most of the work Indian companies do is T&M.

[C300]

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

Lets trivialise the suffering of the general public instead.

Relax. No one is trivializing the suffering of the general public here. People see things a lot differently than you might think. The truth is somewhere in the middle. Good night.

[Zen2001]

The private healthcare sector is India’s fourth largest employer, with 72 per cent of the total hospitals under it, and having 60 per cent of the total hospital beds in the country. Despite its role, the government has not understood what the private sector needs in terms of vision, investment or incentives.
Many private hospitals are on the verge of closure due to a lack of support from the government and the loss of their non covid patients due to the inpatient bed availability crisis.The government is party to the profits made by hospitals, but the private sector has been abandoned in its time of need.
During the ongoing pandemic, the private sector has stepped in in a huge way, with medical and paramedical workers risking their lives for the people of the nation. The government has not provided any support to private hospitals and doctors in coping with the pandemic, but not held back in asking (and even forcing) for help in fighting Covid.
Specialty hospitals need to be more cautious as they are already dealing with patients with various comorbidities and taking in even one Covid patient would risk the lives of numerous others. Also, over the past year with hospitals seeing reduced footfall of non Covid patients, pay cuts (in some to the tune of 75%) have become the norm rather than exception.
Unfortunately, this time, it’s the hospitals and healthcare workers in the private sector that need care. Ironic, isn't it?

[AZT]

Originally Posted by Emvi

Quite a few people are not worried about covid and in some cases people are unwilling to get vaccinated because of the propaganda relating to claimed side effects associated with vaccination.

Sadly, there are such people in urban India as well. There was this stupid Bill Gates conspiracy theory which was widely shared. Posting an article debunking it below in case it helps sharing with anyone.

Fact Check-Bill Gates quote about vaccines and population growth has been taken out of context again

https://www.reuters.com/article/fact...-idUSL1N2MF1L8

Off topic but I have a 70 year old relative who is refusing to take the vaccine for some reason. He is very active on Whatsapp though so we all know where his hesitancy comes from

[Thad E Ginathom]

Originally Posted by C300

Lets not trivialize the challenges faced by the governments across the globe and especially in India. I am sure the entire state and central govt machinery is working round the clock to ease the pain.

The political world, here, of late was recently obsessed with elections rather than health.

[locusjag]

I wanted to point out that COVID is perhaps going to irreversibly alter middle class fortunes because it's probably going to change the real estate scene forever. Can you imagine what happens next if people decide to work from towns and villages permanently and if their employers support them? Real estate markets in cities will crash. India's middle class is heavily invested in the urban real estate scene; what happens when their land loans and home loans turn upside down if their plots/homes/flats get valued at less than their outstanding loans on them?

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

The political world, here, of late was recently obsessed with elections rather than health.

Ah, politics in the time of COVID. A prominent politician who stood to gain nothing from campaigning withdrew from the campaign process ostensibly due to COVID risks. Everyone in elite circles went gaga over his withdrawal...as if his campaigning would have even mattered!

And in stand-up comedy, there's one golden rule. It's okay to punch up; you can make fun of powerful people and it's okay. It's never okay to punch down, to make fun of people that have less than you do.

So it goes with political correctness as well; you cannot point a finger at the "farmers" who are protesting in huge crowds. They're still spreading the virus just as badly, along with blocking essential O2 supplies and stuff. But mum's the word, for you cannot criticize them.

[Dry Ice]

Saving for a rainy day is all fine, and most of us have been brought up on the same philosophy.

What happens when you need oxygen and don't get it? How do you prepare for that and save/help your family/friends?

I am just numb reading all the cries for help, hospitals issuing SOS statements on social media. It almost feels like deja vu. Last year saw something similar. The characters may have changed but the suffering continues!

[Gaur]

As the old saying goes " is hamam mein sab nange hain"

Common man was caught with its pants down and well the politicians were always naked, they all have some blood on their hand, based on which side you are it can be argued who has more who has less.

Definitely we could have prepared better but frankly speaking many of us had not expected this kind of peak, heck even few of my doctor friends are surprised and overwhelmed with the amount of cases.

The common public is also to be blamed for the current situation, what i understand from family members in north is that Holi celebrations, Shopping for upcoming wedding season and general lack of seriousness is the main contributor to this massive spike.

ICould see this here as well in Mumbai people simply throwing away caution to the wind.
I stay just 1km away from the beach which was our daily walk in earlier days but i avoided visiting it for 1 full year due to caution, but not others, untill 1st week april every sunday was nightmare with people madly thronging the beach with scant regard for COVID appropriate behavior.


B.T.W another thing we need to remember, the Govt. was also boxed in with a serious border clash up north with a powerful nuclear neighbor and not to forget the even now continuing Farmers protest.
Both cases taking up considerable bandwidth of the govt.

Again, no excuses for their incompetence...

[VKumar]

Sharing a heartwarming incident from Haryana. Although stealing is simply a crime and what the thief did is any way unacceptable, but this act from Haryana actually shows the kind of impact this crisis has had on all the strata of the society. Normally we hardly expect a thief to return the stuff at least, especially when it's worth a few lacs and has demand in the market too.

Thief Returns COVID-19 Vaccines With a Sorry Note

The handwritten note reads "Sorry, I didn't knew it's Corona Vaccine"!

A thief who had fled with a bag containing over 1,700 doses of COVID-19 vaccine today in Haryana's Jind later had a change of heart. The unknown accused returned the haul and also left a note saying he didn't know about the contents of the bag while whisking it away.
"Sorry, I didn't know it was medicines for corona," the thief wrote in Hindi in the note attached to the returned bag full of Covishield and Covaxin doses.

The police are now tracking the thief and have filed a case into the theft from the Jind General Hospital's storeroom.

Around noon today, the thief gave the bag to a man at a tea shop outside the Civil Lines police station. The unknown accused left after telling the man that he was delivering food for the police and needed to run another errand.

Source: "Sorry, Did Not Know": Thief In Haryana Returns Covid Vaccine With Note