Team-BHP > Shifting gears

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Old 11th December 2020, 00:39   #406
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There is another end to the IT spectrum. I am not an IT guy, but I know of a company in our group. Their only captive clients were our own various group companies. Who couldn't choose anyone else even if they wanted to. This company had absolutely no other clients.

Forget tier two or three towns. This company will scout for people from places like tier four or five. Those boys/girls will not be very savvy, and for the colleges where they studied, there won't be any placement prospects. This company will choose a few from those towns/colleges. They will have to work free for six months. At the end of the period they will be offered a regular position or sent out. Needless to say, the salary won't be anywhere near comparable to regular IT companies.

Some used to be sent out. Some remained for years with the company. A few gained experience, updated themselves and later went to Infosys / Wipro or even abroad. I have seen all three kinds over a period of many years. I was in Finance/Accounts and had to interact with them on a day to day basis.

Last edited by vb-san : 11th December 2020 at 09:32. Reason: Correction as requested
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Old 11th December 2020, 01:44   #407
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Default Re: IT industry salary survey

I think I didn't put it across properly. When I said that, I included myself there . (ie. I consider myself overpaid too). It was a general observation in the industry.
A couple of my friends who are into startup have been having a tough time hiring talent because of the high expectations. Of course, we could argue supply demand etc. But my main point was in isolation. If one compares to something else, there will never be any answers.
No offence taken.

RSU's although wont affect the cash flow, will have to be expensed. So it will affect the accounting profit. Also the increase in number of shares will affect the eps.

Originally Posted by v1p3r View Post
I assume you work in a corporate body, and have a white collar job. Do you think you deserve to make 10x what a rickshaw puller in Kolkata does? He pulls people in his rickshaw, sometime totalling over 200 kilos, for miles every day. There is no chance of a raise or promotion. If he's ill, his family might go hungry.

Perspective is a wonderful thing. And the disparity is already huge. Compare yourself to the rickshaw puller. Or to Mukesh Ambani.

No offence meant, by the way.

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Old 11th December 2020, 15:46   #408
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Originally Posted by View Post
No. Not about reasons. But general views on this high salary. I am not complaining. But I dont think people deserve this kind of salary for the kind of work they do.
Originally Posted by v1p3r View Post
Compare yourself to the rickshaw puller. Or to Mukesh Ambani.
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
Why do you think its wild. If you look at the average productivity rise, the salary has not really kept in step. Look at productivity per employee
One doesn't have to compare oneself with Ambani or a rickshaw puller. Just compare yourself with your counterparts abroad. A guy in the US, for example, with the same experience, same job profile, same productivity and same impact to the company would be earning many times the salary of his colleague in India. So, how do you say the folks in India are paid more than they deserve?

And if you know how much the companies bill the resources for, then you will feel the typical IT employee is significantly underpaid. Once the business team wrongly sent across the billing contract instead of the technical spec to us. For a 5 member, 2 week implementation, the client was paying the annual salary of all of the 5 people and then some more. We even joked to our manager that we are not going to work for the rest of the year

Originally Posted by Jeroen View Post
In India I controlled an organisation of about 23000 people. Today, I have not a single direct report? Do you think that should make a difference in my salary? No, it is about what results I bring to the company.
Quoting from the other thread since I felt it is relevant here. Don't know how it works for people at the top management, but at lower levels, the location plays a significant role in the salary. People getting transferred to developed nations do get a high salary owing to the cost of living and it falls back to the Indian levels when they move back.
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Old 11th December 2020, 16:17   #409
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Originally Posted by Jaguar View Post
Quoting from the other thread since I felt it is relevant here. Don't know how it works for people at the top management, but at lower levels, the location plays a significant role in the salary. People getting transferred to developed nations do get a high salary owing to the cost of living and it falls back to the Indian levels when they move back.
Yes, it is common practice to adjust salaries to which country ones lives in.

But even within one country there could be adjustments. My nephew works for a large construction company in the UK. They have a GLC adjustment. So if you’re being transferred to anywhere within the area of Greater London Circle, part of your package gets adjusted.

Having moved around just about all my working life, I have seen and heard of many different system in place amongst different companies. Some are great, some are very poor.

Large, international companies that move people around internationally tend to have elaborate system in place to ensure their staff when moving around get properly compensated. Adjusting salaries for location has nothing to do with salary increase and or promotion. The idea of course is neither the employer or employee is better/worse off due to having/being asked to move to a different location.

In our company we have a system whereby the basic idea is to set your salary for your position abroad, on the basis of what a similar position would pay in your home country. Then it gets adjusted for whatever is applicable for the country you are heading out for.

I have been back in my home country for the last 3,5 years, having spend a very long time abroad. My company also ensured that important things like my company pension and state pension for my wife and me, were kept in order during my stay abroad.

There is also a difference in how companies deal with sending staff abroad. At it usually reflects in the package you would get too. Although it has changed quite a bit, Shell International used to have excellent expat packages. But if you joined them it was understood you would spend most of your career moving from one country to the next. And you would have no say in where they would send you. But they paid very well, and they went out of their way to accommodate the whole family coming along. They would pay for everything. If you had a child needing special education and or care, Shell would pick up the tap. Only towards the end of your career could you have some influence on your preference on where to go next.

So your whole career was tightly controlled by Shell, but the compensation and other parts of these packages were excellent!

Our expat assignments are always on a voluntarily basis. By and large, it is seen as an important part of your personal development, working in different parts of the world. But there are no guarantees on what your next job would be. Or whether there is a next job, after your assignment comes to an end.

My personal belief has always been that for an International organisation such as ours, it is really important for people to move internationally. I am ok with it being voluntarily, but I do believe that certain positions can only be held if you have build sufficient experience working around the globe.

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Old 11th December 2020, 16:30   #410
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The income that one NEEDS is different from what one WANTS and what one DESERVES is an entirely different thing altogether.

Compared to the average income levels of almost all other occupational classes in India, Software industry pays too high, IT industry is probably better than most and investment banking is higher than even Software.

Of course, my claim - ...Software industry pays too high... - is for the Indian context; can be refuted when compared with American/foreign salaries, but we aren't living there, are we?

It can also be argued that all other sectors aren't paying well, and so Software salaries look too high; and that wouldn't be entirely irrefutable. There are many sectors that pay really bad, not enough to afford a decent life such as a proper 3 bhk apartment, a sedan, savings for a comfortable retirement etc.

Coming back to what salary one DESERVES - my view is, it is a play of multiple factors that leads some people to land those awesome salaries or jobs in awesome firms/sectors that pay really well. Some are pure lucky, some extremely hardworking, some very intelligent; difficult to say someone is undeserving or deserving. As with most things in life - Move On.

I'll add this, though - if one is hardworking and has the "zidd" (can't find exact translation in english); one can land these jobs themselves - I have seen quite a few people in their mid-40s in senior levels in IT services firms, when most of us would happily enjoy the job perks, 50 people teams, business class travel and literally no hands-on work. But these few, did study and prepare and land jobs in Amazon at much junior levels (say PM or Sr. PM); but with 2x-3x the salaries.


Last edited by lazy : 11th December 2020 at 16:32.
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