[tacho]

Originally Posted by prince_pervez

I pity people for their innocence, when they think IPL has anything to do except cricket. The game is just the poster boy presented to us innocent, 9 to 5 beings. There are a lot of behind the scene activities where there is a lot of money involved. Unfortunately for us commoners, this world has become a place of large scale deception, where everyone is being deceived some or the other way. Cricket is a religion in our country and it is being used to mint mint mint since a long long time.

I pity those who are so miserable in their lives that they need to believe the cricketers have the same standard of morals as themselves and will throw matches at the first scent of money. I can start preaching too.

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

If you can answer all the questions that I put up in my previous post, you will have an idea.

You said 1700 crores is too high. What is not too high?

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

It would be foolish not to get into betting with something as big as IPL. Its easy money.

It's just as easy to lose money, surely? Oh wait, not if you fix the match in your favor. My bad.

[extreme_torque]

Originally Posted by tacho

It's just as easy to lose money, surely? Oh wait, not if you fix the match in your favor. My bad.

Not sure what you are trying to say here but you may win more money by loosing than by winning.

[tacho]

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

Not sure what you are trying to say here but you may win more money by loosing than by winning.

I meant losing and winning money, not matches. (fixing in your favor = fixing the match so that you gain money)

Anyway, for someone to make a lot of money in betting, someone else must be losing it. They would then consider themselves foolish for getting into betting

[extreme_torque]

Originally Posted by tacho

I meant losing and winning money, not matches. (fixing in your favor = fixing the match so that you gain money)

Anyway, for someone to make a lot of money in betting, someone else must be losing it. They would then consider themselves foolish for getting into betting

My bad I still dont get? Are you assuming that winning a match equals more money?

Offcourse but that 'someone' isnt the franchises or the bookies becuase they are the one's who are actually manipulating the results and turning the tide in their favor.

Remember the recent match between MI and KKR. Most of the people would have assumed an easy win for MI given their present form and betting odds would have been set accordingly. The end result was KKR won but MI would have made more via bookies by loosing and so did KKR.

[tacho]

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

Remember the recent match between MI and KKR. Most of the people would have assumed an easy win for MI given their present form and betting odds would have been set accordingly. The end result was KKR won but MI would have made more via bookies by loosing and so did KKR.

Ya, I understand. I just meant that whoever (individuals?) bet against KKR lost their money thanks to the illicit relationship between the bookies and the teams - and would be wary of continuing to bet on the IPL.

So, according to this business model, the bookies first set the betting odds and take the bets in. They then proceed to fix the match maximizing the profits for the teams and themselves. This means the end users (people like the guy you know who won 90 Lakhs) collectively lose a lot of money in the long run since they are indirectly paying the bookies, the teams etc.. These guys are either incredibly stupid or incredibly rich.

I am not arguing against you now, just thinking out loud

[extreme_torque]

Originally Posted by tacho

Ya, I understand. I just meant that whoever (individuals?) bet against KKR lost their money thanks to the illicit relationship between the bookies and the teams - and would be wary of continuing to bet on the IPL.

So, according to this business model, the bookies first set the betting odds and take the bets in. They then proceed to fix the match maximizing the profits for the teams and themselves. This means the end users (people like the guy you know who won 90 Lakhs) collectively lose a lot of money in the long run since they are indirectly paying the bookies, the teams etc.. These guys are either incredibly stupid or incredibly rich.

I am not arguing against you now, just thinking out loud

Well its a gamble and likewise if they loose money they dont stop gambling, and in this case betting. The same guy's cousin lost 80k's on the KKR and MI match. The point is that its only money changing hands but the only if there is something definite its only for the big fishes in the pond.

[prince_pervez]

Originally Posted by tacho

I pity those who are so miserable in their lives that they need to believe the cricketers have the same standard of morals as themselves and will throw matches at the first scent of money. I can start preaching too.

Gosh! Last time I checked there is no IQ level constraint to enter here. The conviction on proving that the IPL is free from all vices is naive enough.

And yes "Breaking News" Viru is out of a shoulder injury for the T20 WC and he played all the DD league matches. The same guy was unavailable for some other match representing India, but was caught on camera diving in some river in Kerela for a PEPSI ad. Hozzzzzat !! ??

Forget morals and standards they know now what is profitable and what is not.

[Ranjan Sharma]

Originally Posted by tacho

I pity those who are so miserable in their lives that they need to believe the cricketers have the same standard of morals as themselves and will throw matches at the first scent of money. I can start preaching too.

Ha ha.. Seriously, argument just for the sake of it.

Are you talking about morals for these kindergarten players in IPL? Please look around and you will find the greatest names of cricket history involved in fixing, who were supposed to have the highest standards of morals or whatever....

Without fixing and betting, IPL would not be what it is. I am sure you would not be surprised when Rajasthan Royals won the 1st season because you thought they "deserved" it leaving all Gibbs and Tendulkars looking like goons.

[heavy_foot]

I seriously dont get it, you guys are argueing that matches are fixed just because you are assume it is? or because it sounds too good to be true..or because a weaker team won ? comon guys it is a sport, any team can can win on any given day, of course some teams have better chances, but still there are upsets and surprises. There were few players who were involved in fixing, that doesnt make every player a match fixer. I can understand if you guys have any concrete evidences about match fixing in the IPL, but arguing just on the basis of assumptions and hearsay is plain stupid, my 2 cents.

[tacho]

Originally Posted by prince_pervez

Gosh! Last time I checked there is no IQ level constraint to enter here. The conviction on proving that the IPL is free from all vices is naive enough.

And yes "Breaking News" Viru is out of a shoulder injury for the T20 WC and he played all the DD league matches. The same guy was unavailable for some other match representing India, but was caught on camera diving in some river in Kerela for a PEPSI ad. Hozzzzzat !! ??

Forget morals and standards they know now what is profitable and what is not.

To be honest, I don't know if you believe the IPL is fixed or not. Do you? I said what I said because of your 'pity' and 'ignorance is bliss' comments without providing any tangible evidence in favor of your point of view.

I don't believe the IPL is squeaky clean but I have seen nothing to suggest the matches themselves are fixed in advance.

I don't understand what the IQ comment is supposed to mean here.

Originally Posted by Ranjan Sharma

Ha ha.. Seriously, argument just for the sake of it.

Are you talking about morals for these kindergarten players in IPL? Please look around and you will find the greatest names of cricket history involved in fixing, who were supposed to have the highest standards of morals or whatever....

Mohammed Azharuddin, Ajay Jadeja, Manoj Prabhakar, Hansie Cronje and Salim Malik come to mind. None of whom is in the IPL. I prefer to believe the others are innocent until proven guilty.

Without fixing and betting, IPL would not be what it is. I am sure you would not be surprised when Rajasthan Royals won the 1st season because you thought they "deserved" it leaving all Gibbs and Tendulkars looking like goons.

And I am sure you think IPL 1 was fixed. So? The onus is on you to prove it.

[download2live]

Not here to bash IPL. Afterall they are dishing out what people want. But yes, India has one cricket fan less now. I miss those days when one day match series were held few and far in between. There was a time when we used to wake up at 3 in morning to watch the match. And also I can never forget the way Ambrose Walsh and the company used to move the ball around. Now a days bowlers are forced to ball straight and ball not hit for a six is a good ball. Add to that flat pitches. Its all money with dollops of cheerleaders now. What a shame to see Shilpa and Priety as boss of cricketers. Modi minted his share of money. But Mr Modi......Was it worth it?

[Ranjan Sharma]

Originally Posted by heavy_foot

I can understand if you guys have any concrete evidences about match fixing in the IPL, but arguing just on the basis of assumptions and hearsay is plain stupid, my 2 cents.

Originally Posted by tacho

And I am sure you think IPL 1 was fixed. So? The onus is on you to prove it.

Guys, if it was proved, it wouldn't exist. The fact that it is still going on is because it is made in a manner it won't be proved.

And why are we asking for proof? Tacho gave out the names - Azhar, Cronje, etc etc. Does that not prove match fixing exists? Let the common sense prevail and understand that if INTERNATIONAL matches were proved fixed....................................... IPL=Indian Paisa League is a mere league.

[Gansan]

@tacho
It can't be conclusively proved! But tell me, is there betting involved or not? If you accept betting is there, and involves thousands of crores, then fixing can't be far behind. But of course not all matches will be, or can be fixed, only some when the odds are really huge!

And since there is no national pride involved, more players may be amenable too.

[prince_pervez]

Originally Posted by tacho

I said what I said because of your 'pity' and 'ignorance is bliss' comments without providing any tangible evidence in favor of your point of view.

That was not for you in the first place. I don't know why you took it.

I don't believe the IPL is squeaky clean but I have seen nothing to suggest the matches themselves are fixed in advance.

Not all matches need to be fixed, only the decisive ones.

I don't understand what the IQ comment is supposed to mean here.

Thats what I am talking about. .

[tacho]

Originally Posted by prince_pervez

Thats what I am talking about. .

Still didn't get it...