Air France Plane goes missing!!! 228 feared dead!

DriverR · 2nd June 2009, 09:22

Brazilian Airlines pilot claim seeing evidence of a crash along the Air France Route :

Pilots flying a commercial jet from Paris to Rio de Janeiro for Brazil's largest airline, TAM, spotted what they thought was fire in the ocean along the Air France jet's route early Monday, the airline said in a statement e-mailed to The Associated Press.

Brazilian Air Force spokesman Col. Jorge Amaral said authorities were investigating the report, according to the Agencia Brasil official news service.

"There is information that the pilot of a TAM aircraft saw several orange points on the ocean while flying over the region ... where the Air France plane disappeared," Amaral said.

"After arriving in Brazil, the pilot found out about the disappearance (of the Air France plane) and said that he thought those points on the ocean were fire."

Source: Yahoo News

aaggoswami · 2nd June 2009, 10:04

An unfortunate incident.
But now atleast the theory of Bermuda triangle will not be brought in resulting in a thorough investigation that may help in preventing these crashes from happening.

Spitfire · 2nd June 2009, 10:58

Oh this is horrible. God give strength to the victims families.

DriverR · 2nd June 2009, 18:46

Possible wreckage located.

Source: BBC / CNN / CNN-IBN

Wreckage has been found in the Atlantic Ocean that could have come from a missing Air France jet that disappeared Monday with 228 passengers and crew on board, Brazilian aviation officials said Tuesday.

Floating objects and seats were found 720 kilometers (447 miles) from the island of Fernando de Noronha, said Brazilian Air Force spokesman Jorge Amaral.

The search will continue but there is not enough material to officially say this is the wreckage from Flight 447, Maral said.

kannan666 · 2nd June 2009, 23:08

Just heard on the news (BBC Channel) that the Brazilian armed forces have located the crash site and have found some visible debris like floating seats, airplane parts etc. They claim that it is located in one of the deepest parts of the Atlantic Ocean, so retrieval of the black boxes pose a real challenge.

nitrous · 2nd June 2009, 23:20

OT but related:
So, the floating seat cushions and life jackets are useless?
Or maybe they crash landed into the sea and did not soft land on it in which case the wings would help from sinking for a while.

vivekiny2k · 2nd June 2009, 23:23

if the planes controls went kaput because of electrical/electronics failure, pilots may have no way of gliding the plane to a smooth landing.

also, if they land on cold waters, even with the floating cushions hypothermia can kill very quickly.

mclarenracer · 2nd June 2009, 23:36

temp at the time of crash and till now have been in the range of +20to28degrees C,so there is a very likely chance of survivors if they had a smooth landing. even though A330 is a file-by-wire system, there are manual systems a pilot can use just in case everything goes kaput. i'll venture a guess and say tail section of the plane was torn apart, since pilots never made a mayday call and they droped 35000 feet in 4 min thus no likely survivors.

Nitin · 3rd June 2009, 00:37

As of now, search operations are expected to take weeks or even several months. Given that the ridge line of the bottom of the sea drops close to a miles in certain areas of the Atlantic, no one knows how deep below the surface the black box might be.

shuvc · 3rd June 2009, 00:55

Terrible.

I wonder why it's taking so long to identify the location. Assuming that there is floating debris, shouldn't it be possible for satellite images to pick them up quickly? I'm sure governments have access to extremely detailed images.

mclarenracer · 3rd June 2009, 01:09

it's taking longer due to the distance that has to be covered,all the visual identification that are coming out about the debris are from a plane flying 500-1000 feet asl,at well over 150 knts, 3 commercial vessels are there right now, they will tell government about what they see then they will tell the family and then media.

vivekiny2k · 3rd June 2009, 01:30

This suggests there are no mechanical controls in A330.

Airbus loss likely to remain mystery for a while yet

I mentioned cold water in response to nitrous' query about usability of floats.

mclarenracer · 3rd June 2009, 01:41

my bad about temp,but mechanical controls sources are pilots that fly a330 and staff pilot and engineer that are type rated, there is limited trim and rudder control.

DriverR · 3rd June 2009, 09:00

Debris spotted earlier has been identified as belonging to the Air France flight.

Source: BBC / CNN

The chilling part of the report is that the debris was found spread over a distance of 5 km long

" Two debris fields were found about 650 km (400 miles) northeast of the Fernando de Noronha Islands, an archipelago 355 kilometers (220 miles) off the northeast coast of Brazil -- or at latitude 2 north, longitude 30 west, the Ministry of Defense said on its Web site.

One of the fields was 5 km (3 miles) long and that both lie near the flight path between Rio de Janeiro and Paris."

It is most strange to see that the aircraft systems transmitted automatic messages for about 4 minutes to the homebase server, but the pilots did not radio in. This indicates that the radio must have been among the first equipment to fail. The last automated transmitted message from the aircraft systems reported loss of pressure.

In such scenario, chances of survivors are slim.

I was hoping to avoid saying it, but now, hope is almost gone. May they Rest in Peace. My heartfelt condolence to their family. It is a horrible tragedy.

vivekiny2k · 3rd June 2009, 10:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by DriverR

The chilling part of the report is that the debris was found spread over a distance of 5 km long

not really abnormal. Some of the wreckage from bermuda triangle has been found near the coast of virginia. ocean has strong currents there.

But one thing I noticed is another pilot saw orange "spots" in the ocean. if it was burning over a large area, possibly it caught fire midair and disintegrated while burning. terrorism?

2nd June 2009, 09:22	#31
DriverR BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 414 Thanked: 526 Times	Brazilian Airlines pilot claim seeing evidence of a crash along the Air France Route : Pilots flying a commercial jet from Paris to Rio de Janeiro for Brazil's largest airline, TAM, spotted what they thought was fire in the ocean along the Air France jet's route early Monday, the airline said in a statement e-mailed to The Associated Press. Brazilian Air Force spokesman Col. Jorge Amaral said authorities were investigating the report, according to the Agencia Brasil official news service. "There is information that the pilot of a TAM aircraft saw several orange points on the ocean while flying over the region ... where the Air France plane disappeared," Amaral said. "After arriving in Brazil, the pilot found out about the disappearance (of the Air France plane) and said that he thought those points on the ocean were fire." Source: Yahoo News
	() Thanks

2nd June 2009, 10:04	#32
aaggoswami Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2007 Location: Vadodara Posts: 4,982 Thanked: 2,931 Times	An unfortunate incident. But now atleast the theory of Bermuda triangle will not be brought in resulting in a thorough investigation that may help in preventing these crashes from happening.
	() Thanks

2nd June 2009, 10:58	#33
Spitfire BANNED Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Panaji - Goa/Bangalore - Karnataka Posts: 3,312 Thanked: 774 Times	Oh this is horrible. God give strength to the victims families.
	() Thanks

2nd June 2009, 18:46	#34
DriverR BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 414 Thanked: 526 Times	Possible wreckage located. Source: BBC / CNN / CNN-IBN Wreckage has been found in the Atlantic Ocean that could have come from a missing Air France jet that disappeared Monday with 228 passengers and crew on board, Brazilian aviation officials said Tuesday. Floating objects and seats were found 720 kilometers (447 miles) from the island of Fernando de Noronha, said Brazilian Air Force spokesman Jorge Amaral. The search will continue but there is not enough material to officially say this is the wreckage from Flight 447, Maral said. Last edited by DriverR : 2nd June 2009 at 18:48.
	() Thanks

2nd June 2009, 23:08	#35
kannan666 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: KA-02 Posts: 1,002 Thanked: 128 Times View My Garage	Just heard on the news (BBC Channel) that the Brazilian armed forces have located the crash site and have found some visible debris like floating seats, airplane parts etc. They claim that it is located in one of the deepest parts of the Atlantic Ocean, so retrieval of the black boxes pose a real challenge.
	() Thanks

2nd June 2009, 23:20	#36
nitrous Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2004 Location: UAE/Lon/Madras Posts: 6,965 Thanked: 325 Times View My Garage	OT but related: So, the floating seat cushions and life jackets are useless? Or maybe they crash landed into the sea and did not soft land on it in which case the wings would help from sinking for a while.
	() Thanks

2nd June 2009, 23:23	#37
vivekiny2k Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: cincinnati, jabalpur,chennai Posts: 1,264 Thanked: 209 Times View My Garage	if the planes controls went kaput because of electrical/electronics failure, pilots may have no way of gliding the plane to a smooth landing. also, if they land on cold waters, even with the floating cushions hypothermia can kill very quickly.
	() Thanks

2nd June 2009, 23:36	#38
mclarenracer BHPian Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Seattle Posts: 115 Thanked: 11 Times	temp at the time of crash and till now have been in the range of +20to28degrees C,so there is a very likely chance of survivors if they had a smooth landing. even though A330 is a file-by-wire system, there are manual systems a pilot can use just in case everything goes kaput. i'll venture a guess and say tail section of the plane was torn apart, since pilots never made a mayday call and they droped 35000 feet in 4 min thus no likely survivors.
	() Thanks

3rd June 2009, 00:37	#39
Nitin Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2006 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 3,294 Thanked: 20 Times View My Garage	As of now, search operations are expected to take weeks or even several months. Given that the ridge line of the bottom of the sea drops close to a miles in certain areas of the Atlantic, no one knows how deep below the surface the black box might be.
	() Thanks

3rd June 2009, 00:55	#40
shuvc Senior - BHPian Join Date: May 2005 Location: Kolkata Posts: 2,913 Thanked: 352 Times View My Garage	Terrible. I wonder why it's taking so long to identify the location. Assuming that there is floating debris, shouldn't it be possible for satellite images to pick them up quickly? I'm sure governments have access to extremely detailed images.
	() Thanks

3rd June 2009, 01:09	#41
mclarenracer BHPian Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Seattle Posts: 115 Thanked: 11 Times	it's taking longer due to the distance that has to be covered,all the visual identification that are coming out about the debris are from a plane flying 500-1000 feet asl,at well over 150 knts, 3 commercial vessels are there right now, they will tell government about what they see then they will tell the family and then media.
	() Thanks

3rd June 2009, 01:30	#42
vivekiny2k Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: cincinnati, jabalpur,chennai Posts: 1,264 Thanked: 209 Times View My Garage	This suggests there are no mechanical controls in A330. Airbus loss likely to remain mystery for a while yet I mentioned cold water in response to nitrous' query about usability of floats.
	() Thanks

3rd June 2009, 01:41	#43
mclarenracer BHPian Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Seattle Posts: 115 Thanked: 11 Times	my bad about temp,but mechanical controls sources are pilots that fly a330 and staff pilot and engineer that are type rated, there is limited trim and rudder control.
	() Thanks

3rd June 2009, 09:00	#44
DriverR BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 414 Thanked: 526 Times	Debris spotted earlier has been identified as belonging to the Air France flight. Source: BBC / CNN The chilling part of the report is that the debris was found spread over a distance of 5 km long " Two debris fields were found about 650 km (400 miles) northeast of the Fernando de Noronha Islands, an archipelago 355 kilometers (220 miles) off the northeast coast of Brazil -- or at latitude 2 north, longitude 30 west, the Ministry of Defense said on its Web site. One of the fields was 5 km (3 miles) long and that both lie near the flight path between Rio de Janeiro and Paris." It is most strange to see that the aircraft systems transmitted automatic messages for about 4 minutes to the homebase server, but the pilots did not radio in. This indicates that the radio must have been among the first equipment to fail. The last automated transmitted message from the aircraft systems reported loss of pressure. In such scenario, chances of survivors are slim. I was hoping to avoid saying it, but now, hope is almost gone. May they Rest in Peace. My heartfelt condolence to their family. It is a horrible tragedy. Last edited by DriverR : 3rd June 2009 at 09:06.
	() Thanks