Team-BHP > Around the Corner > Shifting gears


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 18th December 2017, 11:11   #811
BHPian
 
JayKis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Pune
Posts: 241
Thanked: 438 Times
Default Re: IT Industry and Employability of Technical Graduates

Quote:
Originally Posted by NetfreakBombay View Post
In my opinion, this is a pretty good career path. Basically a "custodian" of Product and Business Functionality delivered by the product.

As more and more Products/Projects move up the value chain, domain knowledge becomes valuable. BA/PM (PM = Product Manager) becomes a crucial role by guiding rest of the Dev/Q/Support teams and getting rid of late-nigh calls.

Just do not get too tied to "trend de jour" like SCURM and others that will come and go. Just use them if it helps career in short term.
Yes, it is a good career path. But if you look at it shrewdly, three jobs have been shrunk into one , and one guy has to do all the three jobs.

With QA automation, a QA can be shared across multiple projects since a lot of effort for manual testing is saved.
JayKis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18th December 2017, 11:22   #812
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Andromeda
Posts: 324
Thanked: 65 Times
Default Re: IT Industry and Employability of Technical Graduates

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoumenD View Post
Guess you misinterpreted my statement. What I meant was even with technical skill-set post 40-42 it will be tough to cope as the industry requirements are changing rapidly & I doubt our learning capabilities will be as sharp post 40s as it used to be in the initial years(20s or early 30s).

P.S : Am not talking about people managers as I am not into that stream at all. I find dealing with technology easier than dealing with people
I might disagree with this! You only have to be curious and have some passion for new things in technology and the rest will automatically follow.
joe1980 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18th December 2017, 12:34   #813
BHPian
 
SoumenD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: B'lore
Posts: 745
Thanked: 1,248 Times
Default Re: IT Industry and Employability of Technical Graduates

Quote:
Originally Posted by joe1980 View Post
I might disagree with this! You only have to be curious and have some passion for new things in technology and the rest will automatically follow.
Maybe your are correct.

My context was in early days our sole focus is mostly on job/career as we don't have too many responsibilities that need our attention. But around 40+ one usually has a lot more responsibilities catering to which tends to reduce the adapting ability comparatively. But then I am not yet there, so was just inquisitive

End of OT from my side
SoumenD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 18th December 2017, 18:04   #814
Senior - BHPian
 
DirtyDan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Dharamsala
Posts: 1,890
Thanked: 988 Times
Default Re: IT Industry and Employability of Technical Graduates

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samurai View Post
The guy who drives a juggad Jeep on a regular basis would have lot better understanding of automobiles, than a guy who drives the latest SUV. I know this one by first hand experience. Your syllabus may be teaching you Jeep so that you can easily pickup the basics of automobile engineering. It will setup the foundation to understand latest automobile technology. Therefore, don't reject everything that is old, there are merits in old stuff. On the other hand if they are teaching chariot building, then you have real cause for complaint.

But forget all that. You can't change what your colleges do. The real question is what are you doing? Unlike in my times, you have lot more options to update your knowledge. All of you have powerful home PCs with broadband connections..
Yup, for d@mn sure. There is no better way to REALLY learn to code, create, than by spending hours a day coding and creating. Assembler helped me understand early on, mainframe mostly. But higher languages, too. And hours, and hours, and hours on the keyboard trying stuff.....and hours and hours more...did I mention? Hours! Then, you get a job. And you find that the complexity of actual coding and I.T. is almost unfathomable...but you ramp yourself up and deal with it. And one day, much to your amazement, you find out that you can flat out cut the mustard! The brown goo hits the electrical cooling device and YOU are the one they run to, to make things right.

If you are lucky, you come away from it with some hefty personal gains. Yes, a little money in your pocket but just maybe, you find you now have an orderly mind suited to solve more than just I.T. algorithms.
DirtyDan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th February 2018, 19:29   #815
BHPian
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Bengaluru
Posts: 307
Thanked: 415 Times
Default Re: IT Industry and Employability of Technical Graduates

Some interesting observations by Steve Wozniak published in TOI today:

Quote:
Q: How important is coding and should it be taught to children, particularly in India?
A: Coding is very important. It doesnít need to be taught before 12 years. I say this because there is a thing called cognitive development, the way your mind perceives the world, then assimilates, and moves on to new ways of seeing the world and structuring how data works. You donít get to a stage of symbolic reasoning until you are 12 years old. Some people get there early, but most people at 12, and thatís why algebra canít be taught till you are that age. And programming can be taught only when you are ready for algebra. The real advantage of learning how to code is that you learn how to solve large problems with a lot of steps. The steps add up to a solution. Thatís true of everything in life.
Quote:
Q: What are your views on India? Do you think a global tech company can emerge from here?
A: I am not an anthropologist and I donít know the culture of India well enough. I donít see those big advances in tech companies. What is the biggest tech company here, Infosys maybe? I just donít see that sort of thing coming out of Infosys and I have done keynotes for them three times.
Quote:
Q: What is the missing link here?
A: The culture here is one of success based upon academic excellence, studying, learning, practising and having a good job and a great life. For upper India, not the lower. I see two Indias. Thatís a lot like Singapore study, study, work hard and you get an MBA, you will have a Mercedes but where is the creativity? The creativity gets left out when your behaviour is too predictable and structured, everyone is similar. Look at a small country like New Zealand, the writers, singers, athletes, itís a whole different world.

Last edited by AltoLXI : 25th February 2018 at 19:33.
AltoLXI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th February 2018, 15:35   #816
Team-BHP Support
 
Samurai's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Banglore-Udupi
Posts: 23,824
Thanked: 21,126 Times
Default Re: IT Industry and Employability of Technical Graduates

I read it yesterday and I was very happy that someone highly esteemed like him pointed it out to all the biggies of the Indian IT world. I have mentioned similar sentiments on this thread all along. See the last two paragraphs of this post written in 2009.
Samurai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2018, 11:23   #817
Team-BHP Support
 
SmartCat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 4,450
Thanked: 22,052 Times
Default Re: IT Industry and Employability of Technical Graduates

This is a great thread, by the way. Spent 2 hours reading comments on this thread. In year 2000, the process followed by IT companies for hiring was -

- Aptitude Test
- Ground Discussion (Topic: Brain Train.. or Drain. Or something like that)
- HR interview

I rarely got to the 3rd round. Although I was never able to become a software engineer, I respect Indian IT companies and their employees because all the work they do sounds very smart. Media talking about India being an IT superpower probably influenced me too. But this thread has been very insightful for somebody like me.

Quote:
you get an MBA, you will have a Mercedes but where is the creativity? The creativity gets left out when your behaviour is too predictable and structured, everyone is similar
What does Steve mean by "MBA and creativity"? That Indian MBAs don't start a business after they get their degree? It's probably because of lack of capital. But I have seen many MBA graduates (especially those with IIT/IIM combinations) quit their jobs after 10 years and start a business.

Quote:
Look at a small country like New Zealand, the writers, singers, athletes, it’s a whole different world
This part is a bit unfair because India has a large number of creative industries. OK, we don't have athletes - but we do have writers, movie industry, TV entertainment industry, classical dance/singers etc.
SmartCat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2018, 12:18   #818
BANNED
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: bangalore
Posts: 560
Thanked: 648 Times
Default Re: IT Industry and Employability of Technical Graduates

So IT services is a lowly job, according to some, and only companies like Apple, Google etc are real tech companies. Why? Do everybody have to do high-end tech jobs to earn respect? I have heard many call us - IT workers - IT coolies. What does that imply? Coolies are low lives who do not deserve respect? Out of all the jobs available in this world only a handful of them are creative. The rest are routine jobs which is meant to get things done. And people get paid for it. For they all need to eat and cloth and have a roof above their heads.

IT service companies belong to a certain type of industry. Which does not include Google, Apple etc. Why does Infosys, Wipro, TCS have be like Apple and Google?
blacksport is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2018, 14:52   #819
Senior - BHPian
 
msdivy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1,593
Thanked: 1,123 Times
Default Re: IT Industry and Employability of Technical Graduates

Quote:
Originally Posted by blacksport View Post
Why? Do everybody have to do high-end tech jobs to earn respect?
True. For most, this would be just a paying job for their living and they would spend rest of their time on something else. Nothing humiliating about these work.
Quote:
IT service companies belong to a certain type of industry. Which does not include Google, Apple etc. Why does Infosys, Wipro, TCS have be like Apple and Google?
The question is not on what Infy, Wipro or TCS does or doesn't not. Question is why India does not have Google, Apple etc.
msdivy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2018, 15:09   #820
Team-BHP Support
 
vb-san's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: S'pore/Thrissur
Posts: 5,032
Thanked: 5,473 Times
Default Re: IT Industry and Employability of Technical Graduates

Quote:
Originally Posted by blacksport View Post
I have heard many call us - IT workers - IT coolies. What does that imply? Coolies are low lives who do not deserve respect?
Not qualified enough to talk of the wider topics discussed in this thread, but from what I have seen (in my part of the world) these names are mostly mentioned by the folks who are employed in the IT sector, to refer themselves Ė more in a lighter vein.
vb-san is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2018, 15:54   #821
BHPian
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Bengaluru
Posts: 307
Thanked: 415 Times
Default Re: IT Industry and Employability of Technical Graduates

Quote:
Originally Posted by smartcat View Post
I respect Indian IT companies and their employees because all the work they do sounds very smart.
Sounds very smart but the work done by majority is rather mundane. I say majority because there are tiny companies who have carved out their own niches, but then the number of such companies are far too few for the country which has a population of 1+ billion. After two decades or so, the industry should have matured to leap to the next level but unfortunately it has not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by smartcat View Post
Media talking about India being an IT superpower probably influenced me too.
The less the said about the people in the media pretending to know the IT industry, the better. More of PR exercise by companies having good marketing budget.

Quote:
Originally Posted by blacksport View Post
So IT services is a lowly job, according to some, and only companies like Apple, Google etc are real tech companies. Why? Do everybody have to do high-end tech jobs to earn respect? I have heard many call us - IT workers - IT coolies. What does that imply? Coolies are low lives who do not deserve respect? Out of all the jobs available in this world only a handful of them are creative.

IT service companies belong to a certain type of industry. Which does not include Google, Apple etc. Why does Infosys, Wipro, TCS have be like Apple and Google?
Nothing disrespectful. It is good that people earn their livelihood working for these companies. The issue is there is no real value add to the intellectual capital of the country. Service companies are more of outposts doing back office work outsourced by companies in the West which is more of cost saving measure. Even the work done in the "product/captive" companies is routine affair with the majority of the specifications/design coming from the counterparts outside the country. This is the type of work which can be automated.

Quote:
Originally Posted by blacksport View Post
The rest are routine jobs which is meant to get things done. And people get paid for it. For they all need to eat and cloth and have a roof above their heads.
This means jobs cater only to the lowest level in Maslow's hierarchy of needs

Quote:
Originally Posted by msdivy View Post
Question is why India does not have Google, Apple etc.
That sums it up.

Last edited by AltoLXI : 28th February 2018 at 16:08.
AltoLXI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2018, 16:21   #822
BHPian
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 155
Thanked: 126 Times
Default Re: IT Industry and Employability of Technical Graduates

The real issue is that the people who worked/continue to work in the industry, and the onlookers from the boundaries all generally measured the value of the work from the amount of financial impact it created.
The "air" around IT job in India is not justified when you look at the value output to the industry and the impact in the s/w world. Just think about it -- people who have no clue about technology still earn quite a lot from it, are arrogant within and outside the organizations from the entitlement they seem to receive from their salary history. This single point I guess is what Woz was talking about.

Ubers and Olas paid the drivers too much in the beginning. That was a function of the times, their business model, and the investment to capture the markets, ie. a lot of things totally different from the value of a "driver". IT industry (largely) in India is only in the same lines. The money it produced was just a function of time and had nothing to do with the quality of the people we produced.

No offence to "drivers" for the metaphor or to people currently working IT. I am one too.
ashokrajagopal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2018, 16:23   #823
BANNED
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Bengaluru
Posts: 4,067
Thanked: 1,331 Times
Infractions: 0/2 (8)
Default Re: IT Industry and Employability of Technical Graduates

Quote:
Originally Posted by AltoLXI View Post
Even the work done in the "product/captive" companies is routine affair with the majority of the specifications/design coming from the counterparts outside the country. This is the type of work which can be automated.

This means jobs cater only to the lowest level in Maslow's hierarchy of needs

That sums it up.
Having been part of arguably the foremost Labs in modern communication in research and relocated and working as part of the biggest networking company, I will have to disagree. Please dont generalize. We also outsource to Indian companies and talent from those companies are very good too. Good engineers are a mix of IIT and lesser known colleges too.

R&D service Industry is increasing and maybe will become bigger than what it is today. The same Wipro, Infosys also work in such areas although in smaller numbers.

There might be a cultural issue for risk taking or un-availability of market. But with tools/resources available across the world today, hopefully things will change.

I am not part of a service company as such and I might not know everything about the type of jobs being done there. But then even abroad, majority of the people work in the taking ideas, designs and implementing kind of things. I feel this thread is a little de-meaning to people who work in IT just because they meet the requirements of whats in demand. I know too many people who lost jobs in US and were not able to find suitable ones due to lack of exposure to new demands.

Last edited by srishiva : 28th February 2018 at 16:25.
srishiva is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2018, 16:54   #824
Team-BHP Support
 
SmartCat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 4,450
Thanked: 22,052 Times
Default Re: IT Industry and Employability of Technical Graduates

Strange contradictory articles on Economic Times. On one hand, it says IT companies are cutting India jobs because of automation and need to create job overseas.

Cognizant’s headcount in India drops by 8000 in 2017, US and Europe headcount grows
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com...w/63109489.cms

But then, there is another article that says HCL Tech is struggling with attrition rates and hence looking at setting up facilities in small towns.

HCL Tech looks to small towns to curb attrition, bring stability
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com...campaign=cppst
SmartCat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 5th April 2018, 07:58   #825
Team-BHP Support
 
Samurai's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Banglore-Udupi
Posts: 23,824
Thanked: 21,126 Times
Default Re: IT Industry and Employability of Technical Graduates

Not a surprising fact to regulars of this thread.

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com...users&from=mdr
Samurai is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Revisiting the Indian automobile Industry: Past, Present and future sidindica The Indian Car Scene 99 9th May 2016 21:02
Major changes at Overdrive and the Indian magazine industry GTO The Indian Car Scene 50 28th May 2013 15:40
BackSeat Driver graduates with Khushiyon Ki Chaabi (Tata Nano)!! MileCruncher Test-Drives & Initial Ownership Reports 33 15th November 2011 12:00
BREAKING: BMW design chief Chris Bangle quits job and leaves auto industry sidindica The International Automotive Scene 29 6th February 2009 11:07
technical aspects in technical driving ram_hyundai Technical Stuff 1 2nd February 2008 21:12


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 05:26.

Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks