[srishiva]

Yesterday, I was reading about the CEO or MD of a famous hospital chain. It was about how they grew the business, the revenue running into thousand crores, expansion plans etc., So what is it about doctors and professionalism that we are talking now?
Also, the young women are different now. They dont want any complications nor the pain during delivery, some complications that may occur even after normal delivery (there is a lot that can be botched up even in normal deliveries). And there is no need to worry about the money.

[chetan]

All the big name hospitals have become commercial and don't care about the patients at all. This is becoming a trend. GOD! what has happened to Bangalore!

[clevermax]

I agree with Pramod, at least they wont take you for this big a ride (threadstarter's case).

Many docs prescribe C-Section because they also dont want to take a risk which can affect their reputation. But normal deliveries do happen.

In my case, my wife was happy the moment they told that its gonna be a C-Section. Her BP dropped and babies heartbeat also came down and that's the reason why they suggested it - at least we could see that the baby's heartbeat was low.

But afterwards, they didnt put her (baby) in observation with the Jaundice reason. What the doc strongly suggested was that we need to take the baby to direct sulight for 10-15 minutes in the morning and evening to minimize the risk. We did that and all is fine.

Bangalore is a different case than Kerala. People dont know each other well, So many IT folks with money, and there is no wonder hospitals are commercializing things.

[Gansan]

Health insurance seems to be a double edged sword. A kind of Murphy's law seems to apply the moment the hospital knows you have health insurance - the bill amount some how grows to absorb all the available limit under your policy! And the pity is, even people with no insurance have to soon foot the same kind of bills for all treatments.

Have a look at these two recent news items:

State insurance scheme goes awry as hospitals are blacklisted - Chennai - City - The Times of India

To up insurance bills, docs remove patients' uterus - Chennai - City - The Times of India

[iamswift]

In our case, right from the beginning every thing was normal and hence doctor also went for normal delivery.
After my wife experienced pain at around 4:00 in the morning, we went to hospital - reached there by 4:20. But afterwards we had to wait as it was just start of labor - pelvics to be expanded to start the labor procedures.
At around 12:15 she went in the labor room. Injection given to induce pain.
At around 15:00 pain started. But inspite of the best efforts of doctors and nurses, she could not deliver the baby till 17:00.
After this, doctor came out and explained that my wife is really exhausted. Also if the baby is not delivered for so long, there are chances that baby might swallow meconium. So it is better to go for c-section.

Infact they got signature and other formalities done and make the operation room ready. They were just waiting for the surgoen who would arrive in 15 minutes. But then they tried normal techniques too in parallel - and in another 5 to 10 mins my son is born.
Right from the beginning, their intention is the well being and the money came second. I would say there are still hospitals doing good things. Only thing is we need to identify such hospitals.

[vtecker]

Hey, Sounds familiar. Had a baby 6 months back.

This is a tricky stuff as there is judgment involved, which most of us are not competent to judge.

Do check the following two links, which may help to educate yourself better. There is pleanty more on the web.

Welcome to Birth India

Home

We changed out doc mid way as she was not comfortable discussing her approach & the reasons she would decide a C-section.

We eventually did find a place which was transparent and openly discuss in detail the pros & cons of each decision they take.

[amitoj]

They say no two deliveries are the same.
I think its unfair to expect the doctor to predict in advance whether c section will be required or not. Childbirth is after all a complicated process in which anything can cause complications.
Between high rate of miscarriages and high rate of c-sections, i'll choose the latter any day.

[sgiitk]

The logic in favour of C-section is manifold:

1. Age of first childbirth is increasing.
2. CS has become far safer, as a result forceps deliveries (with a high risk of late life epilepsy) are now totally out. Today you opt for a CS rather than risk the baby or the mother.
3. Many gynos now charge the same for a vaginal and CS delivery to the monetary argument is weaker. Of course the hospital nets more!

[inder_s1]

I agree that the same hospital I talked about had normal deliveries too. It is not a particular hospital I am talking about, it's the way the doctors diagnose nowadays and write medicines that I am talking about. They don't have patience anymore. Maybe for them it's a nth delivery but for us it's our first baby and we need to understand the process.

1. Do you see Med reps at hospitals, Docs get commission if they are able to prescribe a certain amount of their medicines.

2. Doctor 1 and Doctor 2 have different opinions on condition of the patient (Logical somewhat) but when they give a wrong injection , who's to blame?


When I went for vaccination, in Apollo - Mysore, they told us to go to emergency ward, We took our baby and they told us to wait in an open ward divided by a curtain where a dengue patient is lying down and getting tested. Now they also say there are some H1N1 patients in other wards too. On top of that, No special sheet for a baby on the bed, Thank God we had taken a extra sheet. Also, the guys giving injection were tossing my baby left and right till I shouted at them and told them I will be holding the baby.They initially told me and wife to go out of the ward.

Is this the way they treat infants?? I complained and told the Pediatrician that it's better that he gives injection in his chamber and now we get it done there. But so many people unaware or not knowing of this practice, go there, what if the baby gets an infection?


About C-Section:

Though there are advantages, it's also become a money making phenomenon. Have you checked the bills anytime? We have money so we don't care, but what about the not so fortunate people. Misc Charges = 15k , Med Instrument Charges = 10K?? Why?? Why should a patient pay for their medical equipment? Imagine in a day 10 deliveries , they get 1L just for medical instruments?

Indy

[clevermax]

Originally Posted by inder_s1

When I went for vaccination, in Apollo - Mysore, they told us to go to emergency ward, We took our baby and they told us to wait in an open ward divided by a curtain where a dengue patient is lying down and getting tested. Now they also say there are some H1N1 patients in other wards too. On top of that, No special sheet for a baby on the bed, Thank God we had taken a extra sheet. Also, the guys giving injection were tossing my baby left and right till I shouted at them and told them I will be holding the baby.They initially told me and wife to go out of the ward.

Is this the way they treat infants?? I complained and told the Pediatrician that it's better that he gives injection in his chamber and now we get it done there. But so many people unaware or not knowing of this practice, go there, what if the baby gets an infection?

I am shocked to read this because this happened in Apollo Hospital!

We recently went to KIMS (Trivandrum) causality ward. Every bed is separated by a curtain, and above the wall of every bed, there is a ventilator, which makes sure that the air flow is always into that, so that the virus doesn't spread to the nearby people. They say it is the negative pressure set-up. The air sucked through all these pipes are directed to some outlet which is at the top of that building.

There is a separate section for vaccination of babies, and they handle the babies with good care. Mother or someone who came with the baby can always be bear the baby when vaccination is being given. There won't be any H1N1 or dengue patient nearby.

Because of this, we could peacefully go to KIMS for the vaccination of my daughter the very next day after the first H1N1 patient died in KIMS. (He was admitted with a critical condition)

[maddy42]

This is one of the reasons i prefer hospitals in mangalore over bangalore. Atleast humanity still prevails. Can you imagine having a one on one conversation with a nuero surgeon for 20 mins or so as though he was family? Well my dads doctors remembered mine and my brothers names too.
Am telling from personal experience as its kind of unrelated to the topic but this occured when dad was having surgery for a brain clot. The experience eased the tension out of us

[prince_pervez]

Originally Posted by sgiitk

The logic in favour of C-section is manifold:

1. Age of first childbirth is increasing.
2. CS has become far safer, as a result forceps deliveries (with a high risk of late life epilepsy) are now totally out. Today you opt for a CS rather than risk the baby or the mother.
3. Many gynos now charge the same for a vaginal and CS delivery to the monetary argument is weaker. Of course the hospital nets more!

Agreed, though the last point is arguable. I 'heard' that there can be max 2 babies safely delivered under C-Section ? How true is that.

[Nitin]

Originally Posted by vivekiny2k

frankly speaking, apart from the "goofed up" part which is not clear, everything else seems to be complications that can occur to anybody.

as far as making money is concerned, when everybody is making money illegally (RTO, govt babus, HR managers, bank managers, pharma companies.....) why should we blame the doctors for having an eye on the revenue. What's really concerning is the lack of professionalism which results in disasters since it's a life at stake.

I will cite examples from US. unlike India, doctors are strictly bound by the regulations here, mostly enforced or lobbied by insurance. My wife had pains a day before the scheduled date and they refused to get her operated because she was technically not in labor. around noon when their monitors and tests confirmed that she was having contractions, they decided to go with the C-section. Also, first time the baby was breach, so docs insisted on C-section. There had been many cases of breach infants dying while getting delivered. Since first was a C-section, second was also recommended for c-section for fear of rupture of internal scars from first (we were given an option, we took C-section). At both times there was minimal impact to us, most of it was to the insurance, but it was very clear that they did it for our good. And let me re-emphasize that doctors here can not randomly decide on a C-section just to get more from insurance. By the way, I am fully aware of revenue conscious hospital managers and a screwed up healthcare system here.

So first, C-section is not always unnecessary. it's new, it's unnatural, but it has saved many lives. And second, In india where everything can be circumvented and corruption kills faster than cancer, we need to keep our eyes open and seek second or third opinions when it's a major procedure.

Exactly what my wife & I faced 2 weeks ago. Our baby girl was due on Nov 18th, and on 15th night my wife started to get some pains and we went to the hospital.
The doctor had everything planned for a normal delivery,and didn't even give us an option of the c-section.Worked for us, since the recovery is mught quicker with a normal delivery.
Anyway, after 2 hrs of pushing, the baby wasn't coming out.I could see her head, and the doc said the pelivc bone is at an angle that prevents the baby from coming out.Intense pressure leads to the head shaping like a cone (also called conehead), and that can cause serious damage to the baby's brain. The doc said that we can try pushing for 2 hrs more, but nothing would happen. So my wife was rushed in for a c-section and the baby was delivered on 16th evening.
My wife lost a lot of blood during the procedure, and was asked to stay in the hospital for 5 days.We got back home the Friday of the same week, and thank God both mom & baby are doing fine now.

Given a choice, a normal delivery is the way to go unless certain complications arise, in which case there's no short cuts and the c-section has to be performed.

[vivekiny2k]

Originally Posted by Nitin

Exactly what my wife & I faced 2 weeks ago.

Hope you guys are back to normalcy. congratulations!

Originally Posted by prince_pervez

Agreed, though the last point is arguable. I 'heard' that there can be max 2 babies safely delivered under C-Section ? How true is that.

Yes, the risk is minimized by placing the incision (sometimes a vertical incision is made if either two have already been made or the first one takes a critical space). and uterus keeps getting weaker because of scars. But how many does one need anyway?

[prince_pervez]

Originally Posted by vivekiny2k

Yes, the risk is minimized by placing the incision (sometimes a vertical incision is made if either two have already been made or the first one takes a critical space). and uterus keeps getting weaker because of scars. But how many does one need anyway?

I was talking to a gynac yesterday and she said generally 3 were safe under the knife. But depends on person to person as well.

How many does one need anyway ? That depends how a person sees it. Joy and love of kids and offspring or monetery benefit/burden or possible population explosion

Also, just for info, there are some hospitals that charge double for a C-section than a normal delivery and there are other very good and dedicated to pregnancy ones who charge 20% more which was surprising to me. This is in Bangalore itself.