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Old 19th December 2018, 06:49   #11206
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Dhoni was a captain who lost a dozen test matches in quick succession and refused to accept any responsibility for it. His foolish selection of bowlers in England resulted in him bowling several overs in a match with his awkward comical action making a mockery of Indian cricket. His captaincy was indifferent at best, anyone with knowledge of the game can tell. His dislike for established players was evident and was lucky that that Chappell laid the foundation for a new look team India. Kohli may be OTT but is an involved and committed cricketer.
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Old 19th December 2018, 07:49   #11207
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What a variety of views on this thread - I wonder how come most of these went silent when we won the last match

We royally screwed up on the Perth match be it selection or the way we performed across several segments - it'll be interesting to see who gets picked for the Melbourne test, and who gets dropped. Any update on Ashwin's status? Shaw is ruled out for all the remainder of the tests so that's another blow.

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Originally Posted by snaseer View Post
Some reports are suggesting Kohli sledged Paine by telling," I am the best batsmen in the world whereas you are just a stand in captain ! "
Mind sharing which reports - google search throws up results that state he didn't say such a quote. I guess they might have been removed, but do share.

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Originally Posted by fiestarry View Post
Dhoni was a captain who lost a dozen test matches in quick succession and refused to accept any responsibility for it. His foolish selection of bowlers in England resulted in him bowling several overs in a match with his awkward comical action making a mockery of Indian cricket. His captaincy was indifferent at best, anyone with knowledge of the game can tell. His dislike for established players was evident and was lucky that that Chappell laid the foundation for a new look team India
Hahahaha Excellent use of sarcasm! Chappell laid the foundation - ROTFL!

Oh wait, you were serious?

Last edited by ninjatalli : 19th December 2018 at 07:51.
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Old 19th December 2018, 09:58   #11208
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Mind sharing which reports - google search throws up results that state he didn't say such a quote. I guess they might have been removed, but do share.


It was all over the internet, but was later clarified officially by BCCI that this did not happen.

https://scroll.in/field/906184/virat...tim-paine-bcci
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Old 19th December 2018, 10:59   #11209
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Originally Posted by ninjatalli View Post
What a variety of views on this thread - I wonder how come most of these went silent when we won the last match
Because we won the all important toss & batted first!
Something which somewhat guarantees a win if you see the record in the last dozen tests played. Not counting the Ind-WI test here.

Last edited by aah78 : 19th December 2018 at 18:23. Reason: Fixed on request.
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Old 19th December 2018, 11:25   #11210
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^^Actually good point - I was wondering the same today. And this has been a point of discussion in the past - I remember reading someone (Harsha Bhogle maybe?) giving a view that we should do away with the toss with something more different.

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It was all over the internet, but was later clarified officially by BCCI that this did not happen.
I'm guessing whatsapp fueled "fake" news; if a reputable news agency had mentioned it in their articles, chances are they would have retracted their statement with an apology. Things like these get blown out of proportion (or out of nothing); especially when we don't win. And here on this thread we come with our (negative/) critic view immediately

Last edited by ninjatalli : 19th December 2018 at 11:28.
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Old 19th December 2018, 11:49   #11211
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Originally Posted by PPS View Post
Something which somewhat guarantees a win if you see the record in the last dozen tests played.
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Originally Posted by ninjatalli View Post
^^Actually good point - I was wondering the same today.
There is a nice writeup on this topic

http://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/...toss-win-match
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Old 19th December 2018, 12:03   #11212
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Originally Posted by ninjatalli View Post
What a variety of views on this thread - I wonder how come most of these went silent when we won the last match
India played very well in the last game. VK should not cross any lines and I think he's the not the best captain.

For the third test, I think Pujara should open with Vijay. Hardik Pandya should come at no 7 as an all-rounder. If Ashwin is not available, I think we should give Kuldeep a chance.
My ideal 11:
1. Pujara
2. Vijay
3. Kohli
4. Rahane
5. Vihari
6. Pant
7. Pandya
8. Ashwin/Kuldeep
9. Shami
20. Bumrah
11. Ishant

Last edited by landcruiser123 : 19th December 2018 at 12:05.
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Old 19th December 2018, 12:07   #11213
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Too many different views. Let me share mine.
Win the toss win the match has been going on all this year and not only just us, all teams are following this pattern. Even in England we could have won more if toss was in our favor. Coming to this match. We lost cos of various factors.

1. Selection blunder. I mentioned it on day 1. Jadeja for Vihari and Bhuvi for Umesh was the right pick. Not only it strengthens the batting but we could have bowled Aussies out cheaply in both innings.

2. Non existent tail. This is the worst tail I have ever seen.

3. Not playing a spinner. Lyon showed how stupid our selection was and to top it Kohli is still defending it.

4. That brings me to the most important point. Arrogance of Kohli/Shastri combo. The way Mr. Shastri was beating his drums after first test win I knew we gonna lose next one badly and probably others too. They refuse to see cricketing logic and carry on with their Bigheadness.

No accountability. No one from bcci asking the captain and coach to explain the ridiculous selection in SA, England and now Australia. Even Sunny G has questioned it now. Stating if we lose the series the role of Captain and Coach should be assessed. But, bcci and selectors are still sleeping. If nothing changes we gonna lose by 3-1.

This should be the team next match.
Mayank
Parthiv
Pujara
Kohli
Rahane
Vihari
Pant
Ashwin/jadeja
Shami
Ishant
Bumrah

Or open with Pujara and play extra bowler or batsman down the order.

But knowing Kohli and his Random Team Generator let's see what happens.
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Old 19th December 2018, 13:57   #11214
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Originally Posted by harry10 View Post
This should be the team next match.
Mayank
Parthiv
Pujara
Kohli
Rahane
Vihari
Pant
Ashwin/jadeja
Shami
Ishant
Bumrah
Almost perfect. People advocating the inclusion of Pandya are clueless. He is a class A bits and pieces hack, a complete waste of space in tests.

In your above team, I will replace Ishant with Bhuvneshwar - that gives us extra lower order batting strength and variety in bowling. I will also play Kuldeep over Ashwin/Jadeja. A leg spinner is always an attacking option and the Aussie batting looks brittle on paper.
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Old 19th December 2018, 14:26   #11215
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Almost perfect. People advocating the inclusion of Pandya are clueless
Absolutely. As far as tests are concerned, Pandya is a over-hyped player, he's a Bits-and-Pieces stuff, not good enough for tests.
Also good to see that list does'nt include Rohit.
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Old 19th December 2018, 14:33   #11216
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Originally Posted by Oxy View Post
Almost perfect. People advocating the inclusion of Pandya are clueless. He is a class A bits and pieces hack, a complete waste of space in tests.

In your above team, I will replace Ishant with Bhuvneshwar - that gives us extra lower order batting strength and variety in bowling. I will also play Kuldeep over Ashwin/Jadeja. A leg spinner is always an attacking option and the Aussie batting looks brittle on paper.
Pandya is overrated! Kuldeep may come in for the Sydney Test as a second spinner. For the MCG Test, Ashwin is still my pick as the my lone spinner. Bhuvaneshwar for Ishant will be a good change since Ishant looks like he could do with some rest.

Ashwin is an enigma. He seems to have so many variations, that at times, I feel he should stick to his stock balls. Yet again there are times when he locks up all those variations in the cupboard and looks very predictable. He looks like a spinner who needs really favourable conditions to do well, unlike greats like Warne, Muralitharan, Kumble. Lyon looks so much more penetrative when he is bowling on the same pitch. Australia never dropped Warne for another quickie no matter how spin unfriendly the deck was. A quality spinner brings so much to the table in a test match.
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Old 19th December 2018, 14:49   #11217
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Maybe our team is selected on basis of instagram account.
Why on earth was Pandya selected now? What had he done in England tour to justify his selection?

Also what made them select Rohit Sharma for tests? How much do they want to test his Talent in tests.
Bhuvaneshwar who played like an allrounder in SA, is still warming bench.

KL Rahul should be sent back by ship to India as punishment
I agree with most that Ashwin cannot perform up to expectation overseas, its time to give Jaddu a chance.
I feel in next test , we should open with Mayank Agarwal and Ravi Shastri

Last edited by silverado : 19th December 2018 at 14:54.
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Old 19th December 2018, 14:55   #11218
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Pandya, KL Rahul, Pant are all Kohli cronies and by default get long ropes or repetitive recalls even if they have nothing to show for it. It's easy to see even as an outsider who has no knowledge of dressing room dynamics.

Parthiv is a better choice as a keeper as he can also be a quick scoring opener. Let Pant play some more Ranji cricket to get his batting temperament right.

Yes, Silverado has a good point. Maybe its based on instagram. Only cool guys get to play.

Last edited by rovingeye : 19th December 2018 at 14:57.
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Old 19th December 2018, 15:26   #11219
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There was no fight or resilience from any of the players, barring Kohli and maybe Pujara and Vihari. Rahane showed us glimpses of brilliance but they were only glimpses.

For example, in the 1st innings, we were in a commanding position at 220-230 odd for 4. We could have gotten much closer to the target or maybe even surpassed it, had Rahane stuck around for a little longer. Instead, we scored about 50 runs and threw away 6 wickets. That was the turning point in the game for me!
This is something for the likes of Vihari and Pant to answer. They are being given these golden chances to prove themselves and establish themselves in the side.

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And as for the attitude of the Indian players, the less said the better.

I mean, it's perfectly alright to be aggressive. Sledge, if you must! But back it up with some substance!

Individual achievements are worth zilch when your team continues to fail.
I am not sure if we can say team is continuing to fail! We have actually started winning while touring, something that happened only once in blue moon in not too distant past. I've been following cricket for last 25 years or so and I have not known Indian team winning anything on overseas tours most of my life.

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And being the skipper, his responsibility is not to just score hundreds and set the field. It's a lot more than that!

I hate to say this and it pains me to no end, but I feel the purple patch that Kohli is wallowing in at the moment is the reason for his arrogance. What he needs is a humbling experience. Nobody is larger than the game. Not Lara, not Tendulkar, not Bradman and certainly not Kohli!

This is just shocking and totally unprofessional.
So what is the responsibility of Kohli here? Is he asking our openers to fail consistently (it doesnt matter who opens. they all conspire to fail every time). Is he to blame for our middle order not offering any spine? What is he supposed to do when the supposedly world class players (who average more than 50) remarkably forget their skills in SA/Aus/Eng.

I really dont have problem with Kohli's arrogance. The guy is backing it up with his performance which is all I can ask for. He was made captain of the team and so he cannot be seen criticizing his team mates in public. He has to back them publicly every time. Thats the part of job of being captain. I think he shouldnt be made scapegoat for others failures. cricket is a team game and its high time others also start performing.
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Old 19th December 2018, 15:45   #11220
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Originally Posted by joslicx View Post
I am not sure if we can say team is continuing to fail! We have actually started winning while touring, something that happened only once in blue moon in not too distant past. I've been following cricket for last 25 years or so and I have not known Indian team winning anything on overseas tours most of my life.
I agree. This is the most competitive we have been overseas (outside Asia) for a long long time. Maybe 2003 was a tad better, but nothing to choose between the two IMO.

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So what is the responsibility of Kohli here? Is he asking our openers to fail consistently (it doesnt matter who opens. they all conspire to fail every time). Is he to blame for our middle order not offering any spine? What is he supposed to do when the supposedly world class players (who average more than 50) remarkably forget their skills in SA/Aus/Eng.
Partially agree again. The batting has let him down. But is that because of his inconsistent team selection ? I think yes.


Quote:
I really dont have problem with Kohli's arrogance. The guy is backing it up with his performance which is all I can ask for. He was made captain of the team and so he cannot be seen criticizing his team mates in public. He has to back them publicly every time. Thats the part of job of being captain. I think he shouldnt be made scapegoat for others failures. cricket is a team game and its high time others also start performing.
100% agree.
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