[redCherry]

To each his own ... Anyway, my point is that :

1. I am not saying Anderson is a saint, just that they should have got him quietly bowling normally. And yes, I agree they were playing within the rules.

2. I didn't see any of our bowlers trying to bounce Root regularly, or get his wicket trying different things (he averages 60, his highest against any country), but they were peppering no. 11 bunny with lot of bouncers.
In all probability, this was the trigger to all the banter that followed later between these teams.

3. Just because some other team did that to us doesn't have to make us do the same..

Just my thoughts, feel free not to agree.

[Emvi]

While this is easily one of the best moments in Indian cricket history, this also has to be one of the most hilarious moments on a cricket field.





Look at Mr. Anderson, holding his pose for photographers . While he was occupied in figuring out how Siraj managed to breach his SOLID defence and knock off his bails, Siraj had already moved past him celebrating and up'root'ing one of his rather woeful looking stumps. Even that did not stop Jimmy from holding his PERFECT pose for a little longer.

https://youtu.be/Y1J9_9-vNcU

[Chetan_Rao]

Originally Posted by Emvi

...
Look at Mr. Anderson, holding his pose for photographers . While he was occupied in figuring out how Siraj managed to breach his SOLID defence and knock off his bails, Siraj had already moved past him celebrating and up'root'ing one of his rather woeful looking stumps. Even that did not stop Jimmy from holding his PERFECT pose for a little longer...

Having been there more times than I care to remember (as a lowly amateur club cricketer, of course), it's a very natural reaction, and nothing to do with a specific person's ability at the task. You'll find plenty of specialist batsmen, even the best in the world, stay still for a moment before they walk away from a disappointing dismissal.

As a tail-end batsman, it's usually not your fault if you're the difference between a win/draw and a loss, as you're probably there because someone far better equipped at the task failed to hang in there, and you're now in the middle up against often hopeless odds.

Even so, it takes nothing away from not wanting to be the last person to fail, the last defense to fall. You are, you want to be, the last guy to hold fort (when you often can barely wield a bat properly) and somehow defy the odds.

Sometimes you pull it off (been there too), and it feels like a million bucks even in an amateur game that often nobody is watching, it must be an indescribable rush at the sport's highest level with millions watching. When you fail, you're just frozen in the moment, wishing for anything except the one thing that just happened, what you just let happen. Then you realize it did happen, and you drag yourself off the field to fight another day.

It's a few seconds in real time, while some watching sympathize, some empathize, and some just find it amusing. It feels like an eternity for the person frozen in the moment who's fought long and hard (sometimes for several days) to avoid what just happened. Then it passes.

There's a reason this one below is an iconic image. It's often seen as an image of Flintoff consoling Lee, but it's much more than that. It's two men who've both been on either side of that image, and know how exactly each feels.

[Emvi]

Originally Posted by Chetan_Rao

Having been there more times than I care to remember (as a lowly amateur club cricketer, of course), it's a very natural reaction, and nothing to do with a specific person's ability at the task. You'll find plenty of specialist batsmen, even the best in the world, stay still for a moment before they walk away from a disappointing dismissal.

You are right, it's a natural reaction. Anderson is not the first one do it and won't be the last one. Having played the game a little bit and watched it many more, I completely get your point. Its just that Anderson was at the receiving end and the backdrop made me think what I did. England were lording the game till the 5th morning and we all know Lord's is Anderson's happy hunting ground. He wouldn't even have dreamt of the situation he had to endure that evening. Again, that resigned/stunned look from him, backdrop and all the drama was enough for me to find it amusing. I thoroughly enjoyed it .

There's a reason this one below is an iconic image. It's often seen as an image of Flintoff consoling Lee, but it's much more than that. It's two men who've both been on either side of that image, and know how exactly each feels.

Attachment 2195066

Iconic moment for sure. I had watched this moment live on television back then and it's still fresh in my memories.

[searacer932]

Originally Posted by redCherry

To each his own ... Anyway, my point is that :

1. I am not saying Anderson is a saint, just that they should have got him quietly bowling normally. And yes, I agree they were playing within the rules.

2. I didn't see any of our bowlers trying to bounce Root regularly, or get his wicket trying different things (he averages 60, his highest against any country), but they were peppering no. 11 bunny with lot of bouncers.
In all probability, this was the trigger to all the banter that followed later between these teams.

3. Just because some other team did that to us doesn't have to make us do the same..

Just my thoughts, feel free not to agree.

Root can play bouncers. Anderson can't. You bowl to people according to their weakness 😉

[PPS]

Anderson might be the greatest swing bowler of the modern era but he's well known for his antics. He had allegedly pushed Jadeja near the dressing room several years back!

https://www.hindustantimes.com/crick...Z0DmsYTQO.html

[gloriole]

Interesting article in The Guardian by Jonathan Liew on the Lord’s test and Anderson- Bumrah incident

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/bl...at-kohli-image

And absolute gem by Mukul Kesavan
https://www.ndtv.com/opinion/opinion...-2512341?amp=1

[Chetan_Rao]

Originally Posted by PPS

Anderson might be the greatest swing bowler of the modern era but he's well known for his antics...

That was absolutely disgusting! Technical ability, sporting merit and/or stature are absolutely no excuse for horrible behavior.

Cricket has had its low moments historically, but it appears to now be going in a general direction that doesn't sit well with me. Or maybe I'm just a dinosaur stuck in another era that needs to find something else to watch that aligns with my sensibilities.

New Zealand seem to be the holdovers retaining a semblance of this being (or once having been) the gentleman's game, but it's more exception than rule these days.

P.S. Anyone interested in a good read/watch on cricket's intersection with colonialism, Fire in Babylon is well-recommended, both the 2010 documentary and the namesake 2016 book. It's centered around the rise of West Indies as a cricketing giant in the post-colonial era, but the general observations apply far beyond just the Caribbean maestros.

[whencut86]

The mighty Windies got their title not because of mollycoddling the batsmen but because of their bowling. There was not much of protective gear when facing the Windies pace quartet in those times. They never sledged but showed in in their bowling be it top order or lower order. They peppered the lower order with balls around the rib cage region and scary bouncers during those times.

There is absolutely nothing wrong in bowling bouncers to the lower order batsmen. Shardul Thakur was warned by local Aus umpires during our recent Aus tour for intimidatory bowling to Cummins/Starc. Mind you, Cummins at Starc at over 6 feet height, the ball from Shardul at 130-140 KMPH barely made it to their rib cage region. But there was no warning when Aus bowlers bowled bouncers to Natarajan repeatedly.

There was no talk of intimidation when Pujara was getting sprayed with short deliveries and his ribs were targeted during the Aus tour. This was a 5th day pitch and Aus bowlers with their height were able to get the ball to rise even when it was pitched closer to the batsmen. He got hit on his thumb and was wincing in pain but he still stared back aggressively at the bowlers when the next bouncers hit his rib cage and back. Pujara may not respond with words but those stares conveyed what words could not have conveyed effectively. Not everyone is a Pujara in the team and everyone will have their own ways of responding to sledging from opposition.

I have been a critic of Kohli's batting form and his captaincy tactics for a long time but to be fair to him he has matured over the years when it comes to aggression. He doesn't pick fights like earlier but when someone from opposition intimidates him or any other junior member, he responds in kind. He doesn't go overboard and leaves all banter on the field. This was a guy who was very aggressive and in the face of opposition years earlier, urging the crowd not to boo Smith but cheer for India during the World Cup match. A lot has changed over the years and I find this aggression and attitude acceptable in today's standards.

We have seen the different kinds of aggression from Indian cricketers over the years.
1. No response when sledging and not much aggressive and end up on the losing side.
2. A Zen like calmness with aggression in the game. Very few like Sachin, Sehwag, Dhoni, Dravid or Pujara display it. This is very tough for the newer lot to adapt to.
3. An overt display of aggression on the field which sometimes is initiated by our side as well. Something Gambhir or Kohli in their earlier years used to display on field.
4. A restrained aggression and a must win attitude. Never initiate sledging but give it back in equal measure or more when intimidated.

The current team does it as per point no.4 which I don't see any issues with. They are not like the Aus or Eng teams sledging opponents. This new found restrained aggression is helping us win abroad and stick it back to them when we are at the receiving end. I see no harm in this as long as we don't overdo it like Aussies or we do not let it get to our heads and leave everything on the field.

[Turbokick]

Originally Posted by Chetan_Rao

There's a reason this one below is an iconic image. It's often seen as an image of Flintoff consoling Lee, but it's much more than that. It's two men who've both been on either side of that image, and know how exactly each feels.

Attachment 2195066

Somehow I would beg differ in comparing both the incidents where Australia almost won the match from a hopeless situation because of the heroics of Lee and Kasprowicz. That moment was iconic where everyone including the rival team acknowledged the 'never say die attitude' of the Australian team.


English team at Lord's was just the case of diametric opposite. They gave up from a winning (or a strong) position on Day 5 after being the better side for previous 3 days. What happened to Anderson was inevitable for the kind of slaughter caused by Indian pace attack to the English line up. Anderson or Wood were not going to save them the match by playing 8-9 overs.

[harry10]

Originally Posted by Chetan_Rao

There's a reason this one below is an iconic image. It's often seen as an image of Flintoff consoling Lee, but it's much more than that. It's two men who've both been on either side of that image, and know how exactly each feels.

Attachment 2195066

It's indeed an iconic moment. I saw the whole series live and this moment was the best of it. The spirit showed by Flintoff to console Lee when whole team was celebrating was commendable. We need more such moments in our sports.

Originally Posted by searacer932

Root can play bouncers. Anderson can't. You bowl to people according to their weakness ��

Precisely. Likewise England bowlers don't bowl many bouncers to Kohli cos they know he will tackle them easily and hence bowl him at outside off stump which is his weak area.

Originally Posted by PPS

Anderson might be the greatest swing bowler of the modern era but he's well known for his antics. He had allegedly pushed Jadeja near the dressing room several years back!

https://www.hindustantimes.com/crick...Z0DmsYTQO.html

Like I said. Anderson is one of the biggest pricks in world cricket and that's why he isn't respected after being a legend of the game.

Originally Posted by Chetan_Rao

Cricket has had its low moments historically, but it appears to now be going in a general direction that doesn't sit well with me. Or maybe I'm just a dinosaur stuck in another era that needs to find something else to watch that aligns with my sensibilities.

Time have indeed changed. Difference in this India led by Kohli is before they used to take sledges and move on, now they give it equally back. Till it's banter and stays on field it's fine by me. Abuses and physical contact is a big no and should be monitor better by Umpires.

[Chetan_Rao]

Originally Posted by Turbokick

Somehow I would beg differ in comparing both the incidents...

There was no comparison made or intended.

The post in question is entirely about a tail-ender's mindset at being the last line of defense, nothing else.

...Anderson or Wood were not going to save them the match by playing 8-9 overs...

Did not in this instance, but that is the beauty of the sport. You never say never, and you never really know until the last defense is breached and the scorecard confirms you've won or lost. Remember the 1996 Titan Cup game Vs. Australia where Javagal Srinath & Anil Kumble batted India to victory from 8 down and needing 50-odd runs in less than 10 overs? That wasn't supposed to happen either. People were walking out of the stadium, but I believe one of the players mothers (don't remember whose. Edit: Google confirms it was Anil's mother and grandma) were in the stands, cheering.

Nobody expected Bumrah & Shami to put on the 89-run stand they did. But they did, and it arguably won the game. Nor was the Ashes test that picture is from expected to get as close as it eventually did. But it did.

[Eddy]

Good news is that Rahul Dravid has re-applied for his NCA position and is likely to continue.

With Ravi Shastri and team not keen to continue after their tenure ends in Oct 21, it will most likely be a foreign coach for Team India. Bharath Arun will be a big loss.

Tom Moody, Hessen...

[harry10]

Originally Posted by Eddy

Good news is that Rahul Dravid has re-applied for his NCA position and is likely to continue.

With Ravi Shastri and team not keen to continue after their tenure ends in Oct 21, it will most likely be a foreign coach for Team India. Bharath Arun will be a big loss.

Tom Moody, Hessen...

It would have been great if RD was our coach but he isn't keen on it so not possible.

Would be great to have Shastri back in comms box. I am sick and tired of Manjrekar, Shiva, Ajay Jadeja, Murali kartik.

I hope Hessen gets it. He is a thinking guy and his work with NZ was really good. Plus as Kohli is captain and Hessen is already coaching RCB he will get Kohli vote easily.

[AZT]

All this talk of bouncers and body line bowling reminded me of the 'Fire in Babylon' trailer. Video still gives me the chills.

https://youtu.be/WlCZwIOK-do