[shuvc]

Originally Posted by vamsi.kona

I am a person who believes in sticking with the team and support it in thick and thin. But sometimes, the way they surrender hurts a lot. Like in this match, from a commanding position to a position of no hope to abject surrender. I don't mind losing but not this way.

+1 to that. It's incredible when a test team finds it difficult to last a 1-day match duration of 50 overs. Given that they had 1.5 days time. The least they could have done was to make the English bowlers toil a bit.

[Hatari]

Going 2-0 down is a tough one to digest. All is not lost though.
If we have Zaheer, Gauti and Sehwag back for the 3rd test.
I do believe we can make it 2-1. Wtihout being able to field our best side we do not stand a chance against the opposition who are in the form of their life.

The first blatant mistake is that the Test series is held prior to the One dayers.
One dayers can be used to acclimatise (since there was only 1 warm game against Somerset)

The time will then come to analyse what went wrong.
I for one feel the BCCI's approach to test cricket has a lot to do with this result.
There is far too much One day and T-20 cricket being played as they are financially far more remunarative.
Therein lies the problem.

Think 5 years ahead, with the Team sans Dravid, Laxman and Tendulkar and nobody even close to filling their shoes.
Is the Board doing its bit to groom future Test cricketers?
One series in West Indies is far from sufficient.

[safari_lover]

It looks like a long time back when India scored more than 300 in a Test innings!
Even on the Windies tour the scores weren't huge.
There in lies the problem, IMO.

[srishiva]

Originally Posted by Hatari

Is the Board doing its bit to groom future Test cricketers?
One series in West Indies is far from sufficient.

They will keep using IPL to identify players to play tests. They need to change the wickets and concentrate on Ranji to get the next gen test players.

They took players like Kohli direct from playing T20 and then one day into playing tests on challenging tracks.

If the tests were played on Indian soil, we would we talking about promising next gen test players and how we are ready to replace the batting trio

[harry10]

I can see few major reasons for the performance-
1.- Injuries to key players - Zaheer- the main strike bowler would have made a huge difference in wrapping the tail. Sehwag- one player who can change the whole game in a session. Gambhir- After Dravid he is the one who can bat a day to save the match.

2.- IPL- Whatever anyone says if all these players would had not played it they would have been fresh for WI and hence better prepared for ENG series. All the players who missed the WI series are out of form or injured. I admire the Aussie players for missing the t20 tournaments to be ready for Test series which is more important anyday.

3.- Gary Kirsten- It cant be a coincidence that the first major series we play withour Kirsten(not counting the WI series as it wasnt a major one) and we are losing it. This shows the tremendous contribution of kirsten and Fletcher may take a lot of time to turn things around. Unfortunate.

4.- Lack of a genuine allrounder- 1billion people and we cant have one decent allrounder, amazing! The main difference between 2 teams was the runs contributed by the bowlers.

5.- Dhoni- He is not a Test batsman. Never was. His technique on seaming wickets is too pathetic. However he holds the crucial number 7 position and if he doesnt holds that end up out fragile tail is exposed. Look at priors contributions and then Dhoni's. Huge difference. Even his keeping has been pathetic along with his captaincy in this series.

6.- Fourth bowler- we cant ask more from sree,pravin and ishant. They are trying there best but why the hell is Bhajji in the team. Why cant we be bold enough to play a fourth seamer in Munaf on seaming tracks or include Mishra who atleast can spin the bowl and is a leg spinner and traditionally eng was never good in playing leg spin. Huge tactical mistake.

i will be surprised if India can draw even one match let alone win any if all this isnt corrected asap.

As much i hate to admit Eng deserves to be No.1 on their current form.

[Daewood]

Originally Posted by markiv

Badly need Veeru back. More than anyone else, he is the guy who has made this team world beater.

You need batsmen with sound technique (i.e foot movement, straight bat, etc) to counter the swinging ball. That has been the reason for the failure of Rainas and Dhonis in England. The slam-bang variety cannot succeed in this Test series.

It's time to chuck out all these guys, atleast for the Test matches in foreign soil.
Maybe they can be given chances for Test series in the sub-continent, where the pitches are batter-friendly.

[esteem_lover]

Originally Posted by comfortablynumb

55/4 - could someone help me get my foot out of my mouth please?

Cheers,
Vikram

Shastri & Harsha were talking as if this was the end of the world and were even having a running commentary of sehwag's movements. He is taking the flight as we speak, he is ordering for a drink as we go for tea..blah blah blah.... What Dravid, Sachin, Laxman could not do together, is sehwag going to do in one match ?

[joslicx]

So a couple of losses and everybody is jumping for the Gun!

We seem to forget this Eng team beat Australians in Australia 3-1!

A lot more of preparation was required which, thanks to the back-to-back WC, IPL and WI series, wasnt properly done. Eng are in the form of their life, even the likes of Prior (who was routinely criticized in English media and called for dropping) are freely scoring runs. On the other hand, we have a pathetic bowling attack, which cannot even properly take advantage of these bowler friendly conditions (414 runs conceded in a single day!!!)

Rant as you much, these are the same guys who extolled us to No. 1 ranking. 1 or 2 games wont make them as bad as some here are painting them to be!!!

[WindRide]

India is probably the worst No.1 Test team ever.
Imagine sitting at the same table as the Windies of 70's/80s and Aussies of 90s.
Gosh!!

1. Dhoni has no right playing Tests. He is at best a lucky chap who can play scratchy one-day cricket with atrocious technique.
2. Persevere with Yuvraj by dangling the test captaincy carrot before him. Discipline the chap first.
3. Zaheer is on his last legs, literally. Also he's started to resemble Ranatunga. Anyone noticed the paunch he carries nowadays? Give the poor soul a proper send-off party.
4. Send Bhajji back to play for punjab/harayana/wherever in Ranji. He hasn't "made it large".
5. Who "let Sreesanth out"? As long as he takes wickets, i ain't complainin' . But keep him in chains, for sanity sake.
6. Time for Tendulkar to stop being obsessed with the record book and start thinking of post-cricket days. Indian Racing League (IRL) looks right up his alley.

[karanraheja]

Originally Posted by WindRide

India is probably the worst No.1 Test team ever.

We have just lost 2 Test matches and so much criticism from all sides. I thinks its better for Indian Team to stay at No. 2 to stay away from the No.1 limelight. We have always been slow starters while touring abroad . Batting was always our strength but we didnt prove it in last 2 series. Lets hope we go with full strength and try winning the next match.

I think the team changes for next match should be Sehwag/Mukund , Zaheer/Praveen, Gambhir/Bhajji. These conditions dont seem to be assisting spin and Bhajji cant spin anyways. Yuvi and Raina can atleast bowl 10 overs when required . So i feel this might be a better composition.

Originally Posted by markiv

Badly need Veeru back. More than anyone else, he is the guy who has made this team world beater.

Viru can make a huge difference to our team , YES ! But lets not put to much pressure on him ! He can either get out for a duck with a useless shot or score a brisk century.

[RX135]

Originally Posted by Daewood

You need batsmen with sound technique (i.e foot movement, straight bat, etc) to counter the swinging ball. That has been the reason for the failure of Rainas and Dhonis in England. The slam-bang variety cannot succeed in this Test series.

Originally Posted by esteem_lover

What Dravid, Sachin, Laxman could not do together, is sehwag going to do in one match ?

I am not a big fan of "slam-bang" batting of T20 style. And whatever you said about Sehwag, was probably true when he arrived on international scene.

Everyone thought that someone like Sehwag, who relies purely on "hand-eye" coordination without any remote semblance of footwork, will fail miserably once he goes on seaming/bouncing wickets. Perfectly logical, but proved wrong time and again!

I recall, he was the only man, who scored bucketful runs on unplayable fast seaming New Zealand wickets, where everyone else struggled to stay afloat. For all his deficiencies, this man has amazing reflexes and hand-eye coordination. Most importantly, before he falls to a jaffa on an unplayable track, he has already scored enough runs for his team. Even when he doesn't score too many, he leaves bowlers devastated with his onslaught and messes up their minds/line/length, which following batsmen often capitalize on.

True, he can't do it all by himself (which he does at times), but he can be a great catalyst.

[WindRide]

Honestly, is Sehwag the guy you want beside you in the trenches when facing enemy flak?

Sehwag is more of an entertainment factor. Any runs he scores is to be considered only as a bonus. If he clicks, fanstatic! Else, ho hum .. well.

Sehwag is NOT the silver bullet that will solve this team's woes.

[joslicx]

Originally Posted by WindRide

Honestly, is Sehwag the guy you want beside you in the trenches when facing enemy flak?

Sehwag is more of an entertainment factor. Any runs he scores is to be considered only as a bonus. If he clicks, fanstatic! Else, ho hum .. well.

Sehwag is NOT the silver bullet that will solve this team's woes.

Say what you want, he IS the biggest reason why we sit on that perch in test cricket!

There is no better sight in cricket than a Shehwag on song. And the guy, for all the entertainment factor, has nearly 3 triple hundreds and an average over 50! How many technically proficient batsman can boast of that?

[kaushik_s]

Somehow why I'm getting this feeling that some people are just waiting there, praying that Indian Team fails, so that they can swoop in and spew their venom on an online forum.
And to those who are asking about what different Sehwag (and Gambhir) would make. I guess better learn about what test cricket is and what is the importance of a good opening pair. The opening pair have the huge responsibility of playing that new ball and worn it out. If they fail to do so (which is what happened in these tests) then it's very difficult for the batsmen who come to bat after them. And yes, Sehwag and Gambhir together can make a lot of difference. And if some guys still think that he(Sehwag) is no better then they can themselves try to play the game and replace Sehwag and save the Indian Cricket team. And why one guy alone can't change the game (atleast to some extent)? I guess most of you've heard the names like Kapil Dev, Viv Richards or Richard Hadley?
Enough of this, I'm off this thread.

[NPV]

Let's be fair to the team. But let's not say there are no problems or give various reasons for the bad performance - we played bad cricket and deserved the result.
After India lost the first test, Ravi Shastri said we are slow starters and we usually lose the first test of the series and then bounce back - but we saw how the team 'bounced' back in the second test !
There are still 2 more tests to go and I believe that to prove we really are World #1 test team we should win both the remaining tests. This really seems to be the moment of truth for India's test team as well as from a ranking perspective.