[tsk1979]

Originally Posted by RoadSurfer

During all this, they were well behaved and I almost had a sympathy towards them since they get only 3-4 months for doing their business.

There are many places in India, where there are unemployed youths. Forget 3-4 months, these youths do not get even 1 month for doing their business. So is it okay, if local people(not govt) make a rule that unless all local youths are employed, outsiders cannot work there?
For example, if you are from outside Karnataka, but working in Bangalore, you should not be allowed to work, unless all people with your qualification are employed in Bangalore. Food for thought eh?

[mayankk]

Originally Posted by RoadSurfer

You are absolutely correct coolkurt. Taking your own private vehicle till Leh and other attractions in and around Leh is not at all a problem. Self drive cars can be taken only for reaching Leh. From Leh onwards, one needs to take a JK registered taxi or rent local bikes.

I will share my experience. We had hired a Zoomcar Scorpio from Delhi and our plan was to reach Leh by it and use local registered bikes or a taxi for Nubra valley and Pangong. But we used the Zoomcar for local sightseeing in Leh. At Thiksey when we parked our car, a local taxi guy first gave very suspicious looks to me and soon he came with 4 local drivers. One of them said that outside J&K vehicles apart from private ones are not allowed anywhere in Leh. I said that my Hotel owner has said it is ok to take a Zoomcar within Leh. To this he said that the information we got was wrong. So instead of getting into a debate, I immediately offered to park the car at the Hotel and visit other spots by a local taxi. Hearing this they also agreed and didn't do any harm to the vehicle. During all this, they were well behaved and I almost had a sympathy towards them since they get only 3-4 months for doing their business.

Well you gave him what he wanted, why would he not be "well behaved"?
He forced you to park your vehicle, he told you your information was wrong, he made you pay over and above what you had already paid for the rental, he ganged up on you with 4 other drivers. And you still have sympathy for him. I likes!

[RoadSurfer]

Originally Posted by tsk1979

There are many places in India, where there are unemployed youths. Forget 3-4 months, these youths do not get even 1 month for doing their business. So is it okay, if local people(not govt) make a rule that unless all local youths are employed, outsiders cannot work there?
For example, if you are from outside Karnataka, but working in Bangalore, you should not be allowed to work, unless all people with your qualification are employed in Bangalore. Food for thought eh?

Originally Posted by mayankk

Well you gave him what he wanted, why would he not be "well behaved"?
He forced you to park your vehicle, he told you your information was wrong, he made you pay over and above what you had already paid for the rental, he ganged up on you with 4 other drivers. And you still have sympathy for him. I likes!

Friends, I just said I almost felt sympathy. I agree with your views too, respect.
And none of them forced me to park my vehicle, instead I said it from my side. What do you feel I should have done in a new state where I don't know anyone?

[mayankk]

Not pointing any fingers at you.

Originally Posted by RoadSurfer

. What do you feel I should have done in a new state where I don't know anyone?

Precisely.
And they know it too.

[hserus]

Originally Posted by RoadSurfer

Friends, I just said I almost felt sympathy. I agree with your views too, respect.
And none of them forced me to park my vehicle, instead I said it from my side. What do you feel I should have done in a new state where I don't know anyone?

It is called Stockholm Syndrome - a very well known phenomenon usually seen in cases of kidnapping for example, where the victim starts feeling sympathy for their kidnapper. Presumably also the explanation for why the heroine in all those movies falls for the hero after he stalks her, threatens to commit suicide if she doesn't love him etc.

The implied blackmail - that if you don't pay them, and use your own vehicle instead of their hired cabs or bikes, either you and/or your vehicle will suffer some unspecified damage - is very much there in the background. And such blackmail deserves imprisonment by the local police, not any kind of sympathy or acceptance of their demands.

[RoadSurfer]

This is getting exaggerated a bit too much. I felt this because of the harsh conditions the Ladakhis including the car drivers live in. I know they all have born and grown up there and it is a very natural surrounding for them. But for a person like me, I was barely able to walk or talk fast at that altitude. And then apart from tourism and some other small means of employment what do these people have to look forward to. By saying this and also the above posts, in no way was I trying to validate their way of hijacking the roads and mindset of travellers. I felt this purely because of the above points mentioned. Now you call it some syndrome or something else is anyone's choice. My apologies for sounding like I support their way of doing things.

[asingh1977]

Originally Posted by himavanth_m

Hi All,
I am planning to take a friends Scorpio to Ladakh again. Unfortunately, my friend would not be travelling with us as his leave was not approved. However he was kind enough to loan his car for our trip considering our passion. I want to understand if I would face any issue due to this ban? I want to be very sure as I would be starting the drive on September 1st from Hyderabad and I would be traveling with the family with another friend. The Scorpio is a private vehicle on the name of the friend.
My concern is that the other alternative that I have which is a ritz does not have enough space for 4 people for 18 days.

I really appreciate any advice on this.

This is so outright weird. It is people taking the law in their own hands. Though from a technical PoV, does the owner of the RC (name on it), always have to be in the vehicle when it is driven, anywhere in India. How can people just stand on the side of the road and verify if the RC owner is actually in the vehicle. Only an official designated person from a road authority is eligible for this.

This is the problem with tourist destinations in India. There is this clannish offensive against tourists (am from Mussoorie) and ancillary accessories. The cabbies and even the local hot blooded boys, love to push and shove, number plates (and their owners) which are not UK07. It is subtle, but it can be seen. What they do not understand that: tourist season is a mere 4-5 months, and rest of the year they sit in the waning sun playing ludo or smoking beedis. If they harass the clients/customers in such manners they will sit 365 days and make hay. Or not even have money for that. As it is: most hill/mountain regions are littered with alcoholic problems and most of the men are delinquent and lazy hippies anyways. Living a degenerate lifestyle and not striving to up their ante to make better business --- ie modernize with the times. They will rather behave like hoodlums from the owl hoot and assert a right to earn (or fleece) from the dwindling and meager tourist populace.

Am sure Ladakh is going in this visage too. "Guest is God" is a sorry myth.

[hserus]

Originally Posted by RoadSurfer

This is getting exaggerated a bit too much. I felt this because of the harsh conditions the Ladakhis including the car drivers live in. I know they all have born and grown up there and it is a very natural surrounding for them.

Other than the weather that is the exact same situation with tourist only towns - where there is nothing but a particular tourist, religious or other destination without which the place would be just another small village.

Even if the attraction is year round, if you bring your own vehicle you will be fleeced. And if you rent their vehicle you will be fleeced even more.

They know full well that you are there for two or three days at the most, and are not at all likely to become a repeat customer of theirs, you would be back maybe one year later either in your own vehcile or using another cabbie.

So they have only those few short minutes / hours to fleece you, and fleece you they will, with a vengeance.

There is no incentive for them not to fleece you.

[Nilesh5417]

May sound OT but the pretext these guys are using to stop private vehicles from plying does touch some corner of my heart. These guys are no angels and leaving the taxi issue aside, somewhere it must be realized that tourists are increasingly turning ladakh into lonavala.

Why come to places like these abundant with pristine nature and spirituality to only park your cars, play loud music and drink? I was shocked to see pics of people riding their motorcycles in Pangong Tso. Am saddened to see bottles of alcohol being littered.

Ladakh is no more a bikers pilgrimage. Since the improvement in accessibility, its just become a weekend destination for people who don't care for what it really offers.

[ajayclicks]

Originally Posted by Nilesh5417

May sound OT but the pretext these guys are using to stop private vehicles from plying does touch some corner of my heart. These guys are no angels and leaving the taxi issue aside, somewhere it must be realized that tourists are increasingly turning ladakh into lonavala

Feel your pain, but we can't have a taxi mafia control and determine who gets in. If we have to restrict entry of people and vehicles, let's do it by all means, but scientifically, and officially. Charge an official "entry tax" and use that money to post guards to catch and fine litterbugs.

It is not like something like this has not been done- for instance- you can't take you car all the way to Matheran. Also, in hampi, you have to park your car a km away from the Vittala temple and either walk or take an electric buggy. Ditto for the area surrounding Taj Mahal.

In anycase, there is no reason to assume that things will be better if we let this mafia rule. On a trip to Hampi a few years back, the tourist guide was encouraging his clients (a group of foreigners) to create nuisance inside the Vittala temple complex to take pictures and selfies- 6-7 adults climbing up the stone chariot at once etc...

[coolkurt]

Originally Posted by RoadSurfer

You are absolutely correct coolkurt. Taking your own private vehicle till Leh and other attractions in and around Leh is not at all a problem. Self drive cars can be taken only for reaching Leh. From Leh onwards, one needs to take a JK registered taxi or rent local bikes.

I will share my experience. We had hired a Zoomcar Scorpio from Delhi and our plan was to reach Leh by it and use local registered bikes or a taxi for Nubra valley and Pangong. But we used the Zoomcar for local sightseeing in Leh. At Thiksey when we parked our car, a local taxi guy first gave very suspicious looks to me and soon he came with 4 local drivers. One of them said that outside J&K vehicles apart from private ones are not allowed anywhere in Leh. I said that my Hotel owner has said it is ok to take a Zoomcar within Leh. To this he said that the information we got was wrong. So instead of getting into a debate, I immediately offered to park the car at the Hotel and visit other spots by a local taxi. Hearing this they also agreed and didn't do any harm to the vehicle. During all this, they were well behaved and I almost had a sympathy towards them since they get only 3-4 months for doing their business.

What about Tso Moriri? Once we're done with Nubra and Pangong, can we drive a self drive to Tso Moriri as its on the way to sarchu and then manali post that?

[RoadSurfer]

Originally Posted by coolkurt

What about Tso Moriri? Once we're done with Nubra and Pangong, can we drive a self drive to Tso Moriri as its on the way to sarchu and then manali post that?

Sorry, I don't really know about Tso Moriri as we didn't plan for it this time. I would suggest you contact a few hotel owners and they might be able to give you the correct information or atleast help you to contact some relevant person.

[coolkurt]

Originally Posted by RoadSurfer

Sorry, I don't really know about Tso Moriri as we didn't plan for it this time. I would suggest you contact a few hotel owners and they might be able to give you the correct information or atleast help you to contact some relevant person.

I think I read somwhere that Tso Moriri is possible. The Union guys are concentrating on Pangong and Nubra. Moriri isn't on the usual tourist circuit yet. Most people stop enroute to their return journey to Manali.

Edit: Found it.

Link

[jacs]

From most of the posts in the final pages, can I conclude that its safe to drive private vehicles if owner is also present? RC Book ownership compared against a DL at the Union check-post is what I understand.

Season is approaching and I am all ears to know any latest developments or updates.

[coolkurt]

And to clarify, Self drive cars ARE allowed TILL Leh right? So I can use a Zoomcar hire, drive to Leh, park it in Leh and hire a local taxi for Nubra, Pangong etc?