[vickzkool]

To a question asked above on whether the OP would go to a driving test in US / UK wearing shorts , I would like to add my own experience, 8 Summers ago I went to my driving test here in UK in a simple tee and shorts as it was boiling hot on the day , my driving skills were being examined on the day and not my ability to please the examiner !! Similarly 3 years ago I went to my citizenship ceremony wearing a smart shirt and dark jeans ( not shabby but smartly dressed ) as I was happy to be seen in one as I was comfortable in that attire , the picture from the ceremony sits proudly in my living room and I have had not one of my native friends battle an eye lid , some may decide to criticize or judge me but to be honest it simply does not matter to me. On my visits to India during summers I'm mostly around in comfy clothing and if people decide to judge me or treat me differently cause of the way I dress then fair play as it is them who are losing out and not me !!

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by vickzkool

To a question asked above on whether the OP would go to a driving test in US / UK wearing shorts , I would like to add my own experience, 8 Summers ago I went to my driving test here in UK in a simple tee and shorts as it was boiling hot on the day , my driving skills were being examined on the day and not my ability to please the examiner !!

Didn't the RTO officer already answer this question?

'this is not a foreign country, it's Karnataka'

[vickzkool]

Originally Posted by Samurai

Didn't the RTO officer already answer this question?

'this is not a foreign country, it's Karnataka'

Hilarious !! Nice one Samurai , you got me there completely , however I was just answering another member's question few posts ago

[RogueRider]

I feel its absolutely normal for a person to wear shorts to any govt office, as long as he or she isnt working there, if they are then they ought to follow the dress code stipulated. Many women often wear sleeveless tops and this has become an accepted norm, but when a man wears sleeveless tops in govt offices he is frowned upon. I mean, I've seen people wearing shorts to churches, the place where once people only went in bow ties and long dresses. These govt servants need to keep up with the times, India is changing and Indian culture is also changing.

Originally Posted by Zappo

Ok, let me stick my neck out and say something which will probably get a few of the Bangalore members riled up. However, after having seen how the things are slowly becoming across KA and Bangalore in specific I am pretty certain that Bangalore specifically is very steadily becoming hostile and intolerant. Your view, my view, my city, your city you name it... Rioting, attacks on people, general hostility and an overall sense of strong-arm tactics being employed by anyone who has some power in some field is very common of late. Everyone is on a short fuse and everyone wants to prove a point out there! I wonder where this will all eventually lead up to!

I moved to Bangalore around 15 years ago with my family, I have had the same observation as you have stated, especially in the last 3-4 years. Like someone else pointed out it has to be the clash of cultures, We are scarily fond of regionalism, we are kannadiga's and tamilians first. We identify as Indians only when we leave the country. Even then we try to bond with people who speak the same language, hail from the same state ie, we look for things in common.

The rising hostility and aggressive temperament among the locals has to be attributed to the sudden influx of people from every corner of India and even from some other countries. The uninhibited pandering to the MNC's coupled with poor urban planning has literally crippled the city, a recent TOI article stated - there's a 125% increase in built up area between 2010 and 2014, 62% decrease in green cover, 85% decrease in water bodies, add the rising temperatures and vehicular traffic and one would feel this city would be 'unlivable' in the next 10 years. I'm not defending the attitudes of the locals, I don't condone it at all, I've seen people wanting to get into a fight for the silliest of reasons, Bangalore has well passed its glorious past, this is no longer the city it used to be.

[dgogold]

Going through the posts I found it quite hilarious! Some guy got a service denied for not wearing "proper" attire and here we are debating about our cultural strength, Indian unity in diversity, work ethics and what not. In a society we have to behave like social animals and that's the basis of it. I can't let my wife entertain guests coming to my house on a scorching summer day draped in thong bikinis just because she may feel comfortable in that clothing.

As pointed out before, Kurt Kobain married in pyjamas. This is an exception, Kobain also did banned substances, so did Jimmy Hendrix and a long list. So should we follow them? Why only stop at pyjamas? Why not take a gun to the mouth and pull the trigger? There is relativity and we can't ignore that. A pair of shorts or a boxer may look good in many places and might be odd in certain other. No point debating on things like this. Why I visited the RTO is to get some work done and that's my one and only goal. If I get hindered by my attire, or attitude or whatever it may be, I myself would not shift the focus from my work to the other issues. If I have loads of time and stamina and will power to create a mountain out of a molehill, I will definitely create such ado where I know a simple "sorry saar, won't ever happen again" might do some magic and get on with it.

What people wear or do its their choice, but place-time-person as we have a saying in our language, does matter a lot.

[shankar.balan]

Originally Posted by AWD

I follow a very simple logic, do what you feel is right & then take a stand on it. Im a principled man & appeasing babus or acting up to their whims & fancies would be the last thing I'd ever resort to.

Babus are just meant to do the work they are meant to do, its people who pamper their inflated egos that they act in a way the OP had to face. Simple & straight forward conclusion to the thread is "wear the kind of dress you desire to wear, people may judge you & the stereotypical society that India is will form opinions but all behind your back. When this comes in the way of your work, stand & fight for your right. Don't ever fall a victim, a prey to some corrupt, immoral, unjust babu/bureaucrat.

Its you who defines yourself & not your clothes or shoes or the accessories you wear. Your personality should shine through what you wear, in other words don't let your clothes wear you!

& remember its your life you are living, live the way you like or intend to, don't let others influence your ideas when you know you are on the right side.

Wear your attitude!

No one wants to appease anyone especially these Babus. However, my only submission is that the primary battle is to get your work done. Like a Chameleon, one needs to adapt to circumstances while still achieving your ends.
Hence, if it means that I don't wear T Shirt and Shorts to the Indian RTO, then so be it.

Originally Posted by vickzkool

To a question asked above on whether the OP would go to a driving test in US / UK wearing shorts , I would like to add my own experience, 8 Summers ago I went to my driving test here in UK in a simple tee and shorts as it was boiling hot on the day , my driving skills were being examined on the day and not my ability to please the examiner !! Similarly 3 years ago I went to my citizenship ceremony wearing a smart shirt and dark jeans ( not shabby but smartly dressed ) as I was happy to be seen in one as I was comfortable in that attire , the picture from the ceremony sits proudly in my living room and I have had not one of my native friends battle an eye lid , some may decide to criticize or judge me but to be honest it simply does not matter to me. On my visits to India during summers I'm mostly around in comfy clothing and if people decide to judge me or treat me differently cause of the way I dress then fair play as it is them who are losing out and not me !!

Most of the places abroad don't generally bat an eyelid at T shirt and Shorts depending on the weather conditions of course.
Here, there are lots of wheels within wheels - the background of the Babu. His level of frustration with life, his job etc. The general attitude of behaving like a Tin God and asserting authority over the poor tax paying members of the public, the work ethic in Governmental departments etc.
Finally, one wants to get one's work done in as Friction Free a manner as possible. If this dictates that one wears trousers and a shirt, I, for one, will be happy to conform, simply because there are better things to do in life, including lurking at home and reading a book and playing with my dogs, than to spend interminable red tape and hate filled hours in some blighted RTO or other similar preserve of the evil Indian Babu!

Pick your battles, like I said before!

[vb-saan]

It’s about awareness. Know your audience and act accordingly. We all do behavioral adjustments according to the people we meet. And it’s not just about India, but applicable all over the world.

[Sheel]

Going to a bank, a Govt office is different than going to a theater, mall or a restaurant.

How many of us wore shorts to our college, weren't we feeling hot then?

These things are totally dependent on you and your perspective.

I am self-employed, I can go to my work place wearing whatever I wish to, but I do not think I have ever wore shorts and gone to any site or my one room office.

As said by Shankar, know your audience and act accordingly. There are far better things to do.

[TD_GHY]

Originally Posted by Sheel

How many of us wore shorts to our college, weren't we feeling hot then?

While agreeing with the other points that we must try to dress according to the audience and situation, I would like to point out that there are several colleges in India where people indeed come in shorts (not underwear or bikinis as some people opined on not stopping at shorts alone). Enter into any classroom in a IIT/NIT/IIM/Central University and you'll find a lot of them in shorts without the Professors batting an eyelid. I'm sure there are other colleges too.

Clothing is not a static aspect of society. It changes with time. What is not acceptable today will be the norm tomorrow. Eg- We didnt have shirts and trousers until the British made us feel inferior about our dhotis and draperies and we discarded them for formal shirts and trousers. The history of evolution of clothing is a very interesting topic and is now also taught at schools. Covered in one of the NCERT books as well (Class 8 or 9 I think)

Oh yes. I wore shorts in college too.

[VeyronSuperSprt]

You have 2 choices:

(1) Learn from this incident, dress "appropriately" , and get your licence faster

OR

(2) Go in shorts again because (a) you value your independence, (b) you'll use social media to get back against the officials concerned (c) you'll start another thread like this one and debate till kingdom come, and (d) the licence is incidental - after all you're here to change the world.

Incidentally, IF you are a member of the "The Bangalore Club" - you cannot, in the Mysore Room, wear T-Shirts, Jeans, Collarless Shirts, SHORTS, Jeans, Sports Shoes.

Why don't those offended with the RTO incident make a hue and cry about this ???

Instead, the waiting period for a membership of the Bangalore club is 20 years !!!!

[shankar.balan]

Originally Posted by VeyronSuperSprt

You have 2 choices:

(1) Learn from this incident, dress "appropriately" , and get your licence faster

OR

(2) Go in shorts again because (a) you value your independence, (b) you'll use social media to get back against the officials concerned (c) you'll start another thread like this one and debate till kingdom come, and (d) the licence is incidental - it can come after all of the above - after all you're here to change the world.

Incidentally, IF you are a member of the "The Bangalore Club" - you cannot, in the Mysore Room, wear T-Shirts, Jeans, Collarless Shirts, SHORTS, Jeans, Sports Shoes.

Why don't those offended with the RTO incident make a hue and cry about this ???

Instead, the waiting period for a membership of the Bangalore club is 20 years !!!!

It is only recently that Madras Cricket Club and Gymkhana etc started allowing people in, wearing "National Dress".
The Ooty Club still doesn't.

Go to any 5 Star Hotel. Chances are that in their more formal sit down dining and fine dining restaurants, they do have a dress code.

But these are "Private Institutions".

The RTO is a public place and a public office.

Whether Private or Public, we still need to conform to the accepted dress code of the place we are going to, unless of course, we are wanting most deeply to emulate Don Quixote...

[TD_GHY]

Originally Posted by VeyronSuperSprt

Incidentally, IF you are a member of the "The Bangalore Club" - you cannot, in the Mysore Room, wear T-Shirts, Jeans, Collarless Shirts, SHORTS, Jeans, Sports Shoes.

Why don't those offended with the RTO incident make a hue and cry about this ???

Instead, the waiting period for a membership of the Bangalore club is 20 years !!!!

No offence, but this is the first time I've heard of something called a "The Bangalore Club". Pardon my ignorance. Now that we are at it, you may be aware there are definitely dress codes for many other events/places/professions

1. School dresses
2. Placement/job interviews
3. Army/Navy/Air force
4. Sales personnel at Big Bazaar/Reliance etc

Now even the highly demanded Bangalore Club has a dress code and it is good that they have enforced it through explicit communication. Now, what is appropriate for a RTO? Anything besides shorts/underwear/bikinis? Hell, tomorrow one other RTO will come and say he doesn't like your round necked tee, the next will say he doesn't like the print (say FCUK which is a common print) on your tee. If they are so concerned about these minute things like wearing of shorts, they may as well put up a circular just like " The Bangalore Club" instead of employing cheap tactics to make the customer willing to plead before them for a license. Will be end of all confusion right.

On a different note, the father of our nation Mahatma Gandhi attended the 2nd round table conference in London in his waist below khadi only, despite being ridiculed as the "Half naked fakir" by the British Prime Minister.

[AWD]

Originally Posted by shankar.balan

However, my only submission is that the primary battle is to get your work done. Like a Chameleon, one needs to adapt to circumstances

"Work done" yes but not the cost of a direct infringement on right to freedom. The babu has to do his work irrespective of what the ordinary Citizen is wearing. There are Chameleons, then there are monkeys, dogs, pigs, khotas, then lions & then humans, one has to choose for oneself!

The talk of some clubs & hotels specifying particular codes, its ok if they explicitly display such codes. Mostly the herd mentality or the people who feel superior than the rest by dawning such memberships might feel happy about it but not me, I'd take such clubs to task & rather not join them.

When you speak so vehemently against the babus, then why not do something about it ? Why toe their line always, don't the educated & the well aware citizens feel its their duty to pass on a better India to the future generations or they want the rot to spread by being a part of it!

The get your work done & not bothered about anything else sort of attitudes are the biggest hurdles in changing India for good. People are just not ready to speak up, they are afraid, terrified, completely petrified of the babus.

[Karthik Chandra]

We visit government offices for official work.

Official work = formal wear

Getting driving license is an official work, since it is illegal to drive without one, hence the person should have worn appropriate attire.

There are pubs and bars which do not allow

# people wearing slippers
# stag entry
# people wearing shorts

I've not seen anyone crib about this. I've seen people go back, dress as per the code and come back to have fun.

I'm paying more than thrice the price in a pub and I'm not allowed to wear slippers in which I'm comfortable. But I don't complain, I rush back home, wear my shoes and come back to have fun.

Being denied entry at a bar/pub is OK

But when an RTO officer who does an official work for me denies service based on dress code, there is a big hue and cry. Why can't you go back home and come in formals to get the work done just as you do it for entering a pub/bar???

Well different people = different perspective...

But all under on roof T - E - A - M - B - H -P

And that is what makes every debate interesting.

[Selective]

When I read the title, I thought what the heck! Why anyone working at RTO bother? Believe me, I didn't bother to click and read the posts. But when I saw that this thread is growing in numbers, thought some interesting discussion must be going on with different perspectives. And of course, that's what is happening.

Now, thinking seriously about this matter. If I am going to RTO or Sub-registrar office, I will not be in shorts for sure. And I am not saying that I will do this because I believe in it, but because my subconscious mind doesn't allow me to. I don't know why!

I think, now a days, everything needs to be in black and white. If I can wear shorts or not, should be written in black and white and has to be posted on the door. If certain places expect the dress code, we immediately ask where is it written, show me the rule book! There is no common understanding between people or we don't care or respect our surroundings!

Not going too far, when some guests are coming home, we try to dress up adequately. Even our parents expect us to not wear shorts when someone is coming home. And, our guests will never tell us whether they were comfortable when we were in shorts. Yes, we can challenge them, confront them, ignore them or adjust a little and keep everyone happy. Of course there will be exceptions, like meeting same age group people etc.

I believe, it is the cultural or generation gap which will keep shifting. And we just have to take it easy, pick some and drop some and enjoy the life. No one is taking the freedom away from us, let's pay attention to what is most important for us and make it meaningful.