Non KA registered vehicles not welcomed in Karnataka!!!???

kiranpashtakar · 17th October 2006, 18:42

Lets not isolate this issue by saying the problem exsists only in bangalore,
I run a KA registered car and I face it all the time in hyderabad, got freinds in Pune who share the same problem.

The issue here is there is a no transparency in the rules which the authorities try to milk lets not forget we are in India. And no issue pertaining to the govt can be specific to any state.

The last I heard is there is some talk of centralising the RTO taxes and divviding the funds.

There are laws that DR.Ambedkar had written for refunds and registerations etc but our babu's have made it very difficult for the common man to understand these procedures.

vivekkr_99 · 17th October 2006, 18:59

Hi, As far as I know, if you plan to keep the vehicle for more than one year in another state, you have to pay the life time road tax. For that,
a) Get an NOC from the original RTO for transferring the vehicle
b) Go to the new RTO and pay the life time tax (for 15 yrs - the life of your vehicel)
c) Get a refund from the old RTO (proportional amt for which you have used your vehicle will be deducted)
d) Please dont forget that the NOC is valid only for 90 days, and if you fail to pay the tax within that period, you have to get a new NOC from the original RTO.

If you plan to keep the vehicle for more than 3 months but less than 12 months, you have to pay a token amount as the tax. I'm not sure of the amount, but most of us dont do this.

If you plan to keep the vehicle for less than 3 months, no need to pay the tax. Keep some recent petrol bills for proof that you have been here for less than 3 months, pollution certificate from the original state, and insurance from the original state itself. Most of the cases, this will be enough.

In Bangalore, RTO check is more during the months of February and March, so be careful if you have not already paid the tax but has been around for more than a year.
I got this information from IndiaCar.com, where there is FAQ on RTO and other stuff regarding registration of vehicles. Hope this helps...

NIP · 19th October 2006, 15:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by jkdas

Well, cant do that if you get your bike couried!

then u simply use your courier reciept

kb100 · 20th October 2006, 12:32

I own a AP registered bike and a Kerala registered car and have used it extensively in almost all the states in the south south. I have on numerous occassions been caught by these fellows - never once have I paid anything. (incidentally always in Blr and Chennai)

The law is very clear you can drive any car is any state for six months CINTINUOUSLY - after which you become liable to pay local road taxes.. however the law clearly states - and THERE ARE NUMEROUS JUDGEMENTS FROM VARIOUS HIGH COURTS in favour of this- that the ONUS of proving that the car HAS been driven for over six months CONTINOUSLY in the state is the RTO/COP's. All it takes to disprove any evidence they may bring up - including insurance (mine was always renewed in Blr ) - is ONE petrol bill from ANY other state - which in the case of Bangalore is the easiest thing with the borders so close! They have another trick - when you quote the six month rule they will ask you for the NOC - NOC is required only if you are SELLING or RE-REGISTERING your vehicle... tell them clearly you dont intend doing wither therefore there is no requirement for it! (you should see ther faces when you do this!!)

It is very important to know the law.. and SHOW that you know the law... these guys back off the minute you do that ... they can still harass you with your brake lights .. number plate etc.. but if everything is in order they very grudgingly let you off.

esteem_lover · 20th October 2006, 13:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by kb100

I own a AP registered bike and a Kerala registered car and have used it extensively in almost all the states in the south south. I have on numerous occassions been caught by these fellows - never once have I paid anything. (incidentally always in Blr and Chennai)

It is very important to know the law.. and SHOW that you know the law... these guys back off the minute you do that ... they can still harass you with your brake lights .. number plate etc.. but if everything is in order they very grudgingly let you off.

kb100, you can get away with this in CBE, but not in chennai or bangalore or any other big city. i too have a rajasthan registered Yezdi & had a pondy regd. M1000. i spent some time in madurai & hosur & had absolutely no problems with that but when i came back to chennai, i have kept the yezdi for in-colony use & had to change the regn of the M1000 to TN. there are umpteen no. of ways for the cop to prove that you are settled in TN & not a visitor.

kb100 · 20th October 2006, 13:58

Sir Esteem Lover ... I DID stay in Bangalore for 8 years... and Chennai for TWO... I had been stopped at least on TEN occassions in Chennai and about SIX in Bangalore - I moved to CBE only in Jan this year.. These are my EXPERIENCES.

I have no problem with them proving my place of residence - they still cannot prove that the vehicle has not left the state even once in the last six months...this is where the petrol bill comes in handy... Get a bill drive for another six months.. then get another one! .. Hell one of the inspectors who stopped me continued to see me come out of the same office using the same bike for over five years... and there was nothing he could do about it! ... the Law is the LAw!! It works for them as much as it does for us! ... The proof of the pudding.... etc - I DID NOT HAVE TO PAY !!

kph · 20th October 2006, 18:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by kb100

Sir Esteem Lover ... I DID stay in Bangalore for 8 years... and Chennai for TWO... I had been stopped at least on TEN occassions in Chennai and about SIX in Bangalore - I moved to CBE only in Jan this year.. These are my EXPERIENCES.

I have no problem with them proving my place of residence - they still cannot prove that the vehicle has not left the state even once in the last six months...this is where the petrol bill comes in handy... Get a bill drive for another six months.. then get another one! .. Hell one of the inspectors who stopped me continued to see me come out of the same office using the same bike for over five years... and there was nothing he could do about it! ... the Law is the LAw!! It works for them as much as it does for us! ... The proof of the pudding.... etc - I DID NOT HAVE TO PAY !!

Excellent job KB100.
Btw, to make myself clear, let me confirm one thing.. You said, you maintained petrol bills from your state(the state where the vehicle's been registered) for 6 months.. Is that right?
And what did you do about the insurance and pollution certificate? When you have to renew polution from where you run the vehicle, wouldnt that be a reason for the cops to conclude that the vehicle's beeing used there for the last 6 months (we have to renew it in 6 months)

jango · 20th October 2006, 19:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by kph

Excellent job KB100.
Btw, to make myself clear, let me confirm one thing.. You said, you maintained petrol bills from your state(the state where the vehicle's been registered) for 6 months.. Is that right?
And what did you do about the insurance and pollution certificate? When you have to renew polution from where you run the vehicle, wouldnt that be a reason for the cops to conclude that the vehicle's beeing used there for the last 6 months (we have to renew it in 6 months)

@Kph that's tru if you show the pollution cert which you obtained from b'lore, you get screwed up coz it, itself proves that u have been in b'lore for more than 6 months. What i would suggest is next time when u go to Kerala, do get a PUC cert . As u drive down often, or eb\ven if u don't just pay any pollution testing center guys some 25 buck theyt will give u a cerf, even w/o seeing ur indica. I guess that would help. I would be getting one this time for my jeep, also some petrol bills...by the way r u in kerala or B'lore.....

kph · 20th October 2006, 19:21

Smart jango...

Here the guy from whom i took the pol cert last time wont give it without the vehicle, technical difficulties, they keep records, with the photo and date/time. I didn't want to force someone to manipulate.

Now in Kerala, came today morning. Didn't take the car, coz tyres not in good health.

kb100 · 20th October 2006, 22:36

The funda is clear... you can of course put the matter beyond doubt if you have all documents from Kerala as well. (I never did)... However there is no rule preventing me from taking PC cert from anywhere...any certified establishment can give one and the same is valid all over India- I could have been travelling... I repeat .. it is NOT your domicile that matters at all ... its whether the VEHICLE has been driven CONTINUOUSLY in the state for OVER the last SIX months or not... IN other words even if I can get ONE petrol bill I can prove that otherwise.. and for another SIX months from the date of that bill you can continue to use the car legally ... Even if they establish that I am settled in Bangalore I can always claim the vehicle is being used by my relatives in Kerala and has just been brought down etc etc.. Guys .. this is the rule - and hazzar cases exist of the courts ordering release of all vehicles siezed on this count... in fact the court has gone beyond that and RULED that the authorities CANNOT harass owners/ sieze vehicles etc on this count. That the onus of proving the allegation is on the AUTHORITIES. Ppl in Chennai will remember around 1995-96 that the cops went into this frenzy of seizing all Pondy registered vehicles... well public approached the Chennai High Court and the honorouable court ordered the release of every single vehicle - and also prohibited them fron seizing any more on these grounds.. which is why I said.. when faced with this they almost always try to harass you with other things like brakes/light/horn/numberplates etc.

I have noticed one thing about Chennai and Bangalore... Both places I find cops take a particular interest in vehicles registered in the other state... I have on numerous ocassions in Bangy been waved through while a TN registerd vehicle just in front/behind me got flagged down.. ONe favourite hunting ground used to be the Ulsoor lake - a little boyond the Gurudwara .. I have experienced the same thing in reverse in Chennai ( I also happen to own a Karnataka regd Maruti 800 which I have used in Chennai).

Zappo · 21st October 2006, 01:04

there are two parts to this story AFAIK. One is paying the road tax and the second is local registration. I guess the rule is if you run your car in a state for more than a month you gotta pay the taxes... On paying the tax you get the reciept which you must preserve. This should suffice with the cops. Your registration stays the same odl one. However if you stay put over a year you need to get a local registration as well.

Remember, it is not mandatory that you cancel your previous registration when you re-register in a new state. If your car is 3-4 years old the effort may not even be worth it to get the refund... it is too long drawn and tedious, and then the deductions are also huge. It may be a better idea to retain the other no as well, particularly if you often travel back to the other state. You can simply switch the number plate in such cases.

hyper-VTEC · 21st October 2006, 01:22

My WagonR is Delhi Registered DL 2C AA XXXX. I have (god forbid) been caught in bangalore. I am driving for atleast 19 months now. But since Delhi and Bangalore are quite far away, i cannot prove that i came from the neighbor state. So if someday someone catches what am i supposed to say. I know paying the Tax in KA would be at-least 25-30K. My car is 2004 registered. Anyone has any idea on how much i have to shell out.

I once saw a news that Govt. is coming out with flat tax fees for all states. Dont know when that would come, but then people like me who move a lot, won't have to have this problem.

I am not saying that i am psyched driving a DL registered car, but i am not 100% worry free too.

Zappo · 21st October 2006, 01:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by kb100

The funda is clear...

Actually it cuts both ways. My personal experience says that while you may quote the rule-book to the cops they do not take that with much pleasure. Its better to try to reason alongwith the presentation of the proofs.

I have seen/heard of these cases at various places from time to time... on being quoted the rule-book and told that "you can not touch me" the cops raise these issues to get you,
* your wheels/rims are modified. this is a violation of the rules. you have not taken permission from the RTO before carrying out the mods.
* your horn is loud and breaks the decibel level rules.
* the number plate size, fonts do not meet the regulations.
* number plate is not clearly visible, either it is dirty or the lights fitted above the plates do not work, and hence there is a wilful attempt to mask the plate.
* your PUC does not mention the required parameters (almost all fail on this count).
* headlight bulbs are more powerful than the allowed limits (anything above what manufacturer fits).
* and when nothing works, dangerous driving and intent to cause danger to the lives of others on the road (never mind that you were driving at 40kmph when they caught you).

kph · 21st October 2006, 09:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by kb100

there is no rule preventing me from taking PC cert from anywhere...any certified establishment can give one and the same is valid all over India- I could have been travelling... I repeat .. it is NOT your domicile that matters at all ... its whether the VEHICLE has been driven CONTINUOUSLY in the state for OVER the last SIX months or not... IN other words even if I can get ONE petrol bill I can prove that otherwise.. and for another SIX months from the date of that bill you can continue to use the car legally ... Even if they establish that I am settled in Bangalore I can always claim the vehicle is being used by my relatives in Kerala and has just been brought down etc etc.. Guys .. this is the rule - and hazzar cases exist of the courts ordering release of all vehicles siezed on this count... in fact the court has gone beyond that and RULED that the authorities CANNOT harass owners/ sieze vehicles etc on this count.

Just curious... Are you... by any chance.. an advocate?

[PHP]
the onus of proving the allegation is on the AUTHORITIES. [/PHP]
Really?! I thought it's the other way.

kb100 · 21st October 2006, 12:09

Yeah... one cop tried that as well... till my friend told him he is a lawyer himself and that we are willing to fight legally.. that we will file enough counter petitions including harassment and misuse of official powers etc to ensure he sits in the the court four days of the week! - Cops hate that -opportunity costs - "income' !! .. He let us go. Always remember that they always prey on your unwillingness to go to court.

Anyway the point is please read up the rules... and yes - like I mentioned earlier - if your other things like number plate etc are not in order, very little you can do about it other than plead and hope he lets you off with a simple fine..!

17th October 2006, 18:42	#16
kiranpashtakar BHPian Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Bangalore/Hyderabad Posts: 257 Thanked: 7 Times	Lets not isolate this issue by saying the problem exsists only in bangalore, I run a KA registered car and I face it all the time in hyderabad, got freinds in Pune who share the same problem. The issue here is there is a no transparency in the rules which the authorities try to milk lets not forget we are in India. And no issue pertaining to the govt can be specific to any state. The last I heard is there is some talk of centralising the RTO taxes and divviding the funds. There are laws that DR.Ambedkar had written for refunds and registerations etc but our babu's have made it very difficult for the common man to understand these procedures.
	() Thanks

17th October 2006, 18:59	#17
vivekkr_99 BHPian Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Trivandrum Posts: 196 Thanked: 43 Times	Hi, As far as I know, if you plan to keep the vehicle for more than one year in another state, you have to pay the life time road tax. For that, a) Get an NOC from the original RTO for transferring the vehicle b) Go to the new RTO and pay the life time tax (for 15 yrs - the life of your vehicel) c) Get a refund from the old RTO (proportional amt for which you have used your vehicle will be deducted) d) Please dont forget that the NOC is valid only for 90 days, and if you fail to pay the tax within that period, you have to get a new NOC from the original RTO. If you plan to keep the vehicle for more than 3 months but less than 12 months, you have to pay a token amount as the tax. I'm not sure of the amount, but most of us dont do this. If you plan to keep the vehicle for less than 3 months, no need to pay the tax. Keep some recent petrol bills for proof that you have been here for less than 3 months, pollution certificate from the original state, and insurance from the original state itself. Most of the cases, this will be enough. In Bangalore, RTO check is more during the months of February and March, so be careful if you have not already paid the tax but has been around for more than a year. I got this information from IndiaCar.com, where there is FAQ on RTO and other stuff regarding registration of vehicles. Hope this helps...
	(1) Thanks

20th October 2006, 12:32	#19
kb100 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Bangy Boy! Posts: 1,555 Thanked: 21 Times	I own a AP registered bike and a Kerala registered car and have used it extensively in almost all the states in the south south. I have on numerous occassions been caught by these fellows - never once have I paid anything. (incidentally always in Blr and Chennai) The law is very clear you can drive any car is any state for six months CINTINUOUSLY - after which you become liable to pay local road taxes.. however the law clearly states - and THERE ARE NUMEROUS JUDGEMENTS FROM VARIOUS HIGH COURTS in favour of this- that the ONUS of proving that the car HAS been driven for over six months CONTINOUSLY in the state is the RTO/COP's. All it takes to disprove any evidence they may bring up - including insurance (mine was always renewed in Blr ) - is ONE petrol bill from ANY other state - which in the case of Bangalore is the easiest thing with the borders so close! They have another trick - when you quote the six month rule they will ask you for the NOC - NOC is required only if you are SELLING or RE-REGISTERING your vehicle... tell them clearly you dont intend doing wither therefore there is no requirement for it! (you should see ther faces when you do this!!) It is very important to know the law.. and SHOW that you know the law... these guys back off the minute you do that ... they can still harass you with your brake lights .. number plate etc.. but if everything is in order they very grudgingly let you off. Last edited by kb100 : 20th October 2006 at 12:36.
	(2) Thanks

20th October 2006, 13:58	#21
kb100 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Bangy Boy! Posts: 1,555 Thanked: 21 Times	Sir Esteem Lover ... I DID stay in Bangalore for 8 years... and Chennai for TWO... I had been stopped at least on TEN occassions in Chennai and about SIX in Bangalore - I moved to CBE only in Jan this year.. These are my EXPERIENCES. I have no problem with them proving my place of residence - they still cannot prove that the vehicle has not left the state even once in the last six months...this is where the petrol bill comes in handy... Get a bill drive for another six months.. then get another one! .. Hell one of the inspectors who stopped me continued to see me come out of the same office using the same bike for over five years... and there was nothing he could do about it! ... the Law is the LAw!! It works for them as much as it does for us! ... The proof of the pudding.... etc - I DID NOT HAVE TO PAY !! Last edited by kb100 : 20th October 2006 at 14:02.
	() Thanks

20th October 2006, 19:21	#24
kph BHPian Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Manali Posts: 156 Thanked: 13 Times	Smart jango... Here the guy from whom i took the pol cert last time wont give it without the vehicle, technical difficulties, they keep records, with the photo and date/time. I didn't want to force someone to manipulate. Now in Kerala, came today morning. Didn't take the car, coz tyres not in good health.
	() Thanks

20th October 2006, 22:36	#25
kb100 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Bangy Boy! Posts: 1,555 Thanked: 21 Times	The funda is clear... you can of course put the matter beyond doubt if you have all documents from Kerala as well. (I never did)... However there is no rule preventing me from taking PC cert from anywhere...any certified establishment can give one and the same is valid all over India- I could have been travelling... I repeat .. it is NOT your domicile that matters at all ... its whether the VEHICLE has been driven CONTINUOUSLY in the state for OVER the last SIX months or not... IN other words even if I can get ONE petrol bill I can prove that otherwise.. and for another SIX months from the date of that bill you can continue to use the car legally ... Even if they establish that I am settled in Bangalore I can always claim the vehicle is being used by my relatives in Kerala and has just been brought down etc etc.. Guys .. this is the rule - and hazzar cases exist of the courts ordering release of all vehicles siezed on this count... in fact the court has gone beyond that and RULED that the authorities CANNOT harass owners/ sieze vehicles etc on this count. That the onus of proving the allegation is on the AUTHORITIES. Ppl in Chennai will remember around 1995-96 that the cops went into this frenzy of seizing all Pondy registered vehicles... well public approached the Chennai High Court and the honorouable court ordered the release of every single vehicle - and also prohibited them fron seizing any more on these grounds.. which is why I said.. when faced with this they almost always try to harass you with other things like brakes/light/horn/numberplates etc. I have noticed one thing about Chennai and Bangalore... Both places I find cops take a particular interest in vehicles registered in the other state... I have on numerous ocassions in Bangy been waved through while a TN registerd vehicle just in front/behind me got flagged down.. ONe favourite hunting ground used to be the Ulsoor lake - a little boyond the Gurudwara .. I have experienced the same thing in reverse in Chennai ( I also happen to own a Karnataka regd Maruti 800 which I have used in Chennai). Last edited by kb100 : 20th October 2006 at 22:38.
	() Thanks

21st October 2006, 01:04	#26
Zappo Team-BHP Support Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 5,922 Thanked: 2,699 Times	there are two parts to this story AFAIK. One is paying the road tax and the second is local registration. I guess the rule is if you run your car in a state for more than a month you gotta pay the taxes... On paying the tax you get the reciept which you must preserve. This should suffice with the cops. Your registration stays the same odl one. However if you stay put over a year you need to get a local registration as well. Remember, it is not mandatory that you cancel your previous registration when you re-register in a new state. If your car is 3-4 years old the effort may not even be worth it to get the refund... it is too long drawn and tedious, and then the deductions are also huge. It may be a better idea to retain the other no as well, particularly if you often travel back to the other state. You can simply switch the number plate in such cases.
	(1) Thanks

21st October 2006, 01:22	#27
hyper-VTEC BHPian Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Bengal...ooroo Posts: 648 Thanked: 243 Times View My Garage	My WagonR is Delhi Registered DL 2C AA XXXX. I have (god forbid) been caught in bangalore. I am driving for atleast 19 months now. But since Delhi and Bangalore are quite far away, i cannot prove that i came from the neighbor state. So if someday someone catches what am i supposed to say. I know paying the Tax in KA would be at-least 25-30K. My car is 2004 registered. Anyone has any idea on how much i have to shell out. I once saw a news that Govt. is coming out with flat tax fees for all states. Dont know when that would come, but then people like me who move a lot, won't have to have this problem. I am not saying that i am psyched driving a DL registered car, but i am not 100% worry free too.
	() Thanks

21st October 2006, 12:09	#30
kb100 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Bangy Boy! Posts: 1,555 Thanked: 21 Times	Yeah... one cop tried that as well... till my friend told him he is a lawyer himself and that we are willing to fight legally.. that we will file enough counter petitions including harassment and misuse of official powers etc to ensure he sits in the the court four days of the week! - Cops hate that -opportunity costs - "income' !! .. He let us go. Always remember that they always prey on your unwillingness to go to court. Anyway the point is please read up the rules... and yes - like I mentioned earlier - if your other things like number plate etc are not in order, very little you can do about it other than plead and hope he lets you off with a simple fine..! Last edited by kb100 : 21st October 2006 at 12:10.
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