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View Poll Results: The proposed 'Congestion Tax'
May help decongest the streets and reduce pollution, hence a good step. 36 10.23%
Will purely be a revenue generation exercise. Unlikely to address the intended issues. 259 73.58%
Is a harebrained idea that's surely slated for a stillbirth. 122 34.66%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 352. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 26th September 2023, 16:19   #46
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Re: Congestion Tax in Bengaluru | Yes or No?

The only way to reduce congestion is to either increase the space for vehicles or reduce the number of vehicles on road.

The areas affected by crowding has a large IT population movement contributing to this.
Most of the companies who are adopting hybrid model have mandated 50% work from office.

A simpler solution would be for govt to mandate 75% work from home for IT companies. This will immediately reduce congestion, pollution, stress levels, road rage etc.,
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Old 26th September 2023, 16:37   #47
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Re: Congestion Tax in Bengaluru | Yes or No?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Everlearner View Post
A simpler solution would be for govt to mandate 75% work from home for IT companies. This will immediately reduce congestion, pollution, stress levels, road rage etc.,
+1
I don't know about KA but atleast in TN, SEZs are strongly implementing the 50% minimum attendance requirement per employee. Many are not required in office most of the time unless it's collaborative work. Relaxing such norms is the way to go. Roads here are clogged thanks to metro construction and relaxing such rules will save authorities a lot of headache.

Last edited by Turbohead : 26th September 2023 at 16:38.
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Old 26th September 2023, 16:51   #48
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Re: Congestion Tax in Bengaluru | Yes or No?

Bangalores roads often get densely congested & this is causing economic cost apart from actual distress to citizens. While the eventual reality of a small congestion tax for ALL vehicles is inevitable. I believe that at present there is an URGENT need to tax commercial passenger vehicles, ie taxi cabs should be made to pay congestion tax during peak traffic hours.

What we see everyday is vast majority of passenger taxi cabs carrying singular, young & physically able bodied passengers (who use them despite the presence of an elaborate Metro system). These people must absolutely be made to actively pay the actual economic cost to be hogging road-space.

For ANY commercial activity, the business is liable to conform to conditions, avail a plethora of permissions, pay premium rents etc. So please bear with me. I'm not here to demonise taxi cab drivers, I'm merely making the case for their users to bear the full economic cost of a cabs commercial operations.

Lets compare with say a restaurant - the restaurant owner has to bear the cost of premium rents to be able to open a commercial restaurant on a road where commercial activity is permitted based on certain conditions, the owner too pays commercial property tax, the restaurant owner has to bear the cost of commercial Water usage, commercial electricity tariff, buy cooking Gas at a premium, comply with regulations - or atleast manage them, then pay GST on revenue & Income Tax on the business income.

A taxi cab driver doesn't pay ANY of these. Cabbies use subsidised fuel, don't pay Road Tax, GST (on revenue), Income Tax and operate mostly independent of any well set standards by Govt regulation (except speed governors). This means they have very little investment & thereby very little skin in the game - relatively FAR less compared to any other commercial business activity & much less than other private road users. Further, there is a heavy cost of managing them since they largely consist of untrained & uneducated people from the villages who routinely conduct themselves in a very uncouth manner with passengers & other road users.

There are very many good hearted cab drivers too, I'm sure. But its only the economic aspect that is being considered here.

I may not be 100% politically correct here, this may very well not be the perfect solution, and I don't know how the govt plans to implement this, but a congestion tax on cabs during peak traffic hours will be a key tool to actively remind people that their transit comes at a cost to the time of other citizens.

Last edited by GrammarNazi : 26th September 2023 at 17:06.
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Old 26th September 2023, 16:53   #49
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Re: Congestion Tax in Bengaluru | Yes or No?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Everlearner View Post
A simpler solution would be for govt to mandate 75% work from home for IT companies. This will immediately reduce congestion, pollution, stress levels, road rage etc.,
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turbohead View Post
Many are not required in office most of the time unless it's collaborative work. Relaxing such norms is the way to go. Roads here are clogged thanks to metro construction and relaxing such rules will save authorities a lot of headache.
Not to turn this into the 'remote work' thread (we went over all these points on that thread anyway), but in this case, the government did suggest that IT companies along the ORR consider remote work for the duration that the Metro construction would take.

What happened? Big push-back from IT company management (who don't have to drive/ride themselves to work everyday!) and of course the big builders who own the badly-designed IT parks (a single access road in and out of the park for hundreds of vehicles at the same time each day!) that cause all the congestion, and without whose monetary 'support' no government can thrive. The government had to back off and declare that it was merely 'a suggestion'.

Last edited by am1m : 26th September 2023 at 16:54.
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Old 26th September 2023, 17:07   #50
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Re: Congestion Tax in Bengaluru | Yes or No?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GrammarNazi View Post
Bangalores roads often get densely congested & this is causing economic cost apart from actual distress to citizens. While the eventual reality of a small congestion tax for ALL vehicles is inevitable. I believe that at present there is an URGENT need to tax commercial passenger vehicles, ie taxi cabs should be made to pay congestion tax during peak traffic hours.

.
I agree with this. The app companies have even less skin in the game. Charge them a congestion tax!
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Old 26th September 2023, 17:38   #51
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Re: Congestion Tax in Bengaluru | Yes or No?

Well, if our govt really thinks that the congestion tax is going to do any good then either they are fooling themselves or the common citizen. KA is already among the most expensive states for private vehicle ownership so imposing additional financial cost without the provision of adequate modern public transport infrastructure is just like putting the cart before the horse. Why don't they start with something as simple and radical as installation of vertical rotary car parking lots in busy commercial districts which can go a long way in reducing encroachments due to wrong parking and free up drivable space on roads? Other suggestions could be banning of commercial goods movement in busy time slots, resurfacing of roads, installation of one way spikes, making alternate routes connecting major roads and districts. These are some of the low hanging solutions, can those same babus claim that they have implemented all these and still facing congestion?
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Old 26th September 2023, 17:39   #52
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Re: Congestion Tax in Bengaluru | Yes or No?

OK, let me get this straight:

I earn the money, I pay the tax.
I save/invest the money, I pay the tax.
I buy a car, I pay the road tax (what road? where is the road?)
I take the car out on the highway, I pay the toll tax.

Now I take the car out in the city, I have to pay the tax?

Thank God that I'm not paying any tax for just being alive. Or am I?
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Old 26th September 2023, 18:14   #53
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Re: Congestion Tax in Bengaluru | Yes or No?

Buses are the solution. In the last few years, the net number of BMTC buses has not increased even though the city has grown leaps and bounds. I see some new electric buses under the FAME scheme, but no new diesel buses. The green colored electric buses are smaller and of lesser capacity, though I also see few normal capacity electric buses.

If you look at it holistically, diesel buses would still be environmental friendly considering the number of private vehicles they can potentially replace.

Some tech parks like Embassy Tech Village on ORR have recently started running buses which would help employees of the tech park. These tech parks which provide buses can now legitimately charge parking fees.

Instead of a congestion tax, government in partnership with private operators should introduce more buses. But - not to be political here - this government is going the other way in providing free tickets, which has destroyed the private transport sector.
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Old 26th September 2023, 18:57   #54
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Re: Congestion Tax in Bengaluru | Yes or No?

I definitely agree with a Congestion Tax on Taxi Cabs & a maybe PPP Model for adding intra-city Buses. Apparently the lack of new Buses is only due to lack of land availability for Bus Depot/Terminal. There are plenty of routes where bus frequency has been reduced due to lack of communication & co-ordination with commuters. So, IMO what the Govt can rather do is charge Congestion charges through apps like Uber/Ola unless they are being used as a feeder service to the public transit system - all while re-organising connectivity of existing Buses.

Guys, lets avoid over-simplification & off-topic OTT posts on this thread. Theres a separate thread for jokes. Bangalore needs to ensure the road-space is shared equitably among people based on various parameters including economic viability.

Traffic can be truly distressing and IMO Bangalore has a chance to experiment & maybe set an example for all congested metro cities. I'm not advocating hair-brained ideas of banning old cars, or "odd-even" nonsense, but actual workable solutions by finding & addressing the pain-point of how we can have fewer people in individual cars.

Last edited by WorkingGuru : 26th September 2023 at 19:20.
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Old 26th September 2023, 19:06   #55
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Re: Congestion Tax in Bengaluru | Yes or No?

How else will the freebies be given? Democracy itself is a broken model. All a politician has to do is focus on his vote bank and his bank account.

I am fortunate enough that I can do WFH but I am seriously considering leaving Bangalore or moving to the outskirts as the continuous pollution, noise, and dirt is affecting my mental peace and health.
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Old 26th September 2023, 19:08   #56
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Re: Congestion Tax in Bengaluru | Yes or No?

They can charge even 500% tax on vehicles but the roads will be just as congested unless they offer people an alternative AKA reliable public transport including last mile connectivity.

It's like the public littering problem. You can increase fines for littering as much as you want but providing accessible dustbins show better results.
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Old 26th September 2023, 19:35   #57
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Re: Congestion Tax in Bengaluru | Yes or No?

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Originally Posted by Red Liner View Post
I agree with this. The app companies have even less skin in the game. Charge them a congestion tax!
If they put such tax on app companies wouldn't they put that burden on customers thereby increasing the fares which are already at high. Even if government does this I think app companies will find a alternative to pass it onto customers.
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Old 26th September 2023, 19:37   #58
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Re: Congestion Tax in Bengaluru | Yes or No?

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If they put such tax on app companies wouldn't they put that burden on customers thereby increasing the fares which are already at high. Even if government does this I think app companies will find a alternative to pass it onto customers.
Let them. Then consumers will think twice about going for a joy ride using an app cab during prime hours. Or better still veer towards ride sharing apps instead.
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Old 26th September 2023, 20:22   #59
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Re: Congestion Tax in Bengaluru | Yes or No?

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Originally Posted by Revvatron View Post
If they put such tax on app companies wouldn't they put that burden on customers thereby increasing the fares which are already at high. Even if government does this I think app companies will find a alternative to pass it onto customers.
Consider my post above that explains how taxi-cabs are comparatively not paying the full commercial economic cost of the transit & use of the car, unlike any other commercial activity. Such leniency should not be allowed within a place where there is extreme paucity of road-space causing genuine distress to commuters & economic cost to the city and that a congestion tax during peak hours is simply a compensatory levy to just make the commuter realise that their transit in a taxi during peak hours burdens the traffic and reduces road-space.

(Congestion Tax in Bengaluru | Yes or No?)Link

Last edited by GrammarNazi : 26th September 2023 at 20:32. Reason: added "comparatively" for context.
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Old 26th September 2023, 20:30   #60
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Re: Congestion Tax in Bengaluru | Yes or No?

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Originally Posted by GrammarNazi View Post
I may not be 100% politically correct here, this may very well not be the perfect solution, and I don't know how the govt plans to implement this, but a congestion tax on cabs during peak traffic hours will be a key tool to actively remind people that their transit comes at a cost to the time of other citizens.
The problem with cabs is that they park right on road even when they are not plying. There are no designated taxi stands unlike autos. Given they are always inside the car, no parking boards don't matter since they will not get fined, let alone towed.

I agree it is not always possible for them to find a parking place when they are in between rides. But at least a congestion tax would be a way of recouping the cost of congestion caused by parking on the road.

I am fine with paying a congestion tax as long as it is applicable to cabs and autos as well. But highly likely it will be imposed only on private cars which would be very unfair and barely have any impact on congestion.
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