[Caesar]

The law is one thing and implementation of it is entirely another.

Just because someone is not following a law or it is not being enforced at a place does not mean that it has ceased to be a law. It is not permissible to buy petrol in unauthorized containers and the petrol pump owner as well as the cops need to be lauded for sticking to this and not falling to a bribery attempt of Rs. 500.

[Iluvcars]

I didn't know if this rule existed in India until I read your post; so obviously I don't know the reason.
On a related note, while in the US, one of my friends car stalled running out of fuel. He called me. I picked him up and we both went to a gas station with a bottle (some empty soft-drink bottle) and quite ignorantly was about to fill in gasoline in the bottle. Out of nowhere a truck-driver came and warned us not to do. He said the penalty is some USD 500 or so (never verified). We were suggested to buy a container meant for this and buy gasoline and we did exactly that. There were instructions on the container on how to use it.
So the point is from all those instructions (I don't remember them), I inferred that it's hazardous to dispense fuel into such not-to-be-meant-for-that-purpose containers.
Perhaps, was there any safety aspect in their denial? Hard to assume so as by and large fuel stations are just after money even unjustly!

[Iluvcars]

Originally Posted by quickdraw

I was ready to bribe then 500 rupees for 50 rupees worth of fuel just to save my dignity.

I would understand if you shell out Rs. 450 more to get your vehicle moving but what's that "dignity" component? Didn't mean to be picky but honestly I didn't get that.

[Chipz]

I dont know about others, but here in kerala we can find auto drivers always carrying fuel in a soft drink bottle, which is placed below the driver seat or in the back side. I know some auto drivers who do such. They never had any safety issue. Soft drink bottle is a pretty tough material. I do not know if there is any safety aspect to it.

[Born 2 Be Wild]

The Marketing Discipline Guidelines prohibit Dispensing Petrol into plastic Bottles and containers. The reason for this as per Officials is that plastics are prone to buildup of static charge and one such small charge is enough to gut the entire bunk, hence all dealers have strict instructions not to dispense Petrol in PLastic bottles.

Each dealer has one litre aluminium containers at the Pump which are basically used for keeping samples at the Bunk but can be given to the customer on a security deposit of 100rs which the customer can later take back after handing over the Alluminium Bottle.

The attendants did the right thing by refusing to give you fuel in the plastic bottle, but they should have offerd you the option of the alluminium Containers, not doing so by them is a sign of bad customer service.

[quickdraw]

Originally Posted by aargee

So, I assume in your case that these guys deliberately refused selling to you, probably expecting for some extra money in the early hours & knowing you cannot be helped.:

I offered them a lot of extra money, the refused to bulge.

Originally Posted by Live To Jive

That's exactly what I'm saying. You are entitled to 1 litre petrol for a bike in a bottle if you show your RC (the pump may or may not demand it but they cannot refuse if you show the RC). Tourists (on rental bikes) don't have the RC so generally the pump will not refuse tourists.


This is different. This petrol is procured from "Other" sources.


Avoid talking in Marathi & Hindi to the Cops. If you don't know Konkani, speak in English. They somehow feel that English speaking Indian tourists are not the trouble maker type. BTW can you PM me the name/s of the Cop/s who were harrassing you.

I dont know what I said made this misconception, but this happened at Andheri. The cops were sitting on the gate of Oshiwara police station which is right next to Lotus Petrol pump.

Originally Posted by SMK

Its a strict NO NO to sell petrol or any kind of inflamable liquid in a container which is not certified to carry such liquids out here in Australia. According to the rules the petrol bunk owner can be jailed or his licence to sell petrol cancelled if he was found selling petrol in bottles.

I myself would support such a rule on the following counts:
1. Petrol is highly inflammable and can catch fire to the person/surroundings and hence should not be carried around
2. Crimes reported accross the world indicate use of these liquids. (Be it 1 ltr, half ltr or even 100ml, you can burn a person's face off!)
3. Its highly unsafe to carry around such liquids. Period.

1. Petrol is corrosive. I know. But I didnt intend store it in that bottle for no more then 5 minutes. Which I eventually did nothing blew up.
2. Yes but are you forgetting there are a lot of other liquids which are available freely and do the job just the same (read : kerosene etc)
3. Subjective. Again unnecessary speculation would ensue.

Originally Posted by yogeshnaik

This rule can be ammended such that any of the Petrol bunk/Service personnel would accompany the person who is in need of the fuel and refuel the tank incase of emergency.
It would be really tough for the people to push the tons weight car near the fuel pump.
Major precaution is to keep in mind, to have atleast am ample amount of fuel presence before any trip. Also, I have personally seen traffic authorities checking for fuel levels of two wheelers at Hubli.

Such a simple but brilliant idea right? Wonder who makes these archaic laws.

Originally Posted by Spitfire

Dude the incident happened in Pune not in Goa.

No dude it happened in Bombay.

Originally Posted by csentil

The Petrol pump that supplies petrol through other means can be legally liable if the petrol is used for purposes of crime (arson, molotov cocktails etc). In serious cases Petrol Pump licenses can be cancelled and the owner prosecuted.

The rule makes a lot of sense in India given the nature of problems we have had.

Please let me add something to what you have said. Arson and Molotov cocktails can be achieved through other inflammable liquids which are easily available, and I've mentioned this before.

And I have not heard of a single terrorist incident involving petrol that was illigally procured. They get far dangerous RDX, Guns and Grenades. And everyone here is saying petrol in bottles is the problem?

Originally Posted by techn0l0gist

On a similar note, I was denied petrol at the BPCL petrol pump on NH4 at Rannebennur (Karnataka) - reason given was that - they have orders not to dispense petrol after midnight - and I would have to wait till 6.00 am !! Diesel however was available! This happened around 2 am on the 4th of March or so.

I drove on and filled fuel later at Shiggaon. However I still don't get the logic!

Another senseless rule!

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

Petrol melts some plastics. Can it be carried in the bottles sold with water in them?

Yes its safe, although since its corrosive and tends to vaporize with heat it isn't recommended.

Originally Posted by Delta Wing

Read Welcome to Ministry of Petroleum&Natural Gas

Extract:

1. Short title and commencement-
The rules may be called the Petroleum Rules, 1976.
They shall come into force on the Ist day of August, 1976.
2. Definitions- In these rules, unless the context otherwise requires;-

"Act" means the Petroleum Act, 1934 (30 of 1934);
.
.
.
.
"container" means a receptacle for petroleum not exceeding 1,000 litres in capacity.

......
3. Restriction on delivery and despatch of petroleum-

No person shall deliver or despatch any petroleum to anyone in India other than the holder of a storage licence issued under these rules or his authorized agent or a port authority or railway administration or a person who is authorized under the Act to store petroleum without a licence.
.
.
.
4. Approval of containers-

Containers exceeding one litre in capacity for petroleum Class A and five litres in capacity for petroleum Class B or petroleum Class C. shall be of a type approved by the Chief Controller.
Where the approval of the Chief Controller is sought to a type or con- tainer not previously approved, an application accompanied by twelve copies of a drawing thereof to scale showing the design, materials to be used, the method of construction and capacity of the container together with two sample containers and a fee of rupees fifty for scrutiny shall be submitted to the Chief Controller.
Nothing in sub-rules (1) and (2) shall apply to containers in the possession of the Defences Forces of the Union.
5. Containers for petroleum Class A-

Containers for petroleum Class A shall be constructed of tinned, galvanised or externally rust-proofed sheet iron or steel and be of a type approved by the Chief Controller.
The containers shall be so constructed and secured as not to be liable except under circumstances of gross negligence or extraordinary accident to become defective, leaky or insecure in transit and they shall be kept in proper repair.
The containers shall have well-made filling aperture which shall be fitted with well fitting and secure air tight screw plugs of screw caps or other caps.
Containers made of sheet iron or steel shall have the following thickness of metal :
The capacity of any container, other than those approved by the Chief Controller for specified purposes, shall not exceed 300 litres.
An air space of not less than 5 per cent. of its capacity shall be kept in each container.
The container shall bear a stamped, embossed or painted warning exhibiting in conspicuous characters the words "Petrol" or "Motor Spirit" or an equivalent warning of the highly inflamable nature of the petroleum.

Interesting, can someone explain this in laymans terms? And where do we get the controller approved containers? And if the petrol and police guys do not know about these containers (they denied it to be sold in any form whatsoever except into a fuel filler of a vehicle) I dont this this would be of much help.

Originally Posted by Live To Jive

I am quite sure Baga is in Goa. Is there a Baga in Pune too?

I was just referring to me seeing a lot of petrol being sold in bottles in Baga I never said it happened in Goa or Pune. I wonder what made people think that.

Originally Posted by srishiva

Guess the petrol pump guy was right then. The problem is we get used to non-conformance without knowing, then if someone follows the rule we are irked.

Dude seriously, I know you want to sound like the law abiding citizen and all but this rule is senseless. Ironical even.

Originally Posted by emkay456

There are instructions to strictly enforce ban on selling the petrol unless vehicle is present at the petrol station. This has been issued in Maharashtra by the police based on linkage to terrorism. There was a newsreport sometime during last one month. I will try to search on net for any links.

Yeah I know terrorists love blowing up stuff with petrol, oh wait not really they can get C4 and other explosives far easier then going to a petrol pump with bottles. So why bother?

Originally Posted by Caesar

The law is one thing and implementation of it is entirely another.

Just because someone is not following a law or it is not being enforced at a place does not mean that it has ceased to be a law. It is not permissible to buy petrol in unauthorized containers and the petrol pump owner as well as the cops need to be lauded for sticking to this and not falling to a bribery attempt of Rs. 500.

Woah there cowboy. Its not a LAW. Its a senseless rule which neither the petrol pump owner or the police really understand. The exact text has been quoted above and can you really try and explain to me how will I make either of them understand what a approved container is? The only thing they should be lauded for is being ignorant. Getting up and coming with me to my car with petrol in their own hands would be the logical and helpful thing to do and not otherwise.

Originally Posted by Iluvcars

I would understand if you shell out Rs. 450 more to get your vehicle moving but what's that "dignity" component? Didn't mean to be picky but honestly I didn't get that.

Its embarrassing! I am standing on the road trying at 4AM and my poor friends are sitting in the car. Its helpless and a disgusting feeling I hope no one ever has to go through it.

Originally Posted by Born 2 Be Wild

The Marketing Discipline Guidelines prohibit Dispensing Petrol into plastic Bottles and containers. The reason for this as per Officials is that plastics are prone to buildup of static charge and one such small charge is enough to gut the entire bunk, hence all dealers have strict instructions not to dispense Petrol in PLastic bottles.

Each dealer has one litre aluminium containers at the Pump which are basically used for keeping samples at the Bunk but can be given to the customer on a security deposit of 100rs which the customer can later take back after handing over the Alluminium Bottle.

The attendants did the right thing by refusing to give you fuel in the plastic bottle, but they should have offerd you the option of the alluminium Containers, not doing so by them is a sign of bad customer service.

This is the 3rd or 4th reason I've been given for this rule to exist. The bad part is I have not seen it explained or mentioned anywhere. Which doesnt make sense. And I tried 3 different pumps and the police none of them offered any "container" it simply doesnt exist. From what I read only shell keeps it. And I am going to make a point to only fill from Shell bunks from now on.


So anyone know how to file a RTI?

[ph03n!x]

Originally Posted by yogeshnaik

I have personally seen traffic authorities checking for fuel levels of two wheelers at Hubli.

Umm.. I dont get this point. Why should authorities be concerned if you have enough fuel to go home, or if you would be pushing you bike on the way without fuel?

[Born 2 Be Wild]

Originally Posted by quickdraw

This is the 3rd or 4th reason I've been given for this rule to exist. The bad part is I have not seen it explained or mentioned anywhere. Which doesnt make sense. And I tried 3 different pumps and the police none of them offered any "container" it simply doesnt exist. From what I read only shell keeps it. And I am going to make a point to only fill from Shell bunks from now on.

So anyone know how to file a RTI?

I just did try to expalin to you that selling petrol in plastic bottles is not permitted due to build up of static charge in plastics and this is purely from a safety point of view. When a tanker is offloaded Its earthed the Buckets used for samples have earthing, in short the entire bunk is earthed!!

The containers do exist its just that you wern't offered that option by the Pumps which like i said earliar was bad customer service. You could try asking for petrol in a plastic bottle at shell also but be rest assured you will be denied Because shell is stricter with enforcing the rules.

Ps- It aint a senseless rule, heard of the jaipur oil depot fire, it was caused by a small spark due to faulty earthing it raged for 6 days. A wise Man once said Prevention is better than cure.

[Warwithwheels]

Interesting read. Never knew that a bottle of petrol could assume a status tad above the most sophisticated terror fighting technology being developed by the world's super power

Chalo, Jokes apart. I understand that there are some safety norms in place which prohibit sale of highly inflammable products in bottle/cans etc., But then i personally feel that our country has not developed to such an extent where safety overrides profits. At least with the petrol pumps.

While every possible reason has been duly considered in the above posts, I feel that a more practical and realistic dimension to it has been missed out.

IMO, I strongly feel that any fuel station that denies fuel in bottle has its meter tampered. And thats that the reason why you are outrightly denied of it.

Typically all these plastic bottles are transparent and any lay man can easily make out if it the quantity filled is not upto to the brim.

So next time you wanna check if your neighborhood bunk is cheating you just carry a bisleri bottle with you. And voila, u've caught him.