[UP!!!!]

What is the point of having a car and don't drive it. Rather than spending millions to have a garage queen, why can't they just get a body shell of super cars with dummy engine and interiors.

[TrackDay]

I think for that small of percentage of people who are super rich this must be chump change. Nothing more than a small investment.

As for the factor of buying and not using it, that depends on one's own perspective. I have a treadmill that I got 7-8 years back. I bet I clocked less miles on that compared to the Lambo here Someone in a financial position lower than me, must be thinking that I must have wasted money for having purchased that equipment. But for me it was affordable. (It's only use these years have been to dry clothes).

As for the case of these super premium sportscar, they were purchased from day 1 with the intent of not being used. Maybe just once in a blue moon.

[VijayAnand1]

Indians are SMART! The value criteria of any given luxury cager in India is comparatively different from what's been elsewhere. First off, India is a country that loves depreciation, yet everyone wants their assets to be appreciated, same goes equally wrong with their vehicles too. No matter what car you have, from thousands to crores, the market value of these unless sold by exotic resellers/retailers is pretty much a sad story.

There is a convoluted niche though, Indians are peculiar too. If it's owned by a celebrity, people somehow are willing to pay extra (though not much) but it just has a celebrity tag attached to it that does somehow convince the buyer that it's okay to pay the extra. How this works? I am still yet to get my wits on this, but that is India for us.

BMWs, Jags, Audis you name it, all the expensive brands are sold these days at mouthwatering prices, used. Personally, feel no matter how well kept these expensive German cars are, they are a "money pit" and eventually don't last long in India, for the way India wants them to be, IMHO.

All that glitter and shine, stays, only when it's parked as a dead weight in one's garage and as status show and sold at expensive prices where it demands such prices. Here in India, you see a second hand BMW or an Audi at a local seller, you know it's a junk.

Cheers!
VJ

[v1p3r]

Originally Posted by SnS_12

Apart from considering them as an investment and expecting to sell them at a huge profit in the future the other important thing for many owners will be the running cost.

Using a Bugatti Veyron/Chiron on a regular basis can easily cost you close $70k to $100k annually in just tyre/oil and fuel bill (100 octane) any part replacement will be a even bigger hole in the pocket

Realistically, this makes no difference to the owner. If you can afford a million dollar auto like a Veyron, your annual income will be at least 10 million a year - you won't spend more than 10% of your annual income on vehicles (including jets), and this will be one amongst many cars you own. A trip in your private jet will be far more expensive than your annual fuel and tyre bills.

Running expenses are the woes of mere mortals.

[rdst_1]

I echo the same sentiments as GTO - 'To each his own'.
Just as mostly everyone has been saying, that, 'why buy an automobile and not drive it' , it can also be extrapolated to 'why buy a racing machine and not race'. All these cars break so many performance standards and yet, most buyers won't be able to extract even 30% of the performance,even if they drive it.

Somethings just 'tug your heart' so much that one has to buy/own something even if they won't utilize it much. A personal example would be of my Dad, who always loved a Bullet, but bought a scooter because that was what was more practical and in his budget at that time. 10 years later, he was able to able to complete his dream and bought a Bullet in 1997. However, he was never able to ride it as much as he wanted. The bike wasn't as reliable and of course on most occasions, the scooter made more sense to be used and later on the car. However, my father would, without fail, clean and start the bike and take it for a very small spin every weekend. One could clearly see his love for the machine, even if he wasn't able to ride it a lot. In 2006, when I first started riding the bike it had barely covered 6000kms. In the next 15 years, even I wasn't able to ride it as much and now in 2021,the bike stands at just 28k kms. Again, even I like the bike, but only for a small ride on the weekend. So despite loving the bike for how it looks and sounds, I personally just don't like the ride and am just holding to the bike for nostalgic reasons.

[SnS_12]

Originally Posted by v1p3r

Realistically, this makes no difference to the owner. If you can afford a million dollar auto like a Veyron, your annual income will be at least 10 million a year - you won't spend more than 10% of your annual income on vehicles (including jets), and this will be one amongst many cars you own. A trip in your private jet will be far more expensive than your annual fuel and tyre bills.

Running expenses are the woes of mere mortals.

Yes, and still they would rather move around in one of their Rolls instead, which would be more practical than any sports car. Even Manny Khoshbin who owns a couple of Bugatti’s among other supercars has a Rolls to use as his daily.

Plus, when you buy supercars as an investment you would prefer to spend less maintaining/owning the car to enjoy better return on investment.

The Mclaren F1 these days retail for around US$ 20 mln, but if you had to daily use one or have more mileage the chances are you would have spent a good amount of money maintaining it. Just to get the alignment done on an Mclaren F1 a factory driver will do it by testing it on a race track and if Mclaren don’t have direct access to one they will rent one and bill you for it.

As an investor these are the kind of costs I would try to avoid if I am investing money on super/hypercars to get better return on investment.

[v1p3r]

Originally Posted by SnS_12

Yet, and still they would rather move around in one of their Rolls instead, which would be more practical than any sports car. Even Manny Khoshbin who owns a couple of Bugatti’s among other supercars has a Rolls to use as his daily.

We weren't discussing practicality. You said that running costs are important for owners of hypercars, and I disagreed with you on that. I will reiterate that running costs make little to no difference to people who can spend multiple millions on cars every year.

Originally Posted by SnS_12

The Mclaren F1 these days retail for around US$ 20 mln, but if you had to daily use one or have more mileage the chances are you would have spent a good amount of money maintaining it. Just to get the alignment done on an Mclaren F1 a factory driver will do it by testing it on a race track and if Mclaren don’t have direct access to one they will rent one and bill you for it.

Is there any data or workshop manual on this practice? I think this is incredibly stupid, considering they could roadforce balance the wheels and then test the car on a dyno, if needed. As an engineer with racecar experience, I would think anyone recommending alignment testing on a racetrack as part of SOPs is nearly incompetent.

Originally Posted by SnS_12

As an investor these are the kind of costs I would try to avoid if I am investing money on super/hypercars to get better return on investment.

I wouldn't know anything about that, since I don't have any money to invest in hypercars. I do have a couple of cars that have appreciated in value, but I'm always tinkering with them which is sure to annoy some 'investor' or purist.

[SnS_12]

Originally Posted by v1p3r

We weren't discussing practicality. You said that running costs are important for owners of hypercars, and I disagreed with you on that. I will reiterate that running costs make little to no difference to people who can spend multiple millions on cars every year.

Is there any data or workshop manual on this practice? I think this is incredibly stupid, considering they could roadforce balance the wheels and then test the car on a dyno, if needed. As an engineer with racecar experience, I would think anyone recommending alignment testing on a racetrack as part of SOPs is nearly incompetent.

You can hear it from the owner on an F1 in this video the kind of costs these cars attract..

https://youtu.be/EsKDGdcb6BQ

[Kottayamkaran]

I believe the scenario is bit different in India. Might vary from owners to owners. There is a Porsche 911 in Calicut, Kerala which has been driven over 1 lakh kilometers and also saw another post in one of the supercar pages in Instagram about a brand new Ferrari which was driven over 2k kilometers in less than a week after it was bought. So I believe the case varies from owner to owner. But really kudos to the supercar owners in India who use it as a daily drive despite our road conditions.

[gthang]

This brings up the perennial conundrum of Time versus Money.

When you reach the supercar buyer stratosphere, odds are that time is no longer in your control and is usually managed. So, intentions might not match reality.

In developed countries, there are some high earning professionals who can afford to indulge and usually are the ones that drive them the most.

If you have the time and money, there should be no excuse for such abuse.

Cheers

[SatyRoy]

I just cant digest the fact the people own these beauty and never drive it. I understand "to each his own" however I personally feel that cars are meant to be driven. If ever great Lord grant me any such vehicle, I sure would take it out on the streets.

[v1p3r]

Originally Posted by SnS_12

You can hear it from the owner on an F1 in this video the kind of costs these cars attract..

https://Youtu.be/EsKDGdcb6BQ

Thanks for posting this. I appreciate the data.

He is either exaggerating (some possibility) or McL is just milking customers (more of a possibility). There is absolutely no need for that kind of work when fitting new tyres.

F1 and NASCAR racecars see much more brutal use, and far higher tyre stresses and loads. They certainly don't need this sort of post-installation testing after alignment. No one would ever get any actual testing done, if this were necessary.

A 320 kmph Ferrari 488 does not require this (to my knowledge), so why would a 380 kmph F1?

My dead horse has now been beaten as much as possible.

[SnS_12]

Originally Posted by v1p3r

Thanks for posting this. I appreciate the data.

He is either exaggerating (some possibility) or McL is just milking customers (more of a possibility). There is absolutely no need for that kind of work when fitting new tyres.

There is no other information available online to confirm it, but the kind of breakdown he gave for the tyre change cost felt legitimate. Maybe they took it to the track to test something else and not balance the wheels.

This car was the first production car to be built completely from carbon fibre and was the first supercar to cost a million $ and that too in the 90’s. The car came with its own modem which helped engineers diagnose issues remotely. So the maintenance cost can definitely make even the superrich GULP.

He mentioned that the fuel cell needs to be replaced every 5 years irrespective you use the car or not and Jay Leno confirmed it as well to have done it on his F1 which is close to 25 years old so has gone through 5 fuel cell changes already. Luckily he has the resources to get it done in-house helping him save on labour cost (the engine needs to be pulled down to do it) as he was not pleased on the life of a fuel cell being just 5 years and Mclaren not being able to provide a better alternative.

[v1p3r]

Originally Posted by SnS_12

There is no other information available online to confirm it, but the kind of breakdown he gave for the tyre change cost felt legitimate. Maybe they took it to the track to test something else and not balance the wheels.

Yeah I agree, it's not cheap at all. Though I suppose if you can afford 20m now to buy one, the service costs may seem reasonable!

Small correction - the Jag XJR-15 and Bugatti EB-110 both used CF monocoques before the F1.

[SSO]

Originally Posted by v1p3r

Yeah I agree, it's not cheap at all. Though I suppose if you can afford 20m now to buy one, the service costs may seem reasonable!

Small correction - the Jag XJR-15 and Bugatti EB-110 both used CF monocoques before the F1.

I believe the Jaguar XJR-15 was the first to use a CF tub. I owned a XJR-15 for several years and the craftsmanship on the tub was extraordinary. Nicest CF tub I have seen from any manufacturer to date.

I did drive mine on a fairly regular basis but it was a real handful. Its very much a race, and not a road, car.