[shamanth]

Yes, if the prices don't match with Ninja 650, 600F wont take off.

[gsferrari]

I don't know if you guys are talking from experience or just shooting off from the hip...You can get into a LOT of trouble with the 68 Bhp parallel twin in a 650R. Does 210 kph sound slow to you? That too when the rider weights 120 Kilos and is 6'3" tall and about the same width?

yes...I own a 650R and I think it is a fantastic all-rounder but I can see why someone would want an inline 4. But if you haven't ridden a 650R in anger...don't knock it. Past 6000 rpm this thing screams as well!

[Torquedo]

Originally Posted by gsferrari

I don't know if you guys are talking from experience or just shooting off from the hip...You can get into a LOT of trouble with the 68 Bhp parallel twin in a 650R. Does 210 kph sound slow to you? That too when the rider weights 120 Kilos and is 6'3" tall and about the same width?

yes...I own a 650R and I think it is a fantastic all-rounder but I can see why someone would want an inline 4. But if you haven't ridden a 650R in anger...don't knock it. Past 6000 rpm this thing screams as well!

GS -

650R was never a slouch, it is just that the feel of an in line 4 is entirely different. I have been in company of R1's for some time now, would not like to stretch this any further.

Cheers Mate.

[gsferrari]

No I agree...but if someone is not buying a 650R (well...you cannot buy one now anyway) when it is within budget...simply because they want an i4 which is NOT in budget, then it doesn't make sense. Heck I want a Hayabusa now and it is an itch I have to fight scratching because I don't want to have that kind of power in hand and not use it (or use it and die).

After buying the 650R...I have come to the conclusion that using a bike is more important than buying something big and keeping it parked away. I use the 650R so much now that my MT01 has been relegated to the garage on a battery tender. I just find it so much more convenient to hop on the 650R and head to the grocery shop and still do 200+ if I want to. It gives me 23 Kpl on the highway at 120 - 150 and it can take me to Ladakh and back. Cheap as chips to fix and with the backing of Bajaj...I really don't have much to worry about.

Ownership cost is something many people forget about by just focusing on the acquisition cost. i4s and larger CC bikes get super pricey to run!

[slalom]

The 650 R is a nice bike and given our conditions it is packaged well .

I had an R6 in DXB for quite some time and I'm little acquainted with bigger bikes as well ,and I will go weak in the knees for an Inline four ,they are sweet .

In any case if the CB 600F is going to be priced above 7 lacs I will just pass and fall back on the 650 R .

[aargee]

Originally Posted by gsferrari

Ownership cost is something many people forget about by just focusing on the acquisition cost. i4s and larger CC bikes get super pricey to run!

Wow GS!!! Pls share as how a I4 on 600 is expensive to maintain than a twin on 600.

PS - Its a genuine question for learning.

[gsferrari]

Originally Posted by aargee

Wow GS!!! Pls share as how a I4 on 600 is expensive to maintain than a twin on 600.

PS - Its a genuine question for learning.

More moving parts
Higher revving therefore more wear/tear
Burns oil quicker
Less torque...more clutch slip from standstill
More complex electronics and sensitive fueling
Higher compression ratio than 650R = higher octane fuel needed

The engine also costs more than a twin so if you crash/grenade the engine with irresponsible tuning then you will have to shell out more.

[aargee]

Ok, coming to specifics...

Originally Posted by gsferrari

Higher revving therefore more wear/tear

But...how does it fair to long strokes? What I mean is, longer twin stroke should wear out more quicker than shorter 4 cylinders isn't it?

Originally Posted by gsferrari

Burns oil quicker

Okay...

Originally Posted by gsferrari

Less torque...more clutch slip from standstill

Aaha!!! Need to understand this one!!!

Originally Posted by gsferrari

More complex electronics and sensitive fueling

But, wouldn't that depend on CR?

Originally Posted by gsferrari

The engine also costs more than a twin so if you crash/grenade the engine with irresponsible tuning then you will have to shell out more.

Agreed on this front that I'd in my mind initially; but I'm trying to think of possibilities beyond this.

[gsferrari]

Originally Posted by aargee

But...how does it fair to long strokes? What I mean is, longer twin stroke should wear out more quicker than shorter 4 cylinders isn't it?

Greater piston speeds = more wear and tear. Take bullet for example. But in short-stroke motors like the 650R, this isn't an issue. In this case greater revs result in more wear and tear of the rings and block. I'm not entirely sure how this affects the crank and big-end bearings etc.

Aaha!!! Need to understand this one!!!

Most 600s have their first gear limiter at about 110 Kph and sometimes more. 0-100 in ONE GEAR! It is like starting your CBR in 3rd gear

But, wouldn't that depend on CR?


Agreed on this front that I'd in my mind initially; but I'm trying to think of possibilities beyond this.

Not sure what CR is...

I wouldn't get a 600cc inline-4. If you want an i4 then 750cc is where the fun starts. A 600 triple is the best compromise...wait for Triumph to launch the 675 in india...will be expensive though!

These aren't hard-fast rules...

[aargee]

Originally Posted by gsferrari

Greater piston speeds = more wear and tear. Take bullet for example

Right, so I4's should work out better isn't it?

Originally Posted by gsferrari

Most 600s have their first gear limiter at about 110 Kph and sometimes more. 0-100 in ONE GEAR! It is like starting your CBR in 3rd gear

Hmm...will get through this

Originally Posted by gsferrari

Not sure what CR is...

Compression Ratio; Sry

Originally Posted by gsferrari

I wouldn't get a 600cc inline-4

Me too as I love torqy engines; but, I'm under the impression that I4 engine's have long life (comparatively) & when you said I4's are expensive to maintain, I was trying to understand on that front.

Originally Posted by gsferrari

If you want an i4 then 750cc is where the fun starts.

You bet!!! GSX750...perfect one

Originally Posted by gsferrari

A 600 triple is the best compromise...wait for Triumph to launch the 675 in india...will be expensive though

Shoots!!! GS...something is wrong with both of us today!!! You're speaking my mind on all fronts!!! The 675 with 52mm stroke is perfect one (not too short, not too long) with adequate torque & top speed.

But again, the base point still remains - I didn't quite understand how I4's are expensive to maintain (barring the accidental or engine work) on regular maintenance work.

[gsferrari]

A 350cc long stroke single cylinder like the bullet needs higher piston speeds at the same RPM than a 600cc 4 cylinder short-stroke. Keeping just this in mind, the 4 cylinder is less stressed and will live longer. However, the 600cc 4 cylinder produces less torque than a 600cc single at the lower rev range and needs to be revved harder.

If you ride a KTM 690 at 3500 rpm you will make more progress than if you ride a CBR 600RR at 3500 rpm. But to match the performance you needs far more revs in the CBR and that does increase the stress on the engine...

[djay99]

Originally Posted by gsferrari

But to match the performance you needs far more revs in the CBR and that does increase the stress on the engine...

IMO the sweet exhaust note on CBR600F I4 is because of hell lot of stress on engine
If CBR600F is launched at around 6 Lacs then it's definitely gonna sell like hot cakes.
Many people may not worry about the points you mentioned because they never gonna understand them.
All they want is an I4, good looking, sporty bike in the range of 6 lacs.

I am one of them

[e46]

Fellas,
Please keep an eye on the HMSI pavilion, if they launch it


Thanks,
Abhishek

[Torquedo]

Originally Posted by e46

Fellas,
Please keep an eye on the HMSI pavilion, if they launch it

Thanks,
Abhishek

Abhi -

Ha ha , I have been keeping a close eye since morning, but they are launching is absolute TRASH -

CBR150 - Oh ! who needs it.
Dream Yuga - The name in itself, makes me run away, let alone the bike.

It does not seem likely that they would be announcing it for India in AE 2012, might come in later during the year.

[Sheel]

Isn't an I4 designed in such a way as that it can keep spinning in higher rpm's & still run on stock engine. Posting an example

2004 CBR 600 F4i turning 200,000 miles + brief history - YouTube

Any engine which peaks at 14,000 revs (torque), makes power at 17,000 & revs to 19,000 should't have much problem till preventive maintenance is carried out. Should it?