[Venkatesh]

Triumph Trident 660 to launch in India on April 6, 11:30am



Link

[ghost-was-here]

Originally Posted by Kashi053

The price has been leaked in Indian Triump website. It mentions 6.95L onwards.

https://www.drivespark.com/two-wheel...ls-033606.html

This is heart breaking.
With Z900 only 1 lakh away, it is a lot of machine for a very small increase in cost. Not to forget larger service network (compared to Triumph) and cheaper maintenance.

But a very good alternative to Ducati Scrambler if you are looking for a bike with ~80 bhp and want to save 2 lakhs in the process

[Axe77]

Originally Posted by ghost-was-here

Not to forget larger service network (compared to Triumph) and cheaper maintenance.

I am not sure if the Triumph service network is inadequate compared to Kawasaki. I can’t think of a major city where you might need their coverage and its not there (compared to Kawasaki).

Cheaper maintenance?? Where is that coming from? Kawasakis are hands down far more expensive to maintain - no two ways about it.

Do compare final on road prices to gauge the difference. A Z900 customer will also want a peak at the Street Triple R which personally I feel is a better bet so there is no end to the whole logic of - for a lakh or so more I can get xyz.

Triumph service

Unrelated to above quote but I will add one thing on this front. I consistently see south / Bangalore based owners completely dumping on Triumph service on a pan India basis. I really feel sorry at the way Keerthi Triumph is treating its Bangalore customers and I have complete empathy with their issues in these cities. But I feel this is wrongly amplified to consistently discredit Triumph pan India which is not correct. I can say without hesitation that Triumph in both both Mumbai and Pune are absolutely exemplary. Goa is also part owned by Pune team and I have no doubt it will be a similar experience there. Even in NCR while some may have had a less than ideal experience I know many owners who are quite happy with Triumph in NCR.

I agree Honda is generally the gold standard when it comes to service. But I have serious reservations about trashing the brand on a pan India basis when the problem is very acute only with some pockets of dealers.

[bf1983]

Originally Posted by Axe77

I am not sure if the Triumph service network is inadequate compared to Kawasaki. I can’t think of a major city where you might need their coverage and its not there (compared to Kawasaki).

I don't know about pan India but in Mumbai at least kawasaki has far better coverage. I stay in Navi Mumbai and I would have to travel almost 2 hours one way to get my bike serviced if it was a Triumph. Kawasaki has a service center in Navi Mumbai and Thane as well.

If the bike is priced around 7l ex showroom I think it should sell well. Its just 1l more than the Z650 and this bike is far better than that in almost every way.

[Axe77]

Originally Posted by bf1983

I don't know about pan India but in Mumbai at least kawasaki has far better coverage. I stay in Navi Mumbai and I would have to travel almost 2 hours one way to get my bike serviced if it was a Triumph. Kawasaki has a service center in Navi Mumbai and Thane as well.

Well its really one annual service but that aside, Shaman Triumph has listened to you - they are already operating a second showroom / SVC from Vashi since several months now.

In any case they all have pick up drop service so as long as my city has service coverage I would not fret so much on location. Finally, since the last year, their service centre is now also operating on Sundays, not just Saturdays.

All in all I would say that is as good coverage as I would want for a premium bike.

[ghost-was-here]

Originally Posted by Axe77

I am not sure if the Triumph service network is inadequate compared to Kawasaki. I can’t think of a major city where you might need their coverage and its not there (compared to Kawasaki).

Cheaper maintenance?? Where is that coming from? Kawasakis are hands down far more expensive to maintain - no two ways about it.

Do compare final on road prices to gauge the difference. A Z900 customer will also want a peak at the Street Triple R which personally I feel is a better bet so there is no end to the whole logic of - for a lakh or so more I can get xyz.

Triumph service

Unrelated to above quote but I will add one thing on this front. I consistently see south / Bangalore based owners completely dumping on Triumph service on a pan India basis. I really feel sorry at the way Keerthi Triumph is treating its Bangalore customers and I have complete empathy with their issues in these cities. But I feel this is wrongly amplified to consistently discredit Triumph pan India which is not correct. I can say without hesitation that Triumph in both both Mumbai and Pune are absolutely exemplary. Goa is also part owned by Pune team and I have no doubt it will be a similar experience there. Even in NCR while some may have had a less than ideal experience I know many owners who are quite happy with Triumph in NCR.

I agree Honda is generally the gold standard when it comes to service. But I have serious reservations about trashing the brand on a pan India basis when the problem is very acute only with some pockets of dealers.

I'll address your response point wise.

Total Triumph service centers in India = 12
Total Kawasaki service centers in India = 29 (official) / 26 (by my cont)
So i don't know why you would say both are comparable.They are NOT!

Yes, Kawasaki are cheaper to maintain compared to triumphs. Whether it is OE spares, or OEM spares or after-market spares and accessories. Indian owners regularly share their service bills and experience in the respective forums.
And for service experience, i did not comment anything because i don't know the whole picture, but i fathom there are more happy Kawasaki owners than there are triumph owners (w.r.t service alone).

As far as my logic of "Z900 for a lakh more" goes.
It is not for seasoned riders like you who like to shop based on performance category or handling. Many riders buy a superbike (here in india) cause it gets them a screaming inline four + bragging rights (higher displacement) + showoff (no doubts z900 looks far more menacing and aggressive and fast).

Some people shop based purely on budget criteria (say 8-10 lakhs) and will test drive everything under the sun from Harleys to Kawasaki naked to discounted scrambler (Triumphs and Ducatis) to second-hand super sports and then decide on what they want.

Ask around, and you'll be surprised on what going on in a mind of a novice rider upgrading from a humble pulsar 220 or ninja 300 or maybe even from a segment below.

cheers

[bf1983]

Originally Posted by ghost-was-here

Yes, Kawasaki are cheaper to maintain compared to triumphs. Whether it is OE spares, or OEM spares or after-market spares and accessories. Indian owners regularly share their service bills and experience in the respective forums.

Leaving aside the happiness part (I haven't been terribly happy with the servicing of Kawasaki to be honest) but even the pricing part is not really comparable since most Kawasaki bikes have a 6 month service interval while Triumphs have a 10k service interval regardless of bike. So say if a Z900 has a service cost of 8k and a Triumph Street Triple has a service cost of 12k you have to double the service cost of the Z900 to compare since you have to do it twice a year.

[Axe77]

Originally Posted by ghost-was-here

I'll address your response point wise.

cheers

To revert point wise:

1. Coverage:

12 vs 26/29 may be the case but perhaps I was approaching it from my own blinkered perspective. In my mind, if both have service centres in the city I am based in I consider that comparable. Combined with perhaps any key cities I regularly visit. To me that is Mumbai (base) combined with Pune. Possibly Goa too if I plan to ride there once a year.

Coverage is for most part a binary outcome - they are either present in your base city or not. Then whether their footprint otherwise covers 20 other cities or 10 is largely moot - unless one moves cities very frequently and that too to relatively remote places. A brand like Indian which has 3 -4 showrooms pan India - yes that's outright slim coverage. Honda, BMW, Triumph, Kawasaki all have comparably "adequate" footprint in India for a premium bike.

Anyone who's in the market for this bike has to decide whether he has the coverage from Kawasaki or Triumph where HE is based.

2. Service costs

I have no doubt in my mind on this but nothing further to say - it will be your word against mine. No sense debating it. If you feel Kawasakis are cheaper to own and maintain than Triumphs, so be it.

3. A lakh or so more

I hear what you're saying but my only point is there will be a customer at every price point. One who won't stretch beyond the Z 650 for a Trident, one who won't stretch from a Trident to a Z900 and so on.

Also, there is every kind of customer whether new or seasoned at every price point. I have a price agnostic colleague who bought a T 120 at 13 lakh or whatever it costs. I can't for the life of me put that kind of money on that bike personally. But for him it was exactly what he wanted. Some new buyers may find buying a more "new-rider" friendly Trident less intimidating than the more raw Z900. Others may simply want the maximum horses and cylinders for their money. Neither is right or wrong - its their perspective. But there will be enough distinct buyers with their own unique priorities, whether seasoned or first timers.

[ghost-was-here]

@Axe77,
our debate aside, do you see Trident selling in same number as Ninja 650 twins ?

and if it does (and takes customer away from Kawasaki), do you foresee a price correction for Ninja down the line (back to BS4 time prices) ?

[surjaonwheelz]

Originally Posted by ghost-was-here

@Axe77,
our debate aside, do you see Trident selling in same number as Ninja 650 twins ?

and if it does (and takes customer away from Kawasaki), do you foresee a price correction for Ninja down the line (back to BS4 time prices) ?

That's what Triumph is targeting in internationally! To take a pie from the entry level superbikes.

The 650 platform is very reliable from Kawasaki stable and it's been around for many years now. Many upgrade from the twin to bigger bikes. Hence you'll se many in the pre-owned market!

Here, everything depends on pricing. Now consider the choice between a new Trident and a pre-owned Street Triple?

Long story short, test ride it when available and if you feel the connect then decide the value proposition as per pricing. In addition, you have to benchmark a bike and compare the Trident to it, be it the Z650.

/surjaonwheelz

[Axe77]

Originally Posted by ghost-was-here

@Axe77,
our debate aside, do you see Trident selling in same number as Ninja 650 twins ?

and if it does (and takes customer away from Kawasaki), do you foresee a price correction for Ninja down the line (back to BS4 time prices) ?

Haha - best off to agree to disagree on the debate and move on.

On sheer numbers, its hard to say but I doubt it.

This is where your key point of number of dealerships comes in. If it is ~26 vs 12 as you mentioned, very simply they're tapping into a larger potential customer base (even discounting for multiple dealerships in the same city) and just that reason alone could pull in higher numbers for the brand as such. Other than that I definitely think the Trident will pull some numbers away from the Kawasaki 650s just as much as it would poach from the Street Twin also for that matter, and the Striple and the Z900. There will be a range of buyers that will throw the Trident also now into their mix of options and it'll find its takers from buyers who were otherwise considering other alternatives.

I really don't know whether it would be enough to warrant any price correction just on account of a Trident launch. This is still all moot given we don't know firm on road prices for the Trident until launch. Lets see how that plays out first.

My completely unscientific, intuitive, and "have keyboard therefore have opinion" 2 cents above.

[shan_ned]

Originally Posted by ghost-was-here

Yes, Kawasaki are cheaper to maintain compared to triumphs. Whether it is OE spares, or OEM spares or after-market spares and accessories. Indian owners regularly share their service bills and experience in the respective forums.

cheers

Based on my experience of owning both Kawasaki and Triumph bikes, I can certainly say that the OE spares cost plus the labour cost are almost same between the two. In fact some of the spares from Kawasaki are costlier than the ones from Triumph. Of course Kawasaki was way cheaper when they had partnership with Bajaj.

Having said that, Kawasaki bangalore Svc is far more better than Triumph bangalore Svc. And we also know that Triumph india has an incompetent leadership which has no courage to take action against certain dealers. Except for Honda India, the rest of the big bike brands don’t have a full control over the dealers.

[AtheK]

Trident is a good proposition, even at 6.99 lacs, it should find it's own set of buyers. Looking at current prices, Z650 is priced around 6.04 lacs Ex-showroom, with one cylinder less and lesser oomph factor.

Trident will also bring exclusivity and Triumph is considered a premium brand over Kawasaki. That all adds up and a 6.99 price is something that triumph should be able to pull off. Though if they really want to take the battle to Kawasaki, maybe they should price it at 6.49, at least as introductory pricing, that will really make Z650 feel the heat. I for one would pick the trident over Z650 eyes closed if the difference is just 50 thousand.

[Venkatesh]

Triumph Trident 660 arrives on Indian shores ahead of April 6 launch.



Link

[Sebring]

Eagerly awaiting pricing announcement