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Old 30th April 2019, 10:36   #16
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Default Re: Need a Tourer with AWD / 4x4

I cannot add more, all competent solutions have been already suggested. Your post emphasizes the need for AWD below C2 segment. Major players today areName:  2019 C2 segment sales.jpg
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Source (March 2019 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis)and the AWD options in this segment are Duster, Scorpio and Safari.

May be these are cues to manufacturers, for example, providing AWD in compact SUVs can be a significant differentiator, especially for a price sensitive buyer.

Last edited by Thermodynamics : 30th April 2019 at 10:41.
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Old 30th April 2019, 10:55   #17
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Default Re: Need a Tourer with AWD / 4x4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nifty.Nishy View Post

- Touring..... Himalayas/Nilgiris/Western Ghats are what I look forward to.

1. Mahindra Thar:

2. Force Gurkha Extreme:
Forget these two if you want to drive from Chennai to the Himalayas. It is difficult, not impossible though.
Quote:
3. Duster AWD
The best choice. The well-engineered vehicle which is extremely reliable. Even if Renault exits, you'll have enough service back up as it is a very popular vehicle.
Quote:
4. Hyundai Venue:
5. Ford Ecosport:
These are great compact SUVs. I don't think any AWD options are on the horizon.

Alternatively, look for a pre-owned Fortuner, Tata Safari, Scorpio or XUV 500 with 4x4/AWD. Just make sure you're okay driving a big vehicle for regular commutes too.

Last edited by landcruiser123 : 30th April 2019 at 10:56.
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Old 30th April 2019, 18:31   #18
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Default Re: Need a Tourer with AWD / 4x4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nifty.Nishy View Post
My requirements:
- Fuel: I was inclined to Diesel, but looking at the way things are going, I have a big doubt about the future of Diesel. Turbo Petrols seem to be good alternate!

- 4X4 / AWD :
...
1. Mahindra Thar: Competent Off-roader and tourer, but constant niggles, dark future for diesel, soft top and lack of safety makes me stay away. The upgrade should be worth the wait, but again Diesel is bothering me.
3. Duster AWD: The one that ticks all the boxes, except Renault Nissan isn't doing all that great in the market.
Well, there are no new cars in the Indian market that offer you 4wd with a petrol engine as of now. I've been through a similar dilemma a few months ago, and you can read about it here (The Ciazzler® | Our Nexa Blue Maruti-Suzuki Ciaz Petrol (Alpha)).

Fortunately for me, I also have a Thar (The Red One | My Thar'd... err...Third Car), and the Himalayas are not as far away as compared to the distance thereof from Chennai. In your shortlist, the only two vehicles that have 4wd/AWD are the Duster and Thar, and both are diesels. The one vehicle that I would have bought if at all possible, would have been the Jimny, which would now be the perfect replacement for my Thar - petrol, 4wd with low range, and a reasonably comfortable cruiser on the highways. I'm willing to wait a couple of years in the hope that MSIL starts selling it in India - but are you?

OTOH, there were a few excellent petrol 4WDs on sale here till a few years ago - the Suzuki Grand Vitara, Mitsubishi Outlander, and much earlier, the Chevrolet Forester. It might be worth your while to look for a used Grand Vitara for your purposes, till such time as the Jimny or any other petrol 4wd appears in the marketplace.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:18   #19
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Default Re: Need a Tourer with AWD / 4x4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samba View Post
I picked up a Duster AWD last year with the .
Yes Samba Sir, I am a big fan of your travelogues, your etios has seen terrains most SUVs in this country hasn't seen, I can only imagine what your duster has in future! Thank you for your suggestion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shijinpr View Post
Can you give us some info about your touring, like the places you have visited recently. This would help in suggesting the vehicle.
Well I tour a lot. Coorg, Vagamon, Vattakanal, Sahyadri's, Garhwals, etc. The whole need for the AWD was i wouldn't have to bother about the terrain much, as most of the mountains in India get exposed to lot of slush and mud in rains.

Quote:
Originally Posted by humyum View Post
Like everyone is saying, a Duster sounds like the best one, but be aware, it has a hard clutch, the 110 ps one.

Also one more option that came to my head if you don't want the 4X4 is the Brezza, with its 198 mm ground clearance, its quite the go anywhere vehicle!
I truly appreciate your sugestion sir, but Brezza just doesn't appeal to me. Even though the 1.3 does provide a decent drivability, I feel it loses its breath quite soon.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
There are lots of 4x4 / AWD options in today's market. Go through the Official Reviews of the following cars and you'll be all set.

The Duster AWD - old & outdated as it is - still cannot be matched for its ride quality, car-like handling & surprisingly competent AWD.

If you can extend your budget, consider the following. Or if you can't stretch the $$$, look at the pre-owned market for the following = XUV500 AWD, Hexa, Scorpio (I don't like it, but clearly a lot of people do) & Safari Storme (I don't like it, but clearly a lot of people do).

If you can wait for a year or two, the Compass will start hitting the used market. It is one heck of an SUV & decent in the rough stuff too .
Thank you for your feedback, Compass is one droolworthy vehicle, I am definitely keeping your suggestion in mind!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thermodynamics View Post
I cannot add more, all competent solutions have been already suggested. Your post emphasizes the need for AWD below C2 segment. the AWD options in this segment are Duster, Scorpio and Safari.

May be these are cues to manufacturers, for example, providing AWD in compact SUVs can be a significant differentiator, especially for a price sensitive buyer.
Scorpio and Safari, aren't exactly the vehicles I would be looking for. Too big a footprint for my requirements or usage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by landcruiser123 View Post
Forget these two if you want to drive from Chennai to the Himalayas. It is difficult, not impossible though.

The best choice. The well-engineered vehicle which is extremely reliable. Even if Renault exits, you'll have enough service back up as it is a very popular vehicle.

These are great compact SUVs. I don't think any AWD options are on the horizon.

Alternatively, look for a pre-owned Fortuner, Tata Safari, Scorpio or XUV 500 with 4x4/AWD. Just make sure you're okay driving a big vehicle for regular commutes too.
I second you! Thank you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SS-Traveller View Post
Well, there are no new cars in the Indian market that offer you 4wd with a petrol engine as of now. I've been through a similar dilemma a few months ago, and you can read about it here (The Ciazzler® | Our Nexa Blue Maruti-Suzuki Ciaz Petrol (Alpha)).

Fortunately for me, I also have a Thar (The Red One | My Thar'd... err...Third Car), and the Himalayas are not as far away as compared to the distance thereof from Chennai. In your shortlist, the only two vehicles that have 4wd/AWD are the Duster and Thar, and both are diesels. The one vehicle that I would have bought if at all possible, would have been the Jimny, which would now be the perfect replacement for my Thar - petrol, 4wd with low range, and a reasonably comfortable cruiser on the highways. I'm willing to wait a couple of years in the hope that MSIL starts selling it in India - but are you?

OTOH, there were a few excellent petrol 4WDs on sale here till a few years ago - the Suzuki Grand Vitara, Mitsubishi Outlander, and much earlier, the Chevrolet Forester. It might be worth your while to look for a used Grand Vitara for your purposes, till such time as the Jimny or any other petrol 4wd appears in the marketplace.
I had gone through your thread about both Thar and Ciaz. As you rightly commented, India badly wants the Jimny! Anyway, as far as i know from the inside sources, Maruti doesn't have any plans in their pipeline to bring Jimny to India, quite a shame!

Thank you all for your suggestions, I do understand Duster would be the only vehicle that would fit in my requirements, but to be honest I'm unable to connect with that vehicle, maybe a prejudice, however I have reached out to dealership to see if the magic exhibits! I am going to look into Used Car market as well to look out for Grand Vitara, or a Compass. Or I might have to give up on owning AWD for now, and settle down for something that can keep up on most of the terrains without the AWD!
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:43   #20
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Default Re: Need a Tourer with AWD / 4x4

Of your original list, I would only consider Duster AWD, but I find the ergonomics bad. Ecosport - lack of space and only 4x2. Thar - hire one and check it out sufficiently if you find it comfortable for long drives.

From the others, I would suggest (cars already suggested) - Storme 4x4 (can find one within 10L used), XUV500 AWD, Hexa AWD. V-Cross used ones @ about 13-15L.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 09:57   #21
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Default Re: Need a Tourer with AWD / 4x4

The only two cars that come to my mind are - Duster AWD and V-Cross. Since your requirement is of driving long distances, these two are more practical and comfortable options than the Thar or the Gurkha.

If you wish to go through the pre-owned route, you can get everything from a Fortuner to a Prado in your budget. Depending how much would be willing to spend on a pre-owned car and condition of the vehicle, these are the top 5 options that come to my mind -
  • Toyota Fortuner 4x4
  • Mitsubishi Pajero SFX 4x4
  • Mitsubishi Pajero Sports 4x4
  • Honda CR-V AWD
  • Suzuki Grand Vitara 4x4
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:13   #22
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Default Re: Need a Tourer with AWD / 4x4

Let's look at the options:-

1. Duster AWD - Very capable and good tourer but may lack space due to size, for long touring. Also it's an AWD and not a 4WD.

2. Mahindra Thar (new) - This is a proper 4WD. However this vehicle is best suited for off roaders and may not be comfortable for long distance drives and cruising on highways.

3. Mahindra XUV500 AWD (pre owned) - Very good tourer and very comfortable on highways. Again it's a AWD and not a proper 4WD. I would not recommended a pre owned XUV unless you personally know the owner or are sure of the vehicle. Also consider buying the post 2015 models (updated one).

4. Mahindra Scorpio 4WD (pre owned)- Very good vehicle for touring but may not be as comfortable as the XUV. If you go for this one then you must go for the post 2015 models with the new mHawk engine (borrowed from XUV). When Mahindra changed their line up they introduced a S4 model with 4x4. This was cheap and about 14 lakhs onroad. If you get a pre owned one in this model you can save loads of money. Later 4x4 models were launched in top variant only. Even this will suit your budget. However it's hard to find a pre owned Scorpio with 4WD as most of them on sale are 4x2.

5. Izusu - Very capable and good storage space. However it's so long that driving within cities may be an issue.

6. Mitsubishi Pajero 4x4 old and new (pre owned) - Both very capable but lack of spares and service centers may be an issue. Basically you have to be really passionate to own the old generation Pajero.

7. Suzuki Grand Vitara 4x4 (pre owned) - Very good SUV, but somehow did not do well in India. Not seen much on the roads.

8. Old generation Toyota Fortuner 4x4 (pre owned) - This vehicle best suits your needs if touring, 4x4 and robust vehicle is what you need. It has a low range gearbox and has proven off road capabilities. In 13 lakhs or less you will get a wonderful used Fortuner. Even if there are some niggles with the car then Toyota service will look after it. Some may complain about the suspension, so you can easily replace it with better after market ones as there would be no warranty issues with Toyota.


My choice would be a 5-7 years old used Fortuner 4x4, as it will be easily drivable upto 15 years with lakhs of kilometers on the odometer.

Last edited by ruzbehxyz : 2nd May 2019 at 10:32.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:15   #23
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Default Re: Need a Tourer with AWD / 4x4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nifty.Nishy View Post
Hello Guys & Girls!

I'm in a serious dilemma in deciding what to buy, I hope your expertise could help me narrow down, or find something that I missed.

My requirements:

- Touring: (I'm crazy about roadtrips, especially impormptu ones!) Highway mile munching. Off-beat Destinations. Himalayas/Nilgiris/Western Ghats are what I look forward to.

- 4X4 / AWD : Not that I am a hardcore Offroader, but i have always wanted to own a machine that could go literally anywhere, snow, slush, trails. 4x4 has the potential to take you to places no 4x2 can. Period!
You already have a glut of information shared by others. But I had this thought in mind - a 4x4 with its "4L" low-end transfer case will get you through offroading conditions (sand, slush, stones, really steep inclines etc.) whereas an AWD is undoubtedly better in ice and snow alone. The AWD might do well or worse in typical offroading conditions (mentioned above).

With an AWD vehicle - you need to bother about maintaining the same levels of tread depth on all 4 tyres; if one tyre were to get decomissioned for any reason, you'd have to get down to the nasty business of buying 4 new tyres. In the 4.5 years that I owned an AWD SUV in the US, I was ever thankful for its AWD capability in winter but I constantly kept an eye on the tyres' health; I had to ensure that proactive wheel alignment, balancing etc got done on it. The prospect of having to change all 4 tyres due to poor maintenance is in some ways like a millstone around your neck.

I also had to live with the relatively high proactive maintenance/servicing costs of an AWD system, what with all the complex electronics and the systems that are involved.

But that's a narrow point of view on owning an AWD vehicle, however financially loaded it is. Moreover, I've had some Americans tell me that it's a load of lies by OEMs to sell more, by telling us that all 4 tyres have to have the same tread depth on AWD cars. Hey, but what did I know, except the prospect of ruining the AWD system by not following the manufacturer's recommendations?

With a 4x4, I believe when you change tyres, you would need to do so by maintaining the same tread depth on the 2 tyres on each axle. Plus, you would need to make an effort vis-a-vis the maintenance of the 4x4 system.

Personally, I'd recommend a 4x4 to you. How often will you even encounter snow? A 4x4 with snow-chains can probably chug along equally well if driven accordingly. Plus AWDs might overheat their clutch plate if you try to offroad with them.

Viewed through my eyes (which is to say, you won't necessarily view things the same way) - you should just get a used Thar, retrofit a hardtop, equip it with a Racedynamics box (to drive it well on the highway) and enjoy.

Edit: Here's an example of a 4x4 Safari Storme which has made a successful trip to the Himalayas recently (snow et al.) - https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-...ml#post4582632 (Sable – My 2018 Tata Safari Storme EX. EDIT: 14,000 km and 8 months up)

Last edited by locusjag : 2nd May 2019 at 10:33. Reason: Added edit
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Old 2nd May 2019, 10:39   #24
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Default Re: Need a Tourer with AWD / 4x4

I am impressed with Nissan Kicks ride quality and interiors. Please have a test ride of petrol Kicks. It is surprisingly good to drive. Engine is smooth and ride quality is lovely. It feels like, tailer made product for Indian roads. Interiors are pleasant. It is priced well. Sure, it doesn't come with 4X4. Still, I belive it is competent.
Only issue I see with Nissan is service.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 11:31   #25
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Default Re: Need a Tourer with AWD / 4x4

I was looking for a 4x4 tourer/daily driver as well and I already owned a Thar. I finally purchased a pre-owned ‘classic’ Fortuner in October 2017. I’ve been very happy with it.

Since its a proper body on frame 4wd with low range and not an AWD, it is amazing offroad and can take a beating. It is pretty good on the highways as well.

So IMO, it’s the best option if you don’t mind the size. Also, Long term reliability and durability is the best part of owning a Toyota Ladderframe SUV. I’ve driven my Fortuner for 40k kms since I bought it and it’s about to touch 1 lakh kms on the odo now and still feels rock solid.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 11:34   #26
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Default Re: Need a Tourer with AWD / 4x4

I would recommend to check the Isuzu V cross, as an owner for over two years the truck is an absolute delight with some key points to note:
1. It cannot be your only car, if you have another car at home then its fine
2. The front seats are supremely comfortable and the rear is very bouncy if the truck is unloaded, however if you are carrying luggage its quite plated
3. While it can do some serious speeds inline I am not always pushing it as much as I push a Vento or Sx4
4. If you are driving fast fuel economy is ~7-8
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Old 2nd May 2019, 11:37   #27
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Default Re: Need a Tourer with AWD / 4x4

Quote:
Originally Posted by locusjag View Post
With an AWD vehicle - you need to bother about maintaining the same levels of tread depth on all 4 tyres; if one tyre were to get decomissioned for any reason, you'd have to get down to the nasty business of buying 4 new tyres. In the 4.5 years that I owned an AWD SUV in the US, I was ever thankful for its AWD capability in winter but I constantly kept an eye on the tyres' health; I had to ensure that proactive wheel alignment, balancing etc got done on it. The prospect of having to change all 4 tyres due to poor maintenance is in some ways like a millstone around your neck.
I think what you are referring to is an AWD system like in the Subaru (symmetrical, engaged all the time with 25% of the power going to each wheel). But the AWDs sold in India are non-symmetrical and are mostly engaged on demand (expect Fortuner perhaps). This strict rule about maintaining all 4 tires with same tread depth may not be applicable.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 12:04   #28
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Default Re: Need a Tourer with AWD / 4x4

Incase you are not averse to buying used, there's a Scorpio 4x4 on sale in the classifieds. (No, not mine)

Its way up north in NCR, though.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 12:04   #29
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Default Re: Need a Tourer with AWD / 4x4

Hey buddy,

From your requirements and the list that you have posted, none of them tick all the boxes.

I'd suggest Safari Storme 4x4, or just the 4x2 (upgrade the diffrential to make it more competent offroader).
A RWD is way better than a FWD while offroading. Also RWD 4x2 can take you to places where a FWD can't.
It is comfortable to drive, easy on maintenance (trust me, I own a Storme myself), and mostly no nonsense, and solid build.
Unlike what many people think, TATA have improved and come a long way now. They constantly keep upgrading and improving the vehicles based on customer feedback.
I haven't had any problems with TATA Concorde service till date. I have covered more than 1.3 lakh KMS and still counting.

Other options are Hexa, Scorpio (You won't like the ride quality), Duster AWD (I don't like the build).

Go for Diesel, it has more torque for those tough rocky slopes.
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Old 2nd May 2019, 12:15   #30
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Default Re: Need a Tourer with AWD / 4x4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guna View Post
I think what you are referring to is an AWD system like in the Subaru (symmetrical, engaged all the time with 25% of the power going to each wheel). But the AWDs sold in India are non-symmetrical and are mostly engaged on demand (expect Fortuner perhaps). This strict rule about maintaining all 4 tires with same tread depth may not be applicable.
I had a Nissan Rogue AWD; it didn't come with a system which engaged all the wheels all the time. In fact, the computer would even decide to power only one wheel at times (in certain situations). The static split of 25% to each wheel was available as an option, if I would switch on the "AWD lock" button on the dashboard.

But - it is interesting to hear your input and I'll try to read about the Subaru system. Thanks for writing!
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