[stallion_16]

Hey mates,
Having been a viewer of this forum for a better part of 6 years and now a passive member since a few weeks, I finally wish to put all our minds to work over the selection of our next steed. The post would be divided into various parts so everyone knows the history and optimizes the decision making process.

THE BACKGROUND:- We are a family of 4 adults between 5'10 to 5'2, so average heights and fit builds, plus a fur baby, a chocolate Labrador Retriever, with enough luggage as our trips are 10-25 days depending on our schedules.. We have travelled the length and breadth of India in our trusty old Tata Indica Vista Aura Safire petrol model from 2008 for around 9 years(more on that in the later part of the thread). We have a smaller car for the errand runs and city traffic and hence this car might mostly be used for our weekend Mumbai-Lonavala-Pune and longer journeys.
We are travelers at heart and no journey is long enough. Over the years we've had various steeds in our stable which is the next part of this thread.

OUR STEEDS:-
Mahindra Bolero SLX: I do not remember much of this car as I was barely 7 when we had this car except the fact that it ate up rough roads for breakfast, lunch and dinner. It was comfortable enough and powerful for the time.
Mitsubishi Pajero 1986 Wagon: This was truly a beast of a car and we had it with us for 15 years as it was truly a go anywhere vehicle which was our first and the best experience with a SUV. As a child I loved that car and preferred it over the Bolero for it's muscular looks and the feeling of safety it gave. It wasn't a scorcher but it took us to places where roads were a part of our imagination and doing it with ease and comfort. Sold it off due to one of it's axle breaking and it broke our bank to get another one.
Tata Indica Vista Aura Safire: This was the tourer of our family for 10 years. We visited every place in India except the North East in this car. A slouch of an engine, could barely make up the hills but it never failed us and it's build quality was second to none for us. On none of our trips did it ever even have a single puncture, but had to sell it off due to flooding in our society.
Honda City iVtec 1.5 V (2010): Coming from an Indica, the City feels fast and comfortable. It is a beautiful car and super reliable. We love it to no end it also has taken us to all our travel destinations without a hiccup. We intend to keep it till the end of our lives. It's huge boot gobbles up our luggage, which isn't any less, we are talking 2 medium sized suitcases, 2 large duffle bags, a 25L chiller box and a 70L rucksack. It's N.A. engine is the most beautiful I've driven in this budget and the comfort it provides even after being driven for 1300+ kms in a single day is amazing.
Ford Figo 1.2 (2012): Another beautiful car we have with us since 2014. It is fast, reliable, the AC is a chiller, and handles like on rails. Set the bar high for hatchbacks. Set to be replaced.

We've also had a Tata Nano which was mostly used for the city or Lonavala runs, loved the peppy car, the space it offered and the cold AC.

Now the question arises. Which car do we replace it with?

As one can see, we travel, have a lot of luggage and keep our cars for as long as we can. We wish to buy a bigger car now, possibly an SUV again.

THE CONTENDERS:
They are in order of their preference.
1. Ford Endeavour 3.2
2. Tata Hexa XZA
3. Toyota Innova 2.8
4. Toyota Fortuner/Legender 4*4


My heart is stuck on the Endeavour but I'd love to know everyone's views about the options, or any other options I might've missed. We've always gone the pre-owned, pre-loved route and it has been great for us. So really agree with our moderator GTO on the advantages of it.

(PS:- We also wish to buy another true off roader between the Mahindra Thar and the Force Gurkha except the above purchase but it's set for after 5 years so for now I'd wish for a luxury go anywhere vehicle)

[kosjam]

Wow. that is quite the lineage of vehicles you guys travel in.
Since a lot of things are not clear in your post, I am going to make a couple of assumptions, which may or may not apply. Budget, Area of travel, duration of travel are some of them.

While your heart may be set on the Endy, you should ideally look at a well maintained Toyota Innova, followed by the Fortuner. Both vehicles will satisfy the driving pleasure, as well as luggage carrying capacity, as well as the comfort of your 4 legged friend.
There is no beating a Toyota in terms of longevity and reliability. Creature comforts they offer are sometimes the best in class.

The ford has a couple of things going against it. First and foremost, the lack of company level support, which will quickly reduce from whatever levels it is at currently. None of the authorized service stations would be interested in remaining with a dead brand. Any breakdowns will be very costly, both in terms of money, as well as time (Speaking from personal experience with a non ford but discontinued vehicle breakdown).
Ride quality wise, I found the Toyotas far better than the overly heavy and consequently stiff ride quality of the Endy.
In this regard, even the Hexa would be a better bet than the Endy, because even though it is discontinued, its parts might not be as expensive as compared to the Ford, because many of them are even shared with the Harrier/Safari/Aria. Plus, it being from the stables of a relatively well performing Indian brand, finding a service station wont be as difficult as Ford's.

[achyutaghosh]

I was in a similar scenario as yours and went for the Fortuner.
The 2nd choice for me was the Kia Carnival. Do take a look at that.

[druva]

Very interesting query. I was in similar boat.. (with a furry buddy added to family). I was recently looking at similar options, but didn't proceed.

My heart says Endeavour or Pajero.
However head says go with used innova.

in your list, I don't like the ride quality of fortuner. The price to value is not there and used cars are also pricey.
As an ex Safari owner ( I had it for 9 years), I have no idea why Hexa failed. TATA vehicles have rattling problem and that was the most irritating for me. As the age increases, the rattling increases and I never found good mechanic who could fix it for me. If you are buying new vehicle, you could consider TATA, else drop it.

Used car market is always dicey. I would suggest to keep eye open for Endeavour and Innova. If a good vehicle, with preferred budget and colour comes - go for it.

PS:
Innova holds its value in used car market, so you won't get cheap vehicles.
If you consider new vehicles, kia carnival is an option.

[stallion_16]

Originally Posted by kosjam

Wow. that is quite the lineage of vehicles you guys travel in.
Since a lot of things are not clear in your post, I am going to make a couple of assumptions, which may or may not apply. Budget, Area of travel, duration of travel are some of them.

While your heart may be set on the Endy, you should ideally look at a well maintained Toyota Innova, followed by the Fortuner. Both vehicles will satisfy the driving pleasure, as well as luggage carrying capacity, as well as the comfort of your 4 legged friend.
There is no beating a Toyota in terms of longevity and reliability. Creature comforts they offer are sometimes the best in class.

The ford has a couple of things going against it. First and foremost, the lack of company level support, which will quickly reduce from whatever levels it is at currently. None of the authorized service stations would be interested in remaining with a dead brand. Any breakdowns will be very costly, both in terms of money, as well as time (Speaking from personal experience with a non ford but discontinued vehicle breakdown).
Ride quality wise, I found the Toyotas far better than the overly heavy and consequently stiff ride quality of the Endy.
In this regard, even the Hexa would be a better bet than the Endy, because even though it is discontinued, its parts might not be as expensive as compared to the Ford, because many of them are even shared with the Harrier/Safari/Aria. Plus, it being from the stables of a relatively well performing Indian brand, finding a service station wont be as difficult as Ford's.

Our trips are usually anywhere between 700 kms to 4000 kms round distance. Budget isn't something we've thought of as it's the car that is important and we'd be keeping it for around 7-8 years, but let's say the maximum we'd pay for it might not be over 30 big ones. Travel destinations as told in the post could be just anywhere from beautiful 6-lane highways to places where roads don't exist. It might even end up going on different continents.

True about the Toyota being reliable and trustworthy but the used examples are usually having a premium and high mileage at times, it makes me wonder if the running costs after such high mileage are worth the badge of T?

The Hexa is a true contender here and we've been looking at some in the used car market. As you rightly said it is the most VFM product in our eyes.

About the Endy, the only thing stopping us is the maintenance and parts since Ford closed shop, but also seeing the amount of vehicles on road I doubt parts availability might be a problem, but it is sure they'd be at a premium.

We also looked at the Pajero Sport but again we've been burnt by Mitsubishi once and are not looking at that way anymore.

We've driven the Carnival extensively and the low g.c. it offers on full load worried us on bad road. And since it's a new brand, getting stranded in a remote location makes it a task in itself.

Here it's a heart v/s the head with the Endeavour v/s the Toyotas.

Mod Note : Please do NOT use acronyms (e.g. ANHC, MS, T-Fort, ANHV, JC, Endy) when referring to cars or their makers. You are ONLY permitted to use the full Make & Model name. This will make our content useful, searchable & easy-to-understand for experts & newbies alike.

Thanks for the support & understanding.

[sunilch]

Originally Posted by stallion_16

THE CONTENDERS:
They are in order of their preference.
1. Ford Endeavour 3.2
2. Tata Hexa XZA
3. Toyota Innova 2.8
4. Toyota Fortuner/Legender 4*4

Important points:

1) HEXA didn't come in XZA I believe. The highest AT variant was XTA but it is a 4x2. If you want a 4x4, it will be manual. Though that is what I will prefer over the XTA.
2) HEXA XTA came with 19" wheels which are hard on drive and expensive to replace when needed. Better to swap with 17" ones but that will mean additional 60-80K expenses from what recollect.
3) Innova Crysta is your best bet if you don't need 4x4 or AWD. A 2.4 will also be very good option except for the VFM factor which isn't possible at present with Innova Crysta. But if you are open to a 2014-2015 Innova (not Crysta) then your options will improve and VFM deals are possible.
4) For your journeys, boot space is important though the roof carrier will also be useful.
5) A used Marazzo will also be a good VFM car for its space, cost and Mahindra factor. Though it will be only MT, 4x2 and will lack boot space. I understand you don't have budget constraints but it seems like you are more inclined towards a VFM deal (just like myself ) and hence this suggestion.

[VW2010]

Ford endeavor will be my recommendation. You can even pick one cheaper from a panicking seller today and enjoy ownership that will allow you to cover any distance in comfort, space, quietness, and conquer most terrains.

Toyota Innova is a no-brainer honestly but I love the endeavor for what it offers.

My travel buddies are my small family and a beagle and they enjoy the luxury of space and our recent trip down the Banglore highway cemented my research that as a driver I do not feel tired after any long trip. In fact, the sedan I owned earlier tired me down in spite of better ride dynamics and comfort. There is no substitute for ladder chassis.

The ford endeavor is not for many but from your history of cars and what you have shortlisted, go and enjoy the endeavor.

Service - Spares are easily available and support will not be an issue for at least the near term. A better bet is to get a local mechanic to take care of the car.

If I summarize overall feedback on endeavor ownership in spite of mine being the older version, here is what I can share

Comfort - 5 stars (Most comfortable drives while we can cruise at 100-120 easily all day long)
Driveability - 4 stars (For a truck the car corners flat with absolutely no discomfort)
Service and Parts - 4 stars for availability, 3.5 stars for the cost (I order parts and get them delivered at home from an official parts supplier in Chennai)
Fule efficiency - Do not buy this for efficiency runs. It's a guzzler.
Road Presence - 5 star
Space - 5 Stars for a 5 member family, 3 Stars for trying to use the last row with adults.
Off-road fun - 5 Stars (You will not be doing hardcore off-roading and there are specialist vehicles as you mentioned for the same)
Engine Sound - 10 stars if you like diesel engine sound .

People still own Pajeros and most parts need to be imported from Japan. So I am not worried about owning a ford for the next 10 years.

[rutvij]

Originally Posted by stallion_16

Our trips are usually anywhere between 700 kms to 4000 kms round distance. Budget isn't something we've thought of as it's the car that is important and we'd be keeping it for around 7-8 years, but let's say the maximum we'd pay for it might not be over 30 big ones. Travel destinations as told in the post could be just anywhere from beautiful 6-lane highways to places where roads don't exist. It might even end up going on different continents.

True about the Toyota being reliable and trustworthy but the used examples are usually having a premium and high mileage at times, it makes me wonder if the running costs after such high mileage are worth the badge of T?

If your budget is up to 30 lakh then without a second thought go for Innova. I owned an Innova and currently am owning a Fortuner. If you have plans to keep your car for longer period then Toyota definitely makes a sense. In our 9 year ownership of Innova, I did't spend a rupee on any spare part replacement. It is that much reliable. Hassle free ownership will encourage you to keep the car for longer period and that is where your money's worth is.

If you don't need 4WD, Innova makes a better sense over Fortuner and you can get a brand new car also within your budget.

[Aroy]

For a tourer, nothing beats Innova for comfort and space. Endeavor comes next, but is priced way too high.

Most taxi operators use Innova, so you can buy one with your eyes closed.

[kosjam]

Originally Posted by stallion_16

Our trips are usually anywhere between 700 kms to 4000 kms round distance. Budget isn't something we've thought of as it's the car that is important and we'd be keeping it for around 7-8 years, but let's say the maximum we'd pay for it might not be over 30 big ones. Travel destinations as told in the post could be just anywhere from beautiful 6-lane highways to places where roads don't exist. It might even end up going on different continents.

True about the Toyota being reliable and trustworthy but the used examples are usually having a premium and high mileage at times, it makes me wonder if the running costs after such high mileage are worth the badge of T?

The Hexa is a true contender here and we've been looking at some in the used car market. As you rightly said it is the most VFM product in our eyes.

About the Endy, the only thing stopping us is the maintenance and parts since Ford closed shop, but also seeing the amount of vehicles on road I doubt parts availability might be a problem, but it is sure they'd be at a premium.

We also looked at the Pajero Sport but again we've been burnt by Mitsubishi once and are not looking at that way anymore.

We've driven the Carnival extensively and the low g.c. it offers on full load worried us on bad road. And since it's a new brand, getting stranded in a remote location makes it a task in itself.

Here it's a heart v/s the head with the Endeavour v/s the Toyotas.

Mod Note : Please do NOT use acronyms (e.g. ANHC, MS, T-Fort, ANHV, JC, Endy) when referring to cars or their makers. You are ONLY permitted to use the full Make & Model name. This will make our content useful, searchable & easy-to-understand for experts & newbies alike.

Thanks for the support & understanding.

I guess you will have to do a little bit of searching to get a low mileage Toyota in the second hand market, but the quality being bulletproof is vouched by the scores of Qualises (Qualis's?) still running on Indian roads. Look out for people selling because they might be shifting out of the country.

Hexa is an underrated product which, if you can find a good piece, should definitely be on your priority list.

Carnival is a true blue city/highway vehicle, better not to look at it for the type of adventures you are looking at. But otherwise a good vehicle.

[Nav-i-gator]

You would find it hard to get Innova in used car market at a reasonable price. No one sells it, and if someone does, it sells at almost the price of a new one.
If you can get one, go for it, eyes closed. It will serve you like a Donkey.

If listening to your heart, Endeavor is hard to let go as an option. Butch but still classy looks, power, comfort, space, it has everything. Would not be even half as reliable as a Toyota though.

[McLaren Rulez]

Originally Posted by VW2010

Ford endeavor will be my recommendation. You can even pick one cheaper from a panicking seller today.

This is a very good point. Lots of people are overreacting and selling their Endeavour after the exit news. The reality is that the news is already out so the prices they're getting are rock bottom - if anything prices will recover once the blind panic subsides. For the OP, it's an excellent chance to get a great car for a tasty price.

[CEF_Beasts]

My advice will be find a well maintained, Innova Crysta 2.8L ZX AT not more than 3 years old that fits your budget and keep it for long. The 2.8L motor in the Innova is a gem!

[AjinkyaP]

Toyota Innova Crysta AT is the one to go for , new or pre-owned.
My brother-in-law picked 2.4 AT recently and cant stop praising the comfort and effortless driving experince.

[mug:mush]

You can never go wrong with an Innova Crysta 2.8. Have been doing long drives since 2001, but nothing I drove compares to an Innova 2.8 in driving comfort, quality of service, cost of spares, luggage carrying capacity, highway mile munching capacity and road manners. In general, I clock around 30K Kms in car every 3yrs and we replace it. In case of our Innova, it has run 57K Kms in the last 3yrs and we have decided to keep it until diesel is sold at sane prices in India. Yes, its that good