Advise needed on buying Tata Safari

Godfather · 4th July 2007, 07:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by hondadude

There is nothing even remotely car like about it. Not sure if that is the case with all Safaris or it was just the TD vehicles.

It is not car like at all.. It's a Truck

Must be the TD vehicle.. I have not felt anything remotely like this at all.

Godfather

hondadude · 4th July 2007, 17:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Godfather

It is not car like at all.. It's a Truck

Indeed. I was just setting right expectations for anandpadhye.

Quote:

Must be the TD vehicle.. I have not felt anything remotely like this at all.

I am TD'ing another Safari this weekend. Lets see.

anandpadhye · 4th July 2007, 19:10

Finally I took the TD today...

Hoping against the hope, I thought Tata may have improved by now...but no.

Anyways, here are the things I found:

Positives:

Clutch smooth and light.

Lumbar support good.

Gear shift OK. Not as bad as i had thought but no way close to Honda.

Good suspensions.

Negatives:

Harsh, noisy and vibrating engine. He kept telling me this is better than the old TCIC, but then that was hardly the point...and if the engine is as harsh as it is today, I really wonder what DICOR has achieved???

Poor handling. Car was unstable even at 60kmph.

Poor braking.

Wiper and light control levers much shorter in length than the radius of the steering wheel. This is stupid. they should design those proportionate to their steering wheel size.

The jumps seats in the boot space are a big joke. I am only 5'4'' and even I could not sit straight without banging my head.

The middle seat in the rear has very very very hard backrest (formed by the armrest). Did they make it out of some sort of stone (marble/granite, etc)???

The speedo and Odo were disconnected. I strongly argued against using another fellow customer's car for TD. He told me again and again that it's a Tata motors' own test car that keeps travelling on the bypass highway (near hinjewadi IT park) "on test" and is brand new. If a brand new vehicle engine strains like this, then I am afraid what will happen down the line.

****I looked at the sticker on the rear window. it was orange in colour and had all the specs of the vehicle printed (including, Ex, Gearbox name, engine code-name, etc). The series was something...ESZ....

My friend's scorpio that I drive occasionally has much much much better engine that sounds and responds nicely. And I hate Mahindras big time and really wanted to prove to myself that Tata are better...but...alas...

anandpadhye · 4th July 2007, 19:22

BTW, forgot to mention...

2.2 will be launched in December.

But he was again and again asking me why I wanted to wait for 2.2 when 3.0 is bigger?

I told him - 2.2 may be a bit smoother and efficient engine.

His answer - but it is smaller so it will run on higher rpm!!!

Then he also gave this away - sir, 2.2 is only for exports...

So I ask - so export quality, isn't it?

And he had no answer to that.

Rahulk76 · 4th July 2007, 20:35

anand

I am not sure if you know this already...

The current three liter engine is rated for approx 3-4lac kms before any drastic overhauls (provided, it has been properly taken care of).
Its one of tata's most proven and durable engine around, except for stupid deplhi stuff and gizmos and our not so pure adulterated diesel.

despite these, i can easily reach 160 speedo indicated with A/C on comfortably and the engine just doesnt complain much.

Engine Vibrations and Noise::intially my safari made so much noise imean <2000km that everyone came to know that I was home., but now after 10K plus..on odo, even my wifey cant make out when i was back home..(my house is on 1st floor) its settling quiet well and i am sure it will in coming kms as well..if u are concerned about engine noise..u can get after market sound deadeners fitted which work great.

Milage::as u know pune's traffic, with xtra mle diesel, with 100%ac on i manage to get decent 10.5-11kmpl. You can understand the milage this vehicle might give on highways
as far as ur friends scorpio is concerned, wouldnt it have settled in ( imean put in atleast 4k to 5k) Tata's are somewhat crude engine and take time to settle in..so a new car which u drove, might not even have had its PDI done...

my suggestion is to not to keep ur Honda like expectations from Tata's one and only pure Indian bred SUV
..its a different league altogether and very well commands its own respect on the road, i mean u cant beat it

For tata's anything which is newly launched.. always wait for a year for problems to be rectified completely ( i mean almost) then go for it.

rest all is your decision

hondadude · 4th July 2007, 22:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by anandpadhye

Finally I took the TD today...

Hoping against the hope, I thought Tata may have improved by now...but no.

I tried to reset your expectations. Same thing happened with my friend who was expecting a petrol car like gearshift, NVH etc in Tata. I had lot more realistic expectations because I own both NHC and Indica so I know the level of refinement to expect from Tata vehicles.

The strength of Safari is its imposing presence, ride quality and very comfortable middle row (barring the middle seat on the middle row where the backrest is like a rock). If the above factors are very important for you and you are willing to tolerate other negatives that come with it, then you should look at Safari.

Quote:

My friend's scorpio that I drive occasionally has much much much better engine that sounds and responds nicely. And I hate Mahindras big time and really

BTW, care to explain why you hate Mahindra.

anandpadhye · 5th July 2007, 10:41

Rahul and Hondadude,

Thanks for your responses. I really appreciate that.

Well, it is really nice if the engine sort of runs-in and smoothens out after much use. It's just that the initial impression of the engine was so horrible that I was getting vibrations and shocks at the steering!

And regarding the handling, it did not seem planted at 60kmph inspite of it's 2 tonnes weight. I asked him again and again if the alignment has gone for toss and any reasonable guy who cares about his own product would have accepted that (at least as an excuse). But he remained firm that it's a brand new car and alignment was not an issue and blamed it on me (knowing that I drive NHC and I am not used to driving SUV!). The added that person like me (I do not know what that means) should go for VX as I will definately need ABS!!!

Regarding Mahindras, I have had pathetic experience with them rght from buying all the way upto regular (or I should say irregular) servicing of that very Scorpio that i was taking about...eventually, I and my friend sold that scorpio and celebrated that day as it marked the end of our relationship with Mahindras. The details can be found in one of my posts in the "Logan bashing" or "Logan - a late bloomer" thread...

rahul_intlad · 5th July 2007, 11:33

Anand I suggest why not have a look at the innova as well ,its a minivan[and quite ugly at that actually] but you get a refined engine and a very car like experience to drive if that's what you are looking at.However Its only the top end innova that has abs and will be around 11 lakhs.

snaronikar · 5th July 2007, 12:02

Hi, Deepak,

What was the on road price finalized with Prerana? And what all the freebies you have got along with it? Can you conform pls...

kdeepakk · 5th July 2007, 15:18

Hello Snaronikar;

Have u planned to buy one or already booked it?

I was thinking of buying EX-9.26 on road price. They offered me 25k cash discount as corporate discount & some mudflaps & mats free...... After all our friends here suggest to go for LX-8.20 than EX....now i have started thinking.

I have not bargained with them on offers....as i am planning to book it next month.......so till then i will collect details from other BHPians on what they have got & what best i can ask....

The latest was Babu reddy's deal.....think it was a good one...

I have decided i will go with Prerana Motors.........

Regards
Deeps

anandpadhye · 5th July 2007, 16:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by rahul_intlad

Anand I suggest why not have a look at the innova as well ,its a minivan[and quite ugly at that actually] but you get a refined engine and a very car like experience to drive if that's what you are looking at.However Its only the top end innova that has abs and will be around 11 lakhs.

Yes...I thought of that but 2 things:
1. Ground Clearance: I am not sure it's really good for all those bad roads that give tough time to my NHC.
2. The looks: Really really bad

Only thing is it's Toyota engine and powertrain so it must be really well made.

babureddy · 5th July 2007, 16:20

Quote:

After all our friends here suggest to go for LX-8.20 than EX....now i have started thinking.

its better you go for LX and then update it...u will have the difference amount...
Also if you have any query, PM me, will be glad to help you out..

ravibhat · 5th July 2007, 16:35

Hi Anand,

I own Innova infact my Innova is Petrol, Innova ground clearance is 176mm but I never felt its low, I travelled in bad roads, in bangalore city NHC used to hit few speed brakers, I feel NHC GC and suspension is so that it hits speed brakers and stones in bad roads very easily if we don't go slowly.

Coming to Innova only -ve till date its bit odd to look. But I feel Silver top end Innova D which would cost around 12lacs on road in bangalore is not that bad, since it has many goodies.

Ride comfort is awasome even in bad roads with speed 50kmph. With tyre upgrade to 225/60 R15 it will improve further.

Very very less body roll compared with other SUV/MUV.

Very good refinement with engine/suspension/quality used inside the car.

Very easy to drive in city as well. My driver who has around 40,000km driving experience working for me driven 4+ cars in same number of years
finds Innova is best for city and highway use.

If you put good accessories (Rear crash gaurd, side foot steps, 45% dark sun film, body graphics ) to Innova it look very nice. Once you are used to it you feel even better with Innova.

Innova has much better ride quality compared with Honda cars. It come close to Safari.

With Safari you will tend to tired If you drive it like Sedan
because of body roll, more noice, vibrations.

With Innova these issues are minimized by its design but still you can't expect it like Sedan.

If you ask about Ride quality and comfort Safari and Innova are best vehicles compared with any Sedans/hatch backs even few luxury cars.

Regards,

Ravi.

hondadude · 5th July 2007, 16:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by anandpadhye

Yes...I thought of that but 2 things:
1. Ground Clearance: I am not sure it's really good for all those bad roads that give tough time to my NHC.

Almost anything is better than NHC. BTW, Innova is pretty good at handling bad roads unless ofcourse you are planning to do serious off roading. In that case you need an SUV.

Quote:

2. The looks: Really really bad
Only thing is it's Toyota engine and powertrain so it must be really well made.

I totally agree and that is the only reason I don't own one yet. Although after test driving Endy and Pajero extensively and Safari to some extent, I might just buy Innova and learn to tolerate its looks.

One more point in addition to engine and powertrain. Innova is beautiful from inside. Leagues ahead of Scorpio and Safari.

hondadude · 5th July 2007, 16:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by babureddy

its better you go for LX and then update it...u will have the difference amount...
Also if you have any query, PM me, will be glad to help you out..

The only important thing that is missing in LX is rear defogger and from what I read on a different thread, it is not easy to upgrade.

4th July 2007, 19:10	#33
anandpadhye Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Pune Posts: 3,054 Thanked: 3,313 Times	Finally I took the TD today... Hoping against the hope, I thought Tata may have improved by now...but no. Anyways, here are the things I found: Positives: Clutch smooth and light. Lumbar support good. Gear shift OK. Not as bad as i had thought but no way close to Honda. Good suspensions. Negatives: Harsh, noisy and vibrating engine. He kept telling me this is better than the old TCIC, but then that was hardly the point...and if the engine is as harsh as it is today, I really wonder what DICOR has achieved??? Poor handling. Car was unstable even at 60kmph. Poor braking. Wiper and light control levers much shorter in length than the radius of the steering wheel. This is stupid. they should design those proportionate to their steering wheel size. The jumps seats in the boot space are a big joke. I am only 5'4'' and even I could not sit straight without banging my head. The middle seat in the rear has very very very hard backrest (formed by the armrest). Did they make it out of some sort of stone (marble/granite, etc)??? The speedo and Odo were disconnected. I strongly argued against using another fellow customer's car for TD. He told me again and again that it's a Tata motors' own test car that keeps travelling on the bypass highway (near hinjewadi IT park) "on test" and is brand new. If a brand new vehicle engine strains like this, then I am afraid what will happen down the line. ****I looked at the sticker on the rear window. it was orange in colour and had all the specs of the vehicle printed (including, Ex, Gearbox name, engine code-name, etc). The series was something...ESZ.... My friend's scorpio that I drive occasionally has much much much better engine that sounds and responds nicely. And I hate Mahindras big time and really wanted to prove to myself that Tata are better...but...alas...
	() Thanks

4th July 2007, 19:22	#34
anandpadhye Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Pune Posts: 3,054 Thanked: 3,313 Times	BTW, forgot to mention... 2.2 will be launched in December. But he was again and again asking me why I wanted to wait for 2.2 when 3.0 is bigger? I told him - 2.2 may be a bit smoother and efficient engine. His answer - but it is smaller so it will run on higher rpm!!! Then he also gave this away - sir, 2.2 is only for exports... So I ask - so export quality, isn't it? And he had no answer to that.
	() Thanks

4th July 2007, 20:35	#35
Rahulk76 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: India Posts: 1,149 Thanked: 235 Times	anand I am not sure if you know this already... The current three liter engine is rated for approx 3-4lac kms before any drastic overhauls (provided, it has been properly taken care of). Its one of tata's most proven and durable engine around, except for stupid deplhi stuff and gizmos and our not so pure adulterated diesel. despite these, i can easily reach 160 speedo indicated with A/C on comfortably and the engine just doesnt complain much. Engine Vibrations and Noise::intially my safari made so much noise imean <2000km that everyone came to know that I was home., but now after 10K plus..on odo, even my wifey cant make out when i was back home..(my house is on 1st floor) its settling quiet well and i am sure it will in coming kms as well..if u are concerned about engine noise..u can get after market sound deadeners fitted which work great. Milage::as u know pune's traffic, with xtra mle diesel, with 100%ac on i manage to get decent 10.5-11kmpl. You can understand the milage this vehicle might give on highways as far as ur friends scorpio is concerned, wouldnt it have settled in ( imean put in atleast 4k to 5k) Tata's are somewhat crude engine and take time to settle in..so a new car which u drove, might not even have had its PDI done... my suggestion is to not to keep ur Honda like expectations from Tata's one and only pure Indian bred SUV ..its a different league altogether and very well commands its own respect on the road, i mean u cant beat it For tata's anything which is newly launched.. always wait for a year for problems to be rectified completely ( i mean almost) then go for it. rest all is your decision Last edited by Rahulk76 : 4th July 2007 at 20:47.
	() Thanks

5th July 2007, 10:41	#37
anandpadhye Distinguished - BHPian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Pune Posts: 3,054 Thanked: 3,313 Times	Rahul and Hondadude, Thanks for your responses. I really appreciate that. Well, it is really nice if the engine sort of runs-in and smoothens out after much use. It's just that the initial impression of the engine was so horrible that I was getting vibrations and shocks at the steering! And regarding the handling, it did not seem planted at 60kmph inspite of it's 2 tonnes weight. I asked him again and again if the alignment has gone for toss and any reasonable guy who cares about his own product would have accepted that (at least as an excuse). But he remained firm that it's a brand new car and alignment was not an issue and blamed it on me (knowing that I drive NHC and I am not used to driving SUV!). The added that person like me (I do not know what that means) should go for VX as I will definately need ABS!!! Regarding Mahindras, I have had pathetic experience with them rght from buying all the way upto regular (or I should say irregular) servicing of that very Scorpio that i was taking about...eventually, I and my friend sold that scorpio and celebrated that day as it marked the end of our relationship with Mahindras. The details can be found in one of my posts in the "Logan bashing" or "Logan - a late bloomer" thread...
	() Thanks

5th July 2007, 11:33	#38
rahul_intlad Senior - BHPian Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Pune Posts: 1,579 Thanked: 4 Times	Anand I suggest why not have a look at the innova as well ,its a minivan[and quite ugly at that actually] but you get a refined engine and a very car like experience to drive if that's what you are looking at.However Its only the top end innova that has abs and will be around 11 lakhs.
	() Thanks

5th July 2007, 12:02	#39
snaronikar Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Bengaluru Posts: 2,845 Thanked: 29 Times View My Garage	Hi, Deepak, What was the on road price finalized with Prerana? And what all the freebies you have got along with it? Can you conform pls...
	() Thanks

5th July 2007, 15:18	#40
kdeepakk BHPian Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Bangalore Posts: 272 Thanked: 99 Times View My Garage	Hello Snaronikar; Have u planned to buy one or already booked it? I was thinking of buying EX-9.26 on road price. They offered me 25k cash discount as corporate discount & some mudflaps & mats free...... After all our friends here suggest to go for LX-8.20 than EX....now i have started thinking. I have not bargained with them on offers....as i am planning to book it next month.......so till then i will collect details from other BHPians on what they have got & what best i can ask.... The latest was Babu reddy's deal.....think it was a good one... I have decided i will go with Prerana Motors......... Regards Deeps
	() Thanks

5th July 2007, 16:35	#43
ravibhat Senior - BHPian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Bangalore Posts: 2,256 Thanked: 37 Times View My Garage	Hi Anand, I own Innova infact my Innova is Petrol, Innova ground clearance is 176mm but I never felt its low, I travelled in bad roads, in bangalore city NHC used to hit few speed brakers, I feel NHC GC and suspension is so that it hits speed brakers and stones in bad roads very easily if we don't go slowly. Coming to Innova only -ve till date its bit odd to look. But I feel Silver top end Innova D which would cost around 12lacs on road in bangalore is not that bad, since it has many goodies. Ride comfort is awasome even in bad roads with speed 50kmph. With tyre upgrade to 225/60 R15 it will improve further. Very very less body roll compared with other SUV/MUV. Very good refinement with engine/suspension/quality used inside the car. Very easy to drive in city as well. My driver who has around 40,000km driving experience working for me driven 4+ cars in same number of years finds Innova is best for city and highway use. If you put good accessories (Rear crash gaurd, side foot steps, 45% dark sun film, body graphics ) to Innova it look very nice. Once you are used to it you feel even better with Innova. Innova has much better ride quality compared with Honda cars. It come close to Safari. With Safari you will tend to tired If you drive it like Sedan because of body roll, more noice, vibrations. With Innova these issues are minimized by its design but still you can't expect it like Sedan. If you ask about Ride quality and comfort Safari and Innova are best vehicles compared with any Sedans/hatch backs even few luxury cars. Regards, Ravi.
	() Thanks